Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Highlight II/Switching power supply -- Lamp won't strike

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Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-18-2008, 06:41 PM:

Alright, boys and girls. This one's a doozie. Got me one of them Highlight II consoles, mid 90's vintage, I'd say, with a hard wire 1-3kW Version 0 switching power supply. The original trouble call was due to the PS tripping the 3-phase breaker in the wall panel. When I turned on the PS, I nearly had to check my shorts, for it made a pretty loud pop I was not prepared for, and the wall breaker tripped. So I removed the PS, and installed a quick-connect upgrade kit with a 1-3kW Version 1 supply. You know, with all the pretty little lights on it. Now the lamp will not strike, and in fact, the GO light on the PS does not come on. Seems like an interlock problem, right? I triple checked the interlock circuit, right down to checking continuity of every switch. I swapped the power supply with a known good one, I swapped the lamphouse meter/control panel with a known good one, and I even swapped the wire harness from the upgrade kit, thinking there was an issue with the MS connector. Still nothing.

I checked the continuity of the wires that go from pins 2, 4, and 6 on the meter board down to the terminal strip on the wire harness. They are all good and there are no shorts between wires. With the power supply on, there is 110v between pins 2&4, 2&5, 4&6, and 5&6. There is continuity between 2,4 and 5 (all three). This checks out the same in an adjacent house, so I assume it's normal. The console/spotlight switch is in the console position. Moving it to spotlight does not fix the problem. (Not that I thought it would, but at this point I'll try anything.)

My temporary solution, per Strong, was to disconnect the console control wires from the little terminal strip and install a jumper across pins 4 and 6. The lamp will light whenever the power supply is turned on.

Suggestions?

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 11-18-2008, 09:22 PM:

Ken,

There are a couple areas here...Since the rectifier does its thing with your jumper...its time to isolate which interlock is causing the problem or, more likely the RF filter (presumming you have one). If your console has the RF filter (looks like a metal brick of several inches in each dimension and the 5/6 wires are attached to it...loose it. The newer rectifiers don't use a contactor. That RF filter will either be breaking the VERY LOW CURRENT circuit or it will provide a permanent short.

Failing that, one at a time, jump out the interlocks (doors as well as sail switches) until the continutity is restored. Again, due to the lower current in the newer rectifier control circuits, what would work on a typical contactor will NOT necessarily pass enough current on the newer system.

Steve

Posted by Eric Robinson (Member # 2966) on 11-19-2008, 10:15 AM:

I read and reread your post and it appeared as if the following information may be helpful. If you already know this information then please disregard this post.

2 --->>>120VAC OUT-------->> 5 Jumpered
4 --->>>120VAC OUT---/ --->> 6 Interlock path

2 and 4 supply 120VAC output
5 and 6 receive the 120VAC and turn on switcher

If in your case terminal 2 is jumpered to terminal 5
you need only worry about the path from 4 to 6

Measure the VAC on terminals 2 and 4 (should be 120VAC)

Turn your console lamp switch on.

Measure the voltage on terminals 5 and 6. If there is no voltage
then your console interlock circuit has am open somewhere
between the switchers output terminal 4 and the switchers
input terminal 6.

That is why jumpering 4 to 6 causes the switcher to come on bacause you are bypassing the entire interlock circuit.

Interesting point that Steve made about the possibility of low current causing the problem. Its possible you would see the voltage whilst the current would be too low to activate the switcher...that's a tricky one.

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-19-2008, 02:16 PM:

Ken, it's possible that when the first supply let out that loud pop, it may have fried someting in the interlock circuit. Measure continuity of ALL the interlock switches, especially the air sail switches. One or more may have high resistance or be completely open.

Posted by Tristan Lane (Member # 1169) on 11-19-2008, 09:37 PM:

Steve, When you are referring to the RF filter, do you mean that "voltage divider PCB" that attaches on the shunt, or the filter caps?

I've had that particular component cause the exact problem that Ken describes.

Ken, also check the wiring at the stack interlock switch. It may be cooked and shorting to the shield wire. I've never understood why Strong decided to use 2C shielded wire for their interlock switches.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 11-19-2008, 10:07 PM:

If you have CNA-100 or simmilar automation in the console then check the large green PCB in the back that has the motor and lamp relays on it. I've seen the foil traces literally blow off the board by a short in the system, possibly the loud pop myou heard???... seen this on both lamp and motor circuits on that same board... Cheap Strong Equipment!

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 11-20-2008, 12:25 AM:

Use Christies in those lamphouses when it comes to STRONG switchers.

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-20-2008, 10:23 AM:

Yeah. I'll be sure to just buy a new power supply to solve my problem. Thanks for the advice! [thumbsup]

Not.

Ok, this is really starting to piss me off. I came in fresh this morning to start from scratch. First thing I did was check continuity on EVERY interlock switch. All were okay. I removed my jumper on the terminal strip and connected the console wires back up, fired the thing up and tried to strike. I was using the lamp switch on the automation panel. CNA-100, indeed. Of course it didn't work. For grins, I tried the manual switch on the lamphouse control panel, and whaddaya know, it worked. Investigation revealed that the little red connector (what is this connector called?) on the back of the control board for the automation was offset by one pin. D'oh! So I connected it properly, and everything worked. The automation would now strike the lamp.

This was all with the back door open and that switch jumpered because that was the only way I could get to the back of the control board. So the final step, of course, was to remove my jumper and close the door. Now she doesn't work. So you would conclude that the back door safety switch is the culprit, right? Yeah, so would I. But I tested it by placing magnet against it, and there is continuity. I even reinstalled my jumper on that switch so that everything was exactly as it was just ten minutes before, and it's still not working. Am I loosing my mind? Once again, I've gone back and checked every switch, and they all seem okay. I'll look into Steve's suggestion, but if that were the case, why would it have worked once today and now it's not?

Posted by Jeremy Weigel (Member # 4208) on 11-20-2008, 11:34 AM:

Hey Ken,

I had several Highlight 2's (1999) that had loose connections on those small red connectors that plug into the back of the lamp control board. The problem was that the wires were not fully seated into the back of the plug. This was back in 2000, but if memory serves it was on either the J6 or J10 plug.

My symptoms were:

Switcher Indicators all green
No load voltage 150v
No striking of the lamp

Hope this helps.

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-20-2008, 12:44 PM:

Thanks for the tip, Jeremy. I did check that, and all the wires seemed to be seated properly in the connector. I used the tip of a small flat blade screwdriver to push them down just to make sure. Is there a tool available for making these connectors?

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 11-20-2008, 01:15 PM:

I have often had issues with those magnetic switchs and the magnet on the door not lineing up with the switch so the reed switch never pulls in

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-20-2008, 01:34 PM:

Ken, as Mark said check out the circuit board traces on the CNA-100 board, but also take a soldering iron to ALL of the relay and terminal connections..I have found bad solder joints there on a few service calls. (One where the motor either wouldn't run at all or made some strange noises as it attempted to run, I happened to see the blue light from behind the relay. [Smile]

)

It's possible that when you moved that red connector plug it made contact momentarily, so that's the first area I'd look at to re-solder.

Like Mark said, cheap Strong (aka Ballenswine) equipment!!

Oh yeah, at a real electronics store (and on rare instances, Fry's) you can get the tool to seat those connector pins. IIRC, it's a standard molex connector, so ask for a molex pin insertion/extractor tool. Digi-key and Mouser have them online.

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-20-2008, 02:54 PM:

Tony,

The lamp does not strike even when I use the manual switch on the lamp control panel, so I don't think it's an issue with the automation termination panel. And these are not Molex connectors. They are the little red connectors that are also found on the Eprad SLM-150 monitor.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 11-20-2008, 04:03 PM:

Somewhere along the line, an open is present why you're not getting 120v to close the contactor inside to get you power.

Do you have another hardwire version rectifier that you can go back to your original config so you can, at least, 'condemn' that part of the equasion?

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-20-2008, 04:20 PM:

The spares on site are all quick-connect. I have already eliminated the power supply as the cause of the problem by swapping it with another house that had a QC. The problem did not follow the PS, it stayed in the original house.

Posted by Jeremy Weigel (Member # 4208) on 11-20-2008, 05:24 PM:

Are you getting any no load voltage reading on the meter?

Since everything worked until you closed the door I would open it back up bypass the switch again as before and gently wiggle the wires going up to that control board. This is how I found out that I had those loose connections. You might even have a broken wire inside the insulation.

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-23-2008, 12:09 AM:

Ken, any update on this issue?

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-23-2008, 12:26 AM:

Remember my jumper across terminals 4 and 6? Those terminals are now hooked up to a switch, so at least for now they can strike the lamp manually that way.

I did not check the no load voltage because the lamp will strike under certain conditions and not others, so I know the power supply, ignitor, and lamp are all fine. The GO light on the PS is not coming on, so there won't be any no load voltage because the PS isn't even trying to strike the lamp. I did open the door and reconnect my jumper, still nothing. I have checked continuities, reseated connectors, measured voltages, all many times over. Still nothing. At this point, all I can think of is replacing each part of the interlock circuit until it works. Despite what my multimeter is telling me, the problem has to be somewhere in there. How can it not?

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-24-2008, 02:19 AM:

I agree with you that the problem is in the interlock circuits. And yes, despite what your multimeter is telling you, you def have a bad swich somewhere in that interlock circuit. It is possible that the contacts are fried badly enough to prevent proper current flow. ANY switch that has a resistance value (when closed) of greater than 0.25 (1/4) ohm is bad. Use the lowest ohm range on your meter (1 or 10 ohm fullscale).

Another trick to test the interlocks is to connect them up as they should be, then with power on, set your meter to 200volt AC scale, connect one lead to 2 (or 5, since they're jumpered) and use the other lead to read voltage on EACH side of EVERY switch. If the switch is good, you'll read the 120vac ON BOTH sides. The bad switch is the one where you read 120vac ON ONE side only. And if you read 0 volts on BOTH sides, then it is the next switch back in the loop that's bad.

I hope that makes sense, it's hard to do this as a text..

K, let me try this:

2-----(jumper)------5 (Meter lead 1 here)

4-----x1(sw)x2----x3(sw)x4-----x5(sw)x6------x7(sw)x8------6

test with meter lead two at the "x"s

Let's say the switch in BOLD is the bad one, so here's what you'd get at each of the x's:

x1: 120v
x2: 120v
x3: 120v
x4: 120v
x5: 120v
x6: 0v
x7: 0v
x8: 0v