Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Ceiling speakers and 7.1 sound

This is topic Ceiling speakers and 7.1 sound in forum Digital Cinema Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Richard May (Member # 2627) on 11-11-2014, 11:40 AM:

Any recommendations on speakers to use for the ceiling? Also, would the ceiling speakers be split to be used on all 4 surround channels?

Posted by Lyle Romer (Member # 1266) on 11-11-2014, 12:27 PM:

Unless you are installing Atmos or Auro or some kind of undefined 9.1 configuration, there shouldn't be ceiling speakers. They should certainly not be used to playback the normal surround channels of a 5.1 or 7.1 setup.

Posted by Richard May (Member # 2627) on 11-11-2014, 12:35 PM:

I agree but they want them.

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 11-11-2014, 12:48 PM:

Who, and for what purpose? Is this a commercial business driven cinema, a private screening room, or what?

- Carsten

Posted by Richard May (Member # 2627) on 11-11-2014, 01:06 PM:

It's a commercial theater. They just want more surrounds basically. The theaters are tiny. 19' wide by 50' long.

Posted by Marco Giustini (Member # 4544) on 11-11-2014, 01:33 PM:

"more"? Are you saying they already have proper surrounds and they want to "upgrade"?

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 11-11-2014, 01:35 PM:

Well then, source them, build them in, connect them. Then tell them to wait for 9.1 DCPs to show up before they can use them.

- Carsten

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-11-2014, 01:36 PM:

Install speakers on the ceiling, just don't hook them up. Turn the volume on the regular surrounds up slightly. Listen to people marvel at how much 'better' it sounds.

Posted by Richard May (Member # 2627) on 11-11-2014, 01:41 PM:

The theater is renovating. The surrounds were never placed correctly. I understand that they do not need ceiling surrounds for 7.1 but they want them. Even though it's a waste of money, would you hook them up with all 4 surround channels or just left and right surrounds?

Posted by Frank Cox (Member # 6258) on 11-11-2014, 01:44 PM:

Several years ago I had a guy tell me about the time that he installed surround speakers in his auditorium. He hung the speakers on the wall and ran the wires himself. In the week or two after that while he was waiting for the tech to arrive to install the booth equipment and hook them up, he had many compliments on how much better the sound in his theatre was.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-11-2014, 02:31 PM:

quote: Richard May
would you hook them up with all 4 surround channels or just left and right surrounds?

In all seriousness...I would mount those ceiling speakers fairly close to the sides, and hook them up to just the left/right surrounds. If you hook them up to all four channels you would just diminish the directionality of the sound. Maybe you could put a couple more speakers on the back channels to beef that up a bit....?

I wonder if the owner here is thinking he'll need to upgrade to Atmos someday and is planning for that?

I can't imagine watching a movie in a 19x50 auditorium. Are the screens wall-to-wall I hope?

Posted by Richard May (Member # 2627) on 11-11-2014, 02:48 PM:

Thanks Mike. The screens are wall to wall. I don't think Dolby Atmos would work here for many reasons. One being that they are going to mount the side surrounds in the wall and I think it would be harder to position them correctly. Keeping the ceiling surrounds on the side channels only sounds like a good idea. Since they will be mounting them in the ceiling, I will have to look for some kind of in ceiling speakers.

Posted by Marco Giustini (Member # 4544) on 11-11-2014, 04:31 PM:

quote: Richard May
I understand that they do not need ceiling surrounds for 7.1 but they want them

This escapes me.
Did you tell them that installing ceiling surrounds is not going to improve the existing result and that replacing the existing surrounds with real surround speakers is the way to go?
I appreciate they want to spend money, but can't they spend money on something they actually need?

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 11-11-2014, 05:33 PM:

We cannot judge your actual situation. Sometimes, people demand stupid things, but it's not like you ALWAYS have to give into those stupid demands.

Surround mixes are created with a specific layout in mind. Surround sound in a 5.1, 6.1 or 7.1 mix is NOT supposed to come from the ceiling. If they want to invest now in speakers they might be able to use in the future (Dolby Atmos, Auro 3D or whatever comes next), then good for them. Make sure the layout actually conforms to at least one of those formats.

Hooking them up right now to any of the 4 surround channels is just a stupid idea, you're potentially screwing up the sound mixes of many many movies.

Furthermore, I fully agree with Marco. If they want to spend money, let them spend it on something that actually improves stuff. If they're out of ideas, be a bit creative [Wink]

Posted by Frank Cox (Member # 6258) on 11-11-2014, 05:45 PM:

quote: Mike Blakesley
I can't imagine watching a movie in a 19x50 auditorium.

My auditorium isn't much different than that; it's 25x60.

I think it works pretty well, though.