Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Spending on 35mm gear

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Posted by Andy Frodsham (Member # 4061) on 04-05-2011, 03:32 PM:

With the inevitable shift to new digital screening techniques, I wondered if anyone out there is still spending any money on new 35mm equipment?

I am particularly interested to hear if anyone is planning on upgrading any of their present 35mm gear (sound processors etc) and, if so, what?

Posted by Victor Liorentas (Member # 5272) on 04-05-2011, 03:54 PM:

I upgraded my booth in the following ways.
Ultrastar HD lenses flat and scope for 1 machine, bought cheap on e-bay!
Curved gate upgrade to 1 of 2 Simplex XL machines!
Would like to do the other machine in time but i run most stuff off a platter anyway.
Dolby digital and d.t.s for the 1 bad ass Simplex!
Upgraded a Smart mod8 for a CP55 with cat 441 and SRA5 with cat 280t cards!
The other flat gate Simplex does have decent Schneider lenses but i would love to get it a dolby cat 700 ,curved gate and Isco HD lenses!
I hope we can survive long enough to add a third DCI digital Projector but we do have a 720p 3 chip Infocus 777 for Blu-Rays.

Also working on 16mm capability,we have a giant Prevost which needs alot of tlc.
So yes i am buying used 35mm stuff all the time.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 04-05-2011, 06:00 PM:

We are installing a new Kinoton FP30E later this year for one client with plans for more either this year or next. It is an Art/rep house. The projector will feature a 3-wing shutter mode up to 25fps so it will be flicker-free yet run on normal sized lamps due to the higher efficiency that the FP30E premiere affords.

We are still in the film business but new projectors are definitely more in the digital camp nowadays.

-Steve

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 04-05-2011, 09:24 PM:

There were a few film-related products on view at the trade show at CinemaCon. Goldberg Brothers had reels, and various supply houses were still showing splice tape, splicers and such. But I didn't see a single platter or projector.

Posted by Paul Mayer (Member # 355) on 04-05-2011, 09:56 PM:

I had heard that Kinoton had the only film projector on the trade show floor this year. I didn't see it myself, given I was on the floor at the Strong booth for only a few minutes during setup on Monday and teardown on Thursday.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-05-2011, 11:36 PM:

Gary Stanley was the first AND last person to ever run actual film at Cinemacon. You guys just didn't catch him in that 3D booth (of which the name escapes me right now).

Posted by Martin Murray (Member # 162) on 04-06-2011, 01:08 AM:

Speaking of Gary, you would have thought he would have found some trailers that were not scratched...

Posted by Andy Frodsham (Member # 4061) on 04-06-2011, 03:12 AM:

We're doing some advanced planning in readiness for digital. Over summer we're hoping to remove one of our 35mm machines and install a platter to feed the other one. The space freed-up will be used to accommodate a digital projector.

At present, our sound system comprises a CP65 and an XD10 for digital sound. We were wondering about getting hold of a DA20 unit and penthouse reader to expand our digital soundtrack capability. Do you think it's too late to be contemplating such a purchase?

We screen mainly arthouse and second-run material and the DTS soundtracks are few and far between!

We'd like to retain our 35mm facilities as long as possible (possibly forever)!

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 04-06-2011, 03:42 AM:

I would think that getting a DA20 and a penthouse would be a matter of saving them from the trash bin at some point. They certainly should not be commanding a premium price (as the DA20 did just a couple of years ago). Look on the For-Sale list here on F-T...those items are definitely coming out of service now.

And yes, Kinoton had the only film projector I saw on the trade show floor this year (FP30E Premiere).

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 04-06-2011, 06:52 AM:

A local theatre that is being renovated into a multi-use space will be re-installing its 35mm equipment (Century projectors on Simplex soundheads) later this year with the intention of presenting occasional film screenings. They will be upgrading the lamphouses and buying some other items (Kelmar table, house reels, lenses, etc.), but this will all be used equipment.

They are in the same booking zone as a major Showcase location, so they would not be able to get most new films, anyway. I expect that their film presentations will mostly be classic titles, which I am sure will be available in 35mm for the forseeable future.

They will be installing video projection as well (it is sort of expected these days, I suppose, and they are hoping to do rentals for business events (Powerpoint, etc.) during the day). Since most of the equipment (CP650, screen, speakers, etc.) is the same as for video, and they already have a booth and projector heads and bases, the cost to add 35mm capability is actually quite minimal. If they had to buy the equipment brand-new, they might not have decided to do 35mm at all. (Not because of fears of obsolescence, but because it will not likely be a major part of their programming.)

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-06-2011, 10:43 AM:

quote: Martin Murray
Speaking of Gary, you would have thought he would have found some trailers that were not scratched...

In all fairness, Gary only brought the 35mm equipment. The 3D company provided the prints to my understanding, and since not all of them were scratched, it obviously wasn't Gary that did the damage.

It was pretty weird to see that brief section with crooked green scratches in film 3D, which is something I had not seen before.

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 04-06-2011, 12:19 PM:

35mm issues aside, one thing I have noticed in the last 2-4 years is that used but in good nick 16mm machines - even halogen-lit classroom portables - have skyrocketed in second-hand value. About 6-7 years ago I was given an 1970s vintage Eiki by a schoolteacher friend - the school was clearing out its basement. All the belts were perished, the bearings had dried out ... in short, it was good for spares only unless you were prepared to strip it totally, overhaul and reassemble. Thinking that the spares could be useful for my 'good' machine, I gratefully accepted it. Last summer I was having a clean out of the garage - needed to free up some space - and decided that it had to go. I put it on Ebay with a very honest description of its condition, expecting to make a tenner if I was lucky, and the thing fetched £140!

I've taken a bit of an interest in this because I'm on the lookout for a xenon-lit machine for the theatre at the university I work in. Whereas a decade ago, you could have got one for £300-500 easily, people are asking for four figures now.

16mm does seem to be making a bit of a comeback among arty / hippie / experimental type filmmaking (story), and so I wonder if this is driving the price of used equipment up.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 04-06-2011, 12:31 PM:

I have not seen the skyrocket in price on 16mm projectors, yet. We do have a pair of Kinoton/Philips FP16s and an FP18 still. In the portable front, we have some Elmo 16CLs and a CX-550. We might even have an Elmo LX-1100 or 2200 kicking around too.

One thing that is definitely an issue with most 16mm machines now is parts...even the FP16/18 have some key NLA parts. One benefit of the current FP38E machine is that the 16mm portion comes along for the ride on a 35mm machine...which should prolong its life availability, including parts.

-Steve

Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 04-06-2011, 01:14 PM:

We're preparing for the enevitability of digital... mainly saving up the $$$... but no pressure to convert quite yet.

I replaced our DTS 6-D units with XD-10s this season... found both of them on Ebay. Really nice, being able to bank up the trailers and not have to change disks between shows (double feature drive-in).

Beyond that, we're probably in a maintenance-only mode, as much as we can be. I replaced the gate bands on our XLs this year, but that's about it. Think we're OK for the remaining time I think we'll still be running film.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 04-07-2011, 12:11 PM:

Brad - I think that 3D film system was called "Sirius 1." But I could be wrong.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 04-07-2011, 02:43 PM:

Surely you can't be Sirius... and don't call me Shirley!

Posted by John Williamson (Member # 4205) on 04-11-2011, 04:34 PM:

I've had 3 projects removing DLP's and reinstalling film. 2 8-plexes (8 Christie digital out and Simplex in and 8 Christie digital out and Century back in) and one single screen (Sony out and Simplex back in). The 2 8-plex jobs were a new owner who realized that the cost of digital was too high and the Sony was a lease issue. All of our film installs hve been used or rebuilt equipment. Film ain't dead yet.