Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Universal DVDs locking out their logo

This is topic Universal DVDs locking out their logo in forum The Afterlife at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 08-03-2009, 08:20 AM:

I have now had a number of Universal DVD releases from Focus Pictures, EVENING for one, in which the Universal logo will only play the first time you put the disc in the player and play thru (or skip) the trailers and go to the Main Menu. You hit PLAY and the FBI bs comes up as usual and then the Universal logo plays.

Once the Universal logo plays, however, you can't get it back again....ever. You can't use the SKIP button to get back to it, you can't even SCAN backwards button; those actions will only get back to the Focus Feature logo, not the Universal. From that point on, even if you go back to the Main Menu and hit PLAY again, the disc will only start at the Focus Feature logo. The only way to ever play the Universal logo again, is to remove the disc and re-insert it.

So, uh.... WTF?

Posted by Jeremy Jorgenson (Member # 2989) on 08-03-2009, 07:11 PM:

Duh! They are worried that cinema employees might be illegally uploading copies of the Universal logo from certain DVDs (Evening, for example).

Posted by John Hawkinson (Member # 1135) on 08-16-2009, 03:25 PM:

The Universal logo doesn't typically play on the front of Focus Features features theatrically. I assume in this case it plays on the front of the DVD because the DVD is distributed by Universal (I realize that they own Focus). Think of it as just like the credit for the DVD mastering service that sometimes plays at the end of DVD movies.

If it's not part of the theatrical release, it should not play when you hit PLAY.

--jhawk

Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 08-16-2009, 03:44 PM:

Ah, therein lies the mystery. It DOES play when you hit PLAY from the DVD menu....but only the FIRST time you do it. Once you pass the Universal logo and are into the movie proper, you cannot get the Universal logo to play again. If you SKIP back or SCAN back to what you assume would be the first frame, it will always start at the Focus Features logo, bypassing Universal. And this is what's the most puzzeling -- even if you go back to the DVD menu and start by hitting PLAY, it will NOT start on the Universal logo. How is that possible? How can such a variable be flagged into the DVD -- "Play this only once"? As I said, the ONLY way to ever see the Universal logo again is to eject the DVD and reinsert it and play it from the DVD menu.

That's what is driving me crazy.

Posted by Sam Graham (Member # 2889) on 08-16-2009, 07:01 PM:

The Universal logo plays as a separate event and isn't programmed as a chapter of the movie.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-16-2009, 11:45 PM:

quote: J-Hawk
If it's not part of the theatrical release, it should not play when you hit PLAY.

Amen to that. If I could agree with that statement more than 100%, I most certainly would!

But yeah, it's all about the DVD authoring. It's pretty easy to do. Simply only allow the FIRST PLAY to point at the logo and allow nothing else to point at it. Kind of useless, but easy.

Posted by Paul Mayer (Member # 355) on 08-17-2009, 12:24 PM:

I wonder if this is a trend in DVD authoring these days. I recently picked up the US DVD release of the Japanese film "The Girl Who Leapt Through Time" (great little film BTW). When you play the disc you get the English-language Kadokawa Pictures logo, a trailer, then the Japanese Kadokawa logo, the Bandai Entertainment logo, and then the menu. When you hit play (either from the remote or from the menu), you go right to the opening fade-up - no logos.

I didn't get to see this film in a theater (either here or in Japan dammit), so I don't know if it was shown without logos theatrically.

Posted by Tom Mundell (Member # 4555) on 08-17-2009, 01:13 PM:

I saw this when they were running it at the Smithsonian; and I can't remember whether or not there were logos at the beginning (drat! I've seen this far more times on DVD)...though I think I recall it opening like the dvd.

Posted by Robert Harrison (Member # 3202) on 08-17-2009, 01:47 PM:

As Joe pertained to, all DVDs are encoded with commands of all sorts. Upon insertion in a player, the FIRST PLAY command tells the player what part of the disc to navigate to, usually a VIDEO TITLE SET containing a logo of some sort, and then on to the menu or maybe some "forced" ads before that. Then, when you select PLAY, usually there is another command to go to the FBI warning (if this hasn't already happened as part of the FIRST PLAY) and then on to the movie.

After the FIRST PLAY, as you have seen, some of these VIDEO TITLE SETS cannot be selected as there is no corresponding POST COMMAND on any other VIDEO TITLE SET or MENU selection to tell the player to show them again.

Posted by Cody Martin (Member # 2523) on 08-17-2009, 03:52 PM:

Someone out here may find this useful, but I have one of the dvd players that will resume play at the point where you either stopped or ejected the disk. The only solution I have found(other than skipping to the begginning) was to hit the stop button twice. That "fixed" my "issue".

Cody

Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 08-21-2009, 10:05 PM:

Cody, I have an older Pioneer that does that, and I LOVE it. If I stop my other players...or not even stop them -- if I just put them in pause for some reason, like having to go answer the phone, and it automatically goes out of pause and into stop, when I return to it, it will start again from the beginning and I have to find my place. Being able to resume at the same point where you left off is a great feature.

What I would REALLY like to see is some manufacturer come up with a player that will allow the user to decide which flags he wants the player to respond to and which he wants it to ignore. For example -- the FORCE flag for trailers and ads -- the player should have a menu that you could turn that FORCE flag OFF whenever the owner wantsto. Also there is no reason why the player can't be programmed to play from the first frame of the MOVIE whenever you hit play. You should be able to configure the player in its menu to ignore EVERYTHING and play from the first frame of the movie. Should I go partially insane and feel the need to see all that upfront gack, I could go to the DVD menu and disable the DVD's FORCE flag and give my OWN instruction to MY player to SKIP EVERYTHING and play from the first frame of the MOVIE file proper. If I choose, I could leave that as my default. Certainly the OWNER of the hardware should be able to tell it to ignore anything that is telling it to FORCE play something. I mean it's MY DVD player. Just imagine if other content providers such as OTA and cable broadcasters were able to send a flag to your TV set that would force it to play their commercials and you couldn't change the channel or even mute the TV while they were playing. How is this any different?

And if a manufacturer can't see how giving the end user the ability to control the DVD player (which he BOUGHT), as to which flags to accept and which to ignore, as being a FANTASTIC feature which would appeal to a large percentage of the market, then some hackers should get on the ball and provide this service. I would be first in line to get such power.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 08-22-2009, 09:12 AM:

Frank...one of the DVD players we sell does ignore most flags and goes straight to the movie...skipping most if not all menus. Put the disc in...the movie starts after a few seconds....and no on-screen icons or other crap too. Its pricey but it is in the Professional line...you can save $100 by not getting the RS232 port (to which you think..."save $100...DVD players cost 1/4 of that feature alone!").

Steve

Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 08-29-2009, 02:44 AM:

I have a Pioneer DV-588A that does all those via a firmware download made by some guy in Germany I think- I don't know how he was able to do it, I installed it to make it region-free but it also ignores ALL control lock-outs, and has an option you can turn on and off to make it go right to the beginning of the movie- only problem with that is on discs that have still-frame sections it usually goes to that for some reason, also once I watched a borrowed disc and wasn't til afterwards I found that I had watched an 'extended' version of the movie, rather than the theatrical cut which I would have preferred to have watched first.

DVD copying is of course very very naughty, but most programs that do that will take out the lockout flags in the copy too, making them more easy to control on any machine. This is often justifiable, since for a while Universal was putting trailers on discs that you couldn't even chapter-skip past, the only way other than letting them play through was to forward-scan which is a pain. I've boycotted all the movies advertised on those discs.