Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Distorted picture on Christie Projector

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Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-09-2012, 12:11 PM:

Playing Blu-Ray on Christie CP-2230 cinema projector.
Picture comes out distorted.

Looks like "speed lines" you might see in the comics.
Any time there is a light/dark transition, such as around text, these little speed lines appear.

Setup:
* Sony BDP-S590 Blu-Ray --> HDMI output.
* Gefen Cinema Scaler Pro II --> DVI-D output.
* BlackBox 1X2 DVI Splitter --> DVI-D 1) To flat screen monitor. 2) To Christie Projector
* Christie CP-2230 Projector.

Problem DOES NOT appear on the flat screen monitor (i.e. output #2 of BlackBox.)
ONLY appears on auditorium screen (Christie projector.)

Problem DOES NOT appear when playing DCP via Dolby server. ONLY happens when playing Blu-Ray or other auxiliary material via the DVI-D.

Internal test patterns of Christie projector come out clean.

Troubleshooting steps taken:
1) Reboot Gefen.
2) Power cycle BlackBox.
3) Power cycle projector.
4) Bypass Gefen, directly to BlackBox, using a HDMI>DVI cable.
5) Swap monitor and projector cables at Black Box splitter.
6) Replace DVI-D cable from BlackBox to projector.
7) Toggle input of projector to DCP server to DVI and back a couple of times.
8) Toggle "auto adjust" (service menu of projector) a couple of times.

Negative results on all attempts.

Anybody have any ideas?

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 10-09-2012, 01:22 PM:

Did it ever work?

When I have seen this before, the issue was a bad DVI or HDMI cable.

Does it work if you go directly from the HDMI output of the player to the DVI input of the projector? Are you exceeding the length limit for HDMI/DVI?

What is the channel configuration on the projector?

Posted by Tony Bandiera Jr (Member # 2365) on 10-09-2012, 01:44 PM:

Randy, I saw one thing in your tests that stood out: in all of them the only thing you didn't bypass was the "Black Box" splitter. Think about that for a minute. [thumbsup]

As Scott suggested, go directly from the Blu ray to the projector. Image clean? Ok, put the gefen back in the line. Image clear? Ok, shitcan the black box. [Smile]

If you get the Kramer we talked about in the other thread, a really cool feature is it outputs BOTH HDMI and VGA at the same time. No need for external splitter.

One other tip..make sure your Gefen, External monitor and players are getting clean power from a properly grounded receptacle. If your CP2230 has its electronics powered by a UPS then you should be powering all your sources from that UPS or at least the same receptacle the UPS is connected to.

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-09-2012, 01:48 PM:

It has worked in the past.

The DVI cable isn't super long.
The one I substituted in is 25 ft. The installed cable goes out of the rack, over the ceiling and down into the projector. Can't imagine that the installed cable is much longer.

My rationale:
1) Bypassing the Gefen, from the Blu-Ray directly to the BlackBox splitter eliminates the Gefen and its associated cables.

2) Swapping the cables on the BlackBox eliminates the BlackBox and any cables inputting signal to it. Otherwise, the problem would have moved from the live screen to the preview monitor. Swapping these cables makes no change.

3) Substituting a DVI-D cable from the BlackBox to the projector eliminates the installed cable.

4) Toggling the "auto format" setting on the projector SHOULD have made it select the correct resolution, interlacing and format by itself. Right?

I don't remember every exact setting of the projector itself. I'll have to go through the menus and check. I'm not super familiar with the menus and settings on this projector. We've only had it for a couple of months and I haven't had much call to do anything more than operate it normally.

Can somebody walk me through what the menus and settings should be?

I can't fuss with the machine right now because there is a show running. (The Dolby DSS-200 / DCP system works correctly.) I'll have to work on this, incrementally, between shows.

Next show, on the in-between, I'll substitute the DVI cable directly from the Gefen to the DVI-D input of the projector to positively eliminate the BlackBox from the list of candidates.
(I don't think my HDMI>DVI-D cable is long enough to reach but, if it is, I'll try that, too.)

Didn't think of the grounding/UPS issue.
I don't think all equipment is supplied from the same source.
Does the auxiliary equipment need to be simply on the same ground or does it need to be all supplied from the same SOURCE. (i.e. Off the UPS?)

The UPS is in the base of the projector/server. The auxiliary equipment is in the rack. I suppose everything could be made to be on the same circuit or ground but I don't think they would be able to be powered off the USP in the projector base, 5 or 6 feet across the room.

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-09-2012, 03:56 PM:

UPDATE: Connecting Blu-Ray player directly to projector via HDMI>DVI-D cable does NOT solve the problem.

I guess this means that:

1) There is a problem with the projector's settings.

> OR <

2) There is a problem with the power supply/ground between the projector and the outboard equipment.

> OR <

3) There is a fault in the projector.

Correct? [Shrug]

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 10-09-2012, 04:47 PM:

25feet IS quite something, and minor changes can turn a working connection over this cable into a nightmare. Try a shorter direct cable first, then swap the player or try a laptop/set-top box with 1080 output.

- Carsten

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-09-2012, 05:38 PM:

The HDMI-DVI cable that I just used to do the last test, connecting the Blu-Ray directly to the projector, was only arm's length.

The distortion ("speed lines") were still present.

Posted by David Buckley (Member # 2600) on 10-09-2012, 07:26 PM:

I've seen this exact thing happen, it was during the Hoyts suckfest period I whined about on the You Suck Pt II thread, when they were showing stuff sourced from disk.

What it looked like to me (as an audience member) was really bad scaling, which I assumed (yeah, I know) was taking place within the projector.

My belief it was scaling was because the vertical line width in identical letters in title text was not consistent.

Perhaps the Geffen output isn't configured for the right res for the Christie?

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-09-2012, 08:19 PM:

The Geffen is out of the picture.

The Blu-Ray was connected directly to the projector with no intervening equipment. The HDMI/DVI-D cable went directly from player to projector with same results.

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 10-09-2012, 08:33 PM:

I'm assuming that the projector is configured correctly, since it worked before, but, for reference, here are the settings that worked for me on a new-ish Christie:

config 1

input: DVI-B (may vary by machine)
data format: RGB 4:4:4 8-bits
source file: auto square pixels
screen file: flat
lamp file: default
ILS file: (as needed...I made "br178" and "br235")

config 2

measured color: onsite
target color: rec 709
color space: Unity RGB
gamma: NTSC_Enhanced
LUT-CLUT: Linear 9x9x9
"auto scan type detection" checked

3d

"enable 3d" unchecked

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-09-2012, 09:11 PM:

By memory, your settings are similar to mine.

I am using DVI port A.
Screen is flat.
Lamp is default.
Measured color is "onsite."
3D is off. (We do not have a 3D module installed.)

"Auto Scan Type" was toggled on and off a couple of times. It is normally left off.

The reason for this is because the tech from Christie who came to do the setup and alignment said so. The reason for this is because, if it is left on, the image can flicker when switching into that input/format. Since the signal from the Blu-Ray should not change, auto scan detection is not needed.

However, should there be a glitch in the picture, toggling into then out of automatic mode will solve the problem.

I don't know if I agree with that logic but I'll be a good boy and do what I was told.

Regardless, I did as I was told and toggled that setting but it did not help.

The other settings, I'll have to go check because I do not remember them all. I will return to work on Thursday and I will check them at that time.

BTW: This is not Mercyhurst. This is the TREC Center.
I'm having a hard time to get Mercyhurst to spring for a $900 switcher. How in the world could I get them to drop the dough to buy a DCP system? [Wink]

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 10-09-2012, 09:35 PM:

The output of the BR player _will_ change if you turn off the 3:2 pulldown option that most players have turned on by default.

In any case, it sounds as if you might need to try the other DVI input and/or a different player at this point. Also--and you probably already tried this--it might be worth doing a full power-cycle on the projector (at the electrical panel...not just the "soft" power on the touch panel controller). This often seems to "fix" issues with these machines.

Posted by Alan Gouger (Member # 543) on 10-09-2012, 10:23 PM:

Is your Blu-Ray player set to output interlace ( 1080i ) or progressive ( 1080P )
Try switching it to the opposite and see if that works. Your input on the projector could be set to the wrong setting. Also try a different frame rate if outputting a progressive signal 1080p 24 verses 1080p 60.

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 10-11-2012, 02:17 PM:

Just got to work at TREC, just a half hour ago.

We powered down the whole system from the breakers, shut down the UPS and cold booted everything from the beginning.

The problem has gone away and everything seems to be working all right.

Will keep an eye out for more problems but, at this point, we think we have it solved.

Thanks for all your advice! [thumbsup]