Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Problem with Kinoton fp40 motor

This is topic Problem with Kinoton fp40 motor in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://ft-forum.com/ft/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=011466

Posted by Jonathan Wood (Member # 4614) on 06-04-2013, 04:01 PM:

Hi, does anyone have any idea what could be causing the motor on my fp40 to run roughly? The inverter keeps cutting out saying thermal overload on motor . The motor cage turns freely and smoothly by hand it's just when power is applied things go wrong, there's a faint burning smell and it sounds like it's running very roughly. Are there brushes in there that need changing? Have changed oil and everything is lubricated. [Confused]

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 06-04-2013, 10:17 PM:

No brushes. The rough running and burning smell means that the motor's windings are damaged.

Only fix is a replacement motor.

When replacing the motor, check ALL connections for any that may be loose or burned up.

Posted by Jonathan Wood (Member # 4614) on 06-05-2013, 01:55 AM:

Thanks Tony, that's what I feared. No chance it could be re wound ? I suppose it might be cheaper to get a new head!

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 06-05-2013, 07:05 PM:

You're welcome, and sorry to be the bringer of bad news.

A rewind is not out of question IF you can find a rewind shop that specializes in small motors. (Those are hard to find here in the US, you might have better luck over there.)

A new head MAY end up being cheaper.

But, before you give up, send a PM to Mr. Steve Guttag on here, he is the Kinoton guru and he may have a source for a replacement motor at a decent price. Couldn't hurt to ask anyway.

Posted by Jonathan Wood (Member # 4614) on 06-06-2013, 02:06 AM:

Cheers Tony , I will do that , thanks again for your help. There is a shop near me that does rewinds , I will ask. A new motor is well over $500 so a new projector (given the current state of things,) would definately be cheaper! [beer]

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 06-06-2013, 02:59 AM:

Fortunately, that motor is used in most of the late model Kinotons so if you know of "removed" projectors, then it is likely a parts source. Whereas we've never had one fail, it isn't all that common.

Posted by Jonathan Wood (Member # 4614) on 06-06-2013, 03:10 AM:

Thanks Steve, I will look out for one. Interesting you say that they rarely fail-I'm assuming it's the motor and not the intermittent ? The problemis when it starts up it sounds like it's racing and running unevenly and quite noisily, there is also a faint smell of burning .The inverter then cuts out , to protect it I guess? The motor and intermittent turn very easily by hand and I've tried it with another inverter and the same problem . Any advice gratefully received! Jon

Posted by Tom McGarrity (Member # 7320) on 06-06-2013, 09:36 AM:

Jonathan, you can have my fully working de-automated FP40 for £200 + £60 courier, if it's of any help.

Posted by Peter Hall (Member # 695) on 06-06-2013, 10:06 AM:

Hi

We've had a number of these with duff crimps on the projector side of the inverter were badly made. First one we saw had had another install company replace the inverter and motor first ! I'd check these as like Steve have never had a motor fail..

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 06-06-2013, 11:00 AM:

We are talking about a D or E projector?

I've had a few of the Lenze SMD inverters fail so that is a possibility too.

The Lenze will protect itself...if the motor over-currents, it should drop out...what does the display of the Lenze say when it is in the failure state?

Posted by Jonathan Wood (Member # 4614) on 06-06-2013, 11:45 AM:

Hi Steve,
it's a D series. The inverter doesn't have a display as such , just two LEDs. The left hand one is flashing green and the right hand one is un lit.

I did try the motor wired directly to another inverter , an omron j7, and the same results unsteady, noisey and a burning smell.

One thing I have thought of is that by mistake I re filled the oil through the glass tube rather than the plastic hose- stupid mistake I know. I've since drained it and refilled correctly, my point is though that someone told me that if you fill through the glass tube they can run for a while and then seize up? Don't know if this caused an extraneous load on the motor and hence the burn out? It does run (when turned by hand , ) much smoother now.

Tom, thanks for the offer, will certainly bear this in mind if I can't cheaply fix the motor.

Jon

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 06-06-2013, 03:44 PM:

You have a older Lenze...they are even better...never had one of them fail. You need the "faceplate" if you want to control it or see what is going on.

But since you say you tried another inverter with the same results...there you have it.

As to oil filling...technically, the glass tube is the "fill" and the hose is the "drain." Experienced people realized you could get air bubbles in there and basically not really fill the system and just have some oil in the glass tube. When we install them, we punch holes in the dust caps to avoid the possibility of a vacuum causing a false level. We also recommend filling from the hose as it naturally "burps" the system (plus it fits the nozzle of the oil jugs) and actually fills faster since one is squeezing it in and not having to wait for it to drain down the short glass tube.

Posted by Jonathan Wood (Member # 4614) on 06-06-2013, 04:01 PM:

Thanks Steve, I guess it's try and find a cheap second hand motor.

Re the filling method, the mech certainly turns over a lot more freely when filled from the hose, I can even turn the mech from the knurled knob on the bottom sprocket , something I could not do before.