This is topic CP650 sound "wow" on changeovers running Dolby Digital... in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-23-2011, 02:35 PM:
 
Have a strange problem with the CP650 in UC Irvine's HIB 100 screening room.....has anyone else had this happen?

During changeovers, after the incoming projector is started, but before the actual changeover, the sound playing on the outgoing projector goes nuts, acting as if the projector suddenly slowed down and is re-accelerating. It happens going in both directions, i.e. from 1-2 and 2-1.

This came on suddenly and after the processor wigged out during a show (it switched itself from Format 10 to 04).

My thought is the CAT 773 may be bad.....my thought is that the card is mistakenly clocking the digital data to the incoming machine too early while the outgoing machine is still playing.

Yes, I have the proper changeover and motor start commands connected and they are working.

At first I thought it was a projector problem as my #2 machine would on occasion hang start at half speed, but it is happening while the machines are running normally, and I never had trouble with the #1 machine.

Any thoughts?
 

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Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 10-23-2011, 06:50 PM:
 
scanner drums hanging up to pick up speed, since SR-D will 'wow' if data speed isn't correct?

There is a little 4plex in this area that has the BACP penthouse reader sitting on top of an XL/5Star setup, but the motor is an induction motor that will run at slightly odd speeds if the electricity demand is high..and they, on occasion, have these 'wow' sounds in digital.

I mentioned to them, to cure this, is to get a sync motor on there to eliminate this 'wow' .... oh well, that was 4yrs ago..and they haven't done anything about it yet.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-23-2011, 07:02 PM:
 
Good point Monte, but it is happening on the projector that is still running the last 8 seconds of the reel, not the incoming machine. And it is happening ONLY during the runup time of the incoming machine....

And these are on new BACP DSTR-20 penthouses.
 

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Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 10-23-2011, 07:21 PM:
 
..maybe, a small arguement between the two units then, esp when No.2 starts to roll and senses data and does something to cause the arguement..?

What would happen if data wasn't sensed by No.2 (like using a blank leader) until changeover?
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-24-2011, 05:27 PM:
 
Yeah I agree some sort of conflict is happening in both directions...and I don't know yet what the effect of a blank leader would be yet..probably no change as I had the problem with my Dolby Digital trailers and they are all built on one reel with true blank leaders between.

Testing time is a problem now as the room is in use a lot for classes so I may not be able to test it out for a while. I might try swapping the 773 card from the other screening room's processor to see if that solves it.

Sam Chavez, what is your thought on all of this?
 

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Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-24-2011, 10:25 PM:
 
Does the problem sound the same when changing from projector #1 to projector #2 as it sounds when changing from #2 to #1?

What if one projector is running at a constant speed but slightly slower or faster than the other? Would the digital processor ramp the sound up or ramp it down in order to blend the incoming and outgoing tracks together? If so, would you hear an increasing pitch when changing over in one direction and a decreasing pitch when changing over in the other direction?

Thus, if true, a speed check between projectors might be in order. Also compare the ramp-up time between both projectors. Otherwise, check the impedance drums for drag or slippage.

Mostly just spitballing, here but that's all I can think of.
 

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Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 10-24-2011, 10:50 PM:
 
Wow - this sounds sort of familiar.

Good luck.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-25-2011, 12:23 AM:
 
Mark: Thank you for posting that link. I read thru that thread and the problem isn't quite the same...splices aren't in play in this case and I am not running a platter..but there was a lot of great info found there.

quote: Randy Stankey

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Does the problem sound the same when changing from projector #1 to projector #2 as it sounds when changing from #2 to #1?

What if one projector is running at a constant speed but slightly slower or faster than the other? Would the digital processor ramp the sound up or ramp it down in order to blend the incoming and outgoing tracks together? If so, would you hear an increasing pitch when changing over in one direction and a decreasing pitch when changing over in the other direction?

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To answer your questions:

Yes it is the same effect going from 1 to 2 and 2 to 1...

Both machines are running within 1/10 of a frame of each other (look at the pics I posted in the warehouse and you'll see the rate display.) The problem happens because the incoming machine ramps up to speed (inverter drives) and it ONLY happens when the incoming machine is started. As in my first post, it seems like the processor is clocking to the incoming machine as soon as the motor starts and is not "waiting" for the actual changeover to take place before clocking to the incoming track. (Footnote: I work on several other screening rooms with CP-650s and two projectors, many of which also have inverters with the same ramp-up times and they do NOT have this issue.)

My understanding is that in the changeover environment (with the presence of the second Motor Start command,) it should not be blending the transitions at all.

The pitch change is an abrupt drop in pitch which ramps back up (at the same rate as the incoming projector's speed) just before the actual changeover. And it happens the same in both directions of reel change.

So it appears to be some sort of processor problem....

Or, it could be the ghost of the original installer f**king with me...the #2 half-speed start issue I reported about earlier started right after he died.

And the half-speed start has been fixed....so that's not it.

Again, to be clear, here's the scenario:

Playing the end of reel #1, as soon as the projector for reel #2 is started, the sound playing ON REEL 1, slows in pitch then ramps back up matching the ramp up speed of reel #2 even BEFORE the actual changeover. This happens on ALL reel changes regardless of which machine is the running or incoming one.
 

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Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 10-25-2011, 07:11 AM:
 
Tony,

Did it always do this and it has just been noticed?

Just a wild shot here, but what if the video cables are interchanged? Also, maybe the motor relay wires are transposed but this should be more obvious.

Sounds to me like the incoming projector is making a changeover early but since you have a blank leader on the incoming projector it hangs onto to the outgoing audio in the buffer until it sees valid audio on the incoming projector.

Norm Cerda at Dolby is very good on this sort of issue.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-25-2011, 01:34 PM:
 
Hi Sam, how's ShoEast?

It has just started doing this, it was working fine before, it even ran a test print I have after installation with no issues.

The issue is there with standard leaders or with blank leaders.

Like I mentioned in my first post, there was an incident a while ago during a screening where, in mid-reel, the processor freaked out (popping noises in the sound) and switched itself from Format 10 to Format 04....very odd. This current problem appeared shortly after. IIRC I ran a screening or two in SR before this latest digital screening but after the freakout and had noticed no issues in analog.

I will triple-check the motor start and changeover relays and signals to the processor, but I am pretty sure they are still working ok.

I also need to get back and look through the event log to see if that freakout showed up.

Is Norm at Dolby LA or San Fran?
 

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Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 10-25-2011, 04:18 PM:
 
Norm is in SF at tech services. 415 645 5205.
 

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Posted by Kris Verhanneman (Member # 5562) on 10-26-2011, 08:27 AM:
 
Any way of trying/swaping at the location with another working CP?
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-26-2011, 01:14 PM:
 
Thanks Sam.

Kris, yeah that is one option I have as the two screening rooms there are CP-650 equipped. I can't leave them swapped though as the University has them asset tagged to each room, and they get touchy about moving things around.

I will not be able to do any testing until I get the room scheduled for maintenance time which is another difficult thing there of late.
 

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Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 10-26-2011, 08:42 PM:
 
Just curious... You're saying that it does this with a blank leader in the incoming projector, meaning no SRD track at all? What happens if you block the exciter's light on the incoming projector's penthouse reader while the projector ramps up to speed? In essence blocking the Dolby processor from "seeing" the film start up at all. Thread the leader through the reader like normal, but block the light from getting to the camera. Stick an index card in front of it or something when your motor is ramping up.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-27-2011, 12:32 AM:
 
Well, got a chance to talk to Norm at Dolby today..he feels I'm on the right track with the CAT 773 being bad....or possibly the CAT 774 (control board). As I had suspected, he's never heard of this particular problem, but there have been a few rare issues with the CAT 773's before. (And he's heard of/read the other thread.)

I was granted a 4-hour block of time this Saturday to work on it.

Hopefully my other room will be down also so I can try swapping the 773 board to see if it fixes the problem.

Mark: Good idea, and I have an easier way, I have power switches on the LED's for the penthouses so I can just kill the LED to see if it helps.

I will post back on Sunday or Monday with the outcome.
 

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Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 10-27-2011, 04:23 AM:
 
Just curious... what's going on at a UCI screening room that downtime is so hard to come by?
 

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Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 10-27-2011, 05:30 AM:
 
Here's another test that you could try during your downtime which might give interesting results...

With projector #1 running and projector #2 threaded with a blank leader, or loop, or whatever, start the motor on projector #2 while you're in the middle of the reel on #1. Then after #2 ramps up to speed and the wow stops (assuming the wow also happens while you're in the middle of the reel), shut down #2. What happens?
 

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Posted by Ian Parfrey (Member # 5122) on 10-27-2011, 06:03 AM:
 
Why does this sound like really badly regulated mains going to the projector motor?

What does a cro show when hanging off the motor supply on the incoming machine?
 

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Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 10-27-2011, 09:19 AM:
 
Tony: can you swap the 773s? You would then have an iron-clad idea of exactly what is wrong.

Working on room; how about after midnight. That is my way out at the local Univerisyt. Louis
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-27-2011, 02:56 PM:
 
Jim: Both rooms are used for classes during the day. BTW, if you are available I can use a second set of eyes for the process.

Mark: That is one of my planned tests.

Ian: My tach display shows no speed variations during these events. Note that the problem is happening on the machine that is already running at speed when the incoming machine is ramping up. And what the heck is a "CRO"? (These are also inverter drive motors that are pretty immune to mains issues unless the voltage becomes extremely low.)

Louis: The plan is to swap the 773's first, the 774's second and if that doesn't work I will have to have Dolby swap the entire processor.

Midnight access is harder to get than weekend for some odd reason...University policies are very odd sometimes. And I don't fancy staying up all night for this.

Thanks for all the tips and advice guys..I'll let you know how it all shakes out.
 

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Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 10-27-2011, 03:11 PM:
 
Is the Davis loop on the outgoing projector's reader doing anything strange like jumping up and down during this event?

What is upstream of the reader, just an upper reel spindle with a passive clutch for hold back tension?
 

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Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 10-27-2011, 03:48 PM:
 
I like Sam's first idea on his first post. Sometimes the most unreasonable thing is it, even though it is still unreasonable. Louis
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-27-2011, 07:36 PM:
 
Sam:

To your questions, no and yes.

I can see the possibility for the reel spindles to be a cause, if it it wasn't happening with such consistency on both machines, and if it weren't for the fact that the last reel can play all the way to the end with no issues. (And this isn't an irregular variation, it is a smooth ramp-up to speed kind of thing.) (For the thread title, "wow" was the best thing I could think of that would fit the title line limits.)

I'll know late Saturday afternoon what's up for sure.

However, it is something that will be looked at during my test.
 

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Posted by Ian Parfrey (Member # 5122) on 10-27-2011, 08:06 PM:
 
Tony.

CRO = Cathode Ray Oscilloscope or 'scope for short.

I feel very old all of a sudden.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-01-2011, 02:33 PM:
 
Ian:

No need to feel old mate..I think it was just a difference in Anglo-Aussie terminology.

Ok gang, here's the outcome of the testing on Saturday:

Problem persisted at the startup of a reel, but was consistent ONLY when starting at the very beginning of a reel. If I ran partway into a reel, stopped, then did a "changeover" running up from a point other than the leader, the problem would happen.... sometimes.

Doing a changeover into the start of a reel with the Digital reader's LED off, no variation of the outgoing reels speed.

All relays for Motor Start and P1/P2 select were working normally.

No speed issues with either projector.

The other room was in use so I could not swap cards.

Dolby is sending me a CAT 773 and CAT 774 to swap out to see if it solves the problem.

I did find that my power supply voltages were a bit low (big surprise..not) but Norm says that the values I came up with should not be an issue. Both room's PS read about the same. I will be picking up a CP-650 for my own room here shortly, configured the same way, so I will not only have a reference point but also have service spares. (And no, I will not be selling my CP-65 unless someone makes an offer I can't refuse.)

So I will be doing another test this coming Saturday, if I can get the room again and hopefully the problem will be fixed.
 

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Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 11-01-2011, 07:14 PM:
 
Tony,

What kind of leader did you have on the incoming reel? Did it have SR.D info on the perfs?

That might explain why no variations in speed when making a changeover in mid reel as there is most likely SR.D info unless you are using film from the stone age.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-01-2011, 10:43 PM:
 
Sam, all reels leaders are print originals and have the data starting at the usual location.

My hunch is that the start of a reel has no data, then the data starts being read before the actual changeover and that is why the clock picks up on it. During a mid-reel run up data is present immediately and I think the processor's clock ignores it (treating it like a dropout and reversion perhaps?)

The other interesting thing is that forcing reversions on either machine while running behaved perfectly normally.

Isn't modern electronics fun?
 

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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 11-02-2011, 05:10 PM:
 
Tony, have you been using the same print for this? Do you observe this problem with other prints?

Could the condition of the print be an issue? The heads/tails of repertory prints are so often trashed. What are the error rates at the head, midway and tails?

In all honesty, I wouldn't guess that could cause "wow" but who knows? You seem to have stumbled into uncharted territory with this one. To quote General Beringer from "WarGames":

quote:

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"Hell! I'd piss on a sparkplug if I thought it'd do any good."

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Do I understand correctly that you have tried starting with BOTH reels at a midway point (that is not "wow-ing") and executing a changeover from there? In other words, what happens when you perform a changeover with "known-working" data blocks incoming/outgoing?
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-02-2011, 05:38 PM:
 
Manny:

This has happened with several prints, some of which are brand new and have error rates of 3 or lower.

So print condition is not a factor. My test print runs at 4-5 and it does the same thing.

Yes I tried mid reel changeovers from my test print and as I posted, sometimes it would act up and sometimes it won't.

I got the replacement cards from Dolby today and have the room for testing again on Saturday so once I isolate which card I'll report back.
 

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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 11-02-2011, 06:13 PM:
 
Make sure you rip out all of those little blue bits. They only get in the way!

Sorry. Couldn't resist. Old Film-Tech humor. Disregard.
 

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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 11-07-2011, 09:58 AM:
 
Tony, darling:

I'm bored. Please update me.

Yours,
Manny.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-07-2011, 12:40 PM:
 
Manny my little stud muffin:

Well, the test on Saturday was........a disaster.

To start with, the CAT773 sent to me by Dolby arrived damaged (A capacitor was broken off the board..C82 if Norm is checking this thread.)

So I had to get the 773 from our other screening room which luckily was not in use.

So I tried all possible combinations of replacing the CAT 773 and CAT 774.....and the problem persists.

I double-verified that the reader cables were not crossed by disconnecting #2....and #2's reader was out, so that means the cables are ok.

I then looked at a possible grounding issue with the rack/incoming power......we have a good solid ground, with .02 vac measured between ground and neutral. And around .04 vac between the rack and the projector's ground.

I am going to pick up another CP-650 later this week and I'm gonna try swapping the entire processor to see what happens. My show on Thursday night are gonna be the guinea pigs to see if the problem goes away.

Love and kisses,

Tony
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-11-2011, 01:38 PM:
 
I am about to rename this thread "As The Reel Turns" as this gets stranger by the day......

Well, I brought in a whole other CP-650, ran the feature with that substitute....and

now it does it only sometimes and to a lesser degree.

One thing that came to light is that this earlier processor I brought in had the previous version of the software, which I updated before this test. Luckily I have a disc with that previous version (2.3.5.3) so my next step is to "downdate" the original processor to this version from the current 2.3.6.3 to see if THAT solves the problem. (The only thing I don't like is that the older version lacks a few formats I want (Format 76 for example) but I can live with that.)

The test processor also had a better power supply so I am also going to get Dolby to send out a new power supply as some of the voltages were out of tolerance with the original processor.

So at this point, based on the testing so far, I have a combination of weak power supply and possible software issues based on my observations.

Stay tuned for more drama....
 

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Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 11-11-2011, 05:22 PM:
 
Is there a diagnostic port/monitoring tool for the CP650 like on some other processors?

- Carsten
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 11-11-2011, 10:56 PM:
 
Carsten:

The processor stores any error information in the event log, which shows basic diagnostic info, when a laptop is connected with the CP650 setup software it gives a more detailed description of the error..but.....this problem is not showing up as any kind of error in said logs.

I haven't tried using DRAS (Dynamic Reader Alignment Software) to read out what the readers are picking up while running (and I don't think it would work to track an entire feature) but it would not really show any timing/clock rate errors which is what this problem appears to be.

But I may try it next Thursday just for giggles to see if it shows something worthwhile.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 12-03-2011, 12:56 PM:
 
Ok, I haven't had a chance to attack this lately, but having time to think about it leads me to believe the possible cause is software related.

All other screening rooms I have dealt with have older software versions installed and readers in the standard locations.

As you can see from this picture, I have a very long delay (351 perfs) involved in this situation:



I am now thinking that the unusually long delay setting, in concert with the current software, may be the cause of the problem. I'll get a chance later this month to do more testing to find out.
 

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Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 12-03-2011, 02:35 PM:
 
My Dolby software experience is that if it works, DON'T upgrade it. Early on (CP-500) I didn't know that and I drove a lot of miles putting things back where they were when it "worked last." Louis
 

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Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-03-2011, 05:07 PM:
 
Louis,

That is my philosophy for all software. If it is stable and the new software does not address problems I'm experiencing or adds features I want, I leave it alone. The CP500 did indeed inflict problems after software version 1.31 that were not rectified until the final software of 1.65. I had some CP500s run on 1.2 from the beginning of their lives until their end (DCinema did them in). The only problems those CP500s ever had was the occasional Power Supply failure (I think two out of 16 in about a dozen years).

For Kinoton, I normally always recommend the factory RSSD (basement) reader...it will improve analog as well as digital. With even PK60s and FP50s now coming out of service, you might be able to scarf up a suitable RSSD soundhead for your FP30D's for little to no money.

-Steve
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 12-03-2011, 05:45 PM:
 
Steve I would be glad to change the readers out, but:

1: The University will NOT spend any more money on that room, especially with the main film program that I used to run getting the budget ax. ALL of the upgrades (CP650, Digital, Analog red readers, etc.) done as mentioned in my pics in the warehouse were paid for/donated by me.

2: If I recall, those damned lens turrets get in the way of using the RSSD readers.

Now, if you happen across a pair and wish to donate them to the University they will gladly accept them. (I will pay for shipping.)

Louis/Steve: I agree 100% on the software upgrade issues. This processor was new and already had the "6" series software in it. Luckily I have the previous versions that I can try.
 

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Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-03-2011, 06:32 PM:
 
The RSSD can be retroed into any FP20 or FP30...turret or single lens. Another thing you can probably do is switch it to single lens. Again, much of this stuff is a matter of saving it from the dumpster.

-Steve
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 12-03-2011, 10:12 PM:
 
Steve,

I have wanted since 1997 to convert those machines to single lens mounts.

Again, if you come across single lens mounts, the readers and lens holders please PM me so we can make arrangements for me to get that stuff from you. (Or anyone else on the forum who has access to same, let me know!!)

Kinotons weren't used much by the chains out here dumping equipment.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 05-21-2012, 01:03 PM:
 
Bumping this up for a couple of reasons:

1: Scott Norwood just posted a thread asking about CP650 software versions;
2: I haven't had ANY time to get back in and try my software downgrade;

And also to prod Steve Guttag into seeing if he has any single-lens holder assemblies I can get for those pesky Kinotons.

In other news:

On the half-speed hangup I mentioned with the #2 machine I found the issue to be with the relays (the ones soldered to the speed selection board) but due to the ridiculous cost of replacements I have jumpered the card out to run 24 frames always.
 

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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 05-23-2012, 03:45 PM:
 
Tony,

I've been able to force my SRD playback to "wow" by operating in variable speed mode and varying the speed a little. It makes me wonder....

Are you 100% sure that your projectors are rock-steady at 24fps?

One of my (Kinoton) projectors has needed the variable pots to be changed-out twice now (less than 2 years old) and I've noticed that the 25fps "wobbles" like crazy for about 12 seconds before stabilizing -- so it doesn't stabilize until a few seconds after changeover.

You could be having a similar issue on takeoff at 24fps. Do your machines have a 3-digit FPS LED display?

Just a thought.

Stay warm.

Yours,
M.

P.S. - Could it possibly be that you've bypassed 2 of your constant feed sprockets?
 

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Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 05-23-2012, 04:30 PM:
 
No single-lens holders here...sorry.
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 05-23-2012, 08:19 PM:
 
Manny:

Yep I am positive the speed is steady, I have a rate display tied to the encoders for the dubber set to resolve to 1/10 of a frame in speed and they are steady.

And this is not a simple "wow" (as I said in an earlier post it was the only term I could think of at the time), it is a gross drop in speed of the playing audio on the outgoing projector that ramps up in sync with the incoming projector's motor.

As for the constant speed sprockets, if you look at the full size pics in the warehouse you'll see that there is no way to get the film through them ahead of the reader. The film payout off the reels is smooth and no more unsteady that other rooms I run with penthouses that do not have this issue.

Steve:

Keep looking, I'll take them whenever you run across a set.
 

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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 05-24-2012, 09:44 AM:
 
Dammit, Tony! I want this resolved!

Thanks for reminding me -- the incoming projector -- it's been a while.

So I'm thinking then the issue will reside with cabling to the processor or the processor itself -- some kind of "crosstalk" between the motor sensing cables or circuits -- Somehow, that processor is "getting distracted" by the incoming projector -- but you swapped out processors, so it's probably the cabling.

[That other processor works perfectly in a changeover situation somewhere else, right?]

I know you did a basic check to make sure the cables weren't wrong-way-round, but if you haven't done so yet, it might be time to take a close look at the connectors..?

I'll re-read the thread so I don't suggest things that have already been suggested, but in the meantime -- what happens if you only start the motor on the incoming projector, but don't make the changeover -- (from somewhere in the middle of the playing reel, so you don't run out of film) -- does the sound stabilize when the other projector finally gets to speed?? And if you stop the incoming projector, does the sound "wow" with the "coast down?"
 

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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 05-24-2012, 11:50 AM:
 
Two more questions:

What happens to the motor indicator lights on the front panel of the 650 when you start the motor of the incoming projector? Any sign of gremlins at work there?

What happens if you take the affected CP650 to the other cinema? You brought the 2nd processor to the freaky booth. What about the other way round?
 

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Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 06-04-2012, 05:48 AM:
 
Anyone else want to bet that either:

1) This never gets solved, or
2) It magically goes away some day

?
 

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Posted by Brent Francis (Member # 5008) on 06-04-2012, 09:53 AM:
 
HaHaHaHaHaHa
 

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Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 06-04-2012, 01:11 PM:
 
Manny my amigo:

Cabling and connections have all been ruled out as there are no issues there and there are no influences that could affect them, the front panel motor start and changeover indicators show no gremlins, and due to current circumstances there is no way I can swap the processor out to a known-ok room. As mentioned in a previous post, I blew a perfect opportunity by upgrading my own processor with the latest software before I took it in for the test.

Now, as for the mid-reel start and stops you suggested they seem to have no effect at all. But remember that the way Dolby Digital data is read and "cached" at reel transitions (To cover the effects of splices in platter ops and the duplicate data read on incoming reels heads in a changeover op) is part of the reason I am convinced that software is the problem. (Unlike DTS, Dolby Digital will NOT transition to the incoming reel if the processor is NOT seeing a valid changeover signal. DTS WILL jump to the incoming reel audio regardless of changeover status as soon as the incoming reels' timecode is valid.)

Mark, the odds favor #1 at this point as I still cannot gain access to the room for more tests and my own test print doesn't really have the right end-of-reel content to hear the problem.

And since the University has cut back even more on the screenings that leaves even less chances of solving the problem.
 

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Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 06-05-2012, 05:58 AM:
 

quote: Tony Bandiera Jr

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Now, as for the mid-reel start and stops you suggested they seem to have no effect at all. But remember that the way Dolby Digital data is read and "cached" at reel transitions (To cover the effects of splices in platter ops and the duplicate data read on incoming reels heads in a changeover op) is part of the reason I am convinced that software is the problem.

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You are correct, sir.

quote: Tony Bandiera Jr

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Mark, the odds favor #1 at this point

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You are correct again.

Don't feel too bad. The people I worked for never figured it out either.

Fear not, however. In about a year or two, if we're all still here and film is still being used somewhere, someone else will either post a new DOLBY WOW thread or revive this one, and we'll start again.


 

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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 06-05-2012, 09:50 AM:
 

quote:

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Now, as for the mid-reel start and stops you suggested they seem to have no effect at all. But remember that the way Dolby Digital data is read and "cached" at reel transitions (To cover the effects of splices in platter ops and the duplicate data read on incoming reels heads in a changeover op) is part of the reason I am convinced that software is the problem.

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