This is topic System to prevent camcorder piracy in digital projection in forum Digital Cinema Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 10-29-2002, 08:43 AM:
A US company has developed a prototype system, described here, to prevent people from recording a digitally projected picture using a camcorder.This story is a couple of weeks old, but I only came across a link to it via one which appeared today about CD piracy. Sooner or later the CCDs and auto-exposure software in camcorders will become clever enough to defeat this system, I would have thought.
Posted by Pat Moore (Member # 380) on 10-29-2002, 10:57 AM:
Security has always been a hot topic for Digital Cinema, of course, since that supposedly one of the great pluses. SMPTE's DC28 Technology Committee on Digital Cinema has an entire group working on security issues that include prevention as well as watermarking technologies.Pat
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 10-29-2002, 11:18 AM:
Kodak is an active participant on the SMPTE Digital Cinema DC28 working groups, and has some excellent technology:
here Kodak Digital Cinema
here Kodak Compression Technology
here Kodak Extended Range Imaging
here Kodak Invisible Watermarking
here Invisible Watermarking for Digital Cinema------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 10-30-2002, 12:32 AM:
I am sure this is going to sound very stupid but here goes...Couldnt they just put a shutter between the lamphouse and DLP? If we as humans cannot detect the 48 times a second that the light goes out with film why would we be able to with DLP? (Im sure there is a very good answer) I only worked with a DLP once so I dont really know it all that well.
Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 10-30-2002, 12:41 AM:
Adding a shutter would decrease the amount of light that reaches the screen and we would end up with RDLP (Really Dim Lifeless Pixels).Plus, digital video cameras are now capable of 24 frame recording. IIRC there are also some with variable framerates. So a shutter wouldn't prevent it. Just like it doesn't prevent it now (on film). Some pretty good looking recordings are possible, usually with a bad onscreen presentation.
Which leads to me believing that piracy happens the most in theatres that just don't care. If ushers can find people with cell phones, laser pens, etc. what makes it so hard to spot a camera?
Posted by Bill Enos (Member # 440) on 10-30-2002, 07:27 AM:
A friend bought a high end digital camcorder a while back. We set it up on a tripod at the back of the auditorium, set for the correct shutter speed and frame format and got a picture that was quite acceptable even on his 8 ft projection video screen. The set up took all of 2 minutes. Decent sound may be a little harder.
Posted by Ray Derrick (Member # 1001) on 10-30-2002, 07:39 AM:
Most modern cinemas have a hearing impaired sound system, so getting good quality sound should be a piece of cake (if you are one of those low scum of the underworld who find delight in stealing other people's hard work). If I thought of this in a just a few moments, it wouldn't take long for the crims to figure it out. I suggest we look more closely at the operation of hearing impaired systems.------------------
Ray Derrick
President/Chief Engineer
Panalogic Corporation Sydney, Australia
Phone: 61 (0)2 9894 6655 Fax: 61 (0)2 9894 6935
Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 10-30-2002, 02:19 PM:
AFAIK most hearing impared systems are mono... at least they won't be able to have 'PRO LOGIC' sound on their bootleg.
Posted by Ray Derrick (Member # 1001) on 10-30-2002, 07:49 PM:
True
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 10-30-2002, 11:54 PM:
Judging by the few dupes I've seen like this, quality is hardly an issue. Bad video? Bad sound? Doesn't matter. The pirates just think it's cool just to have something before it comes out or when it's popular in the theaters. Being unwatchable is only a minor inconvenienceThere are a lot of screener dubs made from tapes that the studios stupidly send out to reviewers, critics, etc. These are at least Blockbuster VHS quality. In my personal opinion, it is rather moronic of studios to send out tapes like that.
Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 10-31-2002, 12:32 PM:
But they use super advanced anti-piracy technology on the VHS tapes... a magnet beside the rewind spool. If only I had a screw-driver to remove the magnet to keep it from blanking the tape after the first time I watch it.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 10-31-2002, 03:41 PM:
And whatever you do, don't pirate it the first time the tape is viewed. That would be too hard.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 10-31-2002, 03:54 PM:
Back in the late 80's they had VHS cassettes that could be "dialed up" to only play back a certain number of times. I have a few of these sitting around and keep meaning to crack one open to see how it works, but the idea never flew anyway. I know these used security screws that could not be removed without a special tool (or a flat head precision screwdriver which apparently no one would ever try). Anyway, worst cast senario just bust the cassette open and load it into a new VHS shell. Big deal. The guys who come up with this stuff must think that pirates are really stupid. It's a good thing that most of us are honest enough no to do or allow bootlegging.BTW, there are plenty of ways a pure SR signal could be routed out of a processor for the original 2 channel mix to be preserved. It also wouldn't be hard to set the EQs flat and use a small mixer on the LCR outputs either to get a reasonably decent mix. Heck the old "Sound-A-Round" systems actually had post preamp/post NR RCA line level outputs!!! Anyway, sound would be far easier than getting a good picture, unless the bootlegger has one of those new 24P cameras. With those out, that's about it.