Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: ORC 1600 Lamhouse Sparkgap and PS Wiring

This is topic ORC 1600 Lamhouse Sparkgap and PS Wiring in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 05-09-2007, 08:21 AM:

Hi guys,

Have a few questions on my new ORC1600 lamphouse and power supply.

First one is, is the sparkgap under the reflector suppose to have something around it? It looks like it may have been in glass..but I'm not seeing any sign of that in the lamp house. Is it okay to run without the envelope? See attached picture.

The second question is about the power supply wiring. I'm planning on running the ps on 220 so I assume that you hook one leg to each of the 220 lugs. What about the 3rd ground wire as I'm not seeing a terminal for that?

The last question is about the fan relay block in the power supply. The wires are just sitting around it...does anyone have a picture that they could check to see if they are supposed to be hooked up or not?

Thanks for your help, it's veery appreciated.

Thanks,
Cody

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 05-09-2007, 01:33 PM:

call Strong and ask for Dale. He's an old ORC guy. He can answer you questions.

Bernie

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 05-09-2007, 05:57 PM:

Sadly not many parts available from Strong, the last supplier of ORC parts. Substitution may work on electrical parts, including spark gaps. Louis

Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 05-09-2007, 08:22 PM:

Thanks for the replies.

That's what I was fearing about the part. I did find the other part of the envelope. I just didn't know if the gap was in a vacuum or could be used without one. If it doesn't have to be in a vacuum i could put the piece of glass back around it and use it until I can find one.

Louis, might you have in your stock?

Thanks again,
Cody

Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 05-09-2007, 10:50 PM:

The spark gap is not in a vacuum. The covering is just to keep the electrodes from getting into trouble.

Posted by Phil Ranucci (Member # 3820) on 05-09-2007, 11:46 PM:

I'm about to toss out a bunch of ORC 2K rectifiers and platters. Let me know what you need and I'll see if I can remove it.

Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 05-10-2007, 10:21 AM:

The ignitor is a Victoreen which is a division of a resistor manufacturer. I have not seen this unit in years. The cover is an insulated cap not under vaccum. The rental ORC units I had and for client repair I have used a conventional "tube type" spark gap as used in older Cinemeccanica and on the typical German Bauch ignitor.

Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 05-10-2007, 01:41 PM:

quote: Richard Fowler
The ignitor is a Victoreen which is a division of a resistor manufacturer.... and on the typical German Bauch ignitor.

Richard, you're good. [Wink]

Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 05-10-2007, 03:29 PM:

Tim,
[Smile]

Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 05-10-2007, 03:30 PM:

Oh PUHLEEEZE! Get a room you two...

Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 05-10-2007, 04:33 PM:

Phil,
I know you are trying to "hose down" that fire in your backyard. I know you are too busy to join us [Razz]

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 05-10-2007, 04:43 PM:

Phill is never too busy [Big Grin]

Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 05-10-2007, 08:52 PM:

Thanks for everyones help. I'm going to put the glass casing back over it and position it so it stays on there. I believe it was cracked and shipping just knocked it off.

Anyone have a manual for the rectifier so I can get it hooked up?

Thanks,
Cody

Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 05-12-2007, 04:24 PM:

Just wanted to ask one last question, for now. I have the 4 terminals in the power supply labeled 115v 115v input and 230 230 input. I do not see a neutral or a ground. Any ideas how to go about hooking these up? I can get a picture if needed.

Thanks,
Cody

Posted by Matt Zeiner (Member # 1914) on 05-14-2007, 08:40 PM:

I'm pretty sure ground goes to chassis somewhere in there - look for a lug. I recently got replacement RF transformers for those ignitors from Strong, and regularly use the sparkgaps from discarded Strong DC ignitor PC boards to replace faulty ones in the ORCs...
Since you are going to run on 230V, just make sure the chassis is grounded - you'll be fine. If 110, one of those terminals marked 115 should have a white wire on it. Neutral. (If memory serves)

Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 05-16-2007, 11:43 AM:

Matt,

Thank you very much. I found the ground lug on the left side of the rectifier. Should be good now.

I'm planning on setting the bulb in it a few minutes and trying it out.

I'll let you all know how it goes.

Thanks,
Cody

Posted by System Notices (Member # 2357) on 01-28-2009, 11:40 AM:

It has been 622 days since the last post.

Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 01-28-2009, 11:40 AM:

Hello all,

Still working on this lamphouse as time was cut short last year and the booth was put on the back burner. We have decided to run the lamphouse on 120 as we have a 2-20 amp outlet circuits dedicated to the booth area.
Does anyone have any information on the wiring taps and jumpers? Also, once the 120 is hooked up is there any visual indicator that the rectifyer is running(other than having the lamphouse hooked up? I don't have the bulb currently so I didn't know if the fans/exhaust on the unit would still run or if anything would happen.

Also, still unsure about the wiring labeled 115 fan relays(as posted in first picture). Any info at all would be great.

Thanks for your help!
Cody

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-29-2009, 10:05 AM:

Cody,
We have gobs of ORC lamphouse stuff here and alot of scrappers. Just call and let us know what you need for it.

Mark @ CLACO

Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 01-31-2009, 04:17 PM:

Thanks Mark! Tryin to figure out what I may need right now other than the bulb. I am trying to trace the loose wires but the powersupply is pretty tight. I believe the go into the relay PCB.

Hoping someone around here may have either an installation manual for this lamphouse or would be willin gto take a few pictures of the T1 and T2 boards and a picture of the current tap adjustments(which is documented above the terminals so i believe these are right).

Any and all help would be appreciated as I am limited in this field but would love to have the xenon bulb for the summer!

Thanks,
Cody

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 02-06-2009, 01:17 AM:

Hey Guys,

I'm trying to still resurrect this ORC M1000 lamp that I got from another FT-er 4 or so years ago. I thought that the problem of the circuit breaker popping after applying power was a bad diode, so with Mark G's help I replaced all of the diodes with new Semikron units. Upon trying to fire it, the problem persists. I spent a few hours checking things out, and observed the following, When power is applied and the ignitor tries to fire off, that's when the breaker pops. Upon closer inspection of the ignitor assembly under the reflector, it appears that the sparkgap (the same part shown in Cody's posts) has arced through the epoxy at the base of the unit. Right before the breaker pops, I can see a flash through the epoxy. I took the part out of the circuit and put it on a meter and measured 50k ohm resistance between the leads. I guess my question at this point becomes is this part available? If not, does anyone have any suggestions of a substitute?

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 02-06-2009, 01:33 AM:

Sean,

You could try re-epoxying it agan and see what happens use some clear type epoxy though. I assume though that it hasn't gone through the glass part... if it has then it's shot for sure. Call me at work on Monday... we have some scrappers laying around that still have that gap.

Mark

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 02-06-2009, 02:50 AM:

Mark, Well good news.

I went ahead and tried removing the burnt epoxy (actually it's a kind of crumbly rubber) Anyway, Unfortunately I broke the base of the glass doing it. I tried applying hot glue in it's place and still got serious arcing.

I removed the spark gap again and tried removing the rest of the glue, but managed to break away the rest of the glass. I figured it didn't matter at this point since the part was bad anyway. I re-installed the part with no glass whatsoever.

It took about a half hour of trial and error, but after using pliers to get the gap JUUUSt right, the lamp fires up! I have excellent light and arc stability.

I'm wondering if I should try to obtain a correct replacement part enclosed in glass. I can't imaging exposure to the air can be good for the electrodes. That and the fact that the spark gap really wants to howl for a good few seconds before the lamp ignites.

Posted by Robert Throop (Member # 61) on 02-06-2009, 08:33 AM:

I have jury rigged a spark gap from an Irem igniter into an ORC igniter.
Bob

Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 02-06-2009, 11:19 AM:

Victoreen spark gaps are rare these days...always a problem due to seal deteriation due to age. Using an IREM type spark gap tube works well. Some ORC units used an open spark gap but safety may be an issue if you try to retrofit that type into the small lamphouse.

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 04-13-2009, 11:23 AM:

Hey folks,
Looks like my ORC lamp is acting up. Please note in my previous posts in this thread from a few months ago that I went through the lamp and changed out all of the stud diodes with new Semikron replacements. I repaired my bad spark gap in the igniter and everything has been working just fine. The lamp has also been modified to run the fans anytime power is coming into the line.

Anyway, since those repairs, I've put maybe 10-12 hours on it and never had a single issue with striking or otherwise. I've even had a few instances where I have verified I can strike the bulb, cut it off after a while and re-strike it warm with no issues either (this is important to note as you read what happened)

Last night I was getting set up to run a reel. I had fired up the lamp and run a test loop, then closed the dowser and threaded the reel so the lamp had been running a good 10-15 minutes. Something came up and I wasn't going to be able to start the film for a bit so I turned off the bulb (flipped the white switch but leaving my fans running as i normally do) and took care of whatever. I came back to the room about 40 minutes later ready to start the show. Flipped the power switch (fans had been on the entire time) and nothing.. I can hear the big relay click when I flip the power switch, but I don't hear the telltale low frequency faint *hum* that it usually does briefly right before the ignitor fires. The push button breaker is not popping and the ignitor doesn't even try to fire. There's also a low amperage buss fuse next to the power cord inlet that is ok. I poked around a bit and manually jumpered the other relay that runs the ignitor and that still fires off and seems to behave the same, but it appears there is no DC getting to the lamp. I tried reseating the control cards and then gave up since it was late.

Before I start ripping everything apart again, I was wondering if anyone who's had experience with these M1000 lamps has seen this behavior before and or can think of anything right off the top of the head to check initially. Sure appreciate any guidence. Thanks