Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Outdoor / mobile screens

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Posted by Jure Maticic (Member # 7197) on 01-31-2013, 05:55 AM:

Hi everyone,

we're thinking of expanding our activities and one of the ideas in starting an outdoors cinema in the summertime. We will be using two to three locations in the span of two months. I am considering a few options on how to set up our screen and would like some feedback and/or experience on the subject. The first option is to use an aluminum stage construction and use it to mount the screen. The second option is to use an inflatable screen ... i am favoring this one.

Any advice?

Thanks! Jure

Posted by Jonathan Bodge (Member # 4072) on 01-31-2013, 09:51 AM:

I've heard good things about the inflatable screen. They look cool. Haven't seen one myself or if the blower makes noise. The band YES had an inflatable set and the blower noise used to drive Steve Howe crazy.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 01-31-2013, 11:17 AM:

The inflatable ones are just fine. Wrong aspect ration most times. Some trouble if you have much wind. Louis

Posted by Jack Theakston (Member # 4484) on 01-31-2013, 11:37 AM:

Da-Lite also made some stand-up models (I've got a 4:3 silver screen that's about 15 feet tall), but like Louis said, a light breeze has been known to knock that stuff over.

I would just construct a tower in a way that it's easy to put up and take down (make sure it's either posted to the ground or bottom heavy). The inflatable things are more hassle than they're worth.

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 01-31-2013, 03:53 PM:

What size of screen are you thinking of?

'Inflatable' at first sounds like such a great idea. Once you went through an event with it, you will notice it needs at lot more to set up than just a few mouthfuls of air. And they are very expensive.

I guess stage truss usually is the best way to set it up in different locations.

- Carsten

Posted by Antti Nayha (Member # 4980) on 01-31-2013, 04:02 PM:

Now that’s a coincidence… I was also just asked to look at inflatable screens.

Is Airscreen the only available option? I’ve only seen one inflatable screen in action, but I’m not sure about the brand. I wasn’t quite sold on that particular example; the screen surface just looked a bit ugly to me.

I guess you wouldn’t use a center speaker with an inflatable screen for obvious reasons. Or is the consensus here that L+R+sub is ”good enough” for open air screenings anyway?

Posted by Jure Maticic (Member # 7197) on 02-01-2013, 06:20 AM:

I am lookink at something around 7-8m wide, depends what the standard measurments are for the manufacturers of such screens. I wouldn't spend too much on a custom sized screen. I have one offer from Airscreen - their 7.25 m screen (7.25 is just the screen size, the inflatable part comes around it and accounts for a little less than 1 m) would cost me about 11.000 Eur, with the screen included + the inflating device. What is that in USD - 12.000-13.000?? I was also checking out aluminum stage constructions and is seems just the frame would be more expensive + i would need more hands to build it and move it around.

I still haven't decided yet. But one thing is true. So far I still haven't seen the inflatable screen in action ... the other option (aluminum construction) I have seen and works fine, but is a lot of trouble transporting and assembling.

Jure

Posted by Jack Theakston (Member # 4484) on 02-01-2013, 08:36 PM:

Plus, aluminium is super expensive these days. Probably more durable would be a frame made out of PVC piping, and tether a screen to that frame.

Posted by Richard Hamilton (Member # 321) on 02-02-2013, 07:03 AM:

You could try contacting these guys.

MDI
Somehow Strong got involved with them but hopefully they didn't hurt them too much.
or
Franklin Designs

I have worked with both and would think they could recommend someone if they don't have anything.

Rick

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 02-02-2013, 07:17 AM:

Aluminium tubing 7m width does not cost too much. We paid about 300€ for the material (8.50m wide). Standard aluminium stage tubing is a bit more expensive, but then you can use standard connectors and fittings and it's a bit sturdier. Plus you get it at every stage/PA supply, repairs and changes are easy.

But the problem is not the frame. You need a solid mounting/fixing point for it.

And as I said - Airscreen just looks easy on first sight. Collapsed, they are still HUGE. Usually they need water ballasts, etc. It's not an air mattress! And for that, they are really expensive.

These are not strictly for outdoor use, but might give you an idea:

http://www.gerriets.com/_download/produktblaetter/Gerriets_Screens.pdf

(you can inquire for a price list at their website)

I still advocate perforated screens for open air - but it needs some more effort (black back screen foil).

Jure - feed Googles picture search with 'open air screen' - will give you lots of inspiration.

- Carsten

Posted by Patrick White (Member # 7444) on 02-02-2013, 07:54 AM:

Greetings. I'm new to the forum but thought I'd throw my thoughts in here as this is what I do. First, with regard to aspect ratio, you can get screens in whatever size you want just do the math and let the manufacturer know. Second, Airscreen is not the only game in town. I highly recommend you contact Michael Vosse at http://www.thevisionexperience.com/. I have three screens from him and have no complaints.

Posted by Will Kutler (Member # 770) on 02-02-2013, 09:50 AM:

I do not care for inflatable screens.

I have been at outdoor screenings (digital projection) during the spring/summertime.

Windy enviornments make the screens very unstable. All that fluttering around makes it impossible to keep a focused image. Ends up making the viewer nauseous!

Posted by Marin Zorica (Member # 1716) on 02-02-2013, 12:18 PM:

Hi jure!

Airscreen is relly great thing, i am working some film festival on summer and we are using airscreen which is rented via company who also represent them here, so if you need to get in touch and maybee get better prices let me know, so I can let you know for this guys here in Croatia.

Alu construction and screen on it is good, but problem is usual wind. Also, I did have some screens made with some 10mm thick wooden plates on metal construction, and painted in mat white color, that was great, besides fact that you need to put speakers under the screen.

Posted by Cameron Glendinning (Member # 3516) on 02-02-2013, 11:00 PM:

I use and sell inflatable screens that are affordable. I had great trouble sourcing a good design and build. I am more than happy with this one now in its 4th year of service. 25ftx14ft or 7.5 x 4.2 metres image size. This one is designed to cope with 25mph gusts.

Delivered to you about US $6000 not including import taxes or duty etc.

I personally would not use a metal frame (nor pvc pipe) as I think they are a much bigger risk in high winds. With the inflatable you can easly drop the screen quickly, unfortunately with metal it can bend or kill. Our first outdoor gig involved 2 riggers and used scaffolding it took a day to build and a day to pack up. The inflatable is up and down within the hour.

An example of the risks involved see the link below.

http://cxmagblog.com/2012/12/12/st-kilda-screen-collapse-near-miss-for-punters/

Posted by Jay Glaus (Member # 6011) on 02-03-2013, 02:56 AM:

I don't really have experience with either, I use steel tower Selby screens, which I think would be overkill for your application, but, I've known people doing what you want to do. Inflatables aren't bad, if you get them anchored very well. It's basically a sail in the air, so you'd want to make sure it's anchored way more than you believe it needs to be. And of course, better brands will be more sturdy, and more pricey, but you get what you pay for. As far as brands, I can't help you there, don't really know any. And I've never heard the sound from the blowers on an inflatable screen, so I can't help you there either, I assume it's kind of like the ones on a moon bounce, maybe not quite as powerful, no kids jumping on it. As car as a corrugated screen, personally, I prefer flat screens, just because the way it looks close up and the way moisture can lay on a corrugated a little different than flat. But that's my own personal opinion, I know people that swear by corrugated and for a smaller application I don't see why it wouldn't be just fine. I know of someone who got in a couple of shipping containers like you'd find on a dock, stacked them up, slapped a coat of white paint on, and called it a day. I don't know where you actually buy one of them, and it's probably more work than its worth, but it's little creative things like that which get you thinking. Hope this helps!
Jay

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 02-03-2013, 11:35 AM:

Yes, the real problem is to find a balance between size, security, cost/effort. Not easy for this kind of event. Also depends on wether you build it up on one site for multiple occasions, or if it needs to be up and down quickly on multiple locations with a traveling event. The more often you put it up and down, the more sense an inflatable makes.

- Carsten

Posted by Jure Maticic (Member # 7197) on 02-03-2013, 01:14 PM:

I don't thing using just aluminum or PVC tubes would be enough, somehow I wouldn't trust them. If I would go for aluminum i would go for ready made profiles, but as I said, the come with a high cost, especially if you start thinking about raisers and other stuff to make building such a screen easier.

It seems that the dynamic of our outdoors cinema venture will require an inflating screen, since we will have to take it down every night and move locations two or three times. In our part of the world Airscreen is the best option so far, because we have a local dealer and that makes servicing and support much easier for us.

Judging by what first hand experience I could gather, if you do things right with inflatable screens, put them up right, fix them properly ... one should have a stable screen. I guess no outdoor installation is quite safe from stronger winds ...

I'll let you know how it works after this summer is over ...

Cheers!
Jure

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 02-03-2013, 09:37 PM:

The infrateable will bend in a high wind. The others will pick up a truck or car in a high wind.

Posted by Cameron Glendinning (Member # 3516) on 02-06-2013, 01:46 AM:

quote: Jure Maticic
and that makes servicing and support much easier for us

So how do you service an inflatable screen and what do you think is involved? an oil change? I have 5 that I personally own and have sold many more and have never had to service one nor had a return for any reason.

The most that might happen is a hole...... and gaffa tape will keep you going until you use the repair kit (at your leisure) [Smile]

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 02-06-2013, 10:08 PM:

I've used many different outdoor screen types...from scaffolding truss to inflatables. There's no way on earth I would ever do another if it involved anything but an inflatable. Compact when not in use, sturdy, easily put up and down and you can get them made any darn size/ratio you want. Make sure you leave enough black at the bottom though for sight lines.