Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Autoshutter has Sheared!!!

This is topic Autoshutter has Sheared!!! in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Peter David Bruce (Member # 4447) on 01-14-2008, 03:48 PM:

1 problem.
1 cancelled showing.
1 chance to fix.

ok so last showing of the day. we are running charlie wilsons war on screen one (our biggest) and just as the autoshutter (firetrap?) goes down (to block the light while the lens changes) and tries to come back up for the feature... the linkage snaps and theres sound, but no image on the screen!

so i stop the film, dismantle the casing, and take a look, expecting to see a screw loose and nothing more - WRONG!

it seems the screw that actually holds the linkage (metal rod)to the metal plate itself is well and truly GONE. looks like its come off and fallen into the shutter assembly, but i cannot see it.

im running the film on motor now, with no sound (non sync for the intermission cd) so we can get it back onto the platter for the morning.

will attempt to fix the problem tomorrow morning. i guess, and HOPE when i take off the shutter cover i can see the screw, reattach the autoshutter and bingo.

but if not... ill have to just use a piece of string in the place of the rod... something tells me it might not work very well!

we are using strong century MSC-TA projectors.

cheers!
pete

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-14-2008, 08:00 PM:

Sounds like the Changeover, not the fireshutter. If it is the fire shutter...remove it from the gear side...two screws and you are out.

If it is the changever shutter...remove it. You don't need to get into shutter compartment but you will need to take the shroud off the that surrounds the trap (two screws up where the linkage rod goes to grab the changeover). Once the cover is removed, you should be able to slide the changeover douser up and out of its track. Worry about putting it back in when you get the proper parts. Sometimes the pivots will break off if they are the modern light-weight types.

Steve

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-14-2008, 11:11 PM:

Used to have a bunch of Centuries in my old theater and those linkage rods would break ALL the time!

By the end of the first year of operation, all but one had busted several times.

My advice is to ditch the crappy linkage rods and make your own out of a solid piece of coat hanger wire. With a pair of dykes and a needle nose plier you can have the thing working again in under five minutes and it will never break again.

As a last-ditch, "Save the Show" maneuver you can take a piece of coat hanger wire with a hook bent into the end and use it to reach down into the shutter compartment to lift the changeover shutter without having to stop the projector.

However, it usually breaks just as the projector starts and the changeover opens. If it happens before the picture hits the screen it's a lot easier just to shut the projector off and remove the plate. Then you can quickly have the show on-screen again in just a few minutes.

Use the console dowser temporarily.

Repair the linkage with above-mentioned coat hanger between your next round of shows.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-14-2008, 11:22 PM:

That is a VERY common problem on the Strong change over. Also the little metal pins inside tend to snap as well. Kelmar has similar problems but not as often for what ever reason. I replaced a metal linkage rod just before xmas on a Strong Millennium. Sounds like you have multiple machines so ya might want to keep one extra in the booth and also those little pins inside are not available at the corner hardware store.

Mark

Posted by Peter David Bruce (Member # 4447) on 01-15-2008, 11:10 AM:

hi guys

thanks for all the replies. best solution i could come up with was fishing wire in place of the rod. works a treat for now... but hopefully soon ill be able to fix it properly.

ooh yesterday was one of those shifts! tiring! as soon as this happened, i was drained completely. had to do a rush job end of last night and then this morning i had to get a bus in cos trains werent working... still... alls fine now.

im surprised that this is a common problem with strong setups. it never did look that sturdy but then weve never had one go wrong ever... in 15years of use!

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-15-2008, 11:55 AM:

After a while, things like this won't vex you nearly as much.

Not to say that you don't care anymore but experience in dealing with a certain type of problem brings a certain level matter-of-fact calmness to the way you handle them.

What once seemed like an emergency becomes routine.

I'm serious about the coat hanger wire. Good, heavy steel wire won't break like those wimpy little linkage screws do. There was a period of time when this got so routine that, when it happened, I'd pick up a pair of pliers and grab an old wire coat hanger off the rack, almost without a second thought. In five minutes or less, I could have the replacement rod made and the picture would be on-screen again.

It has been over 10 years since these were done and there hasn't been a single complaint since and not one of them has broken.

Posted by Peter David Bruce (Member # 4447) on 01-15-2008, 12:08 PM:

thanks randy. i suppose it all comes down to
A) only being in projection for 5 months
B) not having many mechanical problems on my shifts
C) never having a need to improvise a fix!

worst problem ive had to fix was the changeover device not moving mid show. i moved it by hand, propped it up, dismantled it, replaced a bolt and regreased it, then went on as normal. ive never had anything big happen so that i cant start a show.

im incredibly meticulous with how i do my job. if it isnt right first time... i really kick myself badly. if something goes wrong on my shift its my complete responsibility and i feel i have to apologise to my customers (which im not allowed to do).

i will try the hanger idea. ive got some of those at home i can use. id rather do it that way, than rescrew it in again.

cheers for the advice randy. still nice to know i have some people i can rely on on here!

catch you later on.
peter

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-15-2008, 02:40 PM:

None of the students working for me knows how to fix a film wrap. That's because they've never seen one. That's because I teach them how to do the job right the first time and I hound them to constantly check and recheck their work.

The same thing goes for you. You don't know how to fix very many screw-ups because you've never seen any because you do the job right the first time!

I know the idea of using coat hanger wire to fix a projector seems dodgy when you first think of it but I've tried all sorts of things to fix the problem and they always came undone in the end. A heavy piece of solid steel wire with no screws or parts to break is just about the only thing that will stand up to the abuse that solenoid dishes out.

Work carefully. Take your time to figure things out and do a good job. If you get it right you'll never have to fix it again.

Then, if this ever happens again on another projector you can tell the person assisting you, "Hurry! Go get me a wire coat hanger!" then watch the look on their face as you quickly twist up a replacement.

Toss the old, broken parts into the trash can and tell them, "That's fixed for good!"

If anybody has doubts you can tell them that the Kelmar changeover arrangement on the Simplex projector uses the exact same solenoid unit on top of the projector but uses a solid steel wire with no joiners in it to lift the changeover plate. The only difference is that it uses small cotter pins to hold it in place.

Why will a solid piece of wire work on the Simplex but not on the Century?

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 01-15-2008, 07:56 PM:

The earlier Kelmar "wires" were solid and tended to break. The later ones could rotate where they connected to the blade. This helped.

Also, when you adjust them, do so in a way where they never quite close. The sudden stop wears the pin. Louis

Posted by Thomas Pitt (Member # 4322) on 01-16-2008, 01:50 AM:

If all else fails, perhaps you could just remove the changeover douser and run the projector without it. It seems to be a common problem - Bradford Cineworld uses Century projectors, and most of them have the changeover douser disabled or missing.

The slight downside of this is that when the lens changes over, the projected area will 'fall off' the screen and then zoom up the floor onto the screen. Even if you use black film to cover the changeover, you often get some light transmission leaving a noticeable lit area on the screen.

Posted by Peter David Bruce (Member # 4447) on 01-16-2008, 07:05 AM:

our site used to be a cineworld two years ago. we have the exact same setup. reading all these comments i realise we might be pretty lucky everything still works.. and only now are things starting to work loose. 15 years isnt too bad for one of those bits to last is it!

Posted by Eric Robinson (Member # 2966) on 01-17-2008, 01:05 AM:

A recommendation to remove the dowser for good may not be wise given the risk of a white screen at film end if there is an automation failure. I have seen many a burnt lens from this situation.

Additionally, I have found some nice solenoid linkage pins for the Kelmar changeovers from a company that supplies hardware for airplanes. After installing these new pins, I have never seen one sheer again.