Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Running TOO slick?

This is topic Running TOO slick? in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Tyler Potts (Member # 4952) on 09-29-2008, 04:48 PM:

New to post (faith weather site visitor) and newly appointed head of projection. I came into lead a booth where the last deep clean was months ago, dirt all over prints and scratches.

I ran film guard for the first time (we've had it, but never really used it) on a dirty print of Wall-E and fell in love. I set up daily duties and prints were receiving film guard once a week and projector deep cleans once a week. Now about 4 weeks into this, I'm keeping deep cleans weekly, but film guard only on new prints and special cases.

My question is, has anyone had problems with after using film guard a print running TOO slick? I've had two prints so far where my tension bands were maxed and I was still getting uncontrollable vertical jumping. I replaced those tension bands and then ran the print through film guard without the lubricant (across dry media rollers to take off the film guard).

Posted by Jeremy Weigel (Member # 4208) on 09-29-2008, 04:53 PM:

What type of projectors are you using?

Posted by Tyler Potts (Member # 4952) on 09-29-2008, 04:59 PM:

Simplex

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 09-29-2008, 05:38 PM:

You don't say how you're applying the Film-Guard to the print. If you're using Film-Guard correctly (with a media cleaner) you'll never get too much FG on the film.

Posted by Tyler Potts (Member # 4952) on 09-29-2008, 06:06 PM:

I have 2 film guard units as seen in the main picture here:

I spray the bulk of the roll before use (if you soak the take up side, it'll loosen the tape and not spin correctly) play the film through as told.

At this moment I am a fan only because it cleaned extremely dirty prints, and appears to keep dirt away on new prints. When I started weekly application, I started getting problems with having increase tension bands on numerous projectors. I feel clean projectors/platters/brains can suffice to keep a print in the highest quality of presentation.

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 09-29-2008, 06:43 PM:

HEY! Those media rolls are blue! [Wink]

quote: Tyler Potts
I replaced those tension bands and then ran the print through film guard without the lubricant (across dry media rollers to take off the film guard).

Do you still have issues with those bands? Perhaps the FG just pointed out another problem with your machines. Even if you apply by FG quite liberally by hand you should not have any issues with your tension. Yes, it will have to be increased...but if you've run out of gate tension the problem is not with you applying FG.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-29-2008, 06:47 PM:

How often are you applying Filmguard to the prints? If it is once a week as recommended, then I don't see how you can get "too much, too soon" which is what is going on here. You don't need to resoak the rolls for each run. Just rewind and run again for a week with the same media pads on the same print. When changing out to new media pads the following week, soak them only once as well.

quote: Tyler Potts
I feel clean projectors/platters/brains can suffice to keep a print in the highest quality of presentation.

Oh? While things like that certainly help, your print can and will still get dirty. Do you thread so the leader touches the floor? If ANYONE in your booth does this, then you might as well already admit defeat in the cleanliness area.

Posted by Tyler Potts (Member # 4952) on 09-29-2008, 07:17 PM:

*ugh* Don't get me started on that... I only have 2 projectionists that I've trained personally, the others thread by pulling enough leader as if they're wallpapering the floors.

But yeah, we're soaking the pads about once a day, tossing them when they're done, and as of last week once a week. It appears the projectors with problems are the simplex with a swinging gate (the other straight closing are running fine).

Haha, from recent brief readings I guess there's an inside joke about blue/white media pads that I've yet to learn...

My main concern is that I'm fine with this. Some prints run with high tension band settings than others, I understand. But I had a projectionist the other day wedge a roll of tape between the gate and lens to keep enough tension from the image jumping. This followed after I cleaned the projector as ran the print with film guard for the 1st time that week because it was shedding emulsion in giant green cotton balls.

The less I can have people in booth pulling this blue grass fixes the better.

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 09-29-2008, 10:03 PM:

No, not once a day...apply Film Guard once a week. Toss the pads at the end of the week and go again.

You're drowning your prints and wasting money for no benefit by applying daily.

Posted by Tyler Potts (Member # 4952) on 09-29-2008, 10:14 PM:

Apply film guard to the roller media pads once a week?

So if I have 3 - 5 prints a weekend, only soak the pads once per week. My GM almost wants me to go as far as keeping the rolls in ziplock bags soaking in film guard.

Hopefully trying this new (less soaking) approach will help jumping.

Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 09-29-2008, 10:38 PM:

Ummm...

Show your boss the instructions on the label. I'm pretty sure they don't say anything about daily soaking or keeping the media in plastic bags.

Follow the instructions... you'll most likely be fine. If you come up with your own "custom application procedure" you're probably on your own.

(excerpt from instructions found on this site):

quote:
At the end of each show, rewind the media pads to the start again...

I recommend the film be ran on every show and new pads with freshly soaked FilmGuard be loaded onto the cleaner once a week. In short, use the same set of media pads over and over for an entire week.

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 09-29-2008, 11:24 PM:

quote: Tyler Potts
My GM almost wants me to go as far as keeping the rolls in ziplock bags soaking in film guard.

Perhaps we have found the problem.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 09-30-2008, 12:51 AM:

Once a day is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too much. Stick to the once a week as is noted in the instructions and you won't have any further issues.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-30-2008, 12:59 AM:

By the way Tyler, Brad here invented the stuff, so you may want to at least briefly consider his opinions on the matter. [Smile]