Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Color problems on Christie 2000SB

This is topic Color problems on Christie 2000SB in forum Digital Cinema Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Greg Wood (Member # 5762) on 07-03-2010, 04:41 PM:

Hi all--looking for some input on following lovely issue we are having:

Running a Christie 2000sb with Dolby server and RealD for 3d. Awhile back screen occasionally turned half blue...typical problem it seems and we replaced the EFIB board.

3 months later same issue with Toy Story and happening more often. Replace EFIB board again...after receiving a bad board...same problem. Replaced entire Light Engine a few days ago. Again, same problem.

Anyone else encountering this????? Losing faith in ability of Christie to figure it out???

[ 07-11-2010, 01:36 PM: Message edited by: Adam Martin ]

Posted by Brendan Penny (Member # 5041) on 07-03-2010, 07:01 PM:

Would think this problem is normally formatter but what is your 'dark time' set to out of curiosity? I think I recall if it exceeds 110 it can cause these problems.

Posted by Greg Wood (Member # 5762) on 07-03-2010, 08:46 PM:

Im told by our techs that dark time should not be the problem (and I think it is under 110--waiting to verify).

Screen turned yellow last show. Its a simple fix in power cycle projector but outside of an endless supply of EFIB boards really curious to see what Christie advises next

Posted by Brendan Penny (Member # 5041) on 07-03-2010, 09:14 PM:

Well in my experience replacing the engine is the way to go but considering you have already done this I don't know!

What are the odds you have two defective engines?

Posted by Greg Wood (Member # 5762) on 07-03-2010, 09:50 PM:

Yea seriously...Ive been involved with some other theaters that had this problem and engine fixed it for good. Somehow I seem to be the lucky one (not!).

Would be pretty impressive if Christie sent out a few bad boards AND a bad engine. Replaced color ribbons as well to no avail.

Interestingly enough it seems to only happen running 3d content.

Oh the joys of the digital age lol Looking forward to Christies next solution (unfortunately it will take til tue to find out)

Posted by Brendan Penny (Member # 5041) on 07-03-2010, 10:05 PM:

Ive been though the exact same thing. Swapping boards, servers. Problem only happens in 3D.

Swapped the engine and have not had a problem since. Its a 1.2" thing.

Posted by Greg Wood (Member # 5762) on 07-03-2010, 10:31 PM:

Thx Brendan...glad to know others have encountered the same...FRUSTRATING.

Looks like a tradeup to Series 2 is gonna have to happen...no way I feel like operating like this continuously

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-05-2010, 11:26 AM:

quote: Greg Wood
3 months later same issue with Toy Story and happening more often. Replace EFIB board again...after receiving a bad board...same problem. Replaced entire Light Engine a few days ago. Again, same problem.

No need to wait for a Series 2 projector, keep the one you have and get your $$$ back out of it... I went through this exact same thing about 6 months ago. Including the whole defective ffib board thing. In our case the problem was the light engine and replqacing it fixed the projector for good. We nailed the cause of the problem by swapping boards between two projectors. I suggest you replace the light engine. I agree with Brendan that the problem lies on one of the formatter boards for sure!! I don't know whats with Christie lately but I'm guessing they bit off more than they can chew...

Next time around look at the Series 2 NEC since they've made huge strides in the overall quality of their projectors. Overall, I've had LESS PROBLEMS with NEC than any other brand. And as a last resort then look at BARCO. As much as I like Christie projectors they just not equipped to properly deal with the digital onslaught! That is until they get their Chinese plant into operation.

Mark

Posted by Greg Wood (Member # 5762) on 07-05-2010, 01:24 PM:

Thx Mark. OK...since we did replace the light engine ill look at replacing formatting boards...crap weve replaced eveything else lol!

Agreed...I really am-was a big Christie fan but they clearly are in bit deep. I have a new theater coming out and was planning on new Christie (2230)and this all gives me pause. I do like the new NEC but was told we would get more light out of a christie (and with a screen of almost 70wide thats clearly important). Almost as frustrating as picking out a server (why the heck cant GDC have a better UI ie Dolby).

As much as I love digital...starting to miss the days of no 3d and 35mm

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-07-2010, 04:09 PM:

You can't switch out the formatters. You will have to switch out the whole engine again. Because the formatters are attached to the DMDs it all has to be factory assembled.

Next time just go with the larger NEC 3200 instead of the mid size Christie. It costs just a little more than the mid size Christie and would offer you even more flexibility. The big NECs are located in many prestigous screening rooms all over the world. I feel much the same way about Christie that you do.
Great stuff but I would ertainly give pause and alot of thought about ever using them again. I would even condider using BARCO before Christie again...

Mark

Posted by Brendan Penny (Member # 5041) on 07-07-2010, 07:23 PM:

You can switch out the formatters if you know what you are doing.

Can you please stop up-selling at every opportunity. O.k, we get it. You left Claco and now you sell NEC. If anyone wants an NEC go see Mark.

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
The big NECs are located in many prestigous screening rooms all over the world.

Gee an original claim... Funny how they all claim that huh. Name me 3..

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
Series 2 NEC since they've made huge strides in the overall quality of their projectors

One would hope they did.

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
give pause and alot of thought about ever using them again

Big deal. He had one projector with a problem. [bs]

happens. Anyone that has installed enough of these is bound to have come across a turkey by now.

You are starting to become like the film tech Avon lady with your hard sells.

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-07-2010, 08:33 PM:

Thank you for saving me the effort Brendan.

Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 07-07-2010, 08:47 PM:

Ding dong...

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-10-2010, 09:32 PM:

Brendan... Now you really have me laughing. I am much better off than when I was at CLACO because I can now sell all three brands of projectors. I am no longer stuck in the doldrums of having just one to sell.

Mark

Posted by Brendan Penny (Member # 5041) on 07-11-2010, 02:03 AM:

Well maybe you could offer all three projectors at list price but I would be very suprised if you can sell Christie or Barco at dealer price considering you pay their products out for no real reason. I seriously doubt they would support you.

You make me laugh because your ploy is so obvious.

Personally I don't have anything against any of the major three players (I'm sure you know my position on Kinoton and Cinemeccanica which is a whole other issue) but every 'groundbreaking' thing you have mentioned about NEC series 2 has been done already. So you are coming off like a bit of a retard in my eyes anyway. Oh my god, they have color! WOW! Oh my god they have a touch panel and its called..... Communicator! Oh my god, you can actually read the Diagnostics Package! I mean really, all this stuff is done already.

I don't think you have license to even comment on Barco since it's sounds like the last one you worked on was a DP100 which is unfair considering NEC didn't even have a projector when the DP100 came out.. Catch up.. I think they were still dicking around with 'Digital Projection corp' back then.

Now here is a riddle for you. Why is NEC the only series 2 projector that you can get hold of at the moment??

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 07-11-2010, 04:34 AM:

quote: Brendan Penny
Now here is a riddle for you. Why is NEC the only series 2 projector that you can get hold of at the moment??

Ermm!! Less known brand?
Is it a rhetorical question or do I win anything? [Big Grin]

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 07-11-2010, 01:28 PM:

In Marks defense, I think;

He is not a salesman, he just happens to change his mind rather abruptly, don't read too much into it.

He probably fell in love rather quickly as a young man, but only guessing here.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 07-11-2010, 04:34 PM:

I dunno...while he changes his mind with the wind...his "its great/its crap" style statements tend to be of a promoting, if not selling type nature.

Having written so much about "Wrong" and now they are Strong again....if you are going to play, play...but this is a change of affiliation without any real change in substance.

I think Brendan was spot on. In fact, I think it was a bit understated.

Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-11-2010, 09:50 PM:

Did Regal cancel or delay some orders with NEC? [Wink]

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 07-12-2010, 12:52 AM:

Odeon Europe is putting Nec projectors from what I know and what is published in Cinema Technology Vol 23 No2 June 2010 issue so....

Posted by Brendan Penny (Member # 5041) on 07-13-2010, 03:25 AM:

Well just to clarify I am not paying out on NEC at all. I am sure 'series 2' is probably a good range for NEC.

I am only paying out on Mark for dissing everything he doesn't sell, use or understand.

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 07-14-2010, 11:17 AM:

Mark might be a bit over the top with boosting the Nec Series 2 Projectors but I doubt he deserves anyone attacking as the forum rules say with no offence to anyone.
Demetris

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-20-2010, 09:27 AM:

quote: Brendan Penny
I am only paying out on Mark for dissing everything he doesn't sell, use or understand.

Brendan... I have used just about everything there is out there multiple times on multiple jobs. But in your defense how would you have known that?

Sam, Actually... I was 26... Not too young or too old...

Now to Strong's defense. A Strong Tech (one who is on this site in fact) showed up at one of the NEC locations I installed out in the middle of no where the other day to install an upgraded board. I thought that to be quite exceptional. Now in my 30+ years in this biz I have never had any other manufacturer EXCEPT DOLBY do this way back when there were DA-20 power supply issues. I believe that says alot about how Strong and NEC value it's customers and it's dealer base.

Mark

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-20-2010, 02:39 PM:

Oh please Mark, Christie and QSC both do that as well. Give it a rest or take a break from the forums for awhile. Within 6 months you will be condemning NEC and going crazy over Sony or some other manufacturer anyway with as frequent as you change your mind.

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 07-20-2010, 03:25 PM:

Brad sometimes you can be really rude.I don't think anyone deserves that attitude. If you don't like peoples opinions then there is no reason of having these forums. I am not an advocate but this is too much.
Demetris

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 07-20-2010, 06:57 PM:

Demetris,

Mark is a special case. We all know him for years and he does have a tendency to change his mind a lot, but never because of any advice. Has to do it on his own so we tend to hammer him when he gets out there.

I've had field visits from QSC, Christie, Barco, etc., so don't see anything unusual about NEC showing up at a site.

Posted by Brendan Penny (Member # 5041) on 07-20-2010, 09:46 PM:

Exactly. If you are going to post bs statements you better be prepared to either back it up or admit you were wrong.

What's rude about asking for some actual substance to support comments?

Normally I wouldn't even bother but the fact he has now resorted to upselling on unrelated posts is going too far. What does 'color problems on a christie' have to do with how good NEC is??

Demetris, Mark can post what he wants, as can anyone. There is no censorship here. But if you post shit well.... You gotta expect it don't you? [Roll Eyes]

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-21-2010, 03:12 AM:

Demetris, I am sorry if you feel my direct and blunt comment is too much for your precious eyes to read, but Mark is a big boy as are the rest of the people here. Make no mistake, Mark is a good tech...its just that for some reason his opinion changes wildly and to extremes, often over the course of a matter of months. It is that radical and frequent change in opinion that we are teasing him over as well as his recent over-the-top sales pitches for the one company that can't seem to move their projectors while their competition (Barco and Christie) are 9 months backlogged with orders. Just do the math sweetie. [Wink]

quote: Demetris Thoupis
Mark might be a bit over the top with boosting the Nec Series 2 Projectors but I doubt he deserves anyone attacking as the forum rules say with no offence to anyone.

Hmmmm, and yet you violated rule #2 yourself in your follow up post. Go figure.

This thread has turned into nothing but drama. I don't want to shut it down because it appears Greg hasn't found his answer, but lets drop the drama aspects with future posts to this thread please.

Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 07-21-2010, 10:34 AM:

I am not a Nec supporter but the reason for all the backorders of Christie and Barco come mainly from their wide dealer area. First of all Christie had a HUGE establishment with the 35mm in the US and they were from the first who pushed into the Digital realm even before D-Cinema started to take on. That gave them a leading advantage. Barco partnered wisely with the two biggest 35mm manufacturers in Europe to offer an OEM and also distribute the Barco D-Cinema solutions. And also I do support that the OEM partners yield better results than the actual Barco line and also have pioneered into modifications that Barco actually included in their Series 2 projectors. Let me tell you that I know that most of the deals in the European area for Barco utilising the smaller projectors are not handled directly by the Barco division but by the other two manufacturers. Nec on the other hand is the only company who had no connection to anyone in the film cinema industry, Strong excluded. Strong had no other choice than to partner with NEC since all the others were taken, and already Strong was having a smaller sales pitch of their 35mm. Now you do the math and see why NEC is not up to the sales the other companies are. I am not a Nec supporter nor have I sold any but they do deserve at least some amount of credit. Besides technicians wining about slow software e.t.c, clients cannot see the difference. And also, forum members who have Nec installed do not mention great problems. Christie though with the huge production line is bound to have a lot of DOA as well as a lot of unforseen issues. Even you Brad posted somewhere that you had an issue of the blue half screen with Christie and the only solution is just to restart the projector and God knows how many other problems there are with all these Digital stuff.
Demetris

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-21-2010, 12:48 PM:

I have never had a problem with a blue half screen. You are confusing that with someone else. Regardless as I said (and won't again, this is the final warning) the rest of this thread is for assisting Greg with his specific issue.