Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Quality of International prints

This is topic Quality of International prints - SRD problems in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 01-23-2005, 02:36 PM:

Hi everyone.

Some time ago I wrote here to have your opinion on a little "scratch", a little damage that occours on some print sometimes that would cause the dolby digital decoder to go in "fault" mode soon and eventually to revert to analog in few time.
In that case I had no or few replies for you that, probably, don't have this problem. At that time I tought that was my fault since usually I had this problem on the same machines or on old machines.

Now the problem has become nation-wide so it is almost sure that it is a print issue and not a technical issue. It takes a while to figure it out since too much "projectionists" does not know what means "error rate", "f", reverting etc. This is why for a long time this was just a problem for few foolish projectionists... [Wink]

Here you can found a photo of an Italian film, the emulsion side on the SRD datas has been dropped on the floor. Sometimes it can appears as a "scratch" but with the same behaviours.

Usually a print read 3/4 the first shows, then in the best cases it begins to reads few "F" in one or two weeks. In the worst cases the print drops completely in analog after 4 or 5 days and all the emulsion pieces can be found around the projector...

It's happening on 90% of the prints. I cannot track all the defects, sometimes a reel that reads "5" a day reads in analog the day after...

It has been proved that it is not a machine problem. This issue is more frequent with Cinemeccanicas, V5 (straight gate) and less with other machines. I imagine that V5s are just a little harder on that part of the print, nothing more.

I suppose that you don't have this kind of problem there. What do you think? Can someone explain to me how can be possibile this behaviour?

Oh, I forgot to say that, of course, does not happen on all prints. Example: our dolby trailer are 2 years old, they're projected all days all time and they're reding 4.
A curious thing is that we received a FUJI print, we tought that the SRD problem would appear in few shows... The print has been projected since december, 23 and now reads 3.5... So it is not a print material quality...

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-23-2005, 04:19 PM:

Sorry, but if the print tracks at 4 the first day, it's not a lab problem. Your machine is scuffing up the film.

Without seeing your exact projectors, I can almost guarantee you that your problem is the prints are leaving hardened emulsion deposits in the gate of the projector due to poor lubrication. It's those hard spots in the gate that are causing your scratches. You will probably notice if you pay attention that the first reel isn't as bad as the last one (assuming tower/platter).

So when the show is over, is there ANYTHING in the gate/trap, or is it perfectly clean? What happens if you run a few shows without cleaning the machine each thread? All it takes is one projectionist to be lazy and not clean things between each show on his shift to permanently damage the film.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-24-2005, 03:52 AM:

..would worn scanner drum rollers, intermittent pad rollers, tight gate tension, or worn gate rails cause this one? That the rails in the gate are steel, yet the trap assembly being a solid block of tooled aluminum.

How are the dashpot rollers? any rough spots on these small rollers? They love not to turn when needed.

Usually,a scratch like that in the SR-D area, means curtains for a good read.

V-5's are FUN to work on...

-Monte

Posted by John Hawkinson (Member # 1135) on 01-24-2005, 01:57 PM:

So, Antonio has mentioned that this is a country-wide problem, not just specific to his theatre.

Are these scratches on the base side or on the emulsion side?

Is it possible that the film has not hardened properly? Are there any specs for how hard the base and emulsion side should be, and tests Antonio could do to establish that?

Also, Antonio, do you have a humidity meter (hygrometer) in your booth? Do you know what the humidity range typically is?

--jhawk

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-24-2005, 02:50 PM:

you will probably find one of the pad rollers is too tight against the film and possibly even not turning
the usual culprit is the one on the intermitent and the holdback sprocket

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 01-24-2005, 03:15 PM:

Miramax sent over a back-up print of "Kill Bill Vol.2" from ETS that had the same damage. It was returned to the ETS depot (Cincinnati) in poor shape. [thumbsdown]

Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 01-25-2005, 04:27 AM:

Brad,

as John said it is a country-wide problem. And lately our gate are absolutelty free of ANY dirt at night...

Sure, humidity increase the problem, we don't have an humidfier and I think that when the umidity goes under some value the issue become worse.

The "scratch" is emulsion side. Brad, I have a copy of Alexander where first and last reels are reading "F" all the time and central parts that are reading 4. And how can explain the company logo (that runs for 4 month) and Dolbys logo that read 3/4 after years? These prints does NOT have the MINIMAL damage on the perf area.

We clean the gates every day and our rollers and projectors parts are in good shape, believe me!

I've been told that they're printing copies so fast that this is the result...

I assume that you don't have this issue there...

Bye
A