Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: New Sony 20" CRTs

This is topic New Sony 20" CRTs - no S-video! in forum The Afterlife at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://ft-forum.com/ft/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=12;t=000474

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-24-2006, 10:27 PM:

Sony pisses me off. As you may or may not know, I like videogames. I have a nice collection of older game systems like the Sega Genesis, Super Nintendo, Sega Saturn, Sega Master System, NES, TurboGrafx-16 etc. All hooked up to a miniscule 14" TV in a dedicated room for old, crusty (yet still incredibly fun) games. I want to get a 20" TV because that size is much better and perfect for that room. Sony is my favorite TV manufacturer, as their CRT tubes are usually the best despite geometry issues in some sets. Sony's current 20-incher, the KV-20FS120 is getting rave reviews from everyone who sees it. But they all have the same complaint... no S-video port! In fact a lot of TV manufacturers are getting rid of S-video while keeping component.

There is composite and component, but no S-video. This can suck for satellite users as well. My Sega Saturn and Super Nintendo both use S-video. My Sega Genesis and Master System use component, and the NES & TurboGrafx-16 use composite. So how the hell will I use the Saturn and the SNES on a great new TV without S-video? Last year's model had S-video. Damn them! Needless to say, I have not purchased the TV. What I am doing is getting a SCART RGB cable, one for the Saturn and one for the SNES. The RGB will be converted to "YUV" component with a device I already have and all will be fine, but since it is SCART that means I must order the cables from the UK! The cables are cheap, but shipping is not and the speed at which they arrive is slow. Damn foreigners. But it solves my problem. Still pisses me off, though. It'll be at least a few weeks before the cables arrive, but when they do the quality will be better than S-video would have been.

All of this could have been avoided if Sony just included the S-video. Even my crappy 14" Advent $89 special features both s-video and component. And why doesn't the US embrace SCART? What the hell?

Posted by Robert Minichino (Member # 3495) on 02-24-2006, 11:55 PM:

I just got my parents that set a few months ago, and I also got pissed off when I tried to connect their DirecTiVo (which only has composite and S-video). So they only got composite; at least the comb filter gets a good workout. [Smile]

I've got a SIMA source switcher that upconverts S-video to component, but I'm not spending another $180 for an improvement they probably won't notice anyway. It still bothers me, though. Argh.

Posted by Bruce Hansen (Member # 281) on 02-27-2006, 05:57 PM:

Composite is simply Y and C added together. You can buy a divice that will do just that (through some simple filters) for about $5 or $6. Here is a link to MCM, who sells them: MCM S to Comp

Y/C and composite are very close to the same thing, and those mini 4 pin DIN connectors are crap. I think that the main reason that Y/C came out, was to get people to run out and buy a new TV they didn't need.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-27-2006, 07:43 PM:

Uh... there is a HUGE difference between S-video and composite, especially in vertical lines. I would never want to smash my Y/C down to boring ol' composite. Check out these pics I took myself of an old videogame. None of them were Photoshopped in any way other than cropping and resizing:

Composite.
Notice how blurry everything seems. You can barely
read the red text above the weapon cases.

S-Video.
Overall detail is enhanced. The text is now a bit
easier to read and you can see more crap.

So you see, there is a definite advantage to S-Video over composite that would be lost by defaulting to the yellow cables. I'll take the best video I can get, thank you!

Component.
Of course now everything is readable.
Component really helps the reds.

(By the way, my digital camera is ancient and sucks ass, and these pics were taken on an Advent 14" TV. No adjustments to the TV were made between pictures).

Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 02-28-2006, 03:28 PM:

Y/C keeps the chrominance and luminance separate. Composite puts them together in a way that does not allow them to be pulled apart perfectly. Most cheaper TVs will just cut the luminance off at 3 MHz when a composite signal is fed in, while the S-Video allows full uncorrupted higher-bandwidth luminance to be fed to the set. The annoying dot crawl is eliminated with the S-Video connection because the interference between luminance and chrominance is eliminated.

It's a shame that when color TV came along, they didn't increase the bandwidth for the channels rather than just making the color signal be a black and white signal to be interpreted in a special way. Before color, TV pictures has a bandwidth of 4.2 MHz and after color came along, only the more expensive sets could handle more than 3 MHz luminance because of the separation of the color and luminace that was required. The color bandwidth in a composite signal for broadcast is only 0.6 MHz anyway. It's really an awful system.

Using the component cables frees you from the lower-bandwidth chrominance limitation.