Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Vinegar Syndrome etc.. should I avoid this film?

This is topic Vinegar Syndrome etc.. should I avoid this film? in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Justin Lovell (Member # 6719) on 09-28-2012, 05:01 PM:

A friend asked me to transfer this film for him but I'm nervous about doing it and contaminating my projector/scanner. He says:

"It is on 16mm Kodak safety film but it has vinegar syndrome (AD strip value 2) and significant mothball syndrome indicating deterioration of the plasticizers. Also there is an approximately 10” tear at the head of the film which we are unable to repair. "

I'd love to help him, but is it better if I just avoid this all together?

Thanks!

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 09-28-2012, 05:30 PM:

Its not going to transfer the VS to another print. Just don't store the thing in the same room as other prints.

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 09-28-2012, 10:20 PM:

Just give your machine a good cleaning before and afterward.

If you are going to do multiple prints, clean before each one.

Not strictly to prevent the spread of vinegar but mainly to keep your film clean, prevent the spread of dirt and to get the best possible transfer so that you'll only have to run the film once.
(i.e. The more times you run an old film, the more chance you have of damaging it. If you have a dirty machine and have to run a film twice to get a clean copy that's twice the risk.)

Run your machine at minimum tension to keep the film steady. That's more common sense than anything although, when running old films, you ought to be more attentive to that kind of thing.

FilmGuard... It will arrest the progression of vinegar syndrome but don't expect a cure. FilmGuard can allow a print that has vinegared to last longer but, generally speaking, once a film has started to turn, it's a one way street.

To FilmGuard or not to FilmGuard. That is the question.

FilmGuard can help but not cure. FilmGuard can leave visible streaks on the film.

If the film is really valuable, don't use FilmGuard.

See if you can get a good, clean transfer without using FilmGuard then, after the work is done, consider using it.

If you can't get the print to run through the machine, go ahead and try. It might make the difference between getting an "okay" copy and not getting a copy at all.

Also, I have had some luck putting some FilmGuard on the gate runners and tension bands. It doesn't last a long time. It probably works mostly because it cleans the surfaces more than it lubricates. It will wear off after a while.

Clean the bands using your normal method. Take a Q-Tip and dip it in the solution. Squeeze out most of the excess. Carefully wipe on the bands. Don't use too much. Just a light coating.

Like Brad says, vinegar doesn't spread unless degraded films are stored in close proximity to undegraded films.

It's not like Ebola! [Wink]

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 10-09-2012, 08:04 AM:

quote: Randy Stankey
Like Brad says, vinegar doesn't spread unless degraded films are stored in close proximity to undegraded films.

And even then, the risk is only significant if the autocatalytic (or near to) element is in a vented container. Some archives with limited vault facilities will store the seriously smelly stuff in airtight cans with molecular sieves in them, with vented cans containing the pre-autocatalytic reels in the same room.

Other than keeping things clean, as Randy points out, your real issues are likely to be perforation damage if the film has shrunk significantly (especially if you are using a sprocket-driven transfer device, e.g. Moviestuff or Tobin), and brittleness resulting in moisture loss from the base causing the film to break.

If you are using a sprocket-driven transfer device, I'd be inclined to tell your friend that there is an element of risk (of film breaks and strained/split perforations), and check that he's OK with that before going ahead.

Posted by Brent Francis (Member # 5008) on 10-09-2012, 05:29 PM:

Best & easiest way to check before transfer - run it (carefully!) through a synchronizer first. Worked for me for about 20 years.