quote: Monte L Fullmer

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True..it can be a bugger to time in a P35GPS since these units are a bit more complicated to do than a Simplex.

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Monte, This is the simplest machine on the planet! It should take you less than 60 seconds to time a shutter on a Christie even with having to remove the back cover. They have made it easy for you by placing the cross mark on the shutter. It can be done just as easily with or without the trap in place. It can be done in half that time with an assistant.

1. Assuming trap is in place set the aperature to Scope.

2. Loosen the shutter clamp screws on its shaft so the shutter can be moved..... but not too loose! Use the long T-Handle Allen
Wrench Christie provides with each projector for doing this.

3. Place a screwdriver tip by one of the intermittent sprocket teeth and then slowly turn the projector over until the sprocket advances 2 teeth, STOP!

4. While holding the Ultramittent flywheel move the shutter until the cross mark is centered in the scope aperature. Tighten the shutter blade clamp screws back down. An assistant in back doing this part cuts the time in half!

5. Turn the machine over by hand several cycles and double check that the setting is correct. If its still correct there's no need to run a test film!

The P35GP is really the easiest machine on the planet to repair and maintain . You should be able to.....

Change a shutter belt in less than - 3 min.
Change the Ultramittent and re-time in less than - 10 min.
Re-belt the machine and minor clean up in - 15 min.
Coating the belts with Film-Guard - Timeless
 

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Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-01-2006, 02:27 PM:
 
Oh yes Mark, you are true on this. I remember my first time in belt changeout: took forever since I had the units that didn't have the motor hinge option and no manual to go by - found out the hard way of the "hidden idler sprocket" underneath the motor when lacing up that outer belt.

But with time, I was able to do a changout within 20min of all three belts and do the timing.

..and FG'd the belts afterwards...(lol)

-Monte
 

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Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-01-2006, 02:36 PM:
 
Have to agree with Mark here, the P35GPS is the easiest projector to service. The only clarification I need to make to that statement is that you have to have some experience at it. You can't just hand someone a belt diagram and say "change this belt", as they will certainly get the belts too tight or too loose. There is a little bit of an art to get it right. Once you figure it out (or are shown), these things are a BREEZE.

If only the picture was steadier!
 

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Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-01-2006, 04:39 PM:
 
Absolutely agree Brad, Some experience is a must on them. but Monte's line surprused me as he has significent experience with them but finds them harder than a simplex to work on.

Mark
 

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Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-01-2006, 04:51 PM:
 
I find that the Simplexes just need less work period...and as for most maintenence free...Kinoton PK-60D...damn near zero there.
 

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Posted by Frank Dubrois (Member # 3042) on 01-01-2006, 06:41 PM:
 

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen

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Re-belt the machine and minor clean up in - 15 min

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Are you a GOD? Do you have super human powers? We don't have hinges on our motors so 15 mins can be spent taking them off and putting them back on.

As far as the timing goes, I will try 2 sprockets next time. 3 seems wrong, and usually is. I guess my question is to Mark, you said:

quote:

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5. Turn the machine over by hand several cycles and double check that the setting is correct. If its still correct there's no need to run a test film!

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I don't understand how you can know the timing is correct without actually turning the projector on?? Even though I'm careful when I time it, its mandatory to check my work to make sure we don't have flicker or ghosting. If you know how to check the projector timing without actually turning it on, please share.

Thanks!
 

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Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-01-2006, 06:58 PM:
 
The way that both Richardson and Cameron staight to time a shutter usually works
with the intermitent is in the dwell hold a pencil point between any two sprocket teeth of the intermitent and then advance the mech until 2 teeth have passed and you are between teeth 2 and three at that point the shutter blade must be set to exactly half cover the apperture (ie be centered on the apperture)
The machines that are an exception are brenkert and cinemecanica
After timing it turn the machine over and verify that the apperture is masked during the entire pull down
 

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Posted by Will Kutler (Member # 770) on 01-01-2006, 07:05 PM:
 
Ohhhh Boy! Talk about me having experience timing Christies! Got that down to an art within a few minutes...including the time needed to retrieve tools and parts.

I do think that the one major flaw of the Christie P35GPS is the design of that Jackshaft Assembly. That belt twist is an inappropriate design that has been a thorn in many a peoples side! It's been a while, but I was thinking about how to redesign that Jackshaft Assembly by using a miniature miter gearbox assembly with maybe a brass to stainless gear combo and a "wet-type" gearbox machined out of a solid block of aluminum that could be filled with oil w/o a leakage problem. Maybe if I had a P35GPS in front of me I could work on it as a college product!

Even with the heavier steel gears, that Shutter Assembly can sure get the Gate and Trap assembly dirty! And they can take lots of time (on a weekly basis) to thouroughly clean. I did try to convince my old employer to purchase one or two Ultrasonic cleaners, but that was futile.

The other thing that I dislike about Christie is their dependance on Locktight. Personally, I cannot stand the stuff! As an aircraft mechanic, nothing beats the appropriate type of mechanical locking hardware! I did experience loads of hardware loosening problems with the Christie Gates/Traps. The two screws that attach the Curved Shoe can loosen up and if your not careful,can put a nice scratch right down the middle of your print. So, I got used to inspecting them after every show. Another problem I had on one occasion was the Lateral Guide set-screws loosening up during a show, the Lateral Guide falling out, and me having to find the Jewl in the carpeting. The method Christie uses to secure those set screws in place (by using opposing set screws) is an inappropriate design. An appropriate design would have been to use hardware such as Long-Lok or Nylok set screws from W.M.Berg, Inc. But if Nylon will not hold up due to heat, I believe that brass inserts are also available.

Anyhow, when hardware started loosening up on several machines I spoke to Bevan about what to do. He recommended a certain type of Locktight, and I immediately serviced all 20 machines. It worked for several months, but then about the time I left that theatre, screws started to loosen up, again.

Another thing to be careful of on these machines is that the Gate/Trap assembly is held onto the projector by two socket-head cap screws. Some idiot at that theatre (I do not know who)actually managed to cross-thread one w/o telling anyone and left the screw there folat'in around! I repaired it, but forgot what I did...I was either able to chase the thread with a tap...or I installed a Helicoil...its been too long and I forgot what I did. But it jst goes to show you how todays popcorn floor staff can things up!
 

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Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-01-2006, 07:08 PM:
 
that stupid twist in a timing belt was their solution to problems they experienced with having a shutter gearbox much like the victoria 5 one
 

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Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-01-2006, 07:32 PM:
 

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen

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but finds them harder than a simplex to work on.

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quote: Frank Dubrois

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Are you a GOD?

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quote: Steve Guttag

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I find that the Simplexes just need less work period...

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quote: Mark Gulbrandsen

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5. Turn the machine over by hand several cycles and double check that the setting is correct. If its still correct there's no need to run a test film

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Mark, I just said I run test film to sound good . I always do what you said and just cycle the projector by hand and recheck the timing.
 

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Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-01-2006, 11:15 PM:
 
Here's a little tip. Assuming you have the belt a little looser than it should be, take a small allen wrench and as you are carefully turning the projector over by hand, stick it in between the belt and the upper pulley. This will knock the belt off by one notch depending on which direction you are rotating the machine and is a huge timesaver in case you are only one notch on the belt off from perfect. At that point tighten up the tension just enough so when you are holding the inching knob still, you cannot spin the shutter by hand. Any more tension and you will see premature belt and pulley wear.

To tell if you are properly timed without running film, just look at the intermittent sprocket as the shutter passes behind the aperture. So long as the aperture is covered when the intermittent sprocket starts to turn...and the intermittent sprocket comes back to a stop before the shutter finishes passing behind the aperture, you are in time. Hence, no need to actually run a test film. Make sense?
 

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Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-02-2006, 09:47 AM:
 
I always set the shutter belt tension so that I can just barely pinch both sides of the belt together in the center of its length. If they can't just barely meet together in the moddle then its too tight and although the belt may last a long time it will cause premature wear on the shutter pulleys. Yes, even the new hardened shutter pulleys wear out if there's too much tension! Shutter belts tensioned this way will not skip a tooth.

Assuming there are good clean shutter pulleys 2 years of shutter belt life is reasonable on a machine with 3kw or less lamp size. Larger lamp sizes are going to require once a year belt replacement since the heat does affect the belt material.

Mark
 

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Posted by Will Kutler (Member # 770) on 01-02-2006, 11:31 AM:
 
Hi Mark

The way you described to adjust belt tension is exactly what Christie recommends; 1/4 inch deflection ~ the belt barely touching at midpoint when squeezed. However, I would love to know what you did to get that long of a life out of a belt? Christie recommends annual belt replacement or when they start to show signs of excessive wear.

Now, I was lucky to get 3-6 months wear out of a shutter belt, even with the steel pulleys and a weekly cleaning including a few drops of Christie Belt Lube.

I remember making a recommendation to the G.M. at my old theatre to replace the shutter belt at least every 6 months. He took my advice under consideration, but the "Booth Manager"...a kid with absolutly 0.00% mechanical ability, apitude or interest was dead set against my recommendation.

So, it came to pass that on opening day of a major bluckbuster in the largest auditorium and a packed house the belt broke during the feature. I had the feature back up within about 5 mnutes or so. Now this theatre chains policy was no refunds if the film goes down during the trailers, but if it goes down during the feature, then refunds. And guess when the belt broke! Well, the G.M. tried to chew my ass and blame me for the problem, blaming me for not changing belts like I told him I would. I told him to hold on...that I gave him my recommendation, had yet to hear back...and that his "Booth Manager" had shot the recommendation down. Talk about tension in the workplace...
 

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Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-02-2006, 06:25 PM:
 
I don't know what to say Will, With good pulleys in there and the correct tension 2 years is not a problem around here. Of course these are not grind houses but they do put a fair amount of time on them yearly. The main thing is to have clean pulleys that are in excellent condition... meaning no wear at all allowed. So you may find yourself replacing the shutter pulleys every 3 to 4 years as well. It would be interesting to see how a TIN coating would hold up on those pulleys!

Your reccomendation was a good one to go by in a busy plex. Its not worth loosing a show or even upsetting customers for a $3.00 belt. In a bisy plex I would go with 1 year on all 2kw houses and every three months on 3kw and up. Or over a time period calculate how many operating hours that is and go by the hours like the aircraft industry does.
P.S. ya got to have the correct tension in the workplace as well in order to last !

Mark
 

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Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-03-2006, 02:50 AM:
 
I've never used the technique of squeezing the belt together like Mark mentioned above, but a 2 year changeout on the belts was no problem for me at all and if upon inspection there was not a noticeable wear, I would commonly end up running many for 3 years.
 

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Posted by Frank Dubrois (Member # 3042) on 01-03-2006, 04:33 PM:
 
What are your thoughts on the shutter blade no longer being able to either be loosened on the shaft, or a new shutter blade that is almost impossible to mount on a shaft? Does the metal of the shaft expand? I have attempted to time one projector when it was cold in the morning and just after a show thinking one of the two times might give me a workable solution. No such luck. The shutter blade cannot be loosened to freely spin on the shaft thus making timing VERY difficult.
 

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Posted by Will Kutler (Member # 770) on 01-03-2006, 05:47 PM:
 
Mark and Brad

The belt I recommended changing every 3-6 months was the shutter/jackshaft belt only. They just undergo lots of wear due to that twist, which I believe to be an inappropriate engineering design.

The other belts do last for several years. But cleaning and occasional belt dressing also helps.

K.
 

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Posted by Joseph Pandolfi (Member # 223) on 01-03-2006, 06:00 PM:
 
We check our belts & pulleys weekly for tension and wear. This is part of our preventive maintainence we do here. Once they hit 9 to 11 months we replace all three belts regardless.
 

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Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-03-2006, 07:20 PM:
 

quote: Will Kutler

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The belt I recommended changing every 3-6 months was the shutter/jackshaft belt only. They just undergo lots of wear due to that twist, which I believe to be an inappropriate engineering design.

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Well originally there was a gear-box and that was a very unpredictable piece and cost about 450.00 when it blew... as is typical of Christie it was not field repairable. The gears in one were about the diameter of my little toe! So a 1/2 twist in a belts about the only engineering choice left to choose from and in reality is cheap and works well as long as your pulleys are in like new shape. The big mistake they made was not doing all the belts in kevlar. Some of the other belts are available o0ff the shelf in kevlar versions and they don't cost all that much more. My general feeling is that if your shutter belt(on a 2kw machine) needs attention more often than every 2 years then something else is wrong and needs attention but belts are also cheap, alot cheaper than refunding a show.

I am off to maintain 4 Christies whose belts have not been touched in 1.5 years. I will post photos of them so you can see what the wear looks like after that long.

Another note: Personally I like to go by hours rather than weeks or months when a maintainance schedule is set up. This is most true of oil changes where alot of people think they can go for a year and then change the oil, but they also run 120 hours a week when in fact the oil's properties have deterioated badly by the end of the 2nd month!

Mark
 

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Posted by Frank Dubrois (Member # 3042) on 01-03-2006, 07:22 PM:
 
We have some inner and outer belts going on 2+ years. Preventative maintenence...whats that?? Our motto is, if it aint broke, dont screw with it. I've tried to change that line of thinking, but alas, I failed. This is why I am leaving. It was either "Dont rock our boat" or "were gonna push you overboard". I'm jumping ship. Here's my 2 weeks
 

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Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-03-2006, 07:27 PM:
 

quote: Frank Dubrois

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It was either "Dont rock our boat" or "were gonna push you overboard".

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Frank,

These people are obviously belligerent. Please print this thread out and hand it to them........

Remember if you enjoy the work there is always another theatre somewhere nearby that IS being run by professionals.

Theatre managers/owners that think that way yours do are stupid-stupid- stupid ! Remember..... "stupid is as stupid does"
 

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Posted by Frank Dubrois (Member # 3042) on 01-03-2006, 10:53 PM:
 
I couldnt agree more. Whats worse is being asked for advice, then they don't take it, then when it breaks, I get the phone call saying, "yup, you were right, come fix it now."

Uh huh... be right there

I hope my job search goes well. There's gotta be something else out there somewhere.
 

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