Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Print rising up in middle

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Posted by Ed Forth (Member # 5831) on 11-27-2010, 06:55 PM:

I did a couple of searches to see if there was a thread on this, but nothing came up and I'm not exactly sure what to search for.

I'm the manager of a subrun and we're currently showing The Town.

My assistant built up the print and when he did there were ridges at all of the reel changes. maybe 3-4 film thicknesses, raised up about a centimeter.

After running the film down, the print was smooth, but the ring had worked it's way out of the platter (it's a Potts platter) so that the print was just sitting on the platter with the center raised up the length of the ring posts and the film smoothly going down the the platter over the length of the print.

It's continued to do this everytime we've played the movie, so I've started going up and pushing the ring back in about 40ish minutes into the film, after which it winds up as normal for the rest of the show.

I've never had this happen before, although I've only been projecting for 3-4 years, so there's plenty outside my experience.

Any ideas what's causing it? How I can stop it?

In case it's helpful, here is the information on the side of the platter system:

Robert L Potts, ENT (Urbana, ILL)
Model: 35-5
Serial Number: 5147
120 Volts 9 Amps Max

Posted by Marco Giustini (Member # 4544) on 11-27-2010, 07:05 PM:

It has happened, but I've never figured it out. Static?
Some prints used to raise 1/2" for just a few layers before going back to normality.

I guess it's a print defect since I remember those prints were having this behaviour in the same place all the time.

Try rewinding the print with the emulsion facing the opposite side you normally do then, eventually, go back to the usual way. Just a guess.

I tried some filmguard on top of the platter reel (didn't have the Kelmar) but it didn't work.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-27-2010, 07:06 PM:

Sounds like the print itself has some sprocket or other edge damage. The only fix would be to get a different print and hope for the bet.

Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 11-27-2010, 07:07 PM:

Sounds like your print arrived with edge damage. Someone mis-threaded it and now one edge is 'thicker' than the other, causing the uneven wind.

Not much can be done to fix this AFAIK.

Posted by Ed Forth (Member # 5831) on 11-27-2010, 07:30 PM:

Thank you all very much for an astonishingly quick reply

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 11-27-2010, 08:37 PM:

Is there any oil on the print? If so, it is possible it ran on a ORC/CFS Super platter. Those platters have dished decks and if there is oil on the print, the print will "remember" that wind and cone its way upward on a normal flat platter deck. The only fix is to run it soundtrack down.

Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 11-27-2010, 08:38 PM:

If you move it, be extra careful. It will be loose.

Posted by Marco Giustini (Member # 4544) on 11-28-2010, 08:36 AM:

At the time I inspected the prints carefully: they were brand new prints, no oily at all, without any kind of damages at all. I simply couldn't explain it.

Posted by Ed Forth (Member # 5831) on 12-10-2010, 08:23 PM:

Sorry it took so long for me to get back.

The print was not oily, but I tried lacing soundtrack down anyways, that didn't fix the problem, and when it was wound up soundtrack down the print had a different weirdness to it (sort of scalloped)

I definately believe that the "thinner on one side than the other due to damage" theory was correct.

Posted by Marco Giustini (Member # 4544) on 12-11-2010, 06:03 PM:

quote: Ed Forth
when it was wound up soundtrack down the print had a different weirdness to it (sort of scalloped)

Exactly what I observed. My print was brand new.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 12-11-2010, 09:25 PM:

quote: Ed Forth
sort of scalloped

Called "spoking" - like spokes of a bicycle wheel.

Comes from a slightly green print. Just leave it alone for it's just one of those things that happens when a print leaves the lab prob not completely dried out from the printing area.

I get them from time to time as well in as well as prob the lot of us gets this kind of print.

It may flatten out after a good few runs ....

Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 12-12-2010, 06:03 AM:

Resist the urge to "tap it down" to flatten it out. Doing so may add horizontal scratches to the frames and/or cause edge/sprocket damage.

And I agree with Mike -- be extra careful if you have to move this print -- just about every time this happened to me, the wind was loose.