Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Simplex Intermittent Shaft Collar

This is topic Simplex Intermittent Shaft Collar in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Ian Bailey (Member # 1752) on 01-25-2005, 03:27 AM:

The Intermittent Shaft on my Simplex PR 1014 has a Collar on the end of it(operating side of the projector).This collar has 2 grub screws holding it to the end of the shaft.I don't seem to be able to loosen these grub screws with Allen Keys-I have since been told that they are not designed for Allen Keys.What tool is required to undo these grub screws?

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-25-2005, 04:54 AM:

Hi again Ian - yes, these "grub" screws are the Allen variety. One must use a 1/16" allen, preferably the square end type, not the ball end type of Allen. Ball end Allens of this size have a hard time making secure contact with the six sides of that socket hole.

Unfort, the metric size of 1.5mm is a bit too small for this socket.

If the allen sockets are rounded out, you probably might have to use an "easy-out" of this size to remove those Allen set screws, then order new ones.

Can be a bit of a pain if not careful with these small allen setscrews.

good luck once again. - Monte

Posted by Ian Bailey (Member # 1752) on 01-25-2005, 05:41 AM:

Hi Monte
We will have to stop meeting like this or people will start to talk!!!
Thanks for your advice but I have tried every Allen key I have and I don't seem to be able to get one to fit.I have been told by a friend who does a lot of work on Simplexes that on the early machines these "grub" screws were in fact not Allen heads and Simplex changed them to Allen heads in later models.I'm wandering whether they are "Torx" head(I think that is what they are called?) But i have been trying ball ended allen keys so I will try and get a square ended one as you suggest and see if that works.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-25-2005, 07:57 AM:

Whoa...the intermittent collar screws are often "Bristol" style set screws, not allen...particularly if you have an older projector (Remember, the PR-1014 dates back to the 1960s and began life as a black wrinkle-finish head).

Steve

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-25-2005, 08:49 AM:

Yes, Steve is right they are Bristol. In the states you can get a small set of Bristol wrenches from GC Electronics and also from mchine shop sundry suppliers. If you can't locate a Bristol of the correct size select a very small phillips screw driver that will fit the slots. Then file fown the tip just enough to allow the screwdriver to penetrate into the cross slot enough and then loosen them up. Of course the real wrench is always the perfered tool but this does work in a pinch. While that end cap is off check the condition of the bushing and the star shaft at that end. Usually you will find the star shaft scored and the bushing worn since no one oils that for the most part. I suggest drilling an tiny oil sink in a new bushing assy if you replace the old one and oil it on a regular basis. Although the bushing is "oilite" it tends to run out of oil quickly during its life. This spot on the movement is but one on a list of X-L pet peves I have thats a mile long! Also get 2 6/32 X 3/16 long allen head set screws and replace the Bristols with them. Be sure to set the collar correctly when you go to tighten it down. Too tight and you will put excess wear on the movement.

Mark

Posted by Pete Lawrence (Member # 130) on 01-25-2005, 09:21 AM:

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-25-2005, 10:00 AM:

Pete, Here's a place that sells them........

This set is available for 16.00 U.S. plus shipping Here It should have the correct size in it for the X-L. Others at least should find this guys site somewhat interesting!

Mark

Posted by Ken Layton (Member # 133) on 01-25-2005, 10:21 AM:

Bell & Howell was another projector manufacturer that used large quantities of Bristol setscrews throughout the machinery. They had been using Bristol setscrews since at least 1950.

[ 01-26-2005, 10:16 AM: Message edited by: Ken Layton ]

Posted by Bob Koch (Member # 1062) on 01-25-2005, 07:39 PM:

Western Electric, alias ERPI, used 4 splined Bristol set screws in their universal[1A] base whenI was in high school. AlwAys had to have a Bristol spline wrench for XL intermittent collars. Super Simplex used a conventional screw, as in your eyeglass frame and I may be wrong[have to be the first time] E7`s used a conventional allen.

Posted by Ian Bailey (Member # 1752) on 01-25-2005, 11:20 PM:

Thanks guys for your help-I will try and track down a set of Bristol's.
Mark- thanks for your tips the oil hole sounds like a good idea.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-26-2005, 01:15 AM:

Yea..thx for that help as well Marko. For I've never heard of these "Bristol" wrenches, even when I did work on the old black wrinkled XL's and where a 1/16" allen did work on these collars screws.

Have to remember this one. -thx Monte

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-26-2005, 06:47 AM:

Some people get all of the credit <sniff, sniff>. Believe it or not, the Bristol type set screw was used up until much more recently...I wanna say the change occured under Strong's control of the projector.

The Soundhead lateral guide roller also used the Bristol type set screw on the pivot pin and the operating lever. The operating lever was changed to a square head set screw prior to Strong though.

Steve