Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: film guard mounting for changeovers

This is topic film guard mounting for changeovers in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 02-07-2011, 11:43 AM:

How are folks mounting film cleaners for Film Guard on 6000 foot changeover machines? Kinda close quarters under normal circumstances. Or is that not happening at all?

Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 02-07-2011, 02:27 PM:

Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 02-07-2011, 03:26 PM:

Holy farg!

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-07-2011, 05:29 PM:

Someone didn't put enough media on. [Smile]

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 02-07-2011, 05:38 PM:

where is the cds head

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-07-2011, 08:04 PM:

I think those were only ever mounted in Colorado.

Posted by Sean Weitzel (Member # 244) on 02-07-2011, 11:28 PM:

I have them now. The power supply in the processor is bad but a good friend of mine is rebuilding it.

Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 02-08-2011, 12:04 AM:

Okay, hold it. I'm having a "what's wrong with this picture" moment, so bear with the stupid guy for a second, please.

In both pictures, I saw the film cleaner on the *feed* side of the head, but from what I've read, the application of Film-Guard, at least initially, leaves a really visible film on the print, that shows up on the screen really obviously. It vanishes after a few runs, but it's definitely there the first time you run something. And as much as folks love this expensive hobby, I can't imagine a print getting theatre schedule runs in folks homes.

What does this mean? It means that Jim is obviously missing something major. What am I missing?

"Always use your spell-chech."

Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 02-08-2011, 12:38 AM:

It means that during the initial application, there will be visible streaks if anyone is watching.

If that first show happens to be a test run, then only you and/or your staff will see those streaks.

If the first show happens to be your opening day matinee, then only a few "trailer checkers" will see them. [Razz]

Alternatively, you could do your first FG application at the inspection/rewind table, without projecting the reels.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-08-2011, 12:47 AM:

quote: Joe Redifer
Someone didn't put enough media on.

Actually there was enough media. There was just only about an inch left after the reel finished. [Big Grin]

Let's not forget this install.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-08-2011, 02:53 AM:

Wow. That Fuji camera did not age well at all.

Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 02-08-2011, 09:46 AM:

Here is a more typical example.

Film-Guard should be applied from the feed side. I've been told the heat from the bulb aides in the application.

For one time shows, I use plain dry media to remove the loose dirt. Dry media cannot be reused.

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 02-08-2011, 09:55 AM:

On-topic question:

Is there any risk of scratches or film damage with dry media? I have always been scared of this. Should I be?

Off-topic question:

Is there a reason why the phone is located above the projection port in the above picture? I can't imagine a more inconvenient place for it.

Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 02-08-2011, 10:05 AM:

Neither can I. Each time I pick it up, I must be mindful that the receiver cord does not hang into the picture. The management required that it be placed there so that I could be reached even if I were threading, working on the machine, or (*groan*) about to perform a changeover. A few months after they put it in, they added a speaker to it so that I can just shout at it if my hands are full.

I always use Film-Tech branded media pads, and have not seen any evidence of film damage. I've heard that some other brands can scratch prints. I never use a cleaner on an archive print.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-08-2011, 11:14 AM:

They had to add the capability for the speaker phone? We had that same type of phone and I have always shouted at it. If you picked it up the audio quality was horrible because you'd hear booth sounds fed back to you very loudly.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 02-08-2011, 11:33 AM:

This is my preferred method:

A closer look:

You only need one film cleaner (per title) and there are no visible streaks since it is done on the rewind...right after application, the film lays on itself and dissipates the fluid.

-Steve

Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 02-08-2011, 02:26 PM:

That's awesome. I want to go that route. Have been restoring a couple of Hollywood Film Company powered rewinders, and will have to look for a cleaner and that motor control.

Thanks Steve!

And all the other pics looked pretty impressive as well.

What's the game where you have to take one piece out of a tower structure, and see if you can make it still stand? Some of those towers made me think of that. Don't have an earthquake! [Eek!]

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 02-08-2011, 02:58 PM:

quote: Mike Olpin
Each time I pick it up, I must be mindful that the receiver cord does not hang into the picture. The management required that it be placed there so that I could be reached even if I were threading, working on the machine, or (*groan*) about to perform a changeover. A few months after they put it in, they added a speaker to it so that I can just shout at it if my hands are full.

One word...'Cordless'.

quote: Mr. Guttag
This is my preferred method:

I agree. This would be my preferred method also in a home set-up where multiple runs are not going to happen.

In a 'commercial' theatre setup though I'd have one atop each projector.

Posted by Martin McCaffery (Member # 37) on 02-08-2011, 03:42 PM:

quote: Mike Olpin
I never use a cleaner on an archive print.

Why?

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 02-08-2011, 03:53 PM:

On an archive print you are NEVER to use any liquids...film-guard included. It is not your print to determine apply things to.

The only approved field cleaner is PTR rollers. I change them for EACH 20 minute reel or they will just fill up.

-Steve

Posted by Martin McCaffery (Member # 37) on 02-08-2011, 04:10 PM:

Steve: Good to know, probably won't be a consideration here. I assume you are talking about real archive prints. As opposed to what the distribs are calling archive, which are just the circulation prints they don't want you to platter. I just got an "archive" print which has all sorts of crud on it (shoe polish, tape residue, cue markers, china marker). Have filmguarded 2 reels while testing them, assuming it will be an improvement. Know it won't take off the crud.

Love your bench set up. Do you have templates for the adaptor, or do you sell them?

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 02-08-2011, 04:44 PM:

The bench set up is entirely made from Kelmar parts. I use the AUTOWIND bracket with the adapter for the Neumade measuring machine. You do need to drill and tap the measuring machine bracket to join the two together but other than that, it is a quick and easy thing.

The guys at the AFI/Silver took it a step further...they milled out a section of the front of the table and put in a metal plate with a metal stud sticking out. Then the put a suitable nut to secure the film cleaner bracket. This allows for many installs and removals without wear and tear.

-Steve

Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 02-08-2011, 08:22 PM:

Steve,
How fast do you set your film to travel? Does the film cleaner have more trouble keeping up (advancing the pad) than film running at regular speed during a showing?

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 02-08-2011, 09:29 PM:

I never go above 50% and typically no more than 40%.

Never had a problem with the pads keeping up. I just never rewind that fast. I let the film have a nice easy rewind...not need to rush and risk cinch marks and such.

-Steve