Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: ORC 1000 Automation Wiring

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Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-18-2008, 12:48 AM:

Is there anyway to wire up an ORC 1000 to light on an automated system? There's nothing in the manual about it.

Posted by Al Biers (Member # 1961) on 02-18-2008, 08:43 PM:

Yes, on the left side of the lamp there was a small amphenol plug with a jumper in it, remove jumper and wire lamp on-off thru there.

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-19-2008, 10:47 PM:

Al,

was this on the inside of the lamp at TB1 or is this on the outside?

Thanks

Bernie

Posted by Al Biers (Member # 1961) on 02-23-2008, 09:33 PM:

On the lamps that I worked on it was on the outside on the left looking toward screen.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-23-2008, 10:56 PM:

The connector is indeed on the operator side. You jump the 7:00 and 8:00 connectors together to light the lamp and disconnect to extinguish it.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 02-24-2008, 08:54 AM:

FYI: not all of these lamps HAD an automation connection. Louis

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-24-2008, 09:56 PM:

Yeah, I have one that is the older version that doesn't have the plug and then I have one that is missing the plug, but has the opening in the side of the lamp. From what I was told when it was installed in the Jerry Lewis Cinema, they had a switched AC outlet as part of the automation and they bypassed the fans to keep them running all the time.

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-11-2009, 12:46 PM:

So I decided to give it another shot; hooking the lamp up to the automation. So I don't have to go crazy looking through schematics, hopefully someone could help by pointing me in the right direction. I'm using (2) ORC 1000's and of course, both are different. The first one is the original model with the metal toggle switch to turn it on and the second one is the Circuit Breaker on/off toggle switch. I want to use a outside relay that the automation switches to stirke the lamp, but to keep the fans running at all times (until power is disconnected). On the first lamp, where should I interupt the circuit. Right now, I have the fans wire "pre power switch" and they come on when the cord is plugged in. I talked to some people and they said that it should be after the 1/4 amp fuse which looks like it goes to the input of the control board. On the second lamp, I know there is already a jumper in there that is used for automation. The problem is, the original connector was removed and I really didn't take a close look at the connections. I'd figure I ask and maybe someone would tell me where to look. Its for a home set up so its not a pressing issue. I just want to get the stuff working. ANY help is appreciated. As always, thanks again.

Posted by System Notices (Member # 2357) on 02-18-2010, 12:33 AM:

It has been 371 days since the last post.

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-18-2010, 12:33 AM:

I was thinking about doing this again and was wondering, since I'm dealing with 2 different kinds of ORC 1000 lamps (one designed to be used with automation and one that isn't), that if it was possible to use the lamphouse interlocks as a way to connect it to the automation. The automation supplies a dry contacts for a lighting the lamp. Both of the lamp houses employ interlock switches. Why couldn't the automation contacts be in series to the interlock? Its just like any other switch, right? What's the current of the interlock circuit? Even if I use a relay between the automation and the lamp. Any thoughts?

Bernie

Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-18-2010, 12:39 PM:

Bernie,

That is how most lamps are wired to the automation though they use a terminal strip to make it look pretty. If you look at the circuit for say a strong the automation will send the 120 volts to the safety interlocks and as long as they are all closed it will send the 120 volts to the coil of the contactor causing it to pull in and light the lamp.

What you want to do is take the 120 volts coming in from the power supply and cut it off before the first safety switch and send it into your automation's lamp relay feed side. Take the other end with the switches on it and connect it to the output side of that relay. Now if you leave your lamphouse controls in the "On" (Or automation) p0sition it should light up when you start the automation or use the manual switch on the automation.

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-18-2010, 12:59 PM:

Thanks, I just wanted confirmation on that. Those interlock circuits are usually lower current, right? I know the entire lamp pulls about 18 amps.

Bernie

Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-18-2010, 05:21 PM:

The safety circuit should be regular A/C 120 Volt 20 Amp "house" current. Regardless though your power supply should supply it to the lamphouse.

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-21-2010, 11:12 AM:

So, I got the newer lamphouse hooked up to the automation. It was as simple as finding the old wires to the automation plug (which was removed) and splicing in the automation in series with the circuit.

Now, the older 1000 (first gen with metal toggle switch) has a very different circuit for the interlock. The way it looks is that the interlock switch is in series with the power plug. In the manual, they recommend wiring in a 15 amp relay to the main power plug and switching that. But is there another way to do it in these older lamps? I was looking at the relay on top... what if you broke the wire prior to the first relay contact. I'm assuming by the size of the wire its very low current. Its about an 18-20 gauge wire. What do you think?
Thanks
Bernie

Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-21-2010, 02:30 PM:

I would say that where it sais to use a relay in the older lamphouse is where you want to connect to the the relay in your automation. Basically you want the relay in your automation to be the first "switch" in your safety interlock circuit.

Your circuit should go like this...

Power Supply 120 Out------automation relay-----safety switch-----safety switch-----coil on power supply contactor

Now when all your safety switches are closed and you switch on the automation it will pull in the contactor on your power supply and light the lamp. If they did not provide a place to tap into this circuit I would disconnect the incoming side of the first safety switch run the appropriate gauge 2 conuctor cable to your automation with one wire as the input to the relay and one as the output. Wire the output wire to where you disconnected from the switch and splice the wire that you disconnected together with the input wire.

I hope this makes sense.

Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 02-21-2010, 11:56 PM:

Hey Sean,

I took a look at the lamp again tonight. Everything up to the first interlock (which is the only one) is high voltage and high current. There is really no "real" safety circuit. I pull the relay to see what would happen. Of course it wouldn't like, put you still can hear that the transformer's powered, although the lamp was off. Here's the schematic for this particular version. See what you think? ORC 1000 Electrical Schematic I'm starting to think that a 18-20 amp 110vac relay might be the easiest way to go.

Thanks

Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-22-2010, 07:36 AM:

With this particular unit you could switch the incoming 120V A/C because the entire unit runs off of that single phase "house" current unlike most other xenon lamp houses/power supplies. However, it may become an issue where if you modify something inside of a unit it would not require an electrician, if you modify the power coming into the unit then you might need an electrician. I would add a relay (or use your automations existing lamp control relay) between "cb1" and "s1" or between "s2" and "tb1"

What kind of automation are you using? Your automation should have a 120V AC relay for the lamp. I am not sure what you mean by "high" voltage. If you mean the 120V ac "house" current then that is what you are looking to switch with that relay. The only low voltage will be what the automation sends to open/close that relay. The relay itself should be built to pass 120V ac.

If you are unsure about running wires into your automation to carry 120 Volts you could install a similar relay inside the unit (If there is room) and run the low voltage control circuit to the lamphouse if that makes you more comfortable. That way you would not have to "splice" any 120 Volt wires.

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 02-23-2010, 12:06 AM:

quote: Sean McKinnon
Your automation should have a 120V AC relay for the lamp. I am not sure what you mean by "high" voltage. If you mean the 120V ac "house" current then that is what you are looking to switch with that relay. The only low voltage will be what the automation sends to open/close that relay. The relay itself should be built to pass 120V ac.

Sean, stop right here! The relays in most automations for the lamp are designed to handle at MOST 5 amps at 120 volts!! You will fry the relay and possibly the automation's wiring if you try to control the 13-plus amps of one of those ORC's. The lamp relay in automation is intended to only pull in the rectifier contactor of a standard lamphouse.

Even the motor relays are usually rated at only ten amps.

Bernie, use an outboard relay with at least 20 amp contacts rating and let your automation switch that outboard relay. Use 12 gauge wire to connect the contacts and make sure all connections are tight.

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 02-23-2010, 07:13 AM:

Tony is correct the automation relays will not handle the full lamphouse current
that said the normal relay used in most automations are 10a for the 120 circuits
put a contactor in serries with the lamphouse feed and swithc it

Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-23-2010, 05:45 PM:

At fist I thought these units had a built in contactor. That is what I intended for him to switch with his automation was a 120v 5amp circuit. On my last post I meant to say that he should install a seperate relay (contactor) either in his automation or in the unit if there was room but I realize now re reading what I wrote that it was not what I said. I will edit it for any future readers.

Well the forum wont let me edit it as it has been too long. The following is how I should have written my post;

With this particular unit you could switch the incoming 120V A/C because the entire unit runs off of that single phase "house" current unlike most other xenon lamp houses/power supplies. However, it may become an issue where if you modify something inside of a unit it would not require an electrician, if you modify the power coming into the unit then you might need an electrician. I would add a relay capable of handling 120 volts at 20amps between "cb1" and "s1" or between "s2" and "tb1"

What kind of automation are you using? Your automation should have a 120V AC relay for the lamp but you will not want to use that as it will not handle the current of the lamphouse. You can replace it with a relay capable of latching with your automation but able to pass 120 Volts at 20 amps. The only low voltage will be what the automation sends to open/close that relay. The relay itself should be built to pass 120V ac at 20 amps.

If you are unsure about running wires into your automation to carry 120 Volts you could install a similar relay inside the unit (If there is room) and run the low voltage control circuit to the lamphouse if that makes you more comfortable. That way you would not have to "splice" any 120 Volt wires.