Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Is DP70 overkill for screening room

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Posted by Dave Ritchie (Member # 4030) on 01-02-2007, 04:21 AM:

I have been given the opportunity to buy a DP70 but it wont fit into the screening room that i am in the middle of building- is it worth changing everything around now when it will be mainly dedicated to 35mm - from looking at old posts they are very nice projectors

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-02-2007, 04:46 AM:

You need to chek this screening room plus and this one , to see that it's not an impossibility.

Good luck with your venture - Monte

Posted by Cameron Glendinning (Member # 3516) on 01-02-2007, 05:33 AM:

Its a hard question you post. Is it too tall for your current room or to long or both? Does it come with a lamphouse? red reader sound head ect.

Any philips or kinoton projector tends to be very good in my experience, this however is probably the only model that I have not worked with. I once heard that they are very quiet with 70mm, but not so quiet with 35mm.

I doubt whether there would be any genuine on screen advantage over many brands of smaller 35mm only projectors.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2007, 05:33 AM:

Being that I am the king of overkill, I feel I should chime in here. [Big Grin]

The DP70 brings about lots of problems, so just to irk Mark I will list a few.

First, it is HUGE. Seriously, there is no reason for that damn thing to be so big and heavy.

Second, be prepared to spend some bucks in a BACP analog reader, because the standard optics are CRAP due to an overly wide slit.

While we're talking about that, if you ever wanted to blister a print, just leave the exciter on while the projector is stopped. [Roll Eyes]

You will be forever stuck without being able to run 6000' reels. You can run those 5500' reels, but not true 6000' reels.

Mounting a failsafe isn't impossible, but quite the pain to rig it into the front right corner.

You can't open the door while the machine is running without blocking the picture on screen with most lenses a screening room would be using.

The aperture is a pain to file.

Parts are expensive!!!

I could go on, but suffice to say I had a DP70 in my screening room for about a year and hated that damn thing. My Century JJs put out a phenomenally better picture and win in every other category too. Unless you are getting it for essentially free, don't waste your time.

Posted by Dave Ritchie (Member # 4030) on 01-02-2007, 06:17 AM:

thanks for the low down - Think my old ernemann will keep it's place for a bit longer yet

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-02-2007, 09:19 AM:

It is the new year and I'm feeling argumentative...

quote: Brad Miller
First, it is HUGE. Seriously, there is no reason for that damn thing to be so big and heavy.

Actually I love its size...makes everything easy to work on. It is easy to keep clean. But as to its weight...it is nice and stable too. Ever set a JJ right on the ground...the damn thing falls right over at the slightest tap. Remember, the AA2 is doing what a Console does today, minus the place for the automation. Its weight goes a long way to its stability.

quote: Brad Miller
Second, be prepared to spend some bucks in a BACP analog reader, because the standard optics are CRAP due to an overly wide slit.

The AA2 analog soundhead was the best for me...always set up perfect and with clean optics, always worked wonderful for me. I'm sorry you had such problems...I never did on any of the ones I worked with. As for modern readers. There are a choice...BACP offers TWO...Kinoton offers both just a red light solution and a soundhead replacement that makes it up to Kinoton basement reader standards (the best, that is).

quote: Brad Miller
While we're talking about that, if you ever wanted to blister a print, just leave the exciter on while the projector is stopped.

Yes, that is certainly possible. Then again, it was designed in an era of exciterlamp changeovers. But going beyond that, Norelco addressed that issue nearly 1/2 a Century ago! Back in 1960, they issued TSI #3 to address this very issue.

quote: Brad Miller
You will be forever stuck without being able to run 6000' reels. You can run those 5500' reels, but not true 6000' reels.

Good...I prefer 2000' reels (your preferences may vary).

quote: Brad Miller
Mounting a failsafe isn't impossible, but quite the pain to rig it into the front right corner.

Again good...the operator should be present at all times, particularly in a screening room. However, nowadays...one could equip it with a modern reflex type IR sensor like the ones used in modern Kinoton projectors.

quote: Brad Miller
You can't open the door while the machine is running without blocking the picture on screen with most lenses a screening room would be using.

You win on that one. Then again, normally all one needs to open the door for is to adjust the tension bands and that does not require it to be fully opened. But a pain with this machine is that the lens is recessed so far back...it restricts the type of lenses that may be used for short focal lengths.

quote: Brad Miller
The aperture is a pain to file.

They are not particularly hard to file...remove the gate and tension bands. They are a little thicker than some but they don't tear you hands up they way some do by constantly inserting and removing the plate. They are way easier than a turreted double or triple plate.

quote:
Parts are expensive!!!

About the only parts one requires are tension bands and the occasional sprocket. If you like the velvet tension bands then they last forever too.

No lie, as a general rule, the AA2 is the least expensive machine to keep running...its gear train almost NEVER needs parts. The incompetent operator will chew up the intermittent sprocket with a tension band that is unsecure. I guess some have inflicked harm by jamming the trap open on the moving shutter...but seriously...just what big expensive parts is anyone going through with these? In the competent hands, they seem to run forever.

BTW...I'm not the biggest AA2 fan...it certainly was the best in its time and it has designs that many machines have tried to follow...kinda like a Tucker for automobiles. For 35/70...I'd definately be much happier with an FP75E though I think the AA2 gear train will still be less expensive to keep up. The FP75E continues the tradition of the 35/70 machine typically having superior 35mm performance than its 35mm only counterpart. This is true of the Century JJ versus the SA or DA. I wish the FP75E had a single shutter but I hear that when they tried it...they had massive bearing failures and then switched to the current double counter rotating shutter design.

Steve

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-02-2007, 12:11 PM:

quote: Brad Miller
I could go on, but suffice to say I had a DP70 in my screening room for about a year and hated that damn thing.

Brad, I am quite familiar with what you thought was a DP-70. In relaity it was more the remnants of a DP-70. Your machine which unfortunately was obviously poorly maintained by it previous owners and which you eventually sold off to one of our customers was in too bad of condition to put back into service. It was simply stripped for what ever parts were still servicable and those parts have never been used they are are still sitting on a shelf backstage at the America Theater in Casper. I won't go much past what Steve has already summed up very well except to say that 32mm focal length lenses are about as short as one can go with the DP-70, thats darn short.

To get back to the question... Yes, I would absolutely install DP-70's in my screening room if you can accomodate them... I have done so in the past for myself but gave up film collecting many years ago. Thanks to Thomas Haurslev I still own a minty pair of Phillips FP-56's which are like minature versions of the DP-70 inside.

Apparently Paramount Studios, Eastman Kodak, The Directors Guild, American Cinemateque, and many other very heavily used and famous screening rooms also agree they are among the best ever built or these venerable machines would have been removed many years ago. The owners of the close to 90 DP-70's (including the ex Stag Theater machines which now focus properly) that I maintain here in the Mountain States also feel that they are the least expensive machines to operate and will continue to do so till the end of film.

Are they cheap to maintain. Absolutely YES! Especially with our own line of parts available at about 50% the cost of parts from Kinoton. We also have a full Kodalith sheet of the Todd-AO slits if someone HAS to have one but the BACP scanner is overall a very good deal and the sound reproducer continues to function as a no picture area contact sound reproducer. You can also mount a DTS Time Code reader in place of the mag penthouse if need be. This allows a closed loop time code scan for ultra reliable Time Code.

quote: Brad Miller
You can't open the door while the machine is running without blocking the picture on screen with most lenses a screening room would be using.

Many locations run without the door since these projectors run so quietly.

P.S. I will also mention that fine machine tools are always VERY heavy!!

Mark @ CLACO

Posted by Dave Ritchie (Member # 4030) on 01-03-2007, 04:01 AM:

I've had a better look at this and it seems to run very smoothly have to say I'm very tempted to do the upgrade and move up to to 70mm

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-03-2007, 04:12 AM:

Mark, I've ran 2 other of these beasts and neither impressed me either. The projected picture was simply unacceptable to me. I also saw Gordon's pair running at the IMAX in Toronto a couple of years back and the image wasn't very steady to me on those either. That's not to say that YOURS don't run well. After all I had never seen an acceptable IMAX presentation outside of the OMNI in Fort Worth until I visited Sacramento and 3 locations in Michigan. However even if your machines performed magnificently, I would still hate them for all of the inexcusable design reasons listed above. Give me something modern. At least it won't crack the foundation! [Razz]

Anyway, I just felt like tormenting you since you love those things so much.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-03-2007, 04:22 AM:

quote: Dave Ritchie
I'm very tempted to do the upgrade and move up to to 70mm.

|

One strong suggestion is to visit a cinema, or cinemas, if possible, in NZ or elsewhere that contains these units and see for yourself on their operation.

This will be the proving ground that you will need to finalize your decision. You just can't take it all in from what we all said here 100 percent for it wouldn't be fair to you.

Then, you're can make that final decision by actually witnessing their operations - be it "yea", or "nea".

quote: Brad Miller
The projected picture was simply unacceptable to me.

Now, this could bring up an interesting question:

Granted, I'm not in expertise with a lot of various machinery such as the Philips DP70/AA2, Kinoton and such, but I have witnessed 70mm carbon arc and xenon presentations going through AA2's and carbon arc won the presentation factor hands down with me. I wasn't paying too much attention to picture weave, jitter and the alnomalities of what film can do while going through a machine.

Thus, I was impressed with the projected picture as a good light source being of the old carbon arc. Then, when this theatre switched over to xenon, I was sorely disappointed with the projected picture.

Course, this is actually an unfair comparision since this topic is solely to the usage of xenon illumination.

But still, was the ill presented projected picture, the light's fault, or was it duely towards the machine - since these units began their life as carbon arc projectors?

I'm not trying to change minds here, but have to ask this question since the light issue wasn't discussed.

...be like having a great stereo system and crappy speakers. Actually, when one designs a great stereo system, you begin with the speakers and then work backwards.

-Monte

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-03-2007, 04:25 AM:

Brad,

There are 2 reasons for unsteadiness in the DP-70. 1. Worn or bad gate bands is usually the main culprit. 2. Improper set up of the lateral gyude rollers. You need to use a gauge to set them properly. I made up a copy of the factory gauge and had it calibrated as its quicker to go through and check alot of them on a service visit.

I don't mind being tormented... Its tormenting to work where I do!

Mark

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-03-2007, 04:41 AM:

quote:
Its tormenting to work where I do!

yea, like locations that love to spill film on the floor, unattended. Dealing with theatre M/O's who act like 12 yr olds and have staff that doesn't even know what a projector is, let alone fixing what they muffed up. .. et.al...

-monte

Posted by Dave Ritchie (Member # 4030) on 01-03-2007, 05:02 AM:

Thanks Monte Seeing them in action is definitely going to be the best way to go - I'll have do a bit of research and see if there are any still running in this country and go for a look- Is there still many movie's being released in the USA on 5/70 , I have been told that there have not been any in commercial use in New Zealand for a fair few years

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-03-2007, 03:16 PM:

Dave,

Forgot to mention that hopefully these machines do have the interchangable reel shafts and not the older fixed 70mm only shafts.... The latter require 35mm reels with 70mm hubs on them and unless there happens to be a bunch in the booth they can be hard to locate. We do have LOTS of used interchangable shafts and related stuff should you need to convert them.

Mark

Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 01-03-2007, 03:21 PM:

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
The latter require 35mm reels with 70mm hubs on them and unless there happens to be a bunch in the booth they can be hard to locate.

I'd forgotton about those things; I haven't seen any of them for years.

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 01-03-2007, 04:16 PM:

I own a DP70 at home in a Ground Floor Flat in a room about 14ft x 11ft, it's like a honour of owning a Rolls Royce/Bentley car in the projector world than those common Centurys....

You just about move it mounted on wheels and I can stow it away when not in use.

I just wonder how long a Century JJ's last with their original Intermittants etc and why there are still more Philips DP70 in use today than those 70mm Century's?.

Posted by Dan Lyons (Member # 1454) on 01-03-2007, 04:40 PM:

Ben,

What size image do you get in such a small room? Submit some pictures of your screening room setup. [thumbsup]

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-03-2007, 05:03 PM:

35/70 reels (35mm w/70mm spacers) are still available new in the event there are only 70mm shafts on a projector.

Steve

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-03-2007, 06:50 PM:

quote: Ben Wales
You just about move it mounted on wheels and I can stow it away when not in use.

Ben,

I just love that line [thumbsup]

! "Stow it away".... sounds as easy as stowing some life preservers under the deck of a boat. I just keep thinking of the word inertia... and once you actually get it moving is it actually going to stop or continue on through to the neighbors flat..... [Eek!]

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-03-2007, 08:39 PM:

Well considering he has probably the second largest stash of westrex5000 stuff compared to my collection stowing it might be a space problem [Big Grin]

and if look the norleco dp70 door is actually mounted on his westrex5000

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-04-2007, 08:29 AM:

Gord....Ben,

Why not stop by on the way to Showorst and check out our 5000 parts aisle which is still pretty complete except for stars. Oh, and new 5000 penthouses we have that are still in the box. We could use that parts space to expand on other stuff.
GOT TO GET GOING... I have to go install a loaner JJ intermittent in a thrashed out JJ today down in Orem (Scera Theater). The thrashed part of the JJ will be attended to when I re-install their rebuilt movement on Monday. This machine has only seen about 10 years of service......

Mark

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 01-04-2007, 09:23 AM:

Here are some pictures of my Living Room with the DP70.

Living Room Mode

Living Room Cinema Mode

The Screen is a Roller mounted in the Bay Window and it is a Massive 5ft wide and the projection throw is about 8ft.

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 01-04-2007, 09:55 AM:

Very nice! What anamorphic adapter do you use for showing scope films with such a short throw?

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 01-04-2007, 10:36 AM:

Many more Century 70mm projectors survive than AAII's were made. They are still running the Uptown in Washington and ran the Cine Capri in Phoenix until the end. Many, many multiplexs has them left over from "back in the day."

I agree that there is an aura of respectability with AAII's that does not exist with more contemporary machines. Whether or not this is practical in everyday life in a "Mc Donalds restaurant-style cinema is another question. Not every tech is willing or able to properly support that which is now a labor of love. Whether or not that labor of love will stand up to the hard light of being "worth it" is another question. Louis

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-04-2007, 12:24 PM:

I dunno...The Norelcos that started in the Uptown in the 50s are now in the Bow-Tie Harbour 9...while the JJs in the Uptown do indeed survive (the last I heard)...they have had significantly more work done to them than the Norelcos that are older than them.

The JJs that are in the Uptown historicially were paid very good attention by the projectionists and the service technicans...the Uptown was a special place and most problems were dealt with long before they became show threatening. When you run a pair of projectors day in and day out...and change in their sound becomes immediately noticable and source of said change is discovered...also when you lube up the gears regularly...you see the wear before it becomes a problem...hence preventive maintainence.

As a percentage, it would not surprise me at all that the Norelco AA2s have a current better in-use than the JJ which is more apt to be yanked as it confuses modern booth people. The JJ is not as likely to find a new home...there seems to always be a person that desires or will accept the AA2. You even have Yahoos like Mark making them into dandy 35mm only projectors. Despite its low production volume...you have several choices of basement readers keep it current. The JJ only has Kelmar for the R50 soundhead.

I have no doubt that the total production of JJs far exceed the AA2. You are comparing nearly 50 years against less than 15 years.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-04-2007, 03:02 PM:

VERY GOOOD! Quite interesting on how such a monster of a unit can be so tucked away in a corner of a room and not hog any of the living room up.

One could almost build a nice cabinet to store that thing in-including all of the sound equipment that would take the entire width of that back wall and still make the living room very comfortable looking and not crowded..

My congrats to you on this setup of yours. - Monte

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-04-2007, 04:37 PM:

This lucky Yahoo has close to 90 DP-70's to tend to. Once a year new bands and thats it. Once every few years new lateral guide rollers. Once in a while a contactor fails. Pretty boring to service... I feel like the Maytag Man!

I serviced JJ #758 today and installed a loaner movement.This is one of the disaster Century's built during the era that Century had lots of problems. With a JJ it HAS to be below S/N 500 to be a good one. This needs all new bearings and the movement rebuilt, has given less than 10 years of service running just nights and Saturdays. The theater has always been closed Sundays. There are less than 6 JJ's in the mountain states that survive today.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-04-2007, 05:35 PM:

Would that have been when ORC had Century before STRONG snagged them up?

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 01-04-2007, 05:40 PM:

I also make an Analog reader for the JJ.

There only seem to be yahoo's and the effete snobs in Steve's world. We know who fits that second description.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-04-2007, 10:02 PM:

Sam,

I was referring to a basement analog/digital reader for the R50...My apologies...I forgot...most live in a Penthouse world.

Actually...I tend to group exhibitors into 3 or 4 categories. Two you can actually make money with....one you can't but enjoy it anyway...and the last are just a lot of time with no real profit to show for it nor any satisfaction either.

Steve

Posted by David Kilderry (Member # 142) on 01-06-2007, 05:52 AM:

I have a pair of DP 70's that were about to be installed in my basement theatrette, then we re-opened the drive-in and that is where they live now. We have three now, one is a spare. The other Field runs a Century DAW, whilst it is good, the Phillips are better.

I would recommend DP 70's for just about any use except perhaps an automated multiplex. They are excellent for screening rooms if you can handle the weight. On 35mm they are hardly working and provide a very sharp and steady image. They are after all the only projector I know of that has an Oscar to their name!

David

Posted by Paul Cassidy (Member # 951) on 01-06-2007, 10:23 PM:

Hi Dave , DP70's may still be installed and working at the Civic Theatre Auckland , when it was a twinn , with the Wintergarden downstairs , they had a pair installed there running change over , so I'm sure when they did the restoration they used them again .

Posted by Dave Ritchie (Member # 4030) on 01-07-2007, 04:15 AM:

HI Paul I have been told that the one's in the civic have gone but might ring them and find out for shore, If you are ever heading over to Thames let me know I can show you round the cinema I work at if you want and if you like pre 1940 projectors i have a collection of bits and pieces in my shed

Dave

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-07-2007, 09:06 AM:

quote: David Kilderry
I would recommend DP 70's for just about any use except perhaps an automated multiplex.

Dave,

Have close to 90 of them I tend to that are all automated. They automate just fine..... Automated or not you can't let a booth monkey run or work on them!!

Mark

Posted by Andrew Lee (Member # 1330) on 01-10-2007, 08:58 AM:

Hi All,

Long time no post.

What is the good, bad, and ugly regarding the use of a pair of Philips DP-75's along with ORC Model 2500 lamphouses for a new theatre. I am sure most if not all comments about the DP-70 apply but I need to make sure.

Thanks

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 01-10-2007, 10:36 AM:

Hi Andrew.

There is no similarity between the DP70 and the 75. The DP75 has been covered on another thread and is a good machine but hardly the tank the DP70 represents.

As to the ORC 2500, I pity the fool who tries to make these reliable.

Posted by Paul Cassidy (Member # 951) on 01-11-2007, 12:09 AM:

Thanks Dave , I remember the Thames Cinema (well I hope it's the same one that used to be on the main Street) saw "American Graffiti" there in the late seventies , upstairs with a bunch of noisy ATC cadets . [beer]

Posted by Cory Isemann (Member # 2517) on 01-11-2007, 12:50 AM:

quote: Andrew Lee
ORC Model 2500 lamphouses

Well, there's your problem!

Posted by System Notices (Member # 2357) on 08-06-2008, 03:19 PM:

It has been 573 days since the last post.

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 08-06-2008, 03:19 PM:

quote:
Actually Emiel and me each have one DP70 from MIDI, Tilburg in the Netherlands.
They have ser. nr. 1657 and 1658. The theatre closed december 2007.
On Youtube you can see 1657 but both are identical. The soundhead is great.
We are installing a CP200 but a Philips OMA 4 is also a possibility.
There are 6 DP70s in Geldrop.

Thought I transfer this discussion to this Topic matter.
Great work you have done there and always good to hear there are some other's that appreciate the Rolls Royce of the 35/70mm Projector world [thumbsup]

.

Hope you can keep us posted on further Developments with your DP70.

Posted by David Kilderry (Member # 142) on 08-07-2008, 06:08 AM:

Correction to my previous post above from last year.........I now have four of them!

David

Posted by Damien Taylor (Member # 4255) on 08-07-2008, 07:38 AM:

Stop hogging them all already, i'm down to watching my films on rewinds now. [Cool]

Posted by Emiel De Jong (Member # 4225) on 08-07-2008, 03:12 PM:

And here is a picture of 1656:

And to get down to the topic again: for my screening room it would be overkill, since I built the projector booth / closet exactly the size for a Philips FP56. But I think the DP70 definitely looks nice in the middle of the living room.

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 08-07-2008, 04:03 PM:

And here is a Picture my Philips DP70 Projector S/N 1913 next to my Bell & Howell TQ1 16mm in the Living Room.

The DP70 is mounted on Wheels [Eek!]

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 08-07-2008, 08:47 PM:

Hmmm...I think it is interesting to note that the controls on the upper-base (start, stop, arc on/off) are different than in the US versions. The lamp tables (stoops) also appear to be different than the US versions.

Steve

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-08-2008, 02:08 AM:

quote: Ben Wales
The DP70 is mounted on Wheels

I still think that's quite the kick in seeing this: "Goliath in David's room."

If you picked a Bauer U2 to be along with this, then you'd would have quite the duo there.

Did you have to do some sort of beam spreading techniques from that little lamphouse to fill that 70mm aperture with your unit there?

Great setup anywhos and congrats!

-Monte

Posted by Damien Taylor (Member # 4255) on 08-08-2008, 03:06 AM:

I have a TQ1 with a broken worm, and another similar vintage B&H with a good worm I was going to canabilise. Veering the topic to something thats probably been covered a bazillion times before, but is a working TQ1 a good projector?

Posted by Gerard Bierling (Member # 4900) on 08-08-2008, 04:46 AM:

Emiel's DP 70 comes original from the closed Vreeburg theater in Utrecht and was equipped with SPP, the pulsedlamp from Philips.

That is why the lamptable is different, it was a small lamphouse but it can hold a bigger one.
After mounting shutter,dowser and other stuff it was, together with the one of Tom Beetz, I install them in he MIDI Theater in Tilburg which is, sadly, now closed also.

Gerard

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 08-08-2008, 06:31 AM:

The lamphouse table and machine base were U.S. made on most American machines. Shipping crates still exist in Louisville KY from 1956. The European crates are almost fine furniture, the U.S. crates look like pallets. Louis

Posted by Don Furr (Member # 1469) on 08-08-2008, 06:33 AM:

Ben how are you getting your 3-phase power?

Don

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 08-08-2008, 08:03 AM:

quote: Louis Bornwasser
The lamphouse table and machine base were U.S. made on most American machines.

YEP! The first ones were made by American Ooptical and the later ones by Ballantyne... before they were sucked up by Wrong International.
If anyone needs any DP-70 parts just drop me a note... we have EVERYTHING in stock!

Mark

[ 08-08-2008, 11:45 AM: Message edited by: Mark Gulbrandsen ]

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 08-12-2008, 04:01 PM:

quote:
Do you have to do some sort of beam spreading techniques from that little lamphouse to fill that 70mm aperture with your unit there?

I currently use the old Orcon 1000B 700w Zenon and (just) about get away with a Beam Spreader and defocus the Lamp for a 70mm screen, my screen is only about 8ft at home.

quote: Damien Taylor
have a TQ1 with a broken worm, and another similar vintage B&H with a good worm I was going to canabilise. Veering the topic to something thats probably been covered a bazillion times before, but is a working TQ1 a good projector?

Yes they are, I have two of them and use quite a lot in the Winter for 16mm Race Nights, both had new Worm Gears when I bought them.

There are several people in the UK would still repair these, I would change the old A1/258 for a A1/259 Lamp and base.

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-13-2008, 01:34 PM:

Tell us about the large-reel system for the 16mm projector. Is this something homemade, or is (was?) it a commercially available product? Does it work reliably?

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 08-13-2008, 03:17 PM:

quote: Scott Norwood
Tell us about the large-reel system for the 16mm projector.

That was made in the UK by Bell & Howell for the TQ1 (656) Projector range.

The back feet of the projector would seat on the base of the long play spool arm centre post and another arm would swing down and clamped up on the front feed arm of the projector.

The Take-up was a slipping belt arrangement as the spool got heavier the Torque take-up would be higher.

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 08-13-2008, 04:52 PM:

I'm planning to use an ORC M1000 behind a Century JJ very soon here for my home screening room. Can anyone tell me where I can buy a beam spreader that will work with this kind of setup for 70mm? I'm looking at about a 19 foot throw from lens to screen.

Posted by Don Furr (Member # 1469) on 08-13-2008, 05:39 PM:

Sean I tried using a 1K lamp behind my V8 35/70 and it just wouldn't cut it for a 22 foot throw. I had to go up to a 1600 watt lamp. That made all the difference.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-13-2008, 06:41 PM:

Kinda wondering if a spreader lens from an old Christie CH-10/20 console snood would work with these small ORC lamphouses.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 08-13-2008, 09:30 PM:

You may not need a beam spreader for the ORC 1000 if you just remove the condensing les and adjust the working distance some. Expect to pay $800+ for a beam spreader. Louis

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 08-13-2008, 11:01 PM:

yikes 800 bucks! I'm just a little old film collector who has an eclectic hobby [Smile]

I think I'll have to try it out first and see what the results are before I decide if I need different hardware. Thanks for the advice.

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-13-2008, 11:46 PM:

Don--how big is your screen?

In my screening room setup, I use 500w lamps in Cinemeccanica lamphouses with Century 35mm projectors (with 100-degree shutters, even) and find that the image is plenty bright for an 8' wide scope image, as well as all other formats (common height setup). Throw is something like 25'.

Either your screen is much bigger than mine or the ORC lamphouses really suck.

Posted by System Notices (Member # 2357) on 10-15-2009, 04:54 PM:

It has been 427 days since the last post.

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 10-15-2009, 04:54 PM:

quote:
Actually Emiel and me each have one DP70 from MIDI, Tilburg in the Netherlands.
They have ser. nr. 1657 and 1658. The theatre closed december 2007.
On Youtube you can see 1657 but both are identical. The soundhead is great.
We are installing a CP200 but a Philips OMA 4 is also a possibility.
There are 6 DP70s in Geldrop.

Ok, it is almost a year past and I wondered has there been any changes or perhaps there are more DP70's in Peoples homes?.

Since my last posting on this Subject I have 3 DP70's and now have 35/70mm DTS in the Living Room [thumbsup]

Sadly I hear there are fewer DP70's here in the UK still working in Cinemas and ones are left are seldom used or you hear that Projectionist that can not/don't know how to operate them.

Posted by Joshua Waaland (Member # 287) on 10-15-2009, 05:49 PM:

I had three but finally sold the last one a couple of months ago. I loved them but they had to go since I had eight projectors at one point. Now, I am almost back down to basic necessity items needed to install a screening room and have sold off most of the extra stuff I had including the Norelcos. I have a few more items left to go on ebay and then I will be done. I do have a few extra toys left but they are small and inexpensive. [Big Grin]

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 10-16-2009, 11:30 AM:

Its one of the "easiest on film" projectors ever made!! We had one location here in You-Taw that had 8 of them and they couldn't get a grip on operating them either. Sad because they are actually easier to operate then an X-L/5-Star setup.

Mark

Posted by Rick Raskin (Member # 1561) on 10-16-2009, 12:08 PM:

Other than having to set the intermittent in order to open the gate, what's not to know. Only issue I had with them was the DC changeover that tended to be slow, but they fixed that with an AC version. IMHO, best projectors ever made.

---Rick

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 10-17-2009, 09:18 AM:

Best projector? Maybe yes, maybe no.

It certainly wins in the "poundage" catagory! [beer]

Louis

Posted by Damien Taylor (Member # 4255) on 10-17-2009, 10:12 AM:

quote: Ben Wales
Ok, it is almost a year past and I wondered has there been any changes or perhaps there are more DP70's in Peoples homes?.

Not from a lack of trying [Frown]

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 10-17-2009, 02:53 PM:

quote: Rick Raskin
Other than having to set the intermittent in order to open the gate, what's not to know.

Exactly Rick!

But you have to remember this is Youuuu-Tawwwww...

Mark

Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 05-23-2010, 04:44 PM:

quote: Dave Ritchie
I have been given the opportunity to buy a DP70 but it wont fit into the screening room that i am in the middle of building- is it worth changing everything around now when it will be mainly dedicated to 35mm

Well I have finally made a YouTube Video of my Home Cinema Set and yes you can mount a DP70 Projector on wheels and screen 70mm in a small Living Room [Smile]

DP70 on YouTube

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 05-23-2010, 05:50 PM:

Now, that's called being dedicated to the art of home movie presentation!

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 05-23-2010, 06:41 PM:

Ben,

Your neighbors lights must dim when you hit that motor switch!!

Mark

Posted by Per Hauberg (Member # 529) on 05-23-2010, 08:20 PM:

The dealer, who sold me my pair of DP70 back in 1974, did not say "overkill", but he told me, that I would have projectors here until my retirement. After 36 years in service at my place, they still prove him right. I'm afraid, the only treath coming up is the digital future.
Some few years ago, they had new Kinoton 2000 watt lamphouses mounted, making them even nicer.
I love those two old guys, and I will do my best to keep them running as long as "real film" is available !
Beeing build for 70mm @ 30 FpS, their job here as well in any private screening room is pure running at idle. You will not be able to wear them up. Dealing with Kinoton, Germany direcly, I have had no troubles yet, having parts and good help - neither beeing expensive in any way.
Someone, somewhere, used the word "quirky" about the DP70 - well, -I'm getting quirky, too, so we still match, and we still do our 3 shows on workdays, 4 or 5 in the weekends without problems [beer]

As for Brad and the DP70 - he's from Texas....
Even if his private cinema from the pictures here on F-T sure is the greatest, I've ever seen, it would be even prettyer with a pair of well-kept Rolls-Royces up there. -And Canon people are laughing at Nikon people an so on and so forth [Big Grin]

Come on in: http://www.flickr.com/photos/canonbamse/sets/72157622275996814/

Posted by Thomas Hauerslev (Member # 566) on 05-26-2010, 03:29 AM:

Mr. Kotte's master piece was advertised as a Multi Purpose projector, so of course it fit's in everywhere.

DP70 web site still alive and very well - constantly updated: http://www.in70mm.com/dp70/index.htm