Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: STUDIO MOVIE GRILL CITY CENTRE

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Posted by Bevan Wright (Member # 1884) on 03-22-2009, 11:01 PM:

Very impressive Brad, that is quite a customer you have there. Does the preshow play off the Doremi servers or its it a separate system?

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 03-22-2009, 11:47 PM:

Congratulations Brad and Josh on such a well designed clean install. The Film-less booth is remarkable, although without all the film running around, it's almost boring to look at - from a non exhibitor film enthusiast standpoint [Smile]

I have a question, does this theater boast that it's all digital or is it kind of kept casual? Do the patrons seem to notice? If so, what is the general reaction?

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 03-23-2009, 02:43 AM:

I didn't see anything referencing it being all digital on the section for the new location at SMG's webpage. Though that might just be an oversight. [Smile]

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 03-23-2009, 05:28 AM:

Are they going to paint the booth walls?

Nice installation, otherwise. Using the projection equipment automation to control the rest of the building based upon showtimes is brilliant. [thumbsup]

Posted by Steven J Hart (Member # 2340) on 03-23-2009, 07:40 AM:

Looks like the name "Film"-Tech will have to be changed to something more DCI compliant. [Wink]

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 03-23-2009, 07:55 AM:

television-tech.com is available.... [Smile]

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 03-23-2009, 11:11 AM:

movie-tech.com is available as well. [Smile]

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-23-2009, 12:52 PM:

I was thinking vid-tech.com had more of a ring to it.

quote: Bevan Wright
Does the preshow play off the Doremi servers or its it a separate system?

It is a separate system that loops.

quote: Sean Weitzel
without all the film running around, it's almost boring to look at - from a non exhibitor film enthusiast standpoint

Its also a bit weird in the fact that since we are using the projectors for preshow as well (it doesn't cost any more than maintaining a separate little projector), the bulbs never turn off so you can't really tell when a show is over if you are sitting in the booth.

quote: Sean Weitzel
I have a question, does this theater boast that it's all digital or is it kind of kept casual?

The intention was to advertise it, but you're right now that I think about it, other than a poster in the lobby there is no mention of it.

quote: Scott Norwood
Are they going to paint the booth walls?

It would've been nice, but since that room is destined to evolve into cobwebs, the paint was cut from the project.

quote: Sean Weitzel
Congratulations Brad and Josh on such a well designed clean install.

Don't forget Danny. He may be the quiet one but it took all 3 of us.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 03-23-2009, 01:38 PM:

Great job Brad! Even though I've known about this for the last 6 months it looks much nicer in the pics then you're description was. It's surely a "Model D-Cinema Multiplex" to compare all others too.

Mark

Posted by Rick Raskin (Member # 1561) on 03-23-2009, 04:30 PM:

"The Film-Tech NOC monitors the entire building and handles building the playlists and loading KDMs each week so the manager can concentrate on running the theater."

Brad,

Are you doing off site monitoring from a control center?

Please elaborate about your NOC. Do you monitor multiple locations? I could see this as an up and coming opportunity as digital installs become more prominent.

I'll add to the praise. The installation looks spectacular. Not often do you see dressed wiring these days. Great job.

---Rick

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 03-23-2009, 04:55 PM:

The booth is very nice...although I do miss the look of another platter array. [Frown]

Perhaps you should put one in anyway just to confuse people. [Wink]

Well done boys.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 03-23-2009, 05:43 PM:

We've got a pile of old Super Platters you could set up in the middle of the room to feel more at home...... [Eek!]

Mark

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-23-2009, 06:31 PM:

quote: Rick Raskin
Are you doing off site monitoring from a control center?

Yes, the existing NOC setup is temporary as we are only monitoring 7 theater locations and are running off of 2 internet connections with battery backup power. In June we are moving to a new location with triple redundant internet connections, large battery backup power and a backup generator...just in case. The NOC handles everything except plugging in the hard drives once a week, which the manager does (takes about 2 minutes). If the need should ever arise, the NOC can run shows completely manually.

quote: John Wilson
I do miss the look of another platter array.

You do bring up a good point. I wonder what the going rate for AW3s with dual payout and takeup is these days? [Razz]

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 03-23-2009, 06:41 PM:

Ahhh... much better. [Big Grin]

quote: Brad Miller
You do bring up a good point. I wonder what the going rate for AW3s with dual payout and takeup is these days?

Are you saying you're converting the others or that you just have a bit of stock you now will no longer need? Just send them to me and I'll store them for you. [Wink]

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-23-2009, 06:58 PM:

Pffft. Not impressed, as usual. There isn't anything from Strong or even ORC in the booth so it can't be very good. I bet the xenons aren't even OSRAMs! You should just close the place down now.

Oh and sorry John. I get first dibbs on Brad's Christies.

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 03-23-2009, 07:05 PM:

quote: Joe Redifer
Oh and sorry John. I get first dibbs on Brad's Christies.

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 03-23-2009, 08:45 PM:

Isn't it weird to think of a booth, built and blessed by Brad & company, has not one bottle of filmguard anywhere. (Unless you use the filmguard to wipe down the covers of the equipment to give it that clean and shiny look) [Big Grin]

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 03-23-2009, 09:02 PM:

Better?

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-23-2009, 09:41 PM:

That's too funny John. Can you paint the walls too?

quote: Sean Weitzel
Isn't it weird to think of a booth, built and blessed by Brad & company, has not one bottle of filmguard anywhere.

Obviously you were not paying attention to the picture of the matrix rack. [Cool]

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 03-23-2009, 11:52 PM:

They really should paint the walls or you will be changing filters more often. I've not met an unpainted drywall yet that didn't dust up.

Steve

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 03-23-2009, 11:53 PM:

Hmmm...you're right. Digital painting just ain't gonna do it. It's going to have to be analogue.

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 03-24-2009, 12:45 AM:

Yep I didn't see them hidden behind the matrix rack. I like John's placement better. They look like little monuments!

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-24-2009, 12:52 AM:

Steve, do you have any documentation on that? We share the same concern.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 03-24-2009, 03:53 AM:

Geez...many years at the Ritz 16 ...the drywall dust that got into the blowers, switches...you name it...it was premature failure city.

Fortunately, one of the first things the new owners of the facility did was paint the booth, finally (about 10-years after it opened).

I hope you supplied the SMG with spare filters for those projectors...they are going to need them.

Steve

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 03-24-2009, 04:43 AM:

With the usage of QSC equipment in this plex - including amplifiers and speakers, what was the reason for this choice of manufacturer over JBL for the speakers?

thx-monte

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-24-2009, 09:54 AM:

It does seem pretty amazing that they would spend all those dollars for top-of-the-line everything but not be willing to spend a couple hundred to paint the damn booth.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-24-2009, 10:37 AM:

They also paid top dollar for some ancient old fool to save money and cut costs for them. I bet he chose not to paint the booth.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-24-2009, 11:40 AM:

Thanks for confirming my concern on the paint Steve. That fool Joe speakers of is no longer with the company, but yes it was his doing to not paint it. What a wonderful parting gift he left us with.

Posted by Robert E. Allen (Member # 1351) on 03-24-2009, 01:20 PM:

An absolutely beautiful booth. At first I was a bit saddened to think it spells the death of the projectionist profession. But then I realized this won't happen to small town and rural theatres for probably longer than any of us will live. Congratulations Brad.

Posted by Alan Gouger (Member # 543) on 03-24-2009, 01:20 PM:

Congrats to Brad and team. Always setting the example one step ahead of the technology curve. Nice work.

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 03-24-2009, 01:57 PM:

I want to also add my congrats to Brad and the team for an excellent job..would have loved to see some film equipment instead, but cest la vie. [Smile]

One minor quibble: all the cables dropping from the ceiling into the matrix racks.. I would have attached some of the plastic gutter or a large PVC conduit to cover them, would look a lot cleaner. [Smile]

(Like how the other racks have been done.)

But the overall quality of the work is flawless!!!

Stay tuned to this thread as Brad announces a booth painting party....he'll supply the paint and brushes and rollers, and maybe a free dinner. [Smile]

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 03-24-2009, 02:37 PM:

I was surprised to see the "all digital" booth setup. Does this mean other SMG locations in the Dallas and Houston areas will be converting to digital projection within the next couple or so years?

BTW, what do you do for cleaning the Dolby 3D glasses? Are they safe to run through commercial dish washers or is there some other kind of sanitizing system you had to install?

Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 03-24-2009, 02:49 PM:

Very nice looking install, but they gots to paint the walls! [Wink]

"Film-Tech Cinema Systems, LLC" -- Is that a new entity?

Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 03-24-2009, 03:02 PM:

Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious!

Congrats Brad, Josh, and Danny...the booth, equipment choices, installation, and rack wiring are nothing short of 100% professional!

And Brad, a truly brilliant and revolutionary concept you came up with in the application of show performance, programming, automation, and total theatre monitoring...a look into the future! KuDOS bub!

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-24-2009, 03:11 PM:

I noticed the way "Centre" was spelled. Like "theatre", it is so regal and elegant that it makes me feel as if I should be paying more for what I am getting. It's like it should be in the rich neighborhood or something. Like only white people are allowed.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-24-2009, 03:36 PM:

Tony, the cables coming from the ceiling in the matrix rack was a goof by the contractor. That wasn't the plan, but there wasn't time to fix it due to the contractors being absurdly behind.

Bobby, I'm not sure about other SMG locations, but I know the flexibility of being able to move the "prints" around every show of the day is permitting them to make more flexible movie schedules, which means more profit. It wouldn't surprise me if they crunch the numbers and see that feature of these systems alone (the 8 minute lead time) will pay for the conversion to digital based upon the extra profit they can bring in with moving prints to maximize the show schedule.

The kitchen staff currently cleans the Dolby 3D glasses. I don't know how, I just passed along the paperwork from Dolby to the executive chef. What is funny though is how they pass out the glasses. They let everyone into the auditorium and a couple of minutes before the show starts they have the waiters bring out large cloth covered trays with glasses on them and serve them to the patrons as if the glasses were hors d'oeuvres. The customers seem to really like it, as it is a bit of individual presentation to each guest. When you have a full waitstaff you can do that sort of thing.

David, yes the business name was changed last year. We are finalizing a streamlined version of this system (with all of the features and plenty of room for expansion) that should be ready by the summer for production. It will cut a lot of time off of the site installs and give far more flexibility than installing digital cinema in the traditional fashion. It will also eliminate the hassle of configuring and programming the systems on site, since the racks will ship ready to plug-and-play.

Joe, yes it is centre, pronounced "century", sort of like how theatre is pronounced "the-ah-tree". [Razz]

If anyone due to some horrible turn of events finds themselves in Houston you should swing by. Christie's latest triple-flash projectors and QSC's sound systems are something to check out!

Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 03-24-2009, 03:52 PM:

Wow, the installation is first-rate! I can see there was some serious pre-planning. You must have had a cooperative architect, too.

Although, being there would freak me out because it's probably so *quiet*. I can't get use to projectors that don't make any "clack-clack-clack" noise!

Posted by Julio Roberto (Member # 4976) on 03-24-2009, 04:07 PM:

Thanks so much for sharing, Brad & Cía. Very nice and interesting.

Congrats on job finished and well done!

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 03-24-2009, 06:31 PM:

Yea, I agree what Steve mentions on the filter thing.

Since, you how things are right after a full construction that it takes months for dust and things to settle down...then let alone how those unfinished walls will retain all of that dust that gets moved around due to the air circulating around from the HVAC systems....and then create dust when that paper really begins to dry out and shed being an unfinished paper...

Definite a fantastic system installed .. and what future booths will look like ...

Good luck - Monte

Posted by Fabian Schreyer (Member # 5120) on 03-26-2009, 11:52 AM:

What I was wondering: How many projectionists are required to run shows in all auditoriums at the same time?

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 03-26-2009, 12:46 PM:

Brad, very cool concept indeed. I'll bet you will make a fortune on these systems in years to come. How much time did it take designing this system before you were ready to implement it?

I notice you capitalize Matrix rack. Is that the name you have given to the system? Or, perhaps, is it a proper name that already exists? I am not familiar with it. Just wondering what exactly Matrix refers to.

Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 03-26-2009, 02:27 PM:

Layout, use of double racking, Pennywise, pre-wiring off site, packaged concept, I can relate to [Cool]

The taped up unpainted drywall is an issue. We used to have our sub-contractors do a paint finish prior to our crew doing final install or wall mounting items around the window (most jobs we supplied pre-wired electric / sub-panel systems in addition top projection / sound). We recently did a nine screen video display and server system in Miami...all of the extra maintinance issues disappeared after the raw drywall was finished and painted a month after opening.

Din rail insulated screw terminal blocks versus Euro Style strips are a personal preference...I know layout space and cost was probably a factor.

In all an A+ [Smile]

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 03-27-2009, 02:31 PM:

Thanks for the reply Brad. I can understand how that can happen..been on a lot of jobs like that. [Smile]

You can use the square PVC wire gutter with the snap on covers to cover those wires if you want.. just cut a tight-fit hole in line with the entry on the rack in the ceiling tiles and it will self-support and look great too. [Smile]

Overall though as others have said an outstanding install, and great concept..as much as I'm not a huge fan of D-Cinema...this is definitely "D-Cinema Done Right" [thumbsup]

And with the Studio Movie Grill's concept, this is one time where I can heartily agree that D-Cinema is the way to go, thanks to the versatility of being able to shuffle "prints" with a simple mouse click.

Wow, did I just say that? [Eek!]

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 03-27-2009, 10:03 PM:

quote: Tony Bandiera Jr
thanks to the versatility of being able to shuffle "prints" with a simple mouse click.

Wow, did I just say that?

Since this is where the future is going, then it's time to run to Staples and buy some "That was Easy" buttons and give them to the "Head Injestor" (new name for projectionists..)

..then, we ride off into the sunset...

-Monte

Posted by Aaron Sisemore (Member # 145) on 03-28-2009, 02:46 AM:

quote:
being there would freak me out because it's probably so *quiet*. I can't get use to projectors that don't make any "clack-clack-clack" noise!

Trust me, digital is actually LOUDER. There are several really loud fans on the projector and the power supply, and the later Doremi servers have a pair of super-noisy fans in them. It is louder in my booth all-digital than it was when it ran film.

-Aaron

Posted by Kurt Zupin (Member # 2751) on 03-28-2009, 06:08 AM:

Well I agree with everyone above, it looks great. A real achievement indeed. Congrats Brad, there's a reason your at the top of our Industry.

Posted by Bruce McGee (Member # 131) on 03-29-2009, 12:12 PM:

Congratulations on your work, Josh and Brad.

Posted by Brian Guckian (Member # 1678) on 03-30-2009, 07:37 AM:

quote: Tony Bandiera Jr
I want to also add my congrats to Brad and the team for an excellent job..would have loved to see some film equipment instead, but cest la vie.

Ah, but you are mistaken! Brad has clearly left lots of room for a DTS-70 installation, with 70mm endless loop platters in keeping with the fully automated nature of the projection room [Wink]

Great to see loudspeaker baffles behind the screens as well [thumbsup]

Posted by Per Hauberg (Member # 529) on 03-30-2009, 04:33 PM:

I guess, there is no away out of it. It's coming, whether we like it or not. And as it is so, this looks the perfect way to do it.

If this installment runs as good as it looks, You've done a very fine job. Congratulations !!

I'm still curious to hear the standard audience speak. -Do they spot the difference ?? Will it sell more tickets ??

And I would like someone to tell me, how smaller houses pay for this gear in the States ? Here, the bill will be on 110.000 Euro per screen (I have two). My total ticket income is 200.000 Euro a year... In Germany, distributors pay a nice fee for every new title, opening digital instead of the expensive film print. I do not think, we will be able to get an agreement like that here. Even with less than 180 theatres left in Denmark, we are unable to stand together as the germans can. "Bolt" opened the ball with 3 cinemas running digital 3D, 6 more will follow for "Monsters", and be assured, the distributors are ready with their message: "See: Real cinemas does that without crying..." No shit: If I'd had the money, there would have been one more cinema, the theatre union could have called illoyal. -but I haven't, and therefore, I'm one hell of a loyal kid !

It's not just a question of being old-fashioned romantic or anything like that, when hug my old DP70's every night on the way out. Getting SR-D and DTS was tough on my budget, -the next step may be fatal.

But again: Great job, guys - thanks for sharing the pictures !

All the best

Per

Posted by Jon Miller (Member # 163) on 03-30-2009, 10:44 PM:

Well, I'm late to the party an all the hors d'oeuvres are gone but...

What can I say but what has been said before: sad that there's not even a token 35mm machine in the booth (sorry, John W, Photoshop cannot erase the sadness), but for a purely digital booth with all that integration with the rest of the facility it's kick-butt impressive. Hats off to Brad and crew! [thumbsup]

Brad: Not that I'd want to turn the lobby into a bus terminal or airport, but could your system control a system providing synthesized announcements of showings about to begin, such as, “Coraline in 3-D begins in screen #5 in five minutes?”

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-31-2009, 12:46 AM:

I'd have to give it some thought on how to integrate it, but I'm sure anything is possible. What I wanted to do was to do a 6 panel curved video wall, sort of like Cinerama, surrounding half of the lobby using 6 projectors instead of that one 16:9 video screen to create a 96:9 aspect ratio. The idea got shot down, but one of my guys and I did author some test content and tie it into the automation successfully. Maybe it will get used on the next job.

Posted by Bill Enos (Member # 440) on 03-31-2009, 09:58 PM:

Nice job Brad, sort of eerie though with just boxes on boxes at the ports. I'll agree with Aaron on the noise issue, D-Cinema is very noisy from fans, fans and more fans, cheap noisy damned fans. Our XLs are barely audible outside the booth on a quiet movie passage but the Barco's fans can be heard everywhere, plus the heat, with the exception of the lamp is discharged into the room. The Doremi server we had this past weekend had an especially screamy fan. For the price of this stuff one would think they could use some quieter fans, I know they exist, I have some.

Posted by Bastiaan Fleerkate (Member # 3826) on 04-01-2009, 08:38 AM:

Nice Job! Only....
It's sad to see a projection booth without any 35mm projectors, platters, etc. In the Netherlands we're replacing our 35mm apparatus and there not a lot of new installations. So it's common to see 35mm equipment next to digital projectors.
A while back someone sacrificed a DP70 to make room for a digital installation. It's sad to see stuff like that make place for something that will not last half the time the DP70 did...

When seeing the subject of the photo's, I first thought about old automation. That's because I work in the one of the first cinema's that installed automation for it's 35mm installation in the Netherlands (I've been told). Two auditoriums have their original Zeiss-Ikon automation rolls and we're still using them... [Big Grin]

[ 04-01-2009, 03:10 PM: Message edited by: Bastiaan Fleerkate ]

Posted by Jaime Tuzzio (Member # 4760) on 04-02-2009, 03:42 AM:

I arrived in Houston on the 9th for a week and drove by this place every single day I was there as I was staying close by. The rain I brought with me from Oregon ruined some of my plans so I was looking for stuff to do. If I'd known I definitely would have checked this place out.

In conversation elsewhere this whole set up really impressed, though I can't imagine working in a filmless theatre without so much as a breaker to flip. Projection is the "magic" of it for me, and powering up a building gets me ready to be productive and powering down gets me very ready to go home (want me to feel lost in time and space: put me on a mid-day shift).

The question came up as to what kind of back up there is should the ticketing system crash. If the lights, HVAC, etc. all run off of a show time schedule, what happens when the schedule no longer exists?

You know, I thought all of the wiring I can see in my booth was dressed quite nice, but after looking at those pictures I want to cut every zip tie and do it all again. With a ruler. [Big Grin]

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-02-2009, 11:08 AM:

quote: Jaime Tuzzio
If the lights, HVAC, etc. all run off of a show time schedule, what happens when the schedule no longer exists?

If the show schedule doesn't exist, then they won't be running movies that day. Regardless, towards the bottom of the matrix rack there are two lockboxes (that are not locked) which look like this:

Inside those are springwound 12 hour timers in the highly unlikely event of a problem.

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 04-26-2009, 11:34 AM:

Well I was watching these pictures again and again before I thought to post a comment. My only comment , except a job Well Done, is that the colours used with those 14/4C cables (looks like the Liberty 4 core speaker cables) are wrong! The correct method would be to take the RED as Right +, BLACK as Right -, WHITE as Left + and GREEN as Left - . But of course [thumbsup]

to all who did this. Brad, I think using an automation system like a Crestron coupled with the CA would be easier and faster.
Demetris

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 04-26-2009, 12:12 PM:

I don't know if I would use the term wrong as unconventional...there is no real right/wrong with speaker wiring as it does not follow the NEC where both Red and Black are "high" with green and white being low and green being lower than white...and even the NEC is not as fussy as one would think...white is the most protected color as Neutral...not green as Ground....but I digress.

In the typical electrical wiring make up...the first pair is White and Black...by NEC convention, Black is the "high" side. The third wire is Green (ground) and the 4th wire is Red (second phase wire) and is consider a hot wire. In this respect...everything is wired "properly"

However, in audio wiring...the first pair is Red and Black with Black being the low wire (opposite from normal power electrical wiring). The second pair is Green and White. For most White is the "high" wire but in Cinema...it was established with the solar cells that Green (right channel) would be the High wires and Black the Low.

When we wire with 4-conductor speaker wires...we will use Red as high, black low and Green high with white low. This is uniform from cell to speaker.

Even with White/Black cables (which we don't use whenever possible), we keep black as low...Thus color to color as much as possible. However, all of the speaker cables we specify now are indeed Red and Black (on at least the first pair).

Here is an example of how we wire racks:

crossover in monitors thread

Its not that it is the "correct way"...it is "A" way as is Brad's.

Open your mind to other ideas.

Steve

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 04-26-2009, 02:18 PM:

In custom installation work, all manufacturers label their equipment on the back using the colour scheme I mentioned. Although as you say Steve there is no right and wrong in the connection scheme prefered, it's good keeping a standard. Russound for example has coloured terminal blocks with red,black,white,green and have red and white as positives and black and green as negatives. This also matches most other multizone system manufacturers and some others. Personally I would prefer passing separate 2 instead of 4 conductor. Although a 4 conductor cable makes installation easier, installers need to be very carefull in the correct wiring.
Demetris

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-26-2009, 02:40 PM:

Demetris, it was a matter of keeping the speaker wiring the same in the auditorium vs. the booth since the speaker wiring had been done before we finished the racks. (You can only see some of the surround hookups in that picture.) Regardless, the racks were supplied with a full terminal block breakout. Remember, the rack is MUCH more than just speaker connections in there. There is some logic to it, but you would ideally need to be looking it at with the breakout card in hand to see why some of the colors were done the way they were.

Not everyone drives on the right side of the road either, but so long as you know what side you are supposed to be driving on, its not a problem. [Wink]