This is topic Star Wars: The complete saga on BR this Sept. in forum The Afterlife at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://ft-forum.com/ft/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=12;t=000943
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 02-25-2011, 11:14 AM:
Just got an ad from Amazon for the Blu-Ray versions of the Star Wars saga, available Sept. 27. You can get all six movies in one set ($89.99), or the two trilogies separately ($44.99 each).
Of course the "ORIGINAL" versions of eps. 4-5-6 aren't available, only the special George-Lucas-tweaked versions, so the fans are in an uproar.
I'm sure the two-disk sets containing both original and special versions will be along next year.
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 02-25-2011, 11:21 AM:
I'm sure George Lucas will eventually get around to releasing the original theatrical versions of the first Star Wars trilogy once the 1997 SE versions and prequels make all the money they can on Blu-ray.
One other thing I expect: sub-par video transfers and mediocre audio on the original theatrical cuts. Lucas did this when releasing the theatrical cuts on DVD. If my memory is correct, those discs had non-anamorphic video and lossy Dolby Surround 2.0 audio.
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 02-25-2011, 10:36 PM:
Which sucks since there were so many mixes for those movies. Particularly the first one. There could have been the original stereo matrixed mix, the original mono mix, the original four track mag mix, and the original six track mag mix, and whatever else. It would have been cool to compare them.
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 02-25-2011, 10:47 PM:
I have a good feeling these Stars Wars blu-rays are not going to do as well as past dvd releases.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-25-2011, 10:56 PM:
Mark, was there ONLY one mono mix and ONLY one stereo mix? I seem to recall hearing there was multiples of each, but that when it came down to it, the MONO mix, being the last wave of prints made, was what they refer to as the "definitive" mix because it had all of the desired sound effects and dialogue.
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 02-26-2011, 01:12 AM:
Gasp! Woody Allen was right! Mono is best!
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 02-26-2011, 10:33 AM:
Gasp! You're right! And what movie won Best Picture instead of Star Wars? Hmmm.
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 02-26-2011, 01:35 PM:
quote: I can't provide a link due to an error message
The sound editing and re-recording team began by preparing a four-track master mix (Left-Center-Right-Surround) which would serve as the basis for both the 35mm and 70mm stereo versions. First, the master mix was dubbed to a matrix-encoded two-track Lt-Rt (Left total-Right total) printmaster for use in creating the 35mm Dolby Stereo prints. Then, the same four-track master, with some enhancements added, was used to create the six-track version. In comparison to the 35mm Dolby Stereo version, the Six-Track Dolby Stereo version during playback offered discrete channels, greater clarity, superior dynamic range, and two extra channels for special low-frequency enhancement, in what the Dolby folks affectionately called “baby boom.” After completing the multichannel versions, the soundtrack crew created another English-language mix: a monaural mix. This would be included on prints destined for theatres not equipped with a stereophonic sound system and for versions prepared for ancillary markets. The mono prints were put into circulation upon the wide national break in June 1977.
With each subsequent mix, the filmmakers seized opportunities to revise and enhance selected portions of the soundtrack where they had felt rushed or shortchanged creatively. Sound Designer Ben Burtt recalls: “Because we were always trying to make the film better and better and fix things that were not right, there were some sweetener tracks added; things like different C-3PO or Stormtrooper lines [‘Close the blast doors’], additional sound effects, or some different ADR [the dialogue of Aunt Beru].” Knowing that multiple mixes were made containing subtle yet detectable differences help explain conflicting memories of moviegoers who remember hearing a certain sound effect or line of dialogue in one presentation but not in another.
It may be difficult to comprehend today as most major film releases on DVD sport a 5.1-channel digital soundtrack, but at the time, not knowing what the future would hold in terms of widespread adoption of multichannel sound in movie theatres and in homes, some members of the production felt the mono mix represented the definitive soundtrack of “Star Wars.” They felt that the stereo version was a novelty that selected audiences would be treated to only during a brief theatrical run. “George put a lot of effort in that mono mix,” Burtt remembers. “And he even said several times, ‘Well, this is the real mix. This is the definitive mix of the film.’ He paid more attention to it because he felt it was more important archivally.”
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 02-26-2011, 07:40 PM:
Great quote Michael. It's a shame we don't have that mix available anywhere on video.
I was reading some stuff at originaltrilogy.com, and some tenacious members went through and assembled a "mono mix" from multiple sources. Based on the history of those who have heard the mono mix, it is awfully close to re-creating that.
I was able to take a listen to it, and honestly, it was quite an enjoyable way to watch Star Wars for sure.
AJG
Posted by John Lasher (Member # 968) on 02-26-2011, 11:36 PM:
I will not buy it or accept it as a gift unless I have the option to watch the original editions of these movies in new, full 1080/24p transfers.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-27-2011, 12:50 AM:
I do specifically recall a difference in Empire. Luke is saying something about how familiar this place is...
Luke - "I feel like"
Yoda - "Feel like what?"
Luke turns around and points gun at Yoda
***Yoda screams***
Luke - "Like we're being watched."
Not all prints had the Yoda scream.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-27-2011, 02:01 AM:
I also remember Luke saying to R2D2 after he/it gets spit back out by the swamp monster "It's a good thing you didn't taste too good" which has now been replaced with "You were lucky to get out of there" for whatever bizarre reason. I like the first line better as it makes much more sense. The second line makes it sound like it was pure luck he got spit back out. I am counting on Coate to get to the bottom of this, which I'm sure he easily can.
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 02-27-2011, 02:16 AM:
These sound like differences between the 70mm and 35mm prints.
The 35mm version came out a month after the 70mm version, and so that gave Lucas & company a bit of extra time to fiddle with their movie.
Much to my disappointment, the recently-published book The Making of The Empire Strikes Back by J.W. Rinzler addresses new shots added to the movie's final scene for the 35mm prints as if that was the only revision. (The book otherwise is outstanding.) I cited a few of the differences in the Justin Bieber thread.
Posted by Damien Taylor (Member # 4255) on 02-27-2011, 03:08 AM:
quote: Bobby Henderson
If my memory is correct, those discs had non-anamorphic video and lossy Dolby Surround 2.0 audio.
Yes they were awful windowboxed laserdisc rips, but they were the originals. I never bothered watching the SE discs.
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 02-27-2011, 08:34 AM:
I'm guessing those original edition DVDs were direct ports of the laser disks.
I remember the Yoda scream, Brad. I remember it because it was a part of the Super 8mm digest version which I watched probably 4,000 times as a kid.
Another difference I noticed:
When in the Death Star, and R2 is bringing up the location of the tractor beam on the screen, I believe it was an original VHS version of the movie where C-3PO said, "He'll try to make the exact location appear on the monitor." And then didn't say anything else. The next spoken line was Ben saying, "I don't think you boys can help. I must go alone." Then later in another version they added C-3PO explaining what you were looking at on the screen.
The line Joe mentions after R2 is spit out of the swamp in Empire annoys the crap out of me. The original line about "not tasting very good" that was on every other home version of the movie was better.
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 02-27-2011, 12:46 PM:
So when will he re-re-re-re-release it in 3D? Didn't he announce that they were going to 3D-ize them at some point? And that was before there was home 3DTVs. I imagine the incentive now that he can release them in 3D theatrically and then do a 3D BluRay release will be overwhelming for the STAR WARS factory. STAR WARS -- that's one prolific golden egg-laying goose.
Posted by Sam Graham (Member # 2889) on 02-27-2011, 01:56 PM:
quote: Mark J. Marshall
I'm guessing those original edition DVDs were direct ports of the laser disks.
That's what I recall hearing. I also recall Lucasfilm claiming that's the best they could do in regards to the original versions anymore, as if original negatives no longer existed (which I'd find hard to believe, yet we ARE talking Lucas here).
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 02-27-2011, 03:32 PM:
Frank - The theatrical 3D releases are supposed to start next year with one movie per year, in the numerical saga order. (Episode I first)
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 02-27-2011, 04:02 PM:
Mike-I am pretty sure Episode I will be tested in 3D before they commit to the other five. At least that was my understanding.
I cannot see Star Wars in 3D doing well at all. Titanic yes/maybe but Star Wars. NO.
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 02-27-2011, 05:44 PM:
Star Wars movies of any flavor on the big screen will do very well.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-27-2011, 05:52 PM:
Star Wars episode IV has already been at least partially converted and shown as a test. Fellow forum member Christopher Duvall has seen it at his theater.
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 02-27-2011, 05:58 PM:
quote: Sam Graham
I also recall Lucasfilm claiming that's the best they could do in regards to the original versions anymore
He's full of crap. I know of private collectors that have IB prints of the original Episode IV and very pristine LPP prints of the original Jedi. If you think Lucas doesn't have an original IB print in his vault, and Spielberg doesn't have one, and Copolla doesn't have one, you're crazy. Of course they exist. Those could easily be scanned and cleaned up even if the negatives don't exist and we'd have something better than we have now. Empire might be harder since most of those prints are faded to some degree. But again, they are out there, and it could easily be done.
Well, let's put it in perspective... cleaning up and getting good decent HD masters of the original three films would be easier than creating the right eye out of thin air for all six movies.
Posted by Geoff Jones (Member # 3668) on 02-27-2011, 07:40 PM:
quote: Mark J. Marshall
I know of private collectors that have IB prints of the original Episode IV
How does one go about meeting these people and arranging a screening?
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 02-27-2011, 07:55 PM:
They're private collectors who collect things for their own enjoyment. There's no method of reaching them.
University film archives and other non-profit film preservation societies probably have prints too.
My point is they are out there, and "that's the best we can do" is a bunch of crap.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 02-27-2011, 10:31 PM:
quote: Tom Petrov
Mike-I am pretty sure Episode I will be tested in 3D before they commit to the other five. At least that was my understanding.
The powers that be are quite aware that 3-D or no 3-D, Episode IV on the big screen will be the biggest draw of them all. (That's what happened with the 1997 rerelease of the original trilogy special editions.)
Personally I think they should forget about I, II and III and just release IV, V and VI if they're going to do it. Or, do the 3-month program with the first three, and then go to one per year with the last three.
Anyway, this is a project that's been in progress for years. I saw 20 minutes of test footage of Episode IV at an industry convention about 6 or 7 years ago. (And was not much impressed.)
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 02-28-2011, 01:00 AM:
quote: Mark J. Marshall
My point is they are out there, and "that's the best we can do" is a bunch of crap.
True that. I'll take it one tick further; ask a studio about almost any classic you want to book and pretty much what they tell you about what they have or don't have is, 80% of the time, a bunch of crap.
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 02-28-2011, 02:27 AM:
And you have to consider that Lucas himself has said that the only version of the trilogy that exist are the Special Editions. He thinks that because he says that the Special Edition movies are cannon that the earlier versions will be forgotten.
So it should come as no surprise that he would use any and all excuses available to not give you the original movie.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-28-2011, 11:27 AM:
quote: Mike Blakesley
Anyway, this is a project that's been in progress for years. I saw 20 minutes of test footage of Episode IV at an industry convention about 6 or 7 years ago. (And was not much impressed.)
3D conversion technology will also continue to get better and better. By the time the first movie is finished being converted, George will want to re-do it "because the technology at the time did not permit him to fully utilize his vision", or some such nonsense.
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 02-28-2011, 01:44 PM:
He may just keep re-issuing the 6 of them in 6 year cycles so he can 'keep up with the latest 3D technology'.
(Sigh...)
Posted by John Lasher (Member # 968) on 02-28-2011, 08:50 PM:
There was a claim I read somewhere but can't find now to the effect that the opening crawl on the OE disc of ANH was a new transfer from an original 1977 print (hence, it omits the text "Episode IV: A New Hope"), surely that entire print could be scanned and cleaned up for Blu-Ray.
Supposedly the BD editions are going to be GL's final, definitive word on the subject, to which I respectfully say: Bullshit! You'll potchka with these films till you're on your deathbed, and leave detailed instructions in your last will and testament as to how they should be potchka'd with further for years to come. And double bullshit! The versions you released to theaters in 1977, 1980 and 1983 are the definitive versions, anything else is... New Coke.
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 02-28-2011, 10:46 PM:
And just like the Special Editions... New Coke was actually liked by a lot of people. They taste-tested it long before they brought it to market and it did well. It was mostly only when they did the "We are discontinuing the old formula altogether" that people got really mad.
In fact, I seem to remember that New Coke was liked better than the original formula in blind taste tests, which underscores how strong a sense of nostalgia can be.
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 05-12-2011, 05:22 PM:
So it looks like we have some details.
DTS-HD Master Audio 6.1 surround tracks
THX
9 discs.
Star Wars Blu Ray Info
Posted by Gregory Jones Jr. (Member # 6354) on 06-23-2011, 07:27 PM:
I'm gonna have to pass. I don't feel comfortable giving Lucas more money for discs I'm probably not going to watch. I'll stick with the original versions. But I wouldn't mind renting that bonus disc.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 08-23-2011, 11:37 PM:
Some pre-release discussion with some questions answered by Lucasfilm's Matthew Wood here.
quote:
The Sound of Star Wars: Matthew Wood on the Audio Mixes for the Blu-ray Release
We met with Matthew Wood from Skywalker Sound to find out more about the sound mix and what was done to ready it for Blu-ray. He started working on the Blu-ray audio back in 2007. Here are excerpts from that presentation. It was very obvious that he has a lot of passion for these films. Please note that the questions came from multiple participants, including myself:
I’ve [Matthew Wood] been involved in the restoration and remastering of Episodes IV, V and VI since about 1996 when we started the special editions and all the way through the DVD releases now. I’ve actually brought all 6 movies that I got the print masters from Skywalker Sound so that we can listen to some scenes today. The cool thing about Blu-ray is the fact that when I play you these masters, it’s effectively as what’s on the disc, it’s the file copy that goes on the disc, we have an uncompressed master on the disc.
One other thing I brought that I thought was interesting is part of the remastering of this film. We spent the most time on New Hope, because of all the films, that was the one that was archived with the most issues because when the film was made, it wasn’t really known that it was going to be a hit. It was mixed in Los Angeles during a night shift, and there wasn’t really separation of stems, so I had to recreate with my team the mix from scratch with all the original elements. On this last pass for Blu-ray, I was able to incorporate production sound elements using the archived original production rolls from Star Wars, our analog tape format, 7-1/2 ips tape format, so all of these were transferred into digital. It was a lot of fun looking at the production sound roll, it has all the log information from Tunisia, it has the date “March 22, 1976. We probably had 50 or 60 of these and we ended up transferring them all and I got to hear a lot of the outtakes, which was fun because I am a HUGE fan of Star Wars. As a kid, it influenced me to want to even work for this company, I got a job working here when I was 17 years old (about 21 years ago). I worked bringing digital technology to Skywalker Sound and I got to work with my mentor and the designer of the show, Ben Burtt, so it’s been a really fun ride for me. These are the only films that I probably go back and listen to and know that and making sure that all the right elements are there, because if something is just slightly off, my childhood DNA screams “wrong!”.
It was a challenge to make sure that we retained the “feel” of what people probably saw back in the 70’s, it was mono --- there was a stereo mix made and also a 4-track LCRS master, but we never had separation, so anything we did, like in 1997 when we released it again, was just laid on top of that, we really couldn’t have any separation. And the original production was really brittle, a lot more brittle than what you are hearing, just based on the limitations of the technology of the time. But I wanted to make sure that getting it into the computer it was at least the highest quality version of whatever that limitation was. Our task from George (Lucas) and Ben Burtt was to make sure that all 6 films played together really well, they are all in the same format---that’s why we chose 6.1 because that was our prequel format that we did all 3 prequels in. We had the chance to open this up a little wider, but then balance how people remember effects versus music and dialog.
Some of the original tapes from March 22nd, 1976
Click to open a larger image in a new window.
Q: If you had the chance to do it all again, why not add the extra channel and go to 7.1?
A: We had the chance to go back and do it, we chose 6.1 as the format because 5.1 EX was what we used on the prequels and it had that back-center surround and I think that has a nice 360 feel, and we wanted everything to match that. This is personal for me, but 7.1 has the separation in the back and sides kind of diffuses the back for me and I kind of like a discreet feel in the back with 6.1. We definitely went back and got the discreet masters so it’s not encoded in the back, it’s a discreet whole channel that was set in surround.
I’d like to play something from the prequels, from Episode I, one of my favorite scenes which I think is really showcased on Blu-ray is the pod race. That was when I started working on the prequels with Ben Burtt that was my first task, recording a lot of this material. It integrates everything we did in the DVD release back in 2000 and we’ve also added some little tweaks for the Blu-ray.
We always build upon what we’ve created before, so we used the base of the 2000 DVD for that. I had full participation with Ben Burtt on this project, which was great, and George Lucas, especially on New Hope, was actively involved in sitting down and watching every reel and making sure that we had everything that people remember for the mix, all the right takes and effects since we had to build it all from scratch. We went through the film in 15 second increments, listening to that against what we’d done before and making sure it was all in there.
Q: Can you share any feedback that George might have given you on Episode 4?
A: Yes --- always the question of music and effects, the balance there and how to make it most effective. If someone has a dramatic memory of hearing the film originally, and it had the star destroyer going overhead at the beginning with the blockade runner and the lasers going on----if I played the mono mix of what was there, it was pretty harsh. Most people never even heard any kind of surround information. We had to build that and think about what somebody maybe emotionally remembers from that…it was a hard job. When doing that it was always George just making sure we could hear the music, obviously he wants to make sure the dialog can be heard so you can hear the story go forward, and then build the music and effects around that. We played the reels many times with him and it was fun to hear his anecdotes about making the films. I actually found a few things when going through New Hope that we added, just little comments here and there that were production lines that might not have been used or were changed, but all very subtle little things including some lines of dialog you’ll find them when you watch the Blu-ray.
Q: Would you say that now in discreet 6.1 that it really lends itself to the star destroyer flying over at the beginning?
A: Yes. I would say that. There are a few moments, we’re still calling them “EX Moments” but I guess they are true, un-matrixed CS moments that are in the films for IV-VI.
I can play you another scene, one of my favorites from when I first started with this company as a teenager, I used to come to the archives before it was even digitized and I put up the quarter-inch reels of the carbon freezing chamber ambiance and listen, that’s always been a favorite of mine.
For New Hope, I had to go all the way back to the original production rolls and the original music rolls, but luckily for Episodes V & VI, the archives were a lot more robust, because those movies were already known to have a life beyond the original release. They were archived in a way that had separation of effects, music and dialog, so when I built the 6.1 mixes, it was a lot easier. The other thing that happened is that over time tape can degrade, you get a lot of wow and flutter so anytime that happened I’d have to go back one generation to something and hopefully balance it back into the mix, so there are limitations on the analog source, but now it’s all been digitized in a way that it’s saved. As I said earlier, I think these films for me were the only ones that I could do this on, because I can just feel it when something is wrong, if it’s the wrong take or…. Like on New Hope when Leia is putting the code into R2 on the blockade runner, the background lasers had to be cut against the print master of the previous version because it was all loops on a reel, and it would always be running. So when they had background lasers they would just pull that fader up and down. I had to find that loop and find the exact moment where they went in and out on and I’d have to rhythmically hear the lasers (Matthew makes laser sounds here) and think, ok, that must go here. I was doing it against the print master, it was very forensic. Once I had it all put together I would bring it to the mix stage to Ben and George. I’d approximate it as close as I could and they would give me their final comments.
Q: Was there anything else that you had to make up or add in?
A: Occasionally in New Hope, there were things that could not be completely found, a few very subtle things like a footstep here and there or some background noise that we would just re-perform or get an approximate sound. And of course, every time we watched the movies, George would find something that he wanted to change, so there were changes to the films visually as well as audio-wise, so there are some changes in the Blu-ray version that you guys will find! It was funny, because we’d meticulously put it all together, “here’s what it was!” and then he’ll update it.
Q: On the DVD, the orchestra for the surround channels was swapped, was that fixed?
A: It’s funny, because it never really was an error --- what happened back then was that the music master we had at the time didn’t have any surround information. One of the techniques that has been used previously from mixers is to give it a bigger soundstage---they would have flipped the back channel to give it a different kind of reverb. And that was done on the THX 1138 remaster, which I didn’t work on. For this go-round (6.1) we decided not to do that, so the surround information is direct to the back, no longer flipped on the music track.
Q: Did all 6 films get new mixes?
A: New Hope was a re-editorial of everything; in the areas that have new material those were new mixes done there, but it was really just a forensics to make sure that I have everything. Every time the films get released, there is always a new version, for Episode II there was a D cinema version that was done for digital cinema, then the DVD version, so we want to incorporate those to make sure that we have them at the right levels and such. The most amount of work was done on New Hope, even though we spent a lot of time on the other films as well, making sure that they all sound right and the fidelity was going to be good.
Q: Was there any thought given to archiving previous tracks like the 6-track master from the 70mm prints or the 78 mono remix? Any thought given to putting them on the Blu-ray?
A: Yes, we have those and they’ve all been digitized. I don’t know if they considered putting those on the Blu-ray. That might be more of a question for Marketing, it may be an issue of space. It’s funny because I play those other audio tracks, like the scene when R2 and C3PO have been left on Tatooine and they walk through the canyon. I just love that on the current mix, you can actually hear the quiet, when R2 is lonely, going through the canyon. I played the original mix and it’s FULL of hiss and totally brittle, so it’s fun now to hear it like George wanted it to really be, what was intended.
Q: Did you do a remix for the German language release?
A: We absolutely did. In fact our dubbing supervisor was German, and that was very helpful.
Very interesting information on the status of the original mixes. You could make a very cool disc someday with all the variations if they do in fact exist.
AJG
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-24-2011, 01:00 AM:
quote:
Click to open a larger image in a new window.
I'm trying, but nothing is happening.
Posted by Justin Hamaker (Member # 2165) on 08-24-2011, 02:43 AM:
I don't think I will ever buy another Star Wars collection. I already have two DVD sets - the 2006 Special Editions which have the original theatrical release of the original trilogy, and the 2004 box set of the original trilogy (which I believe was the first DVD release). Plus I think I still have the 1996 VHS version which had the interview with Leonard Maltin.
I haven't watched any episode of Star Wars in several years, and I don't feel the need to keep buying new editions.
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 08-24-2011, 07:40 AM:
quote: Justin Hamaker
I don't think I will ever buy another Star Wars collection.
I agree, I will not being buying this set
Posted by Jeff Kane (Member # 6372) on 08-24-2011, 01:13 PM:
All I want is a Blu-Ray with properly done seamless branching that'll let me select between the original films and the CGIfest. I know I won't get it, but I can dream.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 08-24-2011, 02:17 PM:
quote: Tom Petrov
I will not being buying this set
I probably will not being buying it either, although I'm sure I will being tempted.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-24-2011, 04:26 PM:
I don't want to buy it, but I know I likely will.
Posted by Mike Frese (Member # 4361) on 08-24-2011, 09:04 PM:
Fortunately a benefit to owning a video store for me: I will buy if for my store and eventually it will be in my personal collection when the store is finally closed.
Posted by Sam Graham (Member # 2889) on 08-25-2011, 09:24 AM:
quote: Joe Redifer
I don't want to buy it, but I know I likely will.
Exactly.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 08-25-2011, 09:32 AM:
I'm in the same boat. I'm too geeky and too much a fan of the series not to get yet another version to compare things to.
AJG
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-25-2011, 12:10 PM:
The "complete saga" Blu-ray version may wind up in my collection, but not immediately. There's a number of different Blu-ray box sets I haven't bought over various reasons, the main one being price and the possibility some insanely low priced deal may pop up at Amazon at any time.
Depending on how things work out with "Black Friday" sales a couple months from now I might pick up Star Wars: The Complete Saga on Blu-ray then. Same goes for the Jurassic Park box set, Back to the Future trilogy or the extended version Blu-rays of The Lord of the Rings. I'm not going to buy everything at once, just one or two that happen to be the best deal at that time.
The packaging on the Alien box set had some serious problems. Plus, I really hated the last two movies in that series. I'm hoping for deluxe Blu-ray editions to be released for the first two movies. If the first two movies, available separately in bare bones editions, drop to around $10 each I might pick up those anyway.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-25-2011, 04:35 PM:
I did that with Aliens, Bobby.... waited until they dropped to $10 each at Best Buy and bought only the first two.
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 08-25-2011, 06:05 PM:
quote: Joe Redifer
I did that with Aliens, Bobby.... waited until they dropped to $10 each at Best Buy and bought only the first two.
I did that with my laserdiscs. Waited till there were a $1 each and then I bought them.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 08-26-2011, 01:19 AM:
That's funny: I got the Star Wars THX "faces" LaserDiscs when I joined the Columbia House LaserDisc Club for a $1 a pop. Talk about a discount!
AJG
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 08-27-2011, 12:15 PM:
I got the original laserdisks for $1 each from Columbia house. At the time they listed for $60 each. It was quite the deal - and I still have them.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 08-27-2011, 03:10 PM:
Yep, mine too were listed at $60 a pop. It was the bargain of the century at the time.
AJG
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 08-27-2011, 03:27 PM:
I also paid $1 for the Definitive, Classic CBS Fox version as well as the Faces editions.
The only set on LD I don't have is the Dolby Digital/SE release
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 08-27-2011, 03:27 PM:
I believe the SRP was actually $70, not $60 (but when you're getting 'em for $1, who cares).
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 08-27-2011, 03:33 PM:
I was always surprised that LucasFilm/Fox never jumped on the DTS Laserdisc offering....they could of charged $90 for each.
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-27-2011, 06:31 PM:
No, but they could've.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-27-2011, 07:05 PM:
Chris, I think you need to go a bit easier on Tom Petrov. Obviously English isn't his first language so he can't be expected to know much about it.
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 08-27-2011, 07:09 PM:
I'll pay u $3.25 n'hr if u r really r concerned about my spell-ing.
A bonus if you don't screw up!
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 08-28-2011, 01:14 AM:
Brace yourself for another round of unnecessary "corrections" for the upcoming Blu-ray set.
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 08-28-2011, 09:43 PM:
Thank God Lucas rounded off the bottom left corner of the frame in that shot. That shit has been bothering me for years.
I just want to know if Obi-Wan's dying lightsaber in his duel with Darth Vader will finally get fixed.
Oh, and the lightsabers' SHADOWS in the Luke/Vader duel at the end of Jedi.
Plus about a million other little things too.
I'm glad the Humdinger Glitch is finally getting some attention too.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 08-31-2011, 12:29 AM:
It gets worse if this is legit:
Nooooooo!
Please, someone send Luca Brasi after George.
AJG
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-31-2011, 08:28 PM:
Lucasfilm confirmed the audio changes...
http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/31/lucasfilm-confirms-change-to-blu-ray-release-of-return-of-the-jedi/?smid=tw-nytimesmovies&seid=auto
Posted by Justin Hamaker (Member # 2165) on 08-31-2011, 08:42 PM:
A pointless addition to be sure. Just one more reason why I won't be buying the Blu-Ray.
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-31-2011, 09:12 PM:
That last one has me thinking of the Chef Vader character from South Park. Yeah, that change was unnecessary.
Posted by Jeff Kane (Member # 6372) on 08-31-2011, 09:25 PM:
I just threw up in my mouth a little. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooo is right. I always thought fan edits were a little anorak-y but that NOOoooo is the back-breaking straw for me.
Posted by Victor Liorentas (Member # 5272) on 08-31-2011, 09:41 PM:
Wow! This really has to be one of his worst decisions!
George must think this will be considered brilliant decades from now but what a slap in the face to real Star Wars fans who have already been slapped silly!
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 08-31-2011, 09:51 PM:
This tweak ruins one of the few really good scenes in Jedi. There's also talk out there that the Ewoks now blink their eyes and that the big door to Jabba's Palace is now an even BIGGER door. Ridiculous.
How long will it be before Lucas adds the Emperor and "The Imperial March" into the original movie (Episode IV)?
As much as I'm opposed to the revisions, the one "fix" I would like to see is adding the radar dish to the Millennium Falcon in the establishing shot of the Docking Bay 94 scene. The thing has been missing since Day One and somehow has eluded each "restoration" project. (It's the shot right before Luke says, "What a piece of junk.")
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-31-2011, 09:54 PM:
So they are replacing puppet Yoda in episode 1 with CGI Yoda? They need to replace puppet Yoda in ESB and Return of the Jedi with CGI Yoda as well. They should also make Obi-Wan have newly filmed memory flashbacks to his Ewan McGreggor days in the original Star Wars... a CGI Ewan McGreggor, of course.
Posted by Anslem Rayburn (Member # 1267) on 08-31-2011, 10:01 PM:
Ewoks do blink apparently.
Jabba's huuuuuuuge door
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 08-31-2011, 10:19 PM:
quote: Michael Coate
This tweak ruins one of the few really good scenes in Jedi. There's also talk out there that the Ewoks now blink their eyes and that the big door to Jabba's Palace is now an even BIGGER door. Ridiculous.
How long will it be before Lucas adds the Emperor and "The Imperial March" into the original movie (Episode IV)?
As much as I'm opposed to the revisions, the one "fix" I would like to see is adding the radar dish to the Millennium Falcon in the establishing shot of the Docking Bay 94 scene. The thing has been missing since Day One and somehow has eluded each "restoration" project. (It's the shot right before Luke says, "What a piece of junk.")
Lucas should just remake the original three movies.
Posted by Justin Hamaker (Member # 2165) on 08-31-2011, 10:43 PM:
The blinking Ewok actually makes it look more real. That one doesn't bother me.
I don't get the point of the really large door to Jabba's palace.
I can understand Lucas fixing things that need to be fix - blinking Ewok is one example. But adding or changing dialog changes the story. Just leave it alone.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 09-01-2011, 01:20 AM:
He must just sit in his massive screening room with an iPad, watching the saga over and over, typing in ideas for changes. Pretty sad when he could be making some new movies.
How about this, George? Combine Episodes 1 and 2 into one movie, 3 & 4 into one movie, and so on. That way each installment would be about four hours long, but that's OK because they will be epics! Call it "Star Wars: The EPIC SAGA."
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 09-01-2011, 08:19 AM:
quote: Michael Coate
This tweak ruins one of the few really good scenes in Jedi.
And maybe I over-analyze things sometimes but I see it not just ruining the flow and feel of a fantastic scene, but also creating a plot hole.
If the Emperor hears his literal right-hand man uttering "No!", why would he just sit there shooting lightning at Luke as if nothing had happened? If he's a powerful mastermind, he'd be able to tell that Vader's outburst was him being defiant against what was going on. Sidius can't be both a genius and a moron, unable to figure out what "no" means.
Posted by Hillary Charles (Member # 769) on 09-01-2011, 11:43 AM:
quote: Justin Hamaker
I don't get the point of the really large door to Jabba's palace.
Jabba's place was built by the same contractors who built the wall in King Kong. It's their style, I guess.
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 09-01-2011, 12:16 PM:
I don't think Wicket's blinking bothers me. Yet. I'll have to see if the mass scenes of Ewoks are now distracting because they're all blinking at us. I guess we'll see on that one.
The huge Jabba door... I don't get that. The shot looks awkwardly composed. Majorly awkwardly composed. What does that add to the story? I'm not sure I understand why you'd spend what I'm sure was thousands of dollars to create that scene.
If he went through and made all of these little tweaks, and yet STILL (for about the fourth time of restoring) didn't fix Obi-Wan's dying lightsaber, and all of the little jump cuts in Episode IV, I'll be pissed.
Mind you, I don't think those things NEED to be fixed in order for the movie to be good, but when you say "FIX" - my assumption is that you're addressing things that are "BROKEN" to begin with. The Ewoks not blinking wasn't broken. Lots of animals don't blink in real life so what's the problem? I never found myself not believing the Ewoks were real because they didn't blink. I never thought to myself, "Hey, this Jabba guy doesn't seem so bad, check out his cute little metal door." I never thought Vader's performance at the end of Jedi was unrealistic because he should have been shouting something there. But I HAVE thought to myself, "Wow it looks like Obi Wan's lightsaber has bad batteries in it or something" - - - and I thought that WHEN I WAS EIGHT YEARS OLD. Despite that, I still loved the movie as an 8 year old, and I still love the movie today.
George, with all due respect, I don't understand you anymore. I can appreciate the fact that you sit at your ranch or where ever you are and continue to tweak your movies as you see fit until your heart's content. I appreciate that. I really do. They are YOUR movies, and it is your money. But damn it, you're someone who has the ability to do those things partially thanks to me and millions of other people like me who loved the movies the way you created them the first time. We gave you the ability to sit there and do these things and make yourself happy. So go ahead, and make yourself happy. But one would THINK that a decent person would at least have the respect to give the fans, who have provided you and your companys' income over the last 30 years, what THEY want. One would think you would respect US enough to do that. Lord knows we have given you enough money to finance whatever restoration and clean up of the originals is necessary to create a great Blu-Ray release of the original movies, untouched. But even a mediocre HD scan of an IB PRINT of Episode IV would work as far as I'm concerned. I heard a rumor of a single IB Empire once, but that may have been an error on someone's part. Jedi's LPP prints from 1983 look fantastic still to this day. I don't even care if the prints you use still have a little dirt around the reel changes, although cleaning that up would be the least you could do. Why you continue to insist on poking us in the eye instead is beyond me. I used to have a TON of respect for you when I was a kid. I used to want to be like you when I was growing up. Star Wars, in many ways, ignited a huge passion for film in me, and that passion is as strong as ever today. But now, most of that respect is gone. And I know I'm not alone. I know NO ONE who respects what you're doing to these movies. NO ONE. Do you? Who do you have in your circle that is telling you that this is all a great idea? If there are people telling you that, they are LYING. I don't understand you, George. I used to. You can change that and gain your fans' respect again. Or you can continue to live in your bubble and insult your fans. So far, you've been doing the latter, and that breaks my heart.
Sorry for the rant. It just sort of spilled out of me. Pent up frustration, I guess.
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 09-01-2011, 02:27 PM:
Overheard last year at the Skywalker Ranch dining room:
Lucas: "Steven, you should replace all the shots of the puppet in E.T. with a CGI character."
Spielberg: "Cool. And you should go back into all of the Star Wars movies and replace the light sabers with kid-friendly walkie talkies."
Lucas: "Cool."
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 09-01-2011, 03:26 PM:
What Mark said.
I really hope whomever has the IB prints or any print of the OT for that matter really take care of them because it looks like more and more every day, they are going to be priceless pieces of film history. If George keeps up this anti-original mentality, as does Lucasfilm, people 100 years from now will never even know the originals existed. From a historical preservation perspective, that is simply wrong.
AJG
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-01-2011, 04:06 PM:
The Ewok blinking doesn't look right. How many frames does a person take to blink in real life? Maybe 2 film frames, max? These Ewoks are taking what seems to be 6 or 7 frames to blink. The eyelids look very CGI. It's like they are blinking slower than they should be just so that we notice them blinking.
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 09-01-2011, 08:02 PM:
The problem is that Ewoks will always look like little people in teddy bear suits. I don't think they can fix that without a major CGI budget.
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 09-01-2011, 09:38 PM:
Bite your tongue.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 09-01-2011, 10:07 PM:
quote: Greg Anderson
The problem is that Ewoks will always look like little people in teddy bear suits. I don't think they can fix that without a major CGI budget.
Why not? Yoda always looked like a muppet and CGI fixed that right up!
Everyone is complaining about how George is ruining the Star Wars movies. You don't see him "fixing" Willow or Howard the Duck, do you? Of course not, because those were PERFECT TO BEGIN WITH! George is simply trying to make the Star Wars movies as perfect as those.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-02-2011, 04:57 PM:
"I am altering the film. Pray I don't alter it any further."
"This movie is getting worse all the time!"
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 09-04-2011, 09:34 AM:
Another Star Wars Blu-ray tweak.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-07-2011, 04:10 AM:
Here's another thing that makes zero sense. All 6 movies together costs $90 at Amazon. But if you want the original trilogy only, the price is $40. The prequel trilogy only is also $40. So you pay an extra $10 for no reason that I can find by purchasing all 6 movies together. WTF? Nobody with more than 2 brain cells will buy all 6 in one box.
EDIT: OK the complete collection comes with 3 more BDs. Episodes 7, 8 and 9? Nope, just special features. That's the kind of crap I'd honestly rather watch on Youtube or read on a website. Seriously.
Speaking of boxes, does anyone know how this will be packaged? I want standard Blu-ray cases. It's fine if those cases come in a shitty cardboard box that I can toss into our ever-increasing landfill, but the movies must either be int heir own Blu-ray cases are all 3 movies share a single case, like Star Trek 2-4 do. Ever since DVD came about, studios started getting extremely retarded on their boxes. I just know it will probably be some fold-out shit with a Yoda doll or some such thing that makes no difference in the quality of the movie.
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 09-09-2011, 04:12 AM:
I saw the prevues at the store today. I had to ask the guy if this was actually coming off a Blu Ray because it looked so ordinary. He said it was Blu.
The sub-titles of Jabba are sharp, but the rest looks way ordinary. Phantom looks like video.
No thanks. I'd prefer the 4x3 letterboxed originals.
Posted by Geoff Jones (Member # 3668) on 09-13-2011, 12:05 AM:
In case anyone is interested, there's a guy named Harmy who has been involved in a preservation effort of the original films.
Using a variety of sources, he has created 720p versions that attempt to restore everything to the way they looked in theatres in 77, 81, 83. Those that have seen them claim that they are pretty effective, even on larger screens.
Do an internet search for "Harmy" and "Despecialized Star Wars" to find out more.
Also interesting imo is how the official Blue Rays have been "one-star-bombed" at amazon to knock their review scores down.
Posted by Michael Barry (Member # 237) on 09-13-2011, 10:28 AM:
John, so far I've tried playing 'A New Hope' and 'The Phantom Menace' and they both look incredible. It's likely that the screens you saw them on weren't set up/calibrated well.
In 'A New Hope' you can make out every pebble near Luke's place near the beginning; truly impressive. 'Menace' is a little more variable and there are some soft shots, but overall it's very impressive. Jar Jar Binks has never looked more detailed.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-14-2011, 09:04 PM:
Just saw how the packaging works. Cheap cardboard with little blue trays/doors inside. If I bought this I'd have to buy 6 regular Blu-ray boxes and print out my own artwork. I don't like cheap-looking cardboard on my shelves. Only homeless people like cardboard. These sets always try to do something special with the packaging.
This video says it all, granted the Star Wars cases aren't this bad.
Posted by Ron Funderburg (Member # 4561) on 09-17-2011, 10:13 AM:
Star Wars, Star Wars, I’m sick to death about that damn Star Wars! Not really that is actually a misquote of Archie when exploded at Meat Head about all the talk of the Vet Nam war!
King George will do what King George will do. We will grip and then he will change it again. And still he doesn’t make the change in the first movie that really bugs me. When Han and Lea are talking in the cockpit, they are traveling at light speed to the secret hide out and the stars are not moving. Bugs the crap out of me fix it George make that hyper space, hyper space.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 09-17-2011, 12:16 PM:
Couldn't resist the urge. I haven't gotten through the whole set yet, but here are my initial impressions:
The packaging is both awesome and awful. All the artwork is nice but the slip cover style disc holders may inevitably damage the discs. The marketing guy that produced that should be fired, or better yet, force choked.
The images are stunning to my eyes: I've never seen Star Wars look this good. The amount of detail popping out from all the practical sets, costumes, and models really shines. It really makes you appreciate this style of filmmaking instead of the CGI fest of contemporary Hollywood. Of course, the prequels look as glossy as ever. Phantom Menace has also been made to look more like them. In context of the series, it works but I would rather see it still look like film.
Sound mixes so far are pretty interesting. I watched all of A New Hope and they've done a great job of cleaning up the mix. Is it the original mix? No. What we are hearing here is details that we never new existed, specifically in the dialogue. It's a little jarring at first to hear that sort of clarity, but honestly I welcome it. The sound was obviously recorded that way, but it just never got worked into the mix. Having it now is a treat and makes for a very engaging sound mix.
The dragon call is cheesy as hell, sounds cool in 5.1, but is totally out of place with the rest of the mix. It was a bad decision.
Watched some deleted scenes. Totally wicked. Can't wait to dig through all of them.
Overall, this is a nice set so far. I wish that eventually we could get the original theatrical versions, but these will suffice for now: I'll just pretend the changes aren't there. Bill Hunt at the Digital Bits made an astute observation that Lucasfilm would be smart to release a polished version of the originals because quite frankly, it's only a matter of time before bootleggers and fans create their own polished version of it. There already is a pretty awesome set of a "de-specialized trilogy" out there that fans have compiled together with HD footage, color correction, etc. plus an attempt at a 70mm re-mix. The results are pretty awesome. I honestly think one day we will get the originals in a great set, whether from Lucasfilm or from concerned fans.
Overall, the set is still Star Wars and it's still awesome. Lots of memories with all 6 of these films.
AJG
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-17-2011, 04:59 PM:
quote: Aaron Garman
What we are hearing here [are] details that we never [k]new existed, specifically in the dialogue.
A lot of it sounds like ADR-city. The timbre and quality of the dialog varies from one sentence to the next. Chop chop! When they were outside with the Jawas buying the droids, I could hear lots of reverb in the dialog... kind of like when Luke yells "Move closer!" while riding the speed bikes in a Jedi scene during the trailer for the Special Editions. Reverb. Why?
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 09-17-2011, 05:02 PM:
quote:
I wish that eventually we could get the original theatrical versions,
Of course he will release the original movies. Not right now but eventually.
he did it on dvd did he not?
my hunch is that the originals on dvd never sold as well as the tweaked versions.
Still happy I have my faces laserdiscs and my Japan Phantom Menance
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-17-2011, 05:06 PM:
The originals were never released on their own. They were included as bonus discs. I do not think George Lucas is the type of fellow who would release them.
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 09-17-2011, 05:39 PM:
Boonowa tweepi, ha, ha.
Wow, Who knew that George IS Jabba, san beard and the boufont hairdoo!
Posted by Claude S. Ayakawa (Member # 1401) on 09-17-2011, 08:31 PM:
I never saw Episodes 1-3 with digital projection. I know #1 was photographed with 35mm film and the other two were digital but they were all meant to be presented in digital only until George Lucas changed his mind and decided to show them in both digital and film. I did see Episodes 4-6 in 70mm as well as 35mm in theatres and while I thought the 70mm presentations was fantastic, it cannot even come close to the way the movies now look on Blu Ray. I spent an hour last nigh checking out the image quality of all six movies as well as the bonus features and they were all superb. Hopefully, I will try to watch the movies in their entirety after I finish watching Season One of Hawaii Five-O on Blu-Ray after I buy it on Tuesday.
I must differ with Joe and Aaron about the packaging. I like it very much and the cardboard case does not feel like cheap cardboard but very sturdy in my opinion. The disc storage case is also very sturdy . It is exactly the same packaging Fox had used on the ALIEN films on Blu-Ray and if a lot of people agreed with Joe and complained, I am sure the studio would not have used it again on the STAR WARS movies. Blu Ray have a much better protective surface than DVD so I do not feel there is any risk of damaging the discs when removing and replacing them in the disc holders.
When Best Buy was offering the deluxe set for $90.00 and Episodes 1-3 & 3-6 for $40.00 each it was still a bargain to pay an additional ten dollars for the three extra discs with the bonus features. Because Target offered the deluxe set for $80.00, I was pleasantly surprised when I had learned BB had dropped the price when I tried to get the store to price match Targets. Although Target offered some STAR WARS picture cards as a exclusive, Best Buy's offer of a cool SW T shirt was even better.
-Claude
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 09-17-2011, 08:48 PM:
Thank you for the spelling and grammar corrections Joe. I was a little groggy when I typed that.
The reverb was weird...I didn't get that. The scene I liked specifically was the one with Tarkin and Leia as the Empire prepares to destroy Alderaan. They had partially cleaned up the sound on that scene for the DVD but did it very half assed. This time Peter Cushing's lines seem very consistent in quality.
AJG
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 09-17-2011, 09:55 PM:
I am reading that the blu-rays of the original films are from the same HD scan for the dvd's in 2004.
Anyone want to comment?
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-17-2011, 10:10 PM:
Just watched Empire. I am watching them in the order they were made. As I found out when showing them to Jen in the order they were numbered, it left her very confused while the prequels were playing. You MUST watch them in the order made. ANYWAY, the Empire Blu-ray is identical to the Empire DVD. The center channel is still about 4-5db too low and the subwoofer is still about 9-10db too loud. The force choke and star destroyers do NOT need to drown out dialog and music, respectively. I can't recall if the Jedi DVD suffered from this, but I think it was only Empire. Gawdawful sound mix and it's the best movie! At least they got rid of Luke screaming as he falls off of the platform that was originally in the theatrical special editions.
quote: Claude S. Ayakawa
I must differ with Joe and Aaron about the packaging.
Of course you must, for your name is Claude S. Ayakawa. Honestly, they could make the packaging out of fossilized cow dung and you'd likely think it was "wonderful". Anything but regular ol' Blu-ray boxes. I will eventually get 6 BD cases and scan the artwork from the DVDs, modify them to they say "HD OMG!" and print them so the set doesn't stand out like a cancerous tumor on my shelf.
quote: Claude S. Ayakawa
When Best Buy was offering the deluxe set for $90.00 and Episodes 1-3 & 3-6 for $40.00 each it was still a bargain to pay an additional ten dollars for the three extra discs with the bonus features.
Best Buy was selling the 6-movie pack for $80 when I arrived and that is what they have always been advertising it as for the week prior. The individual 3-movie packs for $40 each (like you said). I saw the t-shirt and I couldn't think of one damned reason why I'd ever wear it, so I left it there. Jen kept asking me "Why don't you want that?" and my response was always "Because I don't".
Posted by Jonathan Goeldner (Member # 4854) on 09-17-2011, 11:10 PM:
I watched 'Phantom Menace' Friday night and my initial impression was that I thought skin complexion looked unnaturally waxy as if DNR had been applied in the video processing of the film to hidef. The DTS-HD MA 6.1 sound though - wow ... WoW!
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 09-17-2011, 11:29 PM:
The skin tones looked waxy because THE DIGITAL MENSACE looked that way in the theatrical presentation both film and digital. It also looked soft in many scenes. The CGI stuff looked sharp and clear while the live action looked slightly out of focus. I am not sure there is much they can do about that.
Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 09-17-2011, 11:39 PM:
I think George is a marketing/sales genius.
Creating the new versions of Star Wars and then withholding the originals has created more demand for the original versions. The real fans will end up buying both. This is straight up double-dipping all over again.
I'm honestly surprised that people aren't used to this by now. Jedi mind tricks?
I'd be curious to know -- how many times have you bought this trilogy on home-video?
I owned the original movie on Beta and later bought the entire first trilogy on Laserdisc.
When I saw the Special Editions in theatres, the love pretty much ended there. I guess I figured if they aren't sacred to George, then maybe they needn't be sacred to me either. At least I still have my happy memories of enjoying them as they were in their time.
Yes, I saw the 2nd trilogy but only because I was working. Actually, I'm not sure if I ever saw all of Episode I or II. I did see all of Episode III and I kind-of liked that one. I think that one has everything we were hoping to get out of the first 2 prequels. Episodes I and II only function as filler (and a way to make 3x as much money as just making Episode III alone).
Even so, someone gave me a free copy of Episode III on DVD and I've only watched the documentary in the supplemental material.
Posted by Victor Liorentas (Member # 5272) on 09-17-2011, 11:49 PM:
My guess on Lucas and Lowery Digital sticking with the 2k master from the 2004 dvd is the prequels have no resolution beyond that to show off.
The originals at 4k or higher would start to look too good like the Blade Runner restoration.
In older interviews George Lucas has talked about resolution being less important for whatever reason? I don't remember but to put out The Phantom Menace as a soft blur fest in 1999 was a sign of caring little about resolution.
Another sign was Return Of The Jedi!After Empire went so far over budget he was determined to speed up production on Jedi and many sloppy grainy shots are very point and shoot!
Irvin Kirshner really was the perfectionist in the whole Star Wars saga.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-18-2011, 09:21 PM:
Just watched Jedi and the sound was fine. Didn't have the low dialog like Empire did. Likely the same mix as the Jedi DVD.
I think George hates the original trilogy and loves the prequels (at least the last two).
Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 09-18-2011, 10:40 PM:
Could be, Joe.
It brings to mind something George's ex-wife, Marcia, once said: "Getting here was more fun than being here." Perhaps she appreciated the creative struggle, while George still seems to have scarred by it even all these years later.
Posted by Jeff Kane (Member # 6372) on 09-18-2011, 10:49 PM:
It's almost like they cut bits and pieces from different sound mixes and pasted 'em in on ANH. I have a pretty revealing system that's admittedly more focused on 2 channel audio (B&W 802D mains, HTM-2D center, Energy Veritas 2.0R sides and rears, Velodyne DD-18 and JL Fathom subs) and the dialog, music, and effects, are all over the place! Even for the same character, the differences can be huge from line to line! Some are way wet (as reverb goes), some dry, some sound quite dull and lifeless and some sound like they were re-recorded last week.
Bad thing about Blu-Ray is that the CGI is even more apparent than from SD sources. It's cleaner than I've ever seen it but it's TOO clean! All just looks DNRed to death. Well, I'm still glad to have it all on BD. I hope we get the originals at some point and I hope George A.) doesn't have to die before we get 'em, and B.) doesn't put language in his will precluding the release of the originals.
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 09-18-2011, 10:51 PM:
quote: Victor Liorentas
I don't remember but to put out The Phantom Menace as a soft blur fest in 1999 was a sign of caring little about resolution.
I wonder if some of the softness problem in Episode I has to do with camera and lens system choices. IIRC, the live action stuff was shot with Russian-made Hawk cameras and lenses. Panavision and Arri are typically the first choices in film cameras with any major production. Panavision makes very high quality lenses. Zeiss makes stuff to fit Arri gear.
George Lucas ditched Panavision for relatively unknown camera systems before. Return of the Jedi was filmed using cameras made by Joe Dunton. Panavision recently acquired the assets of the company and also put Joe Dunton and Lester Dunton on the board of directors. I remember a decent number of movies in the 1980's being filmed in JDC-35 anamorphic.
Posted by Connor Wilson (Member # 6088) on 09-19-2011, 08:49 PM:
Picked up the Complete Saga at Best Buy today. So far, it is not horrible.
I watched A New Hope tonight. This actually the first time I fully watched an episode of the original trilogy, and I enjoyed the film itself. But I will talk about the picture and audio quality.
As for picture quality, I would agree that Star Wars never looked this good on home video. You can definitely see details that were not present in the DVD and LD versions, and watching the film in true 24p/Hz was like watching a lucid painting shift and dance. My BIGGEST complaint, however, is the awful color timing. White walls are a pale grey, C3PO is in copper instead of gold, once warm reds are oversaturated, ad etc. It has unfourtunetly been like this since 2004, but slightly improved in very margin ways. For example, the lightsaber color during Luke's training was, in a few shots however, corrected from green to blue.
The all-new 6.1 DTS-HD:MA sound mix is decent. John Williams' score sounded quite phonemonal on my little 2 front/2 rear sound system (no center or sub). During most of the action sequences, the soundtrack is rocking, with sfx panning in different directions, but it sounded a bit compressed, like I wasn't able to pick up the nuances of Williams' score when lots of stuff was going on each speaker. It might just be my system, which is the best I could make it to be, but I didn't notice this in other soundtracks on BD, like Avatar. I can assure you that the new Krayt dragon call Obi-wan makes is not the worst thing on this mix. The complete misplacing of the quality of the dialogue is really bad. For example, if Luke says a sentence, to be answered by Obi-wan, his response sounds COMPLETLEY different than the last time he spoke. Half of the lines of dialogue are heavy on the mids, like most older films, and the other half has more response on the highs, like it was recorded more recently. The scene that exposes this inconsistency the best is the garbage compactor scene, in which the voices of the characters bounce in clarity. It's a very annoying, should I say, "glitch" in the mix that draws the viewer away from the film.
Overall, the film that started it all, as translated on the greatest home video format of our generation, is not even close to the original theatrical experience, which I think will be available in a restored print after George Lucas dies, sadly. It remains the best version of any cut of A New Hope on video, in terms of A/V performance, and the box set it comes in is essential to every movie fan.
A New Hope (1977)
Movie: 8/10
Video: 9/10
Audio: 8/10
Afterthought: I think this film blew up the tweeters on my front speakers just a little. Damn you, Georgie! (just kidding)
Posted by Connor Wilson (Member # 6088) on 09-20-2011, 08:25 PM:
Watched "Empire" tonight. Here's my thoughts:
As far as the picture quality goes, it is definetly much sharper, much clearer than A New Hope. It was almost a borderline perfect 10/10 score, but the same poopy color timing of the 2004 DVDs had to come and spoil the fun. Hoth is just, a blue, icy desert instead of an exotic ice calp. WTF?
For the soundtrack, I would have to agree with Joe on this one. The sfx like a tie-fighter flying by drowns out the dialogue. Why does all the action scenes have to be obnoxiously loud and wimpy? Why can't the dialogue be well intelligible during loud sequences? Isn't this set supposed to be THX-certified? Speaking of THX, even the "WOW!" Laserdisc has wider dynamic range, clearer dialogue, all the serious tech stuff THX addressed on the disc, than the discrete 6.1 DTS-HD:MA 24-bit audio on the ESB Blu. To top it on that, that Laserdisc had two-channel Dolby Surround-encoded 16/44.1 audio, which should be outdated by now! But, on the positive side, it was an aggressive and rocking mix. Had they fixed the levels and dynamic range, it would almost be a perfect 10.
The Empire Strikes Back (1980)
Movie: 9/10
Video: 9/10
Audio: 8.75/10
Afterthought: Sorry for prolonging my rant, but the restored THX Broadway trailer was a relief. Finally something with wider dynamic range, no harsh frequencies, it turned out to be quieter than the film itself! Odd for a THX trailer, isn't it?
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-20-2011, 09:21 PM:
Finally, someone other than myself notices the odd mixing of ESB. My review was downvoted to oblivion on Blu-ray.com because how dare I say anything negative about it. I'm likely just a hater just posting for reasons of hate.
By the way, is the DTSHDMA 24 bit? I'm used to most audio on movies being 16-bit 48khz. Sometimes it is more, but I figure they stick with such a number due to the severe limitations the sound mixing studios likely have in creating a high-resolution master from start to finish.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-21-2011, 09:39 PM:
Finally done watching all 6 movies. The CGI in Episodes 1, 2, 4, 5 and 6 are about the quality of Playstation 2 graphics. For those not in the know, the Playstation 2 is an older game system from around the year 2000. It did graphics as well as these movies and it had shitty graphics. All muddy with little texture. Just look at Yoda's wooden cane... it's just a shaded brown thing with no significance of wood anywhere. The graphics in Episode 3 did have texture, though. They looked much better.
Episode 3 is also a much, much better movie than the previous 2 and better than Jedi as well. The only things I don't like about it are:
-Darth Vader's "Noooo!"
-The fact that Natalie Portman chooses to die for no reason after the babies were born. That's just stupid. She should have died because two babies were too big for her tiny vagina.
-The fact that they are well under way building the Death Star 5 minutes after Darth Vader is suited up, thus taking around 18 years to complete, but the second, bigger Death Star is way over halfway done I'm guessing 6 or so years after the first one was done blowed up.
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 09-22-2011, 08:34 AM:
Maybe they learned from the mistakes/slowdowns that happened with the first Death Star and were able to build the second one that much quicker?
Posted by John Lasher (Member # 968) on 09-22-2011, 08:46 AM:
^What I was about to say. You beat me to it.
Of course...
quote:
The "Happy" Ending:
The evil Emperor Palpatine hatches a plan to defeat the Rebellion once and for all by telling them the location of his unfinished superweapon and then telling them how to defeat it. This plan goes about exactly as well as you would expect, and our heroes destroy the evil scourge with the help of some genocidal teddy bears.
Wait a Minute...
That epic battle at the end there? That only destroyed one base and a fraction of the troops the Empire had at its disposal. Sure, Vader and the Emperor were both blown up, but that wouldn't destroy the Empire any more than blowing up the Pentagon would dissolve the USA.
What it does do is create a horrific power vacuum, in an empire with fleets of Star Destroyers and millions of pissed-off troops roving around the galaxy (even more pissed off if the payroll office and all of their checks were in the Death Star).

"So... should we just keep being Stormtroopers, or what?"
Soon these power-hungry military officers would no doubt form factions and destroy entire planets in their brutal attempts to seize power. Eventually Palpatine would simply be replaced by a new Emperor, possibly even one competent enough to devise a plan that can't be foiled by developmentally stunted bears throwing rocks.
Sure, the Death Star was taken out, but that didn't exactly stop them last time. Not to mention that by the time they reach phase twenty-six of their patented "Let's just throw Death Stars at the problem until it goes away" strategy, [below] someone's probably going to decide that maybe the ship doesn't really need an unguarded, torpedo-shaped hole on the outside, thus allowing the Empire to swiftly conquer the entire universe.

Read more: The 6 Most Depressing Happy Endings in Movie History | Cracked.com http://www.cracked.com/article_16570_the-6-most-depressing-happy-endings-in-movie-history.html#ixzz1YglQn8Ey
Posted by Ron Funderburg (Member # 4561) on 09-23-2011, 08:29 PM:
Well my wife bought me the hole damn star wars saga today for a belated birthday present. So I guess I will start at 1 and watch it all the way through and bitch, bitch, bitch about all the changes! If I'm not careful she wont be buying me any more special things like that so maybe I will just bitch and not the other bitch, bitch.
Have I mentioned I love my wife? I do!
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 09-26-2011, 12:19 AM:
This bit of digital manipulation seems appropriate.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 09-26-2011, 02:35 AM:
quote: Joe Redifer
The fact that they are well under way building the Death Star 5 minutes after Darth Vader is suited up, thus taking around 18 years to complete, but the second, bigger Death Star is way over halfway done I'm guessing 6 or so years after the first one was done blowed up.
I always thought that they may have had a second one planned all along and it was already under construction well before the first one was destroyed. To quote a film I like, "First rule in government spending: why build one when you can have two at twice the price? Only, this one can be kept secret."
AJG
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-26-2011, 05:01 AM:
William Hurt should have been The Emperor.
So Aaron, how would you compare Phantom Menace's sound to the almighty LaserDisc?
Posted by Connor Wilson (Member # 6088) on 09-26-2011, 05:14 PM:
Just finished Return of the Jedi now. I would agree that it is the worst of the OT, like other fans. But oddly enough, I think, on the set, the video quality was the worst of the OT, but the best audio quality of the OT.
There were a few shots of the film that looked really muddy, like it was upscaled from a DVD (or 720p if I weren't so harsh). Some shots look really crisp, almost of perfect score, however. The consistency of the film's video transfer just bounces around irrationally. Most of the time it's okay, some are just plain ugly, and 1 or 2 shots (in Endor) were goregous. I also hated how they cranked up the brightness of the second Death Star. Looks washed out, but hey, it already did before.
As for audio quality, and after hearing the timbre-bouncing "Hope" and the off-leveled "Empire", it is, in a word, splendid. Of course, the dialogue wasn't intelligible in some scenes, but unlike "Empire" the bass wasn't overpowered. Although some fans despised the recently-added 'Jedi Rocks' musical number, it at least sounded amazing in this mix. The entire living room turned into a soundstage in that minute-and-a-half (otherwise) dread of helium Tina Turner wailing through the speakers. This is what non-classical music should sound like in 5.1 (or 6.1, to be precise). Had only they restored 'Yub Nub' in this mix...
Return of the Jedi (1983)
Movie: 7/10
Video: 8/10
Audio: 9/10
And Joe, I cannot determine if the DTSHDMA on this box set is 24-bit. Lucasfilm started mixing in 24-bit during post for Episode II, and since the entire saga was remixed for the BD, and DTSHDMA tries to emulate the original master, I would assume it was in 24-bit. As for "Empire," I think they used the same notes from the 2004 mix. The same guy who did those mixes remixed again for the BDs.
Posted by Connor Wilson (Member # 6088) on 09-26-2011, 09:58 PM:
Watched The Phantom Meanace tonight.
Wow, talk about Anakin Skywaxer. As others pointed out, Episode 1 has Digital Video Noise Reduction (DVNR, or DNR for shorter) applied to the video transfer. This was most likely done because it was the only film in the PT to be shot in 35mm, while the rest of the two were shot in 1080/24p video. I guess Lucas wanted to do this to keep the consistency with the PT's look and aesthetic. At least the colors are more vibrant than on the DVD. New CGI Yoda isn't too bad. It actually looks better than the puppet originally used, and no longer serves as a distraction. My only complaint is that Frank Oz's performance was more expressive with the puppet than ILM's digital character, for example, how Yoda's ears drop when saying "Hate... Leads to suffering" is less expressed on the digital version. The entire picture looked soft throughout, not so much the sequences entirely made with CGI which now look dated. Add some edge enhancement here or there, and you've got yourself Ep. I on BD, not as bad as Predator: Ultimate Hunter Edition.
The sound, on the other hand, is intense. Unlike the OT on BD, there is no, if any, little fatigue in the sound mix. Everything is crystal clear and full in dynamic range. I personally can't imagine Episode 1 sounding better, but I have yet heard the Laserdisc's AC3 mix. The pod race sequence, hailed as the king of home theater demo material for several years, sounds abseloutley remarkable. The lightsaber duel with Maul hit hard on the low end, and the entire mix is just perfect.
The Phantom Meanace (1999)
Movie: 4/10
Video: 6.5/10
Audio: 10/10
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 09-26-2011, 10:49 PM:
Saw the saga at Wal-mart tonight, $90 for the whole set....I think I'll pass...I think those who did buy it got suckered....
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 09-26-2011, 11:58 PM:
quote: Connor Wilson
The lightsaber duel with Maul hit hard on the low end
I loved that about the mix in the theater. Heavy heavy bass on the lightsabers, and it sounded awesome. The lightsabers in Episodes II and III didn't really have that punch to it in my opinion.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-27-2011, 12:23 AM:
The thing about the home version of the pod race sequence is that it is too long. The theatrical/LaserDisc version makes you want to watch it again because the length is just right, but the other versions add a lot of stuff that doesn't really need to be there. It begins by introducing EVERY racer. Nobody cares about the other racers. Then more stuff goes wrong with Anakin's pod than used to, it's just "oh geez just finish already you little turd". But yes, the sound mix is quite awesome.
They took time to add CGI Yoda, etc. I wish they would have taken the time to delete at least a few Jar Jar scenes. NOBODY would have complained. I wonder what made George think Jar Jar was a good idea in the first place. The least they could have done was change his voice.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 09-27-2011, 02:47 AM:
quote: Joe Redifer
So Aaron, how would you compare Phantom Menace's sound to the almighty LaserDisc?
I haven't done a direct comparison yet...but the Blu-ray did sound pretty damn phenomenal. If anything, it definitely didn't seem as bright but the LFE was still substantial. You're also very correct about the extended pod race: it really hurts the pacing. The theatrical cut is far superior for that scene.
Digital Yoda looks great...a welcome change if you ask me.
AJG
Posted by Connor Wilson (Member # 6088) on 09-27-2011, 07:58 PM:
Just finished Attack of the Clones tonight. Worst episode in the saga, IMO.
Picture quality is step beyond "Menace." Although there is no DNR, as this film was shot digitally, it still looks very, very soft. I didn't notice the "new and improved" color timing on this one. It was very subtle, but I was expecting more green like I saw on the screenshots. In fact, I don't own the DVD.
Audio was good, but a bit lacking compared to "Menace."
Attack of the Clones (2002)
Movie: 2.5/10
Video: 7/10
Audio: 9/10
Posted by Connor Wilson (Member # 6088) on 10-02-2011, 05:39 PM:
Watched Revenge of the Sith today. Best of the prequels.
The video quality was top notch. Although it was filmed on video instead of film, this is the best-looking disc on the set, and it's sad to say it won't look better on home video in the future, because it was shot in 1080p, the Blu-ray standard. They only way it would look better if a codec greater than AVC will be used.
As for sound, "Sith" rocks the house. It was the quietest of them all, so I turned it up a little. Never did my dad complain that it was too loud, unlike the other films. That's saying something.
Revenge of the Sith (2005)
Movie: 7/10
Video: 10/10
Audio: 10/10
Posted by Keegan O'Brien (Member # 6539) on 10-02-2011, 07:14 PM:
quote: Connor Wilson
it's sad to say it won't look better on home video in the future, because it was shot in 1080p, the Blu-ray standard. They only way it would look better if a codec greater than AVC will be used.
"Interesting that a film out from the Alexa, which is less than a 2K original, looks far better at 4K than at 2K. And I do mean far better!"- Roger Deakins
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 10-04-2011, 03:47 PM:
One of the most poorly-researched articles I've ever read. (Or: I guess Blu-ray.com doesn't employ fact-checkers or copy-editors?)
quote:
The Making of Star Wars (Updated)
Posted September 16, 2011 11:35 PM by Robert Siegel
What can one write about a film that has been written about thousands of times, been torn apart in documentaries and on specials since 1977. This was my dilemma when writing about Star Wars. Also coming into play was the problem of obtaining the rights to use many of the materials I had originally planned to use (which may be added to this column at a future date when and if they are cleared). Many of the behind the scenes photographs in my collection could not be cleared for use, as well as some publicity shots. So, I have compiled a history as best I could with what I was able to show and write about. Hopefully you will find some material you have not read or seen before. You may left click on most of the photographs to see an enlarged version. I have taken out all marks and folds on posters and old photographs so I hope you enjoy these "remastered" works of art.
The most magnificent toy ever invented for grown men to play with and express their fantasies, to project their nightmares and dreams, and to indulge their whimsies and secret desires is the motion picture medium. Taking full advantage of the technical wizardry of filmmaking, writer-director George Lucas conceived of his film, Star Wars, as an expression of his boyhood fantasy life, his love for Flash Gordon and all the great mysteries and adventures in books and movies. Star Wars is a distillation of the joys Lucas experienced in the hours he spent watching television and movies, and reading comic books and comic strips. It's a high-energy action movie uniting the hardware of contemporary space adventure with the romantic fantasies of sword and sorcery, plus a dash of wish fulfillment. Lucas' goal had been to make an imaginative entertainment experience that would transport audiences out of the theater and into an unknown galaxy thousands of light years from earth. Star Wars is a tale of heroes and villains and a romance between a young naive boy and a princess. It is an odyssey from innocence to knowledge, the ages-old tale of the passage of the sword from one generation to the next. It is a world where magic is possible, and love and goodness triumph over evil.
Star Wars follows a young man, Luke Skywalker, through exotic worlds uniquely different from our own. Leaving the small arid planet of Tatooine, Luke plunges into an intergalactic search for the kidnapped Rebel Princess Leia from the planet Alderaan. Luke is joined in this adventure by Ben Kenobi, the last of the Jedi Knights who were the guardians of peace and justice in the old days before the "dark times" came to the galaxy; Han Solo, the cynical captain of the Millenium Falcon, a Corellian pirate starship; Chewbacca, a Wookiee, a race of tall anthropoids with quasi-monkey faces and large blue eyes; and the robots, See-Threepio (C3PO) and Artoo- Detoo (R2D2). This odd band of adventurers battle Grand Moff Tarkin, the evil Governor of the Imperial Outland regions, and Darth Vader, the malevolent Dark Lord of the Sith, who employs his extrasensory powers to aid Governor Tarkin in the destruction of the rebellion against the Galactic Empire. In the battle of Yavin, Luke engages in a climactic space battle over the huge man-made planet destroyer, The Death Star. Star Wars was a space fantasy designed to stimulate imaginations, entertain and gave moviegoers an infinite variety of vicarious emotional, physical and mystical delights. It is a world people on this earth have never been to, but it's a world they may have encountered when years ago they dreamed about running away and having adventures that no one else had ever had.
George Lucas
In a 1981 interview, George Lucas said, "I had taken some creative writing courses. I had no intention of becoming a writer. I was always terrible in English." During his attendance to USC, he made eight short films, one of them was THX 1138 4: EB, which was about a man running in the world of the future. "I had already graduated from USC in 1966 with a Bachelors of Fine Arts." He would become worried about being drafted, but when his call came he found out that he had diabetes and they would not accept him. He then applied for a position at the Hanna-Barbara studio because of his love for animation and the fact that with animation, you could be in any world at any time. He was rejected there. Following this rejection, he was invited to a competition of students making documentaries, which was being done by Columbia Pictures for Mackenna's Gold. The students were assigned to make a documentary on the film. The Lucas documentary stood out because it did not have much do do with the film but the location. This impressed Carl Foreman, a Hollywood producer. Due to this, Lucas won a scholarship program at Warner Brothers. Lucas was hoping to be involved in Warner animation but he was sent to the set of Finian's Rainbow, which was being directing by Francis Ford Coppola. This music project was one that Coppola hated and continued to hate throughout the years. As luck would have it, Coppola, seeing Lucas on the set for weeks, got to know him and Lucas eventually became his personal assistant for the picture.
After his helping Coppola and getting to know him on the Finian's Rainbow set, he felt he was ready and started to write his feature length script for THX 1138. Coppola in an interview at the time stated, "I wanted George to make a film and he wanted to make a feature length version of one of his class projects. I told him, "Well you know, we could get money in the budget for you to write a documentary on the making of the film, but instead you could write your script." In 1968, while working on Rain People, Lucas took some much needed time off and vacationed in San Francisco, where he would meet John Korty, who had money to produce his own independent films. Lucas put him in touch with Coppola and out of that introduction came American Zoetrope (under which films like Apocalypse Now would be made).
When THX was completed, Warner Brothers was shocked at what Lucas turned in. They had hoped for a mod sharp film and according to a Warner executive, "We ended up with a very abstract sci-fi documentary." Warners were not pleased and edited out some scenes and without much fanfare released the film. It is apparent looking at the press materials released for THX that Warner didn't expect much as the press materials were quite short compared to all of their other releases at the time. The film bombed, and the contract that had been made with Zoetrope was canceled. Lucas was livid with Warner Brothers for chopping off even a small amount of footage. Lucas then announced his next project would be Apocalypse Now, but Coppola didn't like the direction Lucas was taking it and changed the script completely, using nearly none of Lucas' ideas. Lucas wanted the film to have super-hero like characters and done as a documentary.
Star Wars
United Artists became interested in Lucas and signed him to a deal to make Apocalypse Now and American Graffiti and another picture which would be Star Wars. All Lucas could tell them was that this would be very similar to a Flash Gordon type film. Lucas wrote the script to American Graffiti, mainly using his memories as a teen. After completing the script, United Artists turned him down. That is when Universal showed interest and accepted the project. It was made for $750,000 in 28 days. The film was a gigantic success, surprising the heads of Universal. Lucas at the time wanted to make a film of Flash Gordon, but the rights were not available, and so he decided to write his own story, and all he knew is he wanted space battles, laser swords and sorcerers in capes. Of American Graffiti, Lucas said, "It was January 1973 and I had been paid $20,000 for Graffiti which had taken two years. Universal was unhappy with it before its release and considered selling it to television. Still, the cutting of the film was something I could not tolerate and I decided from then on I would have complete control over my work."
Lucas was enthralled by a 1958 film called The Hidden Fortress. It was a fairy tale-type film made for the younger audience. There were two fighting characters in this film, and so when developing Star Wars (which he started writing in January 1973), Lucas admitted that this was how he developed C-3PO and R2D2. The similarities are fascinating. Universal ended up passing on Star Wars (when American Graffiti had not yet been released), just as United Artists had. Lucas would say, "In their rejection letter, UA states that it is truly a film for all ages but there would be too much cost involved for this kind of kid's story." Universal also said the idea was very good and they might have a great space adventure in the film, but we wonder if Mr. Lucas can pull it off." But the (at-the-time) bright executives at 20th Century Fox could see a fantastic film in the script, and took it on, giving Lucas $50,000 to write it and $100,000 to direct plus all income from merchandising and complete sequel rights. Little did Fox know that with that contract, they were giving up hundreds of millions of dollars.
It took Lucas over a year to write just the first draft. It was titled The Adventures of Luke Starkiller." Lucas did not change his name to Skywalker until one month into filming. After adding Ben Kenobi, Lucas decided this was not all about Luke, and so the title of Star Wars was born and on March 22, 1976, filming commenced. This would be the hardest work Lucas had ever done and he leaned on an expert team to help him with his vision, but he knew exactly what he wanted, it was "in my head." When the film was completed, Lucas thought it was going to be a complete bomb. He had been dealing with robots and models that rarely worked, and thought some of the rubber masks were actually funny when they were not meant to be.
Lucas was a child of the "stereo" era, having grown up with the advent of RCA Living Stereo albums and Columbia stereo albums, and knew this film had to have stereo sound. At the same time, Dolby Laboratories was ready to use their process for the theaters, and so Lucas decided to use Dolby Stereo instead of 4-track magnetic stereo due to it's wider range and quality of sound, and Lucas felt. Dolby would be the future of theater sound. So the film was mixed into 6 tracks for 70mm showing, and then into 4 tracks.
In late spring, the finished film was screened for friends of Lucas, studio executives and a few other special invites. There was no ovation. That night, Brian De Palma and Steven Spielberg were present. Spielberg had met Lucas on the Universal lot during American Graffiti. De Palma told Lucas that the movie was "an absolute travesty, horrible." But Spielberg had a different vision. He told Lucas that he had made a "modern classic."
In the wake of the success of Star Wars, George Lucas' desire to create a nine-part saga set in that galaxy far, far away became a viable aspiration, and "The Empire Strikes Back" is a manifestation of that dream. The movie was a further episode in an adventure divided into three trilogies. Star Wars and "The Empire Strikes Back" were the first two parts of the middle trilogy. "In choosing to film 'Star Wars' first," Lucas had explained, "I chose the chapter I felt the most secure with." "Star Wars: Episode IV - A New Hope" -- its original and complete title - was the result. The episode number and the sub-title were dropped for considerations of length and clarity, and the movie was called simply Star Wars. But now that a saga of interrelated movies is evolving, the full title appears on prints and videos of Star Wars.
"There are essentially nine films," Lucas said. "The first trilogy is about the young Ben Kenobi and the early life of Luke Skywalker's father when Luke was a little boy. The first trilogy takes place some 20 years before the second. About a year elapses between each story of the first trilogy. The whole adventure -encompassing the three trilogies --spans about 40 years." How much has been written? "I have story treatments on all nine," he said at the time. "Then I've got voluminous notes, histories and material I've developed for various purposes. Some of it will be used, some will not. After all, it takes three years to prepare and make a 'Star Wars' picture. How many years are left? It's like making an 18-hour movie. Each film is conceived like a chapter of a book. It's a whole tapestry of which I can deal with one part at a time. Each part is two hours of screen time, and one has limited funds and limited time to do it in."
Mark Hamill
George Lucas is noted for the calm and quick way he handles actors, and in the process, getting very real, very true portrayals from them. When asked about his technique with actors, Lucas merely stated that "I think part of it is that I cast very close to the kinds of people the actors really are. Mark Hamill, who plays the hero in Star Wars is very much like his character, Luke Skywalker. Mark is wonderfully naive, energetic and very enthusiastic." When asked about the nature of the character he portrays, Mark Hamill agreed that his character was very much as Lucas had described him. Then he impishly added, "George Lucas is Luke Skywalker! I guess in many ways George and I are alike," Mark added, "Because neither of us is tall and we both look really young, we've both been called 'the kid' on movie sets. George said he has given to me, forever, his nickname of 'the kid.' That's what he used to be called until he grew his beard. And that's what I ended up being called on the set of Star Wars 'Hey, where's the kid,' was the way the people called me for a scene. "I realized that my character, Luke Skywalker, was really George while we were filming in Tunisia. I was doing the scene where I discover the robots. I said my lines very big, very dramatic. George came over and went over the lines with me. He didn't give me line readings, but as he explained the intention of the scene, he was very low-key. I just watched him. I don't know why, but something in me told me to observe how he was speaking, to try to pick up his inflection.
"I even imitated a few of his gestures as he explained to me what he wanted me to do. At one point, I thought to myself that he was doing it so small. That can't be right. I thought I'd try it very small and he would see that it didn't work. He would tell me to go back to the way I was doing it before. So when I played the scene, I did it just like I thought George would react in the scene. When I did it like that, George called, 'Cut. Perfect.' I was flabbergasted. I thought, 'Oh, I see. Of course, that was right. Luke is George. Even the names are similar, Luke —Lucas.' "From then on, I followed through on my feelings. I began to really feel like I was playing George. I guess if you sit down and write an adventure like this, you have to think of yourself as the main character. I actually think 'Star Wars' is the adventures of George Lucas," Mark said, "Making this movie has been to George like playing with a big toy. He had a great time. While we were filming, Carrie Fisher brought over to England a Buck Rogers helium pistol. She gave the toy to George and he wouldn't put the thing down. We would see him with the gun in the hallways of the studio. Although he was not conspicuously running down the hallways and aiming it at imaginary villains, he did spend a lot of time kind of twirling it around. You couldn't pry that helium pistol away from him," Hamill revealed. "Sure, in 'Star Wars' I'm telling the story of me," George admitted. "It's my fantasy. I made it because no one else is making movies like this and I wanted to see one. I want it to be a success so everyone will copy it. Then I can go see the copies, sit back and enjoy them."
As for The Empire Strikes Back, "I've always identified very closely with the character of Luke Skywalker, and I think it will be clear that in the new picture, both he and I have matured since 'Star Wars,' " said Mark Hamill "Luke was a callow youth in the first movie, and to some extent I was naive and inexperienced too about life in general. Luke was suddenly thrust into amazing adventures in different parts of the galaxy. Similarly, I was taken to Africa and to England to play the role, having previously hardly been out of California," said Hamill. "For the second movie, I had to travel to Norway and to England again. I'm a much more knowledgeable individual now than when George Lucas first auditioned me for the role and I think audiences will see a more mature Luke." In between Star Wars and "The Empire Strikes Back," Hamill not only made other movies, one of which took him to Israel, but traveled widely to help promote Star Wars.
Hamill also survived a very serious road accident, which he believes fundamentally changed him into a more careful, caring person. He also got married, and is now the father of Nathan Elias, born in England during the production of "The Empire Strikes Back." "I know that being Luke Skywalker places upon me the responsibility to live a good life," he said, "because so many young people identify with the character. I don't think I've been changed by the success of Star Wars, it didn't go to my head. But nobody could go through such experiences as I have gone through, without maturing more rapidly than most people do during less eventful lives. So Luke will look and behave more maturely in The Empire Strikes Back' -that is inevitable and it's what George Lucas intended."
Carrie Fisher
In Star Wars," Carrie Fisher had a film role that measured up to her own rich fantasy life. She portrays the beautiful Princess Leia, a senator from the planet Al-deraan and a rebel-leader working secretly for freedom and justice against the oppressive, evil Galactic Empire. "When I made my first film, Shampoo, my scene was shot in a house in Beverly Hills, which is where I grew up. I wore this little tennis outfit, which was something I might wear in real life. It wasn't at all what I expected making movies would be," Carrie Fisher said. "I grew up watching movies and they always seemed like adult recess. And that's exactly what making 'Star Wars' turned out to be - a kind of adult recess. I got to go to lunch with outer space monsters at a Chinese restaurant."
Then 20-year-old daughter of Debbie Reynolds and Eddie Fisher, Carrie Fisher stars with Alec Guinness, Mark Hamill, Harrison Ford and Peter Cushing. Carrie Fisher is five foot one with dark hair and large dark eyes. She was brought up in the show business oriented world of Beverly Hills and made her professional debut at the age of thirteen in her mother's nightclub act. After appearing in "Shampoo," she attended the Central School of Speech and Drama in London. She had been approached to do several motion picture roles following her brief scene in Shampoo but none of them really interested her until she read and was tested for Star Wars. "I wanted to do the role of Princess Leia because I wanted to have real conversations with people with bubbles on their heads," Carrie explained. "I just wanted to be blase about someone sitting across from me being a 'small person' or some strange looking person who was hired through the Ugly Agency. 1 love that there's an agency in London called that. I can't tell you how thrilled I was to be casually sitting around with those people as if they didn't have hair-dryer heads and things like that. I wanted to sit next to Wookiees, which are tall, half-man, half-ape creatures, jawas which are tiny, shrouded creatures with glowing eyes, and all kinds of robots.
"The people in the restaurant wouldn't react. I thought that was terrific. And we were in Boreham-wood, which is the English version of Crazylady, Wyoming. If I saw someone who was seven foot two, like Peter Mayhew, who plays Chew-bacca the Wookiee, with someone like me, who is really small, and all of the rest of the weird looking cast, I certainly would react. We looked like a Fellini congregation entering this little Chinese restaurant. When I was growing up, I used to go out a lot in costumes. There's a whole subculture of people who get dressed up in strange costumes and go out for ice cream at 31 Flavors, and I remember realizing that people just won't give you the attention that you seem to be screaming for. Kids react, of course. They think it's terrific. Adults don't. Except for drunks. Although I never read much science fiction before I made 'Star Wars,' I had a kind of active space fantasy life all my own. Once I saw a science fiction movie that scared the hell out of me. I don't know what it was, but it took place on the moon."
Fisher continued, "And I used to be afraid of Martians. There was an invisible Martian in that movie who was surrounded by an electric field. If you got thrown into that electric field, it was goodbye forever. It was really scary, scarier than even burglars or snipers. You can't put Martians in jail." When asked about her feelings about making a space fantasy film such as Star Wars she said, "I was scared to death. And when I finally did it, I felt like my body was being ventilated from the inside. But it was a different kind of terror. And I knew it was also going to be fun to do. I was really afraid of doing something wrong. I was also afraid my hairpiece would fall off. Despite the fears, I was sort of sorry we got it right on the first take. Once I got over the initial shock of doing it, I wanted to do it again. I still do. And that's why I hope they do a sequel with lots of swings across chasms in it. "I also want weightlessness in the sequel," Carrie Fisher added. "That looks like it could be a lot of fun. And lots of space travel. I like going places."
"It's like in the 1930 films with Fred and Ginger fighting up to the last reel," continued Carrie Fisher, talking about the romantic relationship between Princess Leia and Han Solo, which develops in The Empire Strikes Back. "It's Bogart and Bacall and Hepburn. If two independent people are quarreling and fighting, then they neck. That's what it is. It's romance in celluloid. In "The Empire Strikes Back," a strong emotional situation develops between Han Solo (Harrison Ford) and the Princess. But neither will admit to it until, that is, Han faces extreme danger. Up to that time, it's love in a cold climate with the Princess rejecting Han's advances during their stay on, and flight from, the frozen planet of Hoth. Seriously, though, I believe both characters are far more fully-dimensional in The Empire Strikes Back' than they were in 'Star Wars.' In the first film, the action was so intense that it gave us no time to think about one another. Now George Lucas has given the Princess a more full-blooded feel about her and it was much more challenging to play."
Alec Guiness
"I feel movies can be a positive influence in people's lives. Something really good should come from a motion picture," said Alec Guinness of the making of Star Wars. "A good story can show how people can overcome obstacles, rise to the occasion. When I read the script for 'Star Wars,' it had something that made me high, held my attention. It was an adventure story about the passing of knowledge and the sword from one generation to the next." Alec Guinness portrays Ben Kenobi, the last of the Jedi Knights, one of the greatest warriors of the Old Republic, who leads the fight against the sinister Galactic Empire. "One of the difficulties of being in my sixties is that I can't pick and choose quite as much as I could in my thirties. But my role in 'Star Wars' has been described as a blend of the Wizard Merlin and a Samurai warrior, and you can't beat that," Guinness commented. "Unlike most space fantasy, the characters George Lucas has created aren't cardboard. And the story is gripping. There's a quest, encounters with other forms of life, and conflict between good and evil. The good wins, which is a novelty these days."
"Actually, I think my films have been, on the whole, positive. I think even the comedies, such as 'The Captain's Paradise,' 'The Lavender Hill Mob,' 'The Man in the White Suit' and 'Kind Hearts and Coronets' showed that anyone with ingenuity and aspirations can do something with their lives. People liked to see that. And even though the characters I played often bent the law to achieve their ends, they had a sense of adventure to them. Audiences related to those characters. I suppose I start from the outside of the character and work in. It's wrong, but I can't stop my imagination," he said as he explained his acting methods. Although Guiness might consider the methods he uses wrong, the results he has achieved have been lauded by critics and applauded by film and theater audiences throughout the world. When asked to further amplify on his acting technique, Alec Guinness, who is generally reluctant to talk about either his public or private lives, allowed a brief glimpse into what make his characterizations so memorable. "Never having been a handsome juvenile, I've always been a character actor. I've always been determined that my work should be different each time I act."
Actors are notoriously and perennially worried about being out of work, but Guinness confesses to being lucky. He has worked continuously since John Gielgud took an interest in him when he was starting, casting young Guinness in his production of Hamlet. Then Guinness himself got the chance to play Hamlet when the great director Tyrone Guthrie staged the play. "The production was not a success. Nevertheless it all went to my head. I was only twenty-four at the time. And I still think it was one of the best things Guthrie ever did. Working with Guthrie was a whole other experience. He encouraged his young actors to let their hair down and let things rip. He encouraged a sort of mad amateurism, which was wonderfully liberating. It's the sort of experience actors today don't get. Plays, not to mention films, are much harder to come by because of the expense of putting a production together."
"There's no chance to experiment because each job is a life or death, success or failure experience. When I was starting, if one job failed, there always seemed to be another lurking not too far behind to wipe out the bad memories and, hopefully, the bad notices." Although Alec Guinness has aimed a shrewdly observing eye on the other people, he is not adverse to viewing himself with a keen sense of humor. "I'm a very self-conscious person. Maybe I think people are looking at me the same way I look at them," Guinness admitted. "Probably the most self-conscious moment of my life came when I was knighted by the Queen. It was a very odd experience. I remember there was a little band there for the occasion, and when it came my turn to be knighted, the band struck up, 'I'm Gonna Wash That Man Right Out of My Hair.' It was a very droll moment."
Peter Cushing
Horror film enthusiasts loved, respected and feared Peter Cushing as the fanatical scientist Baron von Frankenstein and as Count Dracula's perennial nemesis, the determined and steely Van Helsing. Now, as Grand Moff Tarkin, the Governor of the Imperial Outland regions, whose insatiable political ambitions to become Emperor have driven him to ruthless means to quell an intergalactic rebellion, Peter Cushing took a role in Star Wars to achieve something new that wasn't horror. Although Peter Cushing has had a remarkable career portraying deadly characters in horror movies, he is a decidedly kind person off-screen, as greatly beloved for his gentleness by his co-workers as he is loved for his evil ways by horror movie cultists. Peter Cushing, before Star Wars, had worked many years for American International Pictures, which released hundreds of low-budget horror movies, some from Hammer films, that generated good profit.
Carrie Fisher said, "I like Peter Cushing so much that it was almost impossible for me to feel the hatred I needed to act against him. I had to say to him lines like, 'I recognize your foul stench,' but the man smelled like linen and lavender. I couldn't say that to this nice English man, whom I adored. So I substituted in my mind the one person I hate." As an example of Peter Cushing's kindness, people would relay stories about about how he insisted on the film company hiring his stand-in, who was recovering from an operation and was still too weak to work. Cushing knew his friend needed the job, so in order to protect him, Cushing ended up standing-in for the stand-in and spending off-camera time making tea for his friend. Peter Cushing was not long on the set of Star Wars though, completing his scenes in just five days.
Harrison Ford on The Empire Strikes Back
Harrison Ford, who later recreated his role as Han Solo in "The Empire Strikes Back" reached the snow-stricken location at Finse, Norway (where the ice-planet scenes were filmed for Empire), in a manner to justify the traditional claim that the show must go on, whatever the conditions. When called form London to the location, which is set on a glacier 6,000 feet above sea level, Europe was in the midst of one of the worst winters on record. Finse was isolated by blizzards and avalanches, which had cut the railway link with Oslo, the only means of reaching the remote mountain pass. Because he was required for scenes of a rescue nature on a snowscape depicting a planet in its ice-age, the production chartered a special snow-train equipped with snow plows that I forged a path to Geilo, a ski resort 30 miles east of Finse where Ford was stranded in a train blocked by a collapsed snow tunnel.
They radioed the railway authorities to unload the actor, and the plow brought him through 50 feet of high drifts to the location base at midnight. In the morning, he was before the cameras with Mark Hamill in the scenes which open the picture."Part of professionalism is showing up on time and knowing your lines," said Harrison, "but I have never before learned them in an avalanche or reached a set in a snow plow." In Star Wars, I was really in my element. I felt that I was just having a great time, it was not like work." Lucas had worked with Harrison Ford before, when he was cast in a small part in American Graffiti. As Lucas prepared the script, he would keep his mind on Ford as Han Solo. "I knew there was something there, a cockiness that was needed for the role and Harrison did it to perfection." Ford says of his role as Han Solo: "I intentionally keep my interpretation simple. Han is no longer the only stamp in my passport, but somehow he is becoming a part of me." After the success of Star Wars, the Chicago-born actor starred in Force Ten From Navarone, Hanover Street, Heroes, Raiders of the Lost Ark series, The Frisco Kid, and played a cameo role in Apocalypse Now. He has gone on to make dozens of successful films.
Darth Vader
One of the most famous villains in movie-land is Darth Vader. While the voice you hear was that of James Earl Jones, it was actually actor David Prowse in the black costume. Darth Vader was originally a Jedi Knight who fell to the dark side of the force. He was a ruthless being with no feelings whatsoever, at least in the first film. Prowse's size filled the large Vader costume creating an evil compelling lord. It was actually a stuntman named Bob Anderson who did the fighting as Vader. Darth Vader did not become such a major player until the second script revision in which Lucas created a more evil threat to the rebellion. Darth Vader has still remained a symbol of evil, and has even been written about in several books by psychiatrists when writing about severed and hidden personalities.
James Earl Jones was known for his infamous low voice, having narrated dozens of programs and did voice overs for commercials, documentaries and other productions. He lent his voice to Robots and The Lion King and starred in such films as Dr. Strangelove, Swashbuckler, Conan the Barbarian, The Hunt for Red October and his famous appearance as the king in Coming to America. David Prowse had many roles on television series but would have very little success in films.
News Coverage
Star Wars would obtain major coverage in almost every newspaper in the country, not only once, but in some papers dozens of times. Considering the film played so long in theaters, newspapers and magazines continued to use the movie as a major story attracting readers. Magazines on the stand in news-stands and grocery stores were full of Star Wars covers. Papers like The New York Times as well as other papers would run behind-the-scenes stories, something they rarely did so many times for a single movie. Hundreds of magazines, whether or not their subject was film, would find a way to incorporate the film into their publications.
John Williams
John Williams, who conducted the London Symphony Orchestra in recording his original compositions for the Star Wars saga, is well known for his very popular and accessible music. Nominated thirteen times for an Academy Award, he has received Oscars for Fiddler on the Roof in 1972, for "Jaws" in 1976, and for Star Wars in 1978, which became one of the top selling soundtrack albums of all time. He had twice received an Emmy Award for "Best Musical Composition," and was awarded two Grammys for Superman. Williams has also composed a large body of work for television, particularly for "Alcoa Theater," "Kraft Theater" and "Playhouse 90." His symphonic works have been performed by many major American orchestras. He was appointed conductor of the Boston Pops Orchestra, succeeding the late Arthur Fiedler and continued to write scores during that time.
For Star Wars, Williams spent months looking at drafts and the finalized screenplay and knew he had something special to work with. "I had done many types of films before, but I was too young to do the serials, the western action/adventures and had only done a few science fictions scores. This film allowed me to combine all of those themes. So I created a special theme for each character that would be heard when the character appeared. For the theme itself, I spent a month at my piano changing notes and working with different octaves and keys. Then one day, a beautiful sunny morning, I woke up, walked to my piano, took all of the work I had used before, and combined it to create the main title theme. It was a very exciting day that I will never forget. I never realized at the time just how popular this composition would become." Lucas had originally planned to use classical music, as in 2001 A Space Odyssey, until Steven Spielberg introduced him to John Williams.
In "Star Wars," Williams' unparalleled ability to create exciting, captivating music is evident. In this two-record set, each major character has its own highly recognizable theme. The only theme that had not been created until the second film was the unforgettable "Imperial March," which not only personified the foreboding character of the villain Darth Vader, but served to depict the Imperial forces themselves. Later he also created a special theme to portray Yoda, the teacher of the Jedi Knights, as well as a beautiful love theme which accompanies the growing romantic relationship between Han Solo and Princess Leia. Williams even wrote a theme for the ever-popular robots, C-3PO and R2-D2. Throughout the soundtrack, Williams had given emphasis to the relationships between the characters, keeping in mind the importance of the original story, while generating excitement for the adventures of the original script. New material was developed to tie-in with the original score, yet the creation of new themes steadily unfolds to accompany every event and character in the Star Wars sequel as well.
Williams also created an appropriate musical mysticism in his themes, which introduces the fantastic and exotic locations in which the story takes place. Star Wars was John Williams' forth association with the London Symphony Orchestra, whose experience in performing film scores went back many years. In Williams' opinion, one of their exceptional attributes was their flexibility. As part of the musical renaissance in London, the London Symphony musicians have been exposed to great changes and innovations in the instrumental arts; there has been the development of new recording techniques, as well as a close association with the British film industry, As a result, the players developed superb technical expertise and artistic flexibility. In recording Star Wars, the orchestra had to adjust to various changes in their composition, depending on the specific requirements of certain sequences. For example, the themes at Luke's home is a theme accompanying the heavy movements of the drama as Luke realized his parents have been killed. This music called for five piccolos, five oboes, a battery of percussion, two grand pianos, and two or three harps in addition to the normal orchestration complement.
With a score as complex as Star Wars, the flexibility of the London Symphony Orchestra and their ability to provide such exceptional orchestration was a tremendous asset in helping Williams create this motion picture soundtrack. The music not only added great dimension to the action in the film itself, but thanks to Williams' unparalleled expertise, the score also stands out on its own - innovative, exciting and appealing. The music from Star Wars is another landmark in both Williams' own career and in the entire field of motion picture soundtracks. The score for Star Wars ranked #1 on AFI's 100 Greatest Film Scores. This also marked the first time in years that the younger audience was buying a soundtrack of orchestral content. At the time of the film's release, there were three singles released of the title theme. The one that made it to the top of the charts was from Meco Monardo (on his albums he is named 'Meco'). The disco version of the theme and its album would remain on the top of the Billboard charts for months. Meco would then be assigned to Millenium Records, and his next album was titled Encounters of Every Kind, using music from Close Encounters and other original Meco space music.
Premiere
The film was shot in an aspect ratio of 2:40:1 with anamorphic lenses, even older VistaVision cameras were sometimes used. Opening weekend grosses came in at an estimated $35.9 million, extremely good for 1977, but the staying power of the film would actually shock the studio, going on to make almost $800 million worldwide. May 25, 1977 will be remembered as one of most important days in film history. This was the day that Star Wars was released. It was booked only into a few select theaters. Word of mouth quickly spread. Lines three to four blocks filled the sidewalks to get in to see this new adventure in space, a totally original tale unlike the public had ever seen.
Lucas told Starlog Magazine in an interview, "I was mixing sound on foreign versions of the film the day it opened here. I had been working so hard that I really forgot the film was being released that day. My wife was mixing New York, New York at night at the same place we were mixing during the day. She came in just as I was leaving for the day and we ran off to the Chinese Theater and there was this huge line around the block. I said, "What's That?" and I couldn't believe it when it hit me, they were waiting to get into Star Wars." Fox executives could not keep track of the boxoffice intake. Not since The Sound of Music had Fox had one of those "One in a million" films that would take the world by storm. In American cities, every show was packed and sold out. To get away from it all, Lucas went to Hawaii with Spielberg and their wives, and on the sand in front of the beautiful ocean, the idea of Raiders of the Lost Ark was born.
On May 25, 1977 at the Chinese Theater in Hollywood, Star Wars had its premiere. The stars came out in droves for the heavily-promoted event. Debbie Reynolds, Beatrice Arthur, Steven Spielberg, Clint Eastwood, Roger Moore, Helen Reddy, Richard Widmark, Burt Reynolds, Jackie Gleason, Linda Blair, Liza Minelli, Robert De Niro, Diane Keaton, Alan Alda, Christopher Reeve, Brad Davis, Genevičve Bujold, Beverly D'Angelo, Charlton Heston, Tom Sellek, Jeff Conaway, Larry Hagman, Jessica Lange, Jim Henson, John Cleese, Gregory Peck and of course the cast were in attendance.
Also attending were the heads of several studios, including the Presidents of Universal and United Artists, both of which had turned down Lucas to make the film. The premiere was similar to the golden days of Hollywood. When the film ended, a five minute standing ovation would bring a tear to the eyes of George Lucas. The stars and specially invited would then attend an after party that was filled with smiles and excitement and lasted into the early morning hours. What would follow this night would not only surprise 20th Century Fox and George Lucas, but nearly everyone in the movie industry.
The World loves Star Wars The reviews began to appear. Time Magazine wrote,'"This is certainly the best film this year, a combination of Flash Gordon, swashbucklers and The Wizard of Oz." The L.A. Times said, "Star Wars is Buck Rodgers with a doctoral degree and not a trace of narcissism...a slam band rip-roaring trip through a distantly futuristic world." Variety exclaimed, "A Magnificent film, like a breath of fresh air." Roger Ebert said, "Every once in a while, I have what I think is an out-of-body experience at a movie. The characters in the movie Star Wars are so perfectly and simply drawn that it's the movie's heart that will endure people to this film for a long time." There wasn't a place in which Star Wars was not being discussed. In schools, gyms, restaurants and literally everywhere, the words Star Wars were echoed.
When Lucas returned from Hawaii, it was madness. Lines around the block in hundreds of theaters nationwide were continuing, and the boxoffice dollars kept coming in. During this period, it is interesting to note that many movie houses equipped their theaters for Dolby Stereo to present the film as best as it could sound. Many of these theaters made the transition after weeks into the run when people who had seen it in a stereo theater complained to management that audiences were not seeing the real Star Wars in their theater without the fantastic stereo experience. By the end of June, only one month, Star Wars earned back it's cost. The flow of cash was so high that Fox, which usually produced twenty-five films a year, produced less than half of that for 1978. After three weeks of release in 1977, Fox's stock price doubled.
With the success of the movie, Lucas could now, having all rights to the sequels, do whatever he wanted at greater cost and perfection and have control over his work. He would go on to produce The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi and then go on to complete the first three chapters. The film would get ten Academy Award nominations, and go on to become to most profitable film in history. It was the first science-fiction film to be nominated for Best Picture. In its first video release, the film remained on top of the charts for months.
Following this and a laserdisc release, Lucas decided to take modern special effects which could not be used in 1977 and apply them to Star Wars. This began a long and serious debate between Star Wars fans and Lucas that continues to this day. Lucas added special effects, and even changed the bar scene in which Han Solo fires his weapon, which has created much controversy. Claiming the original negatives were all cut up to create the special editions, Lucas finally relented and released the laserdisc transfers in non-anamorphic widescreen to DVD.
Comic Books
One of the most popular by-products of the film were the comic book series. Marvel Comics obtained the rights for the first Star Wars comics. Most of the stories did not follow the film and were all original, with titles like "Six Against the Galaxy," "Death Star," "Doomworld," and "Crucible." But in later years, other comic companies would publish many assorted comic books based on the series. "Tales of the Jedi," "Knights of the Old Republic," and "Attack of the Clones" to name a few. Marvel did very well with its original series which is now in the hands of many collectors and extreme fans of the series, with the first issue going for a high price in auction.
Star Wars was the subject matter for many documentaries and spoofs. Mel Brooks used the film as a basis for Spaceballs. Another popular parody made by students was Hardware Wars, with household items taking the place of ships and weapons. In 1982 Lucasfilm made Return of the Ewok. The film has been spoofed in television series such as Robot Chicken and Family Guy among others. Regardless of the Stars Wars on earth over the changing of the original film, the Star Wars in space has become a legend, a film that changed motion pictures forever.
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 10-04-2011, 05:37 PM:
But I don't want to read such a long quote. Can you just give the list of what was wrong in the article?
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 10-05-2011, 10:45 AM:
If I post a list, Greg, it'll be nearly as long as the article...and then you won't read that either. The last time I posted a list of corrections to a published work, it received only a single dismissive comment and no discussion, so why should I think this time will be any different? Instead, how about I just cite a few of the really major ones, such as...
quote: Robert Siegel
Opening weekend grosses came in at an estimated $35.9 million, extremely good for 1977
Thirty-plus million? In the 1970s? Give me a break! That figure is actually what it grossed on the opening weekend of the 1997 "Special Edition" re-release. What it made on its original opening weekend was $1.5 million.
quote: Robert Siegel
On May 25, 1977 at the Chinese Theater in Hollywood, Star Wars had its premiere. The stars came out in droves for the heavily-promoted event. Debbie Reynolds, Beatrice Arthur, Steven Spielberg, Clint Eastwood, Roger Moore, Helen Reddy, Richard Widmark, Burt Reynolds, Jackie Gleason, Linda Blair, Liza Minelli, Robert De Niro, Diane Keaton, Alan Alda, Christopher Reeve, Brad Davis, Genevičve Bujold, Beverly D'Angelo, Charlton Heston, Tom Sellek, Jeff Conaway, Larry Hagman, Jessica Lange, Jim Henson, John Cleese, Gregory Peck and of course the cast were in attendance.
(1) There was no formal premiere for Star Wars. The thing he's describing sounds like the Invitational Preview held at the Samuel Goldwyn Theater in Beverly Hills four days before release. (2) I very highly doubt some of the stars cited attended considering some weren't yet celebrities (like Tom Selleck) and others were out of the country working (like Christopher Reeve). (3) In the online article the author includes a photo of the Chinese Theater with a mass of people crowding the place and captions it as the premiere when in fact the photo was of the footprint ceremony held ten weeks after the film had opened.
quote: Robert Siegel
In late spring, the finished film was screened for friends of Lucas, studio executives and a few other special invites. There was no ovation. That night, Brian De Palma and Steven Spielberg were present.
His timeline is off and he appears to be confusing multiple private and public test screenings that took place during the winter and spring. The movie was actually released to the public in late spring.
quote: Robert Siegel
Spielberg had met Lucas on the Universal lot during American Graffiti.
This conflicts with other accounts of how the two met. And, although Spielberg had a TV directing contract with Universal at that time and was no doubt frequently present on the Universal lot, American Graffiti was shot entirely on location and post-produced in Northern California.
quote: Robert Siegel
John Williams, who conducted the London Symphony Orchestra in recording his original compositions for the Star Wars saga, is well known for his very popular and accessible music. Nominated thirteen times for an Academy Award, he has received Oscars for Fiddler on the Roof in 1972, for Jaws in 1976, and for Star Wars in 1978, which became one of the top selling soundtrack albums of all time. He had twice received an Emmy Award for "Best Musical Composition," and was awarded two Grammys for Superman.
The number of nominations and wins cited are incorrect.
quote: Robert Siegel
When Lucas returned from Hawaii, it was madness. Lines around the block in hundreds of theaters nationwide
When Lucas returned from Hawaii, the film was still playing in fewer than 50 theaters. It hadn't yet "opened wide" in hundreds of theaters.
quote: Robert Siegel
It was the first science-fiction film to be nominated for Best Picture.
I guess he doesn't consider A Clockwork Orange to be science-fiction.
Posted by Claude S. Ayakawa (Member # 1401) on 10-05-2011, 03:18 PM:
Mike,
You are the man! Although long, I enjoyed reading your post about George Lucas and the history of STAR WARS. I learned a lot of things about the film from it,
Thank you for taking the time to put it together and post it.
-Claude
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 10-06-2011, 09:41 AM:
[facepalm]
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 10-06-2011, 11:21 AM:
Ug, Blu-ray dot com. They have some pretty bad people writing for them. Did you e-mail that guy about his research and all of his errors, or at least some? I would. Maybe CC Claude.
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 10-06-2011, 02:04 PM:
Joe... I posted a comment in the comments section that follows the article after first reading it a couple of weeks ago. After a few days of no additional comments or revisions made to the article, I emailed the author asking if he had seen my comment. No reply, but shortly thereafter he had my comment removed. What an asshole! And still no revisions. So, just to piss him and the Blu-ray.com guys off, I re-posted my comment.
If you have the time, check out the comments that follow the article (the link is at the beginning of my post from Oct. 4th). The author is amusingly defensive and seems clueless about the article's shortcomings. And those comments from the author's sycophantic followers!
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 10-06-2011, 02:55 PM:
quote: Michael Coate
The last time I posted a list of corrections to a published work, it received only a single dismissive comment and no discussion, so why should I think this time will be any different?
I don't think you can assume that lack of discussion automatically means no one was interested. I for one, had found the previous correction list interesting and showed how flawed the book in question was but really had nothing to add, especially since you're known here as the perfectionist-type who gets that kind of stuff absolutely right the first time.
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-11-2011, 08:43 PM:
Does anyone have the software or know-how to capture "frame grabs" from Blu-ray Discs? If so, could you please capture a frame from around the 54:36 point during Chapter 25 of Star Wars: Episode IV - A New Hope and post it here in this thread (or email to me)?
The frame in question is during the Docking Bay 94 scene where Luke, Ben and the droids board the Millennium Falcon for their flight to Alderaan. The shot in question is the reveal of the ship that follows the group walking down the flight of stairs. Capture a frame that includes the ship before it cuts to shot of Luke saying, "What a piece of junk."
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-11-2011, 10:32 PM:
The best I might be able to do is take a picture of the screen.
Posted by Jim Bedford (Member # 4) on 11-12-2011, 09:32 AM:
quote: Michael Coate
[facepalm]
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-12-2011, 04:34 PM:
This will have to do (taken with my iPod Touch):
Posted by Ian Parfrey (Member # 5122) on 11-12-2011, 05:54 PM:
What are we looking for in this frame-grab?
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-13-2011, 12:04 AM:
quote: Chris Slycord
I don't think you can assume that lack of discussion automatically means no one was interested. I for one, had found the previous correction list interesting and showed how flawed the book in question was but really had nothing to add, especially since you're known here as the perfectionist-type who gets that kind of stuff absolutely right the first time.
Couldn't have said it better. Sometimes people just read and don't respond. A whole string of comments such as "That's great! Thanks for posting" would be useless. The lack of response doesn't mean the item didn't get read.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-13-2011, 03:23 AM:
Yeah, it's especially true here. We post a new set of pictures or a video in the Warehouse and next to nobody has anything to say about it. It can be pretty discouraging which is why I wanted to post stuff directly to Youtube and forgo the community here. But we do have an idea that would encourage discussion, though it might be a while before it is implemented.
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 11-13-2011, 10:15 PM:
quote: Ian Parfrey
What are we looking for in this frame-grab?
What Ian said.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-13-2011, 11:34 PM:
The lack of radar dish on the ship.
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-14-2011, 01:07 AM:
Yes, posting the frame was indeed to highlight the missing radar dish. (Thanks, Joe, for posting the image.)
My issue with the Falcon's radar dish is that after fifteen years of never-ending tweaks made to the movie, I'm surprised it remains unfixed, especially given the numerous other (mostly unnecessary) changes made to other moments in the movie. I can't believe they've chosen not to fix this but instead chose to change the transitional effect at the head of the same scene. (It originally began with a dissolve from the previous scene; it now begins with a straight cut.) Of course, I'd prefer they leave it (and the rest of the movie) the way it was, but in the context of all these changes being made to the movie anyway, it seems silly for them not to fix it.
If you want/need background info... the dish was missing in the first place because they only built half of the full-scale model and the dish is on the half they didn't build. The original intent was to add the dish in post by combining that footage with a matte painting (which is how they handled a similar shot in another scene).
Wasn't one of the points of doing the Special Edition to fix the things they didn't get right the first time (i.e. "realizing the original vision")? This admittedly minor detail would actually fall into the category of a justified change. Instead, what we got were mostly dumb revisionist changes.
Anyway, most of the time I mention this situation to someone they have no idea what I'm talking about, so it's nice to have an image to help explain the situation.
Posted by Matthew McBride (Member # 6598) on 11-16-2011, 03:23 PM:
I think they may have left the radar off, so that when the next generation of home media players come out, they'll have another reason to re-release the movie again.
Posted by Tom Petrov (Member # 1534) on 01-14-2012, 11:11 AM:
So does anyone know? Was BR release of Star Wars a success or a flop? I did not purchase the discs and neither did most of the star wars fans that I know.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 01-14-2012, 01:57 PM:
http://www.variety.com/article/VR1118043276
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 01-14-2012, 04:29 PM:
Text from the link above (which I intended to post earlier but actual work got in the way):
Blu-ray sales for 'Star Wars' top $84 million; Nine-disk set sells more than 1 million copies worldwide
Consumers were willing to shell out top dollar for the complete "Star Wars" franchise, which bowed on Blu-ray this week, with the collection selling more than 1 million units to break records for the high-definition homevideo format.
The nine-disc set generated more than $84 million from worldwide sales, with $38 million collected in the U.S. alone, from 515,000 units in North America. On average, the collection is priced at $79.99.
The sales figures made "Star Wars: The Complete Saga" the No. 1 pre-order and catalog title since the launch of Blu-ray in 2006.
Lucasfilm and Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment have been promoting the release for the past 13 months, with the marketing campaign including Darth Vader and Stormtroopers taking over the Panasonic booth to announce the September release date at January's Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas and a first look at San Diego Comic-Con.
"Once again our fan's enthusiasm to celebrate 'Stars Wars' continues to amaze us," said Kayleen Walters, senior director, marketing at Lucasfilm. "Our goal was to deliver a premium product that they could enjoy with their family and friends and we are thrilled that they are enjoying it as much as we hoped they would."
Episodes I-III and IV-VI are also available as separate Blu-ray trilogy collections for $39.99 each.
"Star Wars is a franchise with universal stories that resonates as much today as it did 30 years ago," said Mary Daily, executive VP of marketing for Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment and Vincent Marcais, senior VP of international marketing for Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment. "With the Blu-ray, audiences can go deeper into the mythology than ever before and reconnect with everything they love about the saga in the best possible quality."The collection includes the six movies on the Blu-ray format for the first time, with deleted, extended and alternate scenes, new documentaries and "Star Wars" spoofs produced over the past three decades.
The first pic of the original trilogy didn't bow on DVD until 2004, while the prequels came out sooner, beginning in 2000.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 01-14-2012, 05:34 PM:
Oh yeah, this reminds me of something I want to do. I have the box edition pictured in that article but since I've watched all of the extras, I want the two-pack edition. Same movies, just is real Blu-ray cases and no extras. What I want to do is trade the box edition with someone for the two-pack edition straight up. That way I can have normal Blu-ray cases and not some ugly box that not only scratches discs when they are removed or re-inserted, but also make it a physically difficult to remove them.
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 01-21-2012, 09:39 PM:
I just want the ORIGINAL versions of the movies- don't care what kind of cases they come in. I won't buy any Lucas-revised edition, regardless of what his 'creative vision' is.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 01-21-2012, 11:05 PM:
Then buy the original LaserDiscs.
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 01-22-2012, 12:32 AM:
Have 'em, but would like them on Blu-Ray in actual hi-def.
Posted by Shawn Arndt (Member # 7159) on 09-10-2012, 10:12 AM:
I have this Bluray set and the ONLY thing I enjoyed aside from the extra's discs is the fact that TPM was finally uncropped. Thankfully, I still have a fine laserdisc machine with copies of the "Faces" set, the "Definitive Edition" set and the U.S. & Japan releases of the Special Edition plus Phantom Menace. ALL the original releases & Special Edition discs are far better than their Bluray counterparts. I grew up with the originals and even saw Jedi in 70mm in Milwaukee. George's versions just don't cut it.....Han shot first!!!!
Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 06-19-2013, 11:06 PM:
BUMP! To add to this post after 9 months:
I went to Costco to get my new glasses at the Vision Center and passed the HDTV's which were playing SW:EPIII on these displays from a BR source.
Passed by the new Samsung 60 plus inch screen units that now have 240HZ refresh rate and with this high of a refresh rate, it made this Third Episode look like it was shot on video instead of film - just amazingly sharp and clear of an image!
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 06-20-2013, 01:08 PM:
quote:
Passed by the new Samsung 60 plus inch screen units that now have 240HZ refresh rate and with this high of a refresh rate, it made this Third Episode look like it was shot on video instead of film - just amazingly sharp and clear of an image!
They probably had the motion enhancement "motion flow" or whatever frame interpolation nonsense is called in the TV turned on and set to "high". I can't stand that stuff. It not only makes a movie look like it was shot on video, but that you're watching it on videotape and the tape deck is stuck in fast forward mode.
That motion enhancement stuff also blurs out a lot of what it thinks is "noise" but is really image detail. A lot of TV sets with that feature turned on will make textures like skin look like plastic.
Posted by Mike Heenan (Member # 392) on 06-21-2013, 04:22 PM:
Episode 3 was shot on video, not film
Posted by Connor Wilson (Member # 6088) on 06-21-2013, 05:59 PM:
Anything shot in 24 frames, video or not, doesn't look good with "Motionflow."
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 06-24-2013, 12:55 PM:
Had it been shot on film properly, and had the motion thing been turned off, Monte might have REALLY been impressed!
Posted by Harry Robinson (Member # 265) on 06-25-2013, 03:50 PM:
I just helped a friend set up his home theater and he had one of those Samsung LEDs preset to the advanced refresh rate. It took me forever to find the settings so I could put it back to normal. He was complaining that everything looked like a soap opera.
Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM
6.3.1.2