Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Moving Prints Between Two Buildings

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Posted by Aaron Mehocic (Member # 15) on 08-09-2008, 10:23 PM:

Since acquiring two theaters in the same town our booker has arranged many prints to be transported from the first-run location down to the sub-run. Clamping prints works, but I'm looking for some other alternative for safe moving. The other operators like these, but I'm certain they're way out-of-line in terms of price.

What other recommendations are out there?

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 08-09-2008, 10:52 PM:

We have a version of that but we made them ourselves. It just takes some woodworking skills and won't set you back too far budget-wise. If I can, I'll get a photo of one and post it.

Posted by Justin Hamaker (Member # 2165) on 08-09-2008, 11:00 PM:

I frequently have to move prints between our cinema and drive-in. In the past I've just clamped the prints and moved them. But this year I started breaking them down onto two 6K reels and then winding them back on at the drive-in. It's a little more time consuming, but there is far less risk. Plus, anything over about 110min didn't fit well in my car.

I still use the clamps if I'm pressed for time, but the 6K reels works well and it doesn't cost anything extra.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-09-2008, 11:15 PM:

I do clamps and a pizza board made out of 3/8" plywood with dimensions of 32"x36" for print moving.

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 08-10-2008, 03:55 PM:

We have had good luck using the Print Pocket for transporting between theatres

Posted by Bryan M. Montgomery (Member # 4412) on 08-10-2008, 04:22 PM:

I did the old "clamp it and CAREFULLY put it in the trunk" deal many times, never liked doing it. I've been a proponent of the Print Pocket for a while now, it has been a tremendous time saver for me and I believe, your best and safest option for transporting in a vehicle with the print still ring mounted. I do suggest getting a strip of double sided velcro (like the print bands) and loop it through the handle and the ring and sinch it down to keep it in the pocket. The last thing you want is a dropped print in the parking lot. Man, that would suck!

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-11-2008, 03:18 AM:

And in case the original poster isn't aware, the print pocket is pretty much identical to the thing linked to above. The only difference is that a print pocket can come both in a plywood model similar to the one linked above but also in plastic though all of them I've seen have wheels (the link above seems to indicate the wheels are optional).

Posted by Stu Jamieson (Member # 4626) on 08-11-2008, 03:35 AM:

That thing that Aaron linked to is exactly the same thing (functionally) that we use except that one is tarted up to look like (and, no doubt, cost) a million dollars.

Like everyone else, we also use these sleeves to cart between sites. Depending on how tight the platter wind is, we may also use these in conjunction with a clamp or two.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-11-2008, 03:51 AM:

Course, if you have any 13k reels floating around with your Christie equipment, those reels do fit the MUT if you move your rollers out of the way.

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 08-11-2008, 04:45 AM:

quote: Stu Jamieson
That thing that Aaron linked to is exactly the same thing (functionally) that we use except that one is tarted up to look like (and, no doubt, cost) a million dollars.

Not quite, but close.

>>Recommended Customer Price: 328€/444€ (FC-100/FC-115)<< [eyes]

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-11-2008, 08:15 AM:

I think that the answer to this question depends upon how much the operators at the two theatres trust each other.

I can count on one hand the number of people I know from whom I would accept a print without feeling the need to re-inspect it on the bench. I would never accept a plattered-and-clamped print from anyone else.

Unless there is a high degree of trust between the theatres, I would say that breaking the film down onto 6000' reels would be the safest approach. It minimizes the damage that can happen on breakdown and subsequent makeup because most features would only need to be handled in one place, but still allows bench inspection at the next house. It also reduces the print to smaller, lighter, more easily (and safely) handled units. Just be sure to add 10-20 feet of protective head and tail leader on each of the 6k' reels.

Posted by Kenneth Wuepper (Member # 1174) on 08-11-2008, 08:27 AM:

For a film festival we used the 6,000 foot reels and enclosed them in plastic dry cleaner bags to help minimize dirt during transfer in the car.

One theatre is reel to reel and the other is platter. Both theatres have 1/2 inch shafts. Unfortunately, the over sized 6,000 foot reels from the platter house did not fit into the magazines of the reel house. The 6,000 foot reels from the big theatre had spacers for the 70mm magazines and did not fit on the spindle of the platter house MUT so a special shaft was machined to accommodate them.

KEN

Posted by Jim Cassedy (Member # 4115) on 08-11-2008, 12:18 PM:

I regularly use the "Print Pocket" to move films between theaters located about two city blocks from each other.

It just happens to clamp perfectly into this bicycle-rack-thingy that one of the theater staff members has on the back of his car. However, in a pinch we have actually hand carried the print down the street.

THIS IS A PRINT POCKET

We have two of them, but the theater owner doesn't remember where he got them. It has a little sticker attached giving the website of the manufacturer, but the URL no longer works.

Someone with carpentry skills could probably make something similar. It's made from masonite, with simple pine wood frame.
Very lightweight but strong. You can't see it, but there is a small weel on one end that allows you to roll it from one booth to another in the same theater, but IMO wheel isn't durable enough to roll down a city sidewalk without breaking off.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-11-2008, 12:25 PM:

I don't know how much these pocket things cost, but they aren't anywhere as good of a method as using a Goldberg Platter Reel and simply winding up the last show on that and carrying the film on a reel to the next venue. The platter reels aren't that expensive AND they will MORE than pay for themselves with the drastic savings in buildup time on Thursday nights.

Read this and buy one

Posted by Jim Cassedy (Member # 4115) on 08-11-2008, 12:58 PM:

So, Brad- - Do you know who sells/distributes the Goldberg Platter reel?

I'd considered buying one but the local theater suppliers I spoke to had either never heard of them or told me they were
no longer being made.
(I'm somwhat skeptical of that last remark, which came from a supplier who has a tendency to say that when HE doesn't carry a particular product in his inventory and wants to sell me something else)

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-11-2008, 01:00 PM:

It's a good idea, but some theatre owners refuse to spend money for such conveniences for their booth personnel.

Some places are just plain lucky to have clamps and other cheap forms of moving prints. Otherwise, it's the classic 6k reel usage for print transfers.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-11-2008, 01:07 PM:

A platter reel costs about the same as two 6K reels, so there is really no excuse.

And yes Jim, they are still being made. Sounds like it is time to change dealers. With you being in CA, there shouldn't be any problem finding another dealer nearby.

Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 08-11-2008, 01:09 PM:

R.S. Engineering & Mfg sells them.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-11-2008, 01:14 PM:

Two 6k reels costing $539.11,what RSEM is selling this thing for?

I'd be shot in the head if I presented this platter reel idea with my superiors...

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-11-2008, 01:58 PM:

Just because it's the size of 2 6K reels doesn't make it valid to call it "2 6K reels." You save time building up (no need for rewinding) and this thing could also be used in place of a donut/board for moving plattered prints.

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-11-2008, 02:04 PM:

Except that you still need the 6k' reels even if you have the platter reels. The 6k' reels are needed for dealing with prints that come in tails-up and also for exchanging prints with changeover houses (assuming that the changeover houses can accommodate the large reels).

The platter reels are great, but really doesn't help with either of those issues.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-11-2008, 02:07 PM:

quote: Chris Slycord
You save time building up (no need for rewinding) and this thing could also be used in place of a donut/board for moving plattered prints

..and I won't argue on that one.

But sadly, the $$$ sign is more important to a lot of companies to be used somewhere else (mainly, for their own benefit than for the employee's benefit) and where money could be used in more useful places, it ususally gets spent where it really doesn't need to be at.

-Monte

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-11-2008, 02:21 PM:

If prints get built up quicker don't they save payroll?

Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 08-11-2008, 02:57 PM:

I can see where if you just say "I need a $600 platter reel" the bean counters would reflexively reply "No".

OTOH, if you give them a cost-benefit justification that shows the reel paying for itself in a reasonable period of time by, for example, reducing their labor cost, thus making the theater more profitable, that's something they can understand. If it also helps the presentation, that's a bonus.

Posted by Jim Cassedy (Member # 4115) on 08-11-2008, 03:44 PM:

quote: Chris Slycord
If prints get built up quicker don't they save payroll?

Not necessarily.

I'm aware of at least two theaters here in San Francisco that pay a flat "bonus" rate to the platter-jockey who gets stuck making up or breaking prints.

So they get paid the same regardless of if it takes them 30min or 2hrs.

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-11-2008, 04:15 PM:

Well of course if the person who's doing the build-ups was going to be there regardless for his normal shift and was building up in addition to his/her normal duties then yeah saving time wouldn't save $.

Then again, if you made it so that dealing with the build-up was no big deal (due to it taking far less time for the operator) you could remove that extra bonus fee I would think.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 08-11-2008, 04:19 PM:

We got paid for a build-up and a teardown when we moved a prints between buildings. And at select locations we got paid for the moves (buildups & teardowns) of prints within a theatre in one of those large palaces that was plexed with a booth in the former balconey. And the chains paid for build-ups and teardowns on regular engagements, plus your regular hourly rate at the theatre.

Posted by Justin Hamaker (Member # 2165) on 08-11-2008, 04:48 PM:

From my perspective, the main advantage of a platter reel is when you get those sub-run prints on Friday morning that have to be on screen 90 minutes after you receive them . While the reels certainly save time over building up on 6K reels, I don't feel like it saves a ton of time - certainly not enough time to justify the cost when build up is usually just part of the daily routine of someone who is going to be on site anyways.

Don't misunderstand me, I'm certainly glad my boss was willing to buy one. I'm just saying that I don't think the labor savings is enough to justify spending $500.

For Jim: I believe we purchased ours the Harrah's Theatre Supply.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 08-11-2008, 09:38 PM:

quote: David Stambaugh
reducing their labor cost, thus making the theater more profitable, that's something they can understand. If it also helps the presentation, that's a bonus.

Oh, do fully agree with you Dave on this, just that the actual payoff that some of the bean counters (and they count every bean-big and small) will ask is: "If getting this device increases the tix sales whereas the previous method of clamps and board have proven itself to be a dependable method of doing film moves, then it will be worth it. Otherwise, it 's just money tossed out the door." (and this attitude goes along on the same breath of doing booth modification that could increase tix sales, but they see that things are going okey, why change it out...)

And by that, sadly, they are just seeing projection staff as just people doing their job and nothing else.

Goes back to the old saying that a cynic is a person who knows the price of everything, but knows the value of nothing.

Personally, I would love to have one of these devices, but unfortunately, I don't have a main booth that I work in all the time - just watch over others plus the one I work at..and this would be the main reason of not getting one since to have others trained and learned out on how to handle a device would be complicated to these other booth locations. To them, doing clamps and boards is just easy enough for the booth jockeys to handle.
-Monte

Posted by James R. Hammonds, Jr (Member # 673) on 08-11-2008, 10:01 PM:

I have one question about taking up on the platter reel.
How do you secure it to the platter.
Since different types of platters use different types of rings, wouldn't the holes for the center ring be spaced differently for each one?

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-12-2008, 12:36 AM:

quote: Scott Norwood
The 6k' reels are needed for dealing with prints that come in tails-up

Why? Unless you have a MUT like those from Strong (which obviously can't fit something the size of a platter reel), wouldn't you simply build the movie up from end to beginning onto the reel then put it on your MUT and run the entire feature onto the platter?

quote: James R. Hammonds, Jr
Since different types of platters use different types of rings, wouldn't the holes for the center ring be spaced differently for each one?

It doesn't use your platter's ring. The part that you attach the film to is removeable so you center the print then remove that part and the film can run as-is.

Posted by Kenneth Wuepper (Member # 1174) on 08-12-2008, 06:08 AM:

Chris,

He is asking about using the reel as TAKEUP for removing the film after the last showing on that platter. In that case you do need a center to attach the end of the film. What do you use?

KEN

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-12-2008, 07:16 AM:

The platter reels have their own plastic center rings. You take up using one half of the platter reel attached to this ring, then attach the other flange to the top before moving the reel.

These rings have an assortment of holes in them that should line up with the holes on most platter systems. I have stuck Allen wrenches through these holes to engage the hole on the platter decks, but this is supposedly not necessary.

Posted by Geena Phillips (Member # 3726) on 08-12-2008, 12:16 PM:

We move a TON of prints between locations; I'm definitely gonna look into getting one or two of these.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-12-2008, 12:55 PM:

The reel is heavy enough not to slip. For removable brain platters just lay the entire reel fully assembled down on the platter and get it approximately centered and you are fine.

If you have stationary brains, then you have to use Scott's approach detailed above.

Posted by Aaron Mehocic (Member # 15) on 08-16-2008, 10:44 AM:

Thank you for all the suggestions. I will present these products for consideration of the man with the cash.