Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: 42nd street AMC Digital screw up?

This is topic 42nd street AMC Digital screw up? in forum Digital Cinema Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 03-22-2001, 06:19 PM:

Has anyone heard this one? I heard this from a pretty reliable source. About a month ago at the AMC 25 on 42nd street, NYC. I heard that they were playing something in their digital format (I think it was Gladiator that they brought back for the Oscars) and they had a problem with the sound sync. So they stopped the show and told the packed audience that it would be a minute and it would be fixed. Well, evidently, you can rewind on these things and you can see it on the screen almost like a DVD rewinding. Well, the audience, from what I heard went nuts and almost caused a riot. AMC cancelled the show. People were demanding their money back and saying things like "we paid $9 to watch a video? If we wanted to see it on video we would have rented it at the video store". Now...like I said, I heard this from a very reliable source and was wondering if anyone heard more about it.

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 03-22-2001, 07:03 PM:

What's interesting about that is that the complainers didn't realise they were watching a video until they saw the rewinding.

Posted by Tod J. Weitzel (Member # 760) on 03-22-2001, 07:37 PM:

You would think they would have a monitor up in the booth for things like this so they could close the dowser while adjusting the framerate or whatever wonky digital thing they were doing. By seeking the image onscreen, not only were they putting those with epillepsy at risk (try rewinding a video on a giant screen and not have your eyes go crazy), but it broke the metaphor of going to the movies.

How unprofessional.

-Tw?

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Resident nerd.

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 03-22-2001, 08:53 PM:

Funny the christie here doesn't have a dowser

Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 03-22-2001, 09:02 PM:

I've heard that it's preferred to keep the light going through the DLP optics, so that a constant thermal condition is maintained. Cycling the radiant energy off and on is evidently more likely to cause problems. So no dowser.

Can any of our DLP-Cinema projectionists confirm if this is the case? Paul? Scott?

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John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-22-2001, 11:29 PM:

If that is true John they could always put something in front of the porthole to block the light.

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-22-2001, 11:31 PM:

Well, couldn't somebody have put a piece of cardboard up in front of the port or something??

What I think this shows is that digital projection has its own set of pitfalls just as film has. It's just that people aren't admitting it in order to promote their "agendas".

I've always said that the problems and pitfalls of digital projection won't be known until more movies are shown digitally. It's already beginning to happen, by the looks of this.

Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 03-23-2001, 01:12 PM:

I will have to look to see if we have a manual douser.

We do shut the lamp off between shows though.

Paul.

Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 03-23-2001, 07:33 PM:

Fellows,

This never happened anywhere, much less the Empire 25. Must be an attempt at starting a specialized urban legend.

Also, Universal does not do D-Cinema, at least not yet. They are sittin' on the fence.

Finally, lip sync is locked in with the PIX, so this couldn't have happened.

As far as an un-knowing audience rioting.......please!

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Better Projection Pays!

Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 03-23-2001, 07:45 PM:

At any rate, this would be good wouldn't it? I don't know how many times over the years I've been asked to rewind the movie for someone!

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Better Projection Pays!

Posted by Mark Ogden (Member # 43) on 03-23-2001, 07:51 PM:

I can confirm that this is totally untrue. The last DLP show at the AMC 25 was a two week run of "The Perfect Storm" back in November, and before that the wide break of "Fantasia 2000" last fall. They go digital on one screen next week for the re-release of the Japanese anime "Akira".

Tell whoever told you this that if you're gonna troll, ya gotta at least make it plausible.

Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 03-23-2001, 08:11 PM:

Mark: FWIW, when I went to the "Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace" digital screenings in Secaucus NJ and Paramus NJ, AFTER the show was finished, I DID witness high speed slew of the data on the screen. Not really a fault of the system, but simply that they didn't cap the projector to keep the digital breakup "garbage" off the screen. The projectionist and engineers probably thought everyone had left the auditorium. I recall these theatres were using the PLUTO RAID arrays for this show.

Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 03-26-2001, 11:10 AM:

John, in an answer about the douser question.

Yes, our Christie console does have a manual douser.

I agree with everyone else. I don't believe that there is any way for the sound to get out of sync unless the sound/picture was running two different sources.

I thought all the DLP locations were playing the Jekyll and Hyde Broadway.

Also, Gladiator would have been too large to hold on the "typical" QuBit player today.

Mission to Mars was so large, that it only had one trailer, (Gone in 60 seconds) and the DLP Gold Timeline and DLP Logo. No Theatre Logo. Only left a few bytes free on the player.

Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 03-26-2001, 11:34 AM:

Paul:

Maintaining sound sync may not be a problem with the current setup, but it can be an issue in the future, even if the data files for picture and sound are stored on the same server. The SMPTE DC28 committees will need to deal with this issue, as any digital signal processing (DSP) for encryption or compression may involve the use of frame stores that act as a delay line, so the image signal path may be different than the sound signal path. I understand maintaining sync has been a real problem in implementing digital television, where a variety of signal sources with different delays must be accomodated.

Posted by Tom Wurz (Member # 42) on 03-28-2001, 06:16 PM:

This story is related in an article titled, DLP, A Delight in the Trenches, by Steven Romano. It's in the current issue of Big Reel, on page 69. Romano is a union projectionist working at the empire 25.
Tom