Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Masking won't stay open when movie started

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Posted by Anslem Rayburn (Member # 1267) on 09-19-2005, 03:26 PM:

We have CNA-150s, and everything has been working fine on all 8 units until recently. Now, one of the units will not keep the masking open for scope films. If we run the film manually, ie. not using the start button, everything stays as it should. If we press the start button, however, the masking closes. Pressing the scope button again opens the masking, but it immediately closes to flat. It does not take a cue to initiate the return to flat mode, the second it stops open for scope, it starts closing again for flat. I have checked the program and made quadruple sure that it is set to scope for all cues, and it is. I even made another program to make sure that it wasn't a programming error, with the same result. Any ideas what to check?

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 09-19-2005, 03:28 PM:

Maybe a stuck relay! Not on the automation but on the screen side. Check the relays for continuity.

Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 09-19-2005, 03:42 PM:

In addition to relays check the limit switches in your masking motor.

Posted by Bryan Fournier (Member # 264) on 09-19-2005, 04:00 PM:

Is your default (between shows) setting flat? If so, it sounds like an automation relay for scope is "un"latching. I'm not familiar with the CNA-150, so I'm sure others can give you more precise advice. Good luck.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 09-19-2005, 05:08 PM:

Could be that the momboard in those CNA's have bit the dust, since they love to go bad - had to replace one on a CNA-100 that was basically doing the same thing by running the program irractly after redoing the program and even copying the program to another line.

Try to switchout a momboard with that one "A" unit with another "B" unit and see if the problem travels to the "B" machine. If it follows, then momboard is the culprit since you've reprogrammed as much as possible and still the condition exists.

Also, even the touchpad loves to go bad as well, thus you can try a switchout on the touchpad as well with a different unit.

I've replaced three of those touchpads on CNA-100's - for some dumb reason why the inside of the touchpad loves to short out is beyond me....the usual STRONG thingey.. [Roll Eyes]

good luck - thx,Monte

Posted by Eric Hooper (Member # 1730) on 09-19-2005, 05:29 PM:

And all this is going on when customers are in the auditorium??? [Eek!]

Posted by Wolff King Morrow (Member # 2226) on 09-19-2005, 05:44 PM:

To rule out the CNA, I'd suggest swapping it out with one from another projector, but be sure to make note of the dip switch settings on each as these tell the network the projector identity for interlocks. If the problem continues after the board swap, then you know its not the CNA card and most likely a motor problem.

Edit: Looks like Monte beat me to the suggestion (you rule ;-)

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 09-19-2005, 06:13 PM:

quote: Eric Hooper
And all this is going on when customers are in the auditorium???

..that's when you trip the breaker in the panel to shut off the masking motor(s) and leave your maskings open to what the film format is and to where it could be used for both lens formats, until a solution is met with this issue.

And if the downstairs people gets pissy at you, tell them if they want to handle this problem and if they have any better solutions on containing the issue, to get their butts upstairs and figure out the solution "muy pronto!" - let them know who's running the operation upstairs..

Thx a bunch Wolff, you rule as well [Wink]

thx-Monte

Posted by Anslem Rayburn (Member # 1267) on 09-19-2005, 06:55 PM:

Will try these ideas after closing.

We are running the show manually right now, as the problem only arises after pressing "Start" on the automation. If we switch lamp and motor to manual, dim the lights, turn off the slides, and switch sound formats manually, the masking stays open. It's not a big deal, except when you are busy with other things going on and forget to get the lights at show end or shut the lamp & motor down .

Posted by Jason Miller (Member # 2341) on 09-19-2005, 08:46 PM:

which will become a VERY big deal to your lens when the lamp stays on and the dowser doesnt close.

I had this same issue in Minneapolis. It called for replacing the entire termination board.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 09-19-2005, 10:32 PM:

quote:
which will become a VERY big deal to your lens when the lamp stays on and the dowser doesn't close.

..but nice thing about CNA automations is that this will never happen, even with a momboard run problem, since this is in a different part of the circuit ... AS LONG as that CUE fault button isn't activated, which bypasses all of the failsafes-both the FP-350 failsafe (if on a Strong machine) and the wrap detector on the platter, if it is.

But, you get those booth clowns who HAS to press that damned button to get things going again and then forget - burn up the lenses and blow holes in the dowser plate from the lamp not turning off.

-Monte

Posted by Michael Cunningham (Member # 210) on 09-20-2005, 09:59 AM:

Completely agree with Monty on this one. Open your masking to the 'SCOPE' position and then kill power to the masking motor (at the breaker, by unplugging it, whatever). Now, leave it this way and run your shows as usual. If you switch films, repower the motor long enough to switch into 'FLAT' position.

Posted by Heath Dutton (Member # 3265) on 09-20-2005, 03:16 PM:

I know of one occasion where we had a problem very similar to this and it was fixed by copying the program from another machine using the network. I'd at least give that a try since it only takes a minute. In our case the programs were identical (or so they seemed on the led's), but something in the background had apparently been corrupted.