Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Hobbitt II - Smaug

This is topic Hobbitt II - Smaug - any 15/70 showings? in forum Large Format Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 12-05-2013, 11:16 PM:

Being from the San Diego corner of the US, naturally, I'm focussing in on possible Southern California cinemas, but don't let me stop the worldwide discussion...

Posted by Dick Vaughan (Member # 540) on 12-06-2013, 04:54 AM:

Well there are certainly 1570 prints being made although I think this may be as low a number as 20 worldwide.
We are haaving one here in Bradford ,UK and it is my understsnding that BFI IMAX in LOndon will aslos have one.

I'm afraid I can't add any more info right now.

Posted by Jock Blakley (Member # 6552) on 12-06-2013, 09:03 AM:

Melbourne Museum will have it in both 15/70 3D and LieMAX HFR 3D.

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-06-2013, 12:33 PM:

quote: Dick Vaughan
I think this may be as low a number as 20 worldwide

I think the release might be down to as low as 15 prints. There are a few theatres that played Catching Fire that are not playing The Hobbit 2.

In Canada, IMAX Quebec is the only theatre playing Hobbit 2 in 15/70 that I know of. All other locations are to be shown in digital.

Iowa has a print. It will on a dome screen..
Henry Ford
Seattle has it booked along with DHOOM as the next title.
San Antonio
Bob Bullock
Minnesota
Chicago
Fort Lauderdale

There should be a few others.

Posted by Jeff Arellano (Member # 3249) on 12-07-2013, 05:20 PM:

From my understanding Hobbit will be the last 70mm film at the Rave 18 Los Angeles. It will be installing a digital projector after the end of its Hobbit run. Apparently Hobbit is the last 70mm IMAX film.

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-07-2013, 05:51 PM:

Jeff, that is really sad to hear.

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 12-07-2013, 06:09 PM:

quote: Terry Lynn-Stevens
Seattle has it booked along with DHOOM as the next title.

Does this mean they're opening it later than its normal release date? Because the only 1570 IMAX in Seattle is the Science Center downtown and they have showtimes already into first week of the new year and no DHOOM 3 listing (and it's supposed to be released on the 20th of this month).

Granted, it's not uncommon for bollywood movies to get released state-side later than in India, but releasing on the same date is more the norm lately, especially for these bigger releases.

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-07-2013, 09:13 PM:

quote: Dick Vaughan
it is my understsnding that BFI IMAX in LOndon will aslos have one

Hi Dick, is BFI a dual digital/1570 IMAX cinema?

quote: Chris Slycord
Does this mean they're opening it later than its normal release date? Because the only 1570 IMAX in Seattle is the Science Center downtown and they have showtimes already into first week of the new year and no DHOOM 3 listing (and it's supposed to be released on the 20th of this month).

Dhoom will be opening in December as per the website but you are correct the showtimes indicate no room for it as all showtimes are for Hobbit 2 until Jan 5.

Posted by Allan Young (Member # 6332) on 12-08-2013, 07:52 AM:

quote: Terry Lynn-Stevens
is BFI a dual digital/1570 IMAX cinema?

Yes it is. Digital projection was added in July 2012.

At the time of the conversion the operators claimed that 15/70 prints would continue to be used if they were available.

This pledge lasted approximately three months. They used a digital copy of Skyfall in October.

Posted by Jeffry L. Johnson (Member # 453) on 12-08-2013, 09:31 AM:

quote: Jeff Arellano
Apparently Hobbit is the last 70mm IMAX film.

Last DMR IMAX feature length conversion?

I have a new IMAX documentary 1570 film print booked for next April. And another new release booked after that.

IMAX won't convert some screens to digital cinema (or add digital cinema) until 2015, maybe later.

Posted by Jonathan Goeldner (Member # 4854) on 12-08-2013, 09:49 AM:

unless they are announcing the opening this week, none of the three 15/70 Smithsonian IMAX screens are showing this ... [Confused]

...

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-08-2013, 10:34 AM:

I noticed that too, Hunger Games 2 is playing at the Airbus IMAX, they are booked until Jan 5th, I have feeling they will be playing to a lot of empty shows by that point.

Perhaps this is in fact the end for the DMR 15/70 film print releases as I really have not heard all that much about the success of these showings, there is not much in the media or on the fans forums from I seen and there was almost no buzz about the Catching Fire IMAX sequences this time around. The bookings for Dark Knight and Dark Knight Rises was truly an extraordinary event and perhaps gave these stand alone IMAX theatres false hope.

It really is too bad that IMAX got into the Hollywood scene so late, the 1980's would of been the perfect time to release 70mm IMAX Hollywood movies for very long box office runs.

quote:
I have a new IMAX documentary 1570 film print booked for next April. And another new release booked after th

IMAX has confirmed via interviews in the press as close as late November that they will still supply 70mm prints to those who want them. For the DMR stuff, they are well aware that Kodak could stop making prints anytime which could cause problems if that happens.

quote: Jeffry L. Johnson
IMAX won't convert some screens to digital cinema (or add digital cinema) until 2015, maybe later.

Did they give you a reason?

Posted by Jeffry L. Johnson (Member # 453) on 12-09-2013, 09:47 AM:

quote: Terry Lynn-Stevens
Did they give you a reason?

That's the announced rollout date for dome screens.

Here's Brian Bonnick, IMAX chief technology officer, speaking at September's GSCA conference about the next-generation laser IMAX digital system.

quote:
Mid-next year, we're putting beta systems or field trial systems out into the marketplace with a GT launch at the end of the year and dome to follow shortly thereafter in the 2015 timeframe.

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 12-09-2013, 08:14 PM:

quote: Terry Lynn-Stevens
Dhoom will be opening in December as per the website but you are correct the showtimes indicate no room for it as all showtimes are for Hobbit 2 until Jan 5.

Well, I only mentioned the 20th since that's the date on a standee I saw at a local cinema. My guess is that it's only playing in the IMAX theaters in India and the normal places here in the states that have bollywood fare.

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-09-2013, 08:33 PM:

quote: Jeffry L. Johnson
That's the announced rollout date for dome screens.

Here's Brian Bonnick, IMAX chief technology officer, speaking at September's GSCA conference about the next-generation laser IMAX digital system.

IMAX is not offering the older purpose built IMAX theatres the current digital set up because most of the content in the IMAX catalog for these theatres has not been DMR'd for the 2K system. Also, the current digital system was never really intended to replace GT or SR projectors, it was designed to replace MPX systems and to be the new projector for new conversions that have smaller screens than.

More recently, IMAX has begun to install the IMAX digital system that they currently have in existing 15/70 theatres that are committed to Hollywood DMR movies. The world's largest IMAX screen now has a dual digital projector to go along with their 15/70 unit.

The content for the new Barco projectors will be able to play catalog movies like the ones you are playing at your OMNIMAX theatre. In November IMAX outsourced a company who will do the scanning of the 70mm negatives for the 4K Barco units. IMAX says these new projectors are a game changer, we'll see I guess but at least they will have the 15/70 aspect ratio.

quote: Chris Slycord
Well, I only mentioned the 20th since that's the date on a standee I saw at a local cinema. My guess is that it's only playing in the IMAX theaters in India and the normal places here in the states that have bollywood fare.

I guess Dhoom 3 is a digital only release.

Posted by Dick Vaughan (Member # 540) on 12-10-2013, 10:06 AM:

quote: Chris Slycord
Does this mean they're opening it later than its normal release date? Because the only 1570 IMAX in Seattle is the Science Center downtown and they have showtimes already into first week of the new year and no DHOOM 3 listing (and it's supposed to be released on the 20th of this month).

Pacific Science Centre has two IMAX theatres. One 1570 GT 3D and one digital 3D so they could potentially show both at the same time.

AS for last DMR title then Chris Nolan's Interstellar next November is my best guess. An enormous amount of 15 perf footage was hot for this film and a trailer is on the front of Hobbit 2.

At the GSCA conference in September David Keighley of IMAX asked all theatres considering converting from film to digital to retain their film projectors until the end of 2014. IMAX have promised Nolan that there will be 50 1570 screens available to show his film.

Posted by Joseph L. Kleiman (Member # 3097) on 12-10-2013, 03:36 PM:

quote: Allan Young
At the time of the conversion the operators claimed that 15/70 prints would continue to be used if they were available.

This pledge lasted approximately three months. They used a digital copy of Skyfall in October.

The BFI did not break that pledge with Skyfall. Sony decided at the last minute not to make any 1570 prints of the film available in the UK. As a result, the National Media Museum was unable to book it in their IMAX theater.

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-10-2013, 03:39 PM:

quote: Dick Vaughan
At the GSCA conference in September David Keighley of IMAX asked all theatres considering converting from film to digital to retain their film projectors until the end of 2014.

Great info Dick!

The big screens that are not committed to DMR movies will likely support 15/70 for a lot longer than we think. The content for the new projectors are not yet ready for showing, but once they are, the incentive to switch over to the new projectors are for the expanded library that will be available.

IMAX said in November that they are fully committed to providing 15/70 as long a theatre wants it. The big concern is whether or not Kodak will continue providing film going forward and whether or not the studios will continue paying for 15/70 prints.

Interstellar is still a year away, hopefully there will be some IMAX venues that are still capable of showing it. There are no theatres in my area which really sucks.

Posted by Dick Vaughan (Member # 540) on 12-11-2013, 05:34 AM:

For The Dark Knight Rises a number of theatres that had switched to digital but still had the 1570 kit on site had it re-installed . Both sets of projectors were mounted on a rail system that allowed which ever was in use to be moved to the centreline projection point.
That may be an option in some cases for Interstellat.

And Joe was right about Skyfall . Both BFI and Bradford were keen to screen 1570 prints but Sony decided not to bring prints in to the UK.

Posted by Allan Young (Member # 6332) on 12-11-2013, 07:42 AM:

quote: Joseph L. Kleiman
The BFI did not break that pledge with Skyfall. Sony decided at the last minute not to make any 1570 prints of the film available in the UK.

Thanks for the correction ! A strange decision by Sony, considering it was a Bond movie.

(Minor point - the cinema is now operated by Odeon Cinemas, not the BFI).

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-11-2013, 08:51 AM:

quote: Dick Vaughan
For The Dark Knight Rises a number of theatres that had switched to digital but still had the 1570 kit on site had it re-installed . Both sets of projectors were mounted on a rail system that allowed which ever was in use to be moved to the centreline projection point.
That may be an option in some cases for Interstellat.

I know for my territory this was the case, however it was only for the The Dark Knight Rises and was a "one off" I was under the impression that the 15/70 would stay installed on the rail system for future use when something big was released. This however was simply not the case and the projectors and rail systems have since been removed from the theatres close to me.

I can't really comment about cinemas outside of my territory but there was an excel sheet going around with the confirmed 15/70 print release of Catching Fire and the confirmed prints were down to 23 prints in North American with most being an institution or destination IMAX theatre. Very few were in US chain cinemas.

Lastly, many theatres lease their IMAX GT or SR equipment from IMAX, so there really is no point in keeping the equipment around for one movie. There are no more MPX projectors left in operation.

But you are right, if they are still on the rails then I guess they could be used.

Posted by Dick Vaughan (Member # 540) on 12-11-2013, 09:31 AM:

The only real incentive to use the 1570 projectors in already converted theatres would be for titles where a large percentage of the footage was originated on IMAX 15 perf 65mm cameras.

TDKR had by far the most of this footage but this is likely to be surpassed by Interstellar.

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 12-11-2013, 11:21 AM:

quote: Dick Vaughan
And Joe was right about Skyfall . Both BFI and Bradford were keen to screen 1570 prints but Sony decided not to bring prints in to the UK.

That's not too big a loss. Skyfall was shot on video, mostly using the Arri Alexa camera. Its shoots a 2.8K image (2880x1620) when using Arriraw; it down-samples to 1920x1080 in other formats, including HD-SDI output. Even though the digital intermediate for Skyfall was rendered in 4K most of the photography in it was blown up to that. 2.8K is a step up from the 2K of IMAX Digital projection, but not too big a step.

quote: Dick Vaughan
The only real incentive to use the 1570 projectors in already converted theatres would be for titles where a large percentage of the footage was originated on IMAX 15 perf 65mm cameras.

It's really the only incentive for making 15-perf 70mm prints at all. The big question is how many more movie productions will shoot footage on 15/65 negatives. If existing 15/70 projectors are on rails in the booth it would be best to leave them there as long as there is a chance of getting a 15/70 print. It's a much bigger pain to remove a 15/70 projection system and then reinstall it.

I think it's a huge waste to take a movie shot with HD resolution video cameras and/or put through a 2K digital intermediate work flow and have those results blown up to the IMAX film format. Viewers might as well watch that kind of material in IMAX Digital, or better yet watch such movies on more modest sized screens where the 2K pixel grid isn't enlarged so much.

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 12-11-2013, 03:42 PM:

quote: Dick Vaughan
The only real incentive to use the 1570 projectors in already converted theatres would be for titles where a large percentage of the footage was originated on IMAX 15 perf 65mm cameras.

DMR content showing on the 15/70 projectors usually looked pretty good to me, lets not kid ourselves, it is not 15/70 quality but to me it still looked just as good or better than IMAX Digital. Skyfall was not bad in 15/70 and I watched that on the heels of The Dark Knight Rises. I regret not going to watch Elysium in 15/70 back in October.

quote: Bobby Henderson
If existing 15/70 projectors are on rails in the booth it would be best to leave them there as long as there is a chance of getting a 15/70 print. It's a much bigger pain to remove a 15/70 projection system and then reinstall it.

Bobby, many theatres lease their 15/70 equipment (although some own it) so keeping it in their projection booths is not always an option.

Posted by Jim Henk (Member # 3628) on 02-01-2014, 05:28 PM:

quote: Jeff Arellano
From my understanding Hobbit will be the last 70mm film at the Rave 18 Los Angeles. It will be installing a digital projector after the end of its Hobbit run. Apparently Hobbit is the last 70mm IMAX film.

I did see it at the Rave on 12/31. I had a great time. It was spectacular. Was only sorry that my friends bailed at the last second, so it was just me.

As closing credits were rolling, I couldn't believe I was seeing probably the final iMAX feature in film I would ever see. Just can't see paying $16.50 for basically, a 2k show blown up on a large screen. More, if there are 3D glasses involved. Nope. That's it for me for iMAX, I guess. Damn shame.

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 02-01-2014, 05:52 PM:

Interstellar should have some 15-perf 70mm film prints when the movie is released in November. The big questions are how many prints will be made and which IMAX theaters will be playing them?

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 02-01-2014, 06:34 PM:

quote: Jim Henk
As closing credits were rolling, I couldn't believe I was seeing probably the final iMAX feature in film I would ever see.

It looks like Hobbit 2 is the last DMR 15/70 release as of now. IMAX is on record stating that they will provide 15/70 prints if the studios will be willing to make them. Of course Kodak would have to remain in business for this to happen as well.

The recent releases of Hobbit 2 and Catching Fire debuted on something like 20 screens in 15/70. Some of these location are dual 15.70/IMAX-D locations such as the two IMAX locations in Sydney and Melbourne. If Paramount is willing to announce that they will support 35mm prints for Interstellar and perhaps make a push to add some 35mm prints to existing digital multiplexes, then I don't see why they would not offer up some 15/70 prints.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-01-2014, 08:46 PM:

quote: Bobby Henderson
The big questions are how many prints will be made and which IMAX theaters will be playing them?

And will there still be an honest to goodness REAL IMAX projectionist around that knows how to not damage the film by that point? There were only a few 5 years ago. What makes anyone think at the end of 2014 this is a good idea?

Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 02-01-2014, 11:03 PM:

quote: Brad Miller
And will there still be an honest to goodness REAL IMAX projectionist around that knows how to not damage the film by that point?

Yes, but none of us will be in the booth. Or the theater, for that matter. [Razz]

[ 02-02-2014, 02:43 AM: Message edited by: Adam Martin ]

Posted by Terry Lynn-Stevens (Member # 7349) on 02-03-2014, 01:22 AM:

quote: Dick Vaughan
For The Dark Knight Rises a number of theatres that had switched to digital but still had the 1570 kit on site had it re-installed . Both sets of projectors were mounted on a rail system that allowed which ever was in use to be moved to the centreline projection point.
That may be an option in some cases for Interstellat.

I was wrong earlier about Cineplex removing their 15/70 projectors completely at the purpose built IMAX locations in Canada, I can confirm they are in fact still installed and located right behind the digital projectors. The projectors are still there for pending future "one-off" releases and Interstellar will be getting the same Dark Knight Rises 15/70 style release.

I was also wrong about Cineplex using GT units in all of their purpose built locations. Some are using 15/70 SR units.

quote:
Yes, but none of us will be in the booth. Or the theater, for that matter. [Razz]

For Dark Knight Rises, the theatres that were already digital and were able to run Dark Knight Rises in 15/70, some projectionists were hired by IMAX. For Interstellar, it is expected that IMAX will once again do the hiring.