Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: AMC Metreon SF Dolby Cinema Problem

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Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 03-22-2017, 11:13 PM:

Went today for the first time to our first Dolby Cinema set up at the AMC Metreon in San Francisco to watch the 2-D movie Logan. I knew something was wrong when my friends and I entered the nice size remodeled auditorium as the sound was on for the pre show but no picture on the giant scope curved screen. Went to hunt someone down as everyone else just sat there. Found someone and they went into the booth and after 5 minutes turned on one projector in a mirror two projector set up. Just after they left the other projector came on with the same information that played a few minutes on projector 1. So now we have two separate images showing and this was not 3-D. I had to go out again and get someone to come back. After 4 minutes they got both projectors going with the same image in snyc just in time for the main feature. Great base and a clear picture plus kick ass base sound even in the seats. I hope next time I see a movie here the Dolby Cinema will be working from the start. The day manager did give me some re enter tickets. The old Loews/Sony former candy counter lobby is being torn out. All the big fun things will be gone soon. The big giant hot dogs/drink cups and popcorn images will be history.

Posted by Brian Woods (Member # 3521) on 04-05-2017, 11:25 AM:

Here at AMC, we would like to apologize for the life alternating event that you experienced. We do apologize that you had to tell us that the picture was not on. We however did resolve it, and gave you readmit passes for the problem. We also see that it was such a life changing event, you shared your experience with the world. With that, we thank you....Please feel free to let us know when you have any other issues that are life changing and will need to be posted on social media. -AMC

Posted by Leslie Hartmier (Member # 7053) on 04-05-2017, 03:01 PM:

Hmm, let's see...

- Mentioned going to a location.
- Found that stuff was wrong for indeterminate amount of time. (To be fair, might have only been 30 seconds)
- After what generally would be a somewhat long time, someone made it work, but didn't check to make sure it was all working right.
- Had to go out to inform the operators of the location that it was not working correctly (might have been beneficial to have a followup auditorium check without customers alerting staff), and it barely got fixed in time for the paid-for feature.
-Compliments the quality of the audio and video.
-Makes a gentle comment that they hope that there will be a flawless presentation when next they patronize the location (not if, even. When.)
- Expresses wistfulness/marginal regret about a change occurring in the location.

Yes indeed, you were right to call out this individual for them tearing mercilessly into the location's innocent staff for the decreased experience quality.

Seriously though, other than providing foodstuffs to excrete later, all we truly have to offer is (hopefully) an outstanding *experience*. Anything that detracts from that is counter-intuitive to what we are trying to accomplish, and I assure you, that matters greatly to the bottom line.

Should we shame people/locations for having presentation issues? Of course not, unless it is a regular thing.

However, when a location makes a mistake, or has a problem, it should NOT be swept under the rug. Instead, posting it in what amounts to an insider forum is beneficial for many, so that they can see what didn't work, perhaps how to fix it, and even a description from someone acting as a patron, so they might see it from the other side.

I confess, I might be a bit embarrassed to have it brought into the light if it were my location, but if all the policies in place worked, there wouldn't be that post, as gentle and in the end, complimentary as it was.

I don't know that the snark was necessary. It rather causes you to come across as petty.

Leslie

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 04-05-2017, 03:19 PM:

Since when did it become the customer's responsibility to make sure the shows run correctly? It is a complete failure of the cinema if a customer has to inform the cinema of an issue. They paid money before entering to be served, not to be a volunteer employee.

If you don't want public postings, don't have problems and if you fix them, fix them properly.

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 04-05-2017, 04:06 PM:

All good points here but who is Brian Woods? Maybe not even an AMC employee judging from the wording.

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 04-05-2017, 04:07 PM:

Wow, is that an actual AMC statement? I can't believe AMC is letting one of their employees out into the wild to drop his (and their) pants. Is their training really that bad?

Now, will we see another, 'higher', AMC suit trying to remediate?

- Carsten

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 04-05-2017, 04:07 PM:

I think he was just interjecting a bit of sarcasm...

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-05-2017, 05:11 PM:

Is that you, Wang Jianlin?

Seriously, if this was sarcastic, it was entirely misplaced and if this is real, it's just lame and pitiful. Why not just take it like a man and apologize for the mistake that happened? It's not like we've never been part of a screwed up show in one way or another.

Posted by Buck Wilson (Member # 5885) on 04-05-2017, 06:24 PM:

Well this certainly is an interesting thread.

Brian, as has been mentioned, it is not the customers job to have to inform staff that something is amiss.

On the original topic, I, too, have seen more than a handful of issues getting the preshow seamless with the trailers/feature in AMC Dolby Cinema auditoriums. I'm not sure if it's because the technology in them is seemingly ever changing and they just can't keep up on getting everything smooth or what. I've seen late starts(5+ minutes), "active desktop recovery" shown on screen, choppy image transitions, etc.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 04-05-2017, 11:48 PM:

I'd be amazed if Brian was an AMC employee. AMC carefully controls their public statements and would never have a mere employee or manager make such a public post and would likely not only admonish said employee would quite probably terminate them.

I think everyone gets the point that "things happen" to everyone but what is missed by his statement is that it should NEVER be the customer's responsibility to be the informant. Furthermore, there was multiple screwups in the described event so it wasn't corrected the first time and again, the staff was the last to know, not the first.

Posted by Brian Woods (Member # 3521) on 04-05-2017, 11:49 PM:

It was sarcasm. I don't work for AMC. You are correct, managers should have caught it and double checked to make sure it was fixed. My only thing I might have done different is use that pass and come back and see if they corrected their issues. If they haven't, then I would say it's worth posting about your issues you experienced with them. I'm sure everyone has a 100% day every day? We all screw up... and hopefully we can apologize and not repeat the issue again. I say go back and see how your experience is the second time around. I am now interested in knowing how it goes. Did it go well, or did the same thing happen again? Other issues? Again it was sarcasm, and no one had posted on the thread, and was I interested in other people's thoughts.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 04-05-2017, 11:56 PM:

The thing is, automation is no excuse for a bad show. If AMC or anyone else chooses to reduce labor and use automation, there is the risk of reduced performance. Then again, odds are, with automation, there is an improvement in consistency. Automation is very good at repetitive tasks. The trick is in finding the balance such that customers always receive the best of people and automation.

However, just because everybody does it is no excuse for doing a poor job.

Our industry faces an ever increasing challenge to define itself from home presentations and other forms of entertainment outside of the home. Poor experiences really take a hit into that. The industry needs to do better than give away a distributor's product (free passes) for continual screw ups. I never understood why readmits should be free to the exhibitor. The distributor should collect on every show, regardless of what form of ticket was used to enter. If you give out a lot of readmits, it should cost you the exhibitor. It wasn't the distributor's fault that your equipment/people failed.

[edit] I see that Brian deleted the text of his post right above mine. I didn't see anything wrong with his post, it was just a clarification of his thoughts without the sarcasm. Unfortunately, for him, the internet never forgets and there is a copy of that text.

[edit again] I see Brian has merely altered his text from before. I guess everyone is entitled to a rewrite.

Posted by Brian Woods (Member # 3521) on 04-06-2017, 12:15 AM:

I agree with you. After typing it out, it wasn't the real point I was aiming for. I think I was aiming for we all have made mistakes, had issues, and not been 100%. I would have gave them another chance to see if they corrected their issues with the pass they gave me. If not, then I would maybe made some comments.

Posted by Frank Cox (Member # 6258) on 04-06-2017, 02:14 AM:

I walk into my auditorium and stand at the back for (at least) a minute or two after starting a show. That way I know what's going on on the screen AND in the audience. (One night I actually discovered a guy standing in the aisle beside his buddies and waving a beer around in the air.)

I guess nobody else does that, either. I'm really starting to think that I'm the last guy left in the world who actually cares what happens in his theatre. Sigh....

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 04-06-2017, 06:04 AM:

Brian - this is a Dolby Cinema, not your round the corner Mom & Pop location.
They charge a premium. They have to deliver a premium experience. No excuses.

- Carsten

Posted by Brian Woods (Member # 3521) on 04-06-2017, 07:18 AM:

I agree with you too Carsten. But you've never had an equipment malfunction? I wonder if every show after that day went fine? I'm saying sometimes we are too quick to jump and point out a problem. I'm sure AMC and Dolby will be fine after this review. What's even more interesting how quickly everyone jumped on my post, but nothing about the origin post at all. So, put down your pitch forks and torches... I agree with most of you... well not some of you.. well, just maybe a few.... take a breath... and hopefully you all have a glitch free day.

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 04-06-2017, 09:45 AM:

There shouldn't be anything wrong with the gear in these new "Dolby Cinema @ AMC" installations. The dual Christie 6P laser projectors are new. In most cases the Atmos-equipped sound systems are new (unless it's a former Prime/ETX house with Atmos). All this stuff should still be under warranty have a good service plan. In this theater's case, Dolby's HQ is nearby. There should be no operational problems with this new, premium ticket price auditorium.

I'm willing to forgive some minor glitches in the presentation of a movie. The slack I'm willing to extend decreases rapidly as that ticket price rises. Any theater charging a premium to customers for their version of IMAX, Dolby Cinema or home-cooked fake large format process has to be on top of their game. They need to be checking the status of their sound/projection systems during down time and they need to be noticing glitches during presentations quickly. If they're going to be charging that much more per ticket they need to have booth staff periodically checking the show. This isn't one of those "press a button and forget it" situations.

Due to how modern stadium seated theaters are designed it is a royal pain in the ass to leave one's seat to go alert staff way out in the lobby something is wrong with the show. You have to carefully step over other people's legs, hand bags and other stuff to get to the aisle. Then you have to step down the stadium riser til you're nearly at the base of the theater screen and then walk another auditorium length to get to the room's entrance/exit. Then it's a fast walk or jog way out to the lobby where, if you're lucky, a manager or assistant manager will be present. Usually you have to tell a counter staffer the issue. There's no telling how long it will take for them to alert the manager about the issue. Some have walkie-talkies or phones to alert the booth or manager's office. Others have to pass the word by foot. By the time you get back to your seat you have missed several minutes of the show.

If I have to leave my seat to alert staff about a problem I'm going to have to fight hard to suppress any vibe to theater staff that I'm irritated as hell.

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 04-06-2017, 11:02 AM:

quote: Brian Woods
I agree with you too Carsten. But you've never had an equipment malfunction?

If I'd charge as much for admittance as AMC does for their Dolby Cinema showings, I'd wouldn't let it happen that a show starts without an image on screen. Sorry, not with that profile.
If we have no picture or no sound, we notice it 15min before we even let someone enter the auditorium. And after the show starts, someone looks into the auditorium to check wether there is still picture and sound. Is that a luxury? No, because we sell tickets for movie showings, so making picture and sound 'available' to paying patrons is our core business. Imagine running a dinner, and after you served a customer he comes back and complains 'The plate you brought to my table 5min ago and cashed for is empty'.

They do not only betray their patrons, they also betray their advertising partners.
They boast superlatives like no one else. They have to deliver. And the very least they have to accept is that people make their failure to do so public.

- Carsten

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-06-2017, 03:20 PM:

quote: Brian Woods
I agree with you too Carsten. But you've never had an equipment malfunction? I wonder if every show after that day went fine? I'm saying sometimes we are too quick to jump and point out a problem. I'm sure AMC and Dolby will be fine after this review. What's even more interesting how quickly everyone jumped on my post, but nothing about the origin post at all. So, put down your pitch forks and torches... I agree with most of you... well not some of you.. well, just maybe a few.... take a breath... and hopefully you all have a glitch free day.

The reason why people jumped on your post is pretty obvious, isn't it?

Although the sarcasm in your post might have been somewhat obvious, it was also partially misleading. You also claimed Terry posted it on "social media". While I don't know what he posted on actual social media, this here isn't particularly Facebook, it's a specialist forum where people happen to discuss such things.

Then, like Carsten already put it. It's Dolby Cinema, it is advertized by both AMC and Dolby as the absolute Gold Standard in cinema. A technical glitch can still happen, but the mere fact that it went completely unnoticed and the customer had to go out and find someone to get it noticed is pretty unacceptable for such a premium product.

I recently attended a 2D Dolby Cinema screening, where they handed me Dolby 3D glasses at the entrance. The people that went in before me ended up with useless 3D glasses. I was pretty perplexed and I asked the guy if he knew it was a 2D screening. According to him, Dolby Cinema always used 3D glasses. I heard him ask some one else: Hey, can you tell me how this Dolby Cinema thing actually works. The show itself went fine though. Yeah, it might be a low paying job, but I consider this lack of interest in your job insulting, especially since you sold me this as a premium product at premium prices.

If this lack of care is the new gold standard, do we wonder why people choose to stay at home instead?

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 04-06-2017, 03:52 PM:

quote: Carsten Kurz
Brian - this is a Dolby Cinema, not your round the corner Mom & Pop location.
They charge a premium. They have to deliver a premium experience. No excuses.

- Carsten

You must be new to going to AMC Cinemas!

Posted by Brian Woods (Member # 3521) on 04-06-2017, 04:44 PM:

Why won't you people let me agree with you? I agree with you, I agree with you...you're worse than my ex wife....I actually liked the review if that's what it is. The subject title leads me to think it's a complaint of a problem, not a review. Everyone has the right to complain. I'm doing it right now... I think...Also, anything you can post to is social media, so it's not misleading. Can we be social? Technical glitches come and go... sometimes they can be headed off. I agree that they should have caught that there was no picture on the screen. I also agree that they should have double checked their fix. They seemly tried to remedy their mistake by apologizing and offering passes to come back. I am not sure what more could have been done at that moment besides calling them a witch and burning them at the stake....I agree with everything everyone is saying... Everything should be 100% every time. If something does happen, did the management remedy the problem? Yes, No, Yes....but, I don't state something is a problem that happens one time with remedy. If it happens two times, then yes, there is a problem.... hence my second marriage...

Posted by Rick Raskin (Member # 1561) on 04-06-2017, 05:26 PM:

You need a thick skin to post on this forum. Seriously trough, I did see the humor in your sarcasm, but the key point here is that it is the theater's responsibility to endure the customer is getting the best experience possible and their experience of going to a theater is something special. Set it and forget it should never be permitted. Elsewise we are headed for extinction as described in another thread on this site.

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-06-2017, 06:01 PM:

Maybe we can help you fix your first marriage in retrospect for you. Sorry, I was being sarcastic. [Razz]

quote: Brian Woods
Why won't you people let me agree with you? I agree with you, I agree with you...you're worse than my ex wife....

quote: Brian Woods
I agree with you too Carsten. But you've never had an equipment malfunction? I wonder if every show after that day went fine? I'm saying sometimes we are too quick to jump and point out a problem.

So, do you agree with Carsten or not? Yes! But no... That's how at least I interpret this post.

quote: Brian Woods
I actually liked the review if that's what it is. The subject title leads me to think it's a complaint of a problem, not a review.

Maybe it was a review AND a compliant? I'm pretty sure the original poster wasn't expecting AMC PR to respond though.

quote: Brian Woods
Everyone has the right to complain. I'm doing it right now... I think...

You do have many other rights too, like the one so popular in movies and TV series: The right to remain silent.

(Sorry, don't take it personal. I have the right to be sarcastic, haven't I? [Razz]

)

quote: Brian Woods
Also, anything you can post to is social media, so it's not misleading. Can we be social?

The misleading part is that you wrote it as if you're an AMC employee, not the social media part. Also, an AMC employee being present on this forum wouldn't be entirely unimaginable.

Posted by Brian Woods (Member # 3521) on 04-06-2017, 06:15 PM:

You have the right to be whatever you want pumpkin.. have we made it to 3 topic pages yet? #goals

Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 04-06-2017, 10:26 PM:

Thanks guys for your notes about by problem at AMC in SF. What I forgot to put into my first note besides all the problems during the pre show ads with the start and stop 2 or 3 times they are still remodeling the cinemas and during the non heavy bass sound from their speakers all our group heard loud banging and hammering going on from all the new way to large recliner seats they have been putting in during the day when half of the theatres are still open and showing movies. At least they need to have a sign at the one person out of 5 station boxoffice that work is being done and we are sorry for the noise or do this work late at night when the cinema is closed to customers. Yes when they have a new film in Dolby Cinema I will try the place again as the screen is worth the price of admission as It is the best curved screen in SF and sound to match. I just hope they get things correct so I don't have to go out to look for help again.

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-07-2017, 03:39 PM:

If you're doing remodeling work with impact on your operation, you should at least inform your customers. I would also expect at least a discount to compensate for those kind of disruptions.

Posted by Brian Woods (Member # 3521) on 04-08-2017, 11:36 AM:

I agree with Marcel...(If he will let me) on the construction. If you heard banging and hammering, I would suggest contacting their customer service through their website. Hopefully they would reply back and possibly compensate you for your experience. The work should be done overnight or stop once movies are starting. Sounds like this visit wasn't good. To address the issue of pretending to be an AMC Customer Service Rep.... I am sure some companies out there look at this site from time to time. I thought I wrote in a satirical way that no one would think it would be a real rep saying those things. "Life Changing Event...." that should have been a clue... but I guess some people have a sense of humor, some don't. No one commented on the original post for a whole week. I guess it wasn't worth replying to until something else was added to the post that brought out the pitch forks and torches? We all want every visit from customer to exhibitor to be 100%. It's the only way we get people to come back. If something is not 100%, we do need to make it up to the customer. To say you have never had a problem with equipment, that you never had to apologize to a customer for a projection issue, seems hard to believe. If I brought up a Yelp review for the theaters that you're over or work at, would they all be 5 stars? Presentation and Customer Service are the two key factors here. Seems that they need work on both. If there is a problem, and the customer service addressed it, and offered another chance to come back, I would give them one. If the second visit had issues, then yes, I would not be a happy camper. I am interested in his review because with all new technology, there will sometimes be glitches. Lab testing is one thing, field testing is another. I have found out over the years, especially with new equipment, you have to work out the kinks and bugs. I agree the management should be checking for issues and heading them off. If there was not a picture, could something had been not turned on for the projector? Sounds like it. That's a training issue, and should be addressed. Overall, only a few offered response to the original post after my first post, and the rest focused on me, which is fine. I did poke the bear, and sometimes its interesting to see if the bear ignores you, or if they want to maul you. My opinion may differ on how their experience went and how it was handled. With the more facts that came in, it didn't go well. I hope Terry goes back and everything goes 100%. I would like to know either way. I would also suggest to still go through their website and send in a comment card. This way you have sent them something that maybe their home office can address. (Construction only overnight.) I hope everyone has a glitch free week, and look forward to the next review.

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-09-2017, 06:34 PM:

There's no reason why I couldn't agree with you. There's nothing personal about this discussion.

The point is, everyone in the business has lost a show from time to time. A lot of technical details have to come together to get a show running and sometimes stuff fails.

Everybody in the business has had to deal with immature hardware or software. Part of this is also the reason some around here still have a job.

Screwing up a show or even losing an entire show is one thing. Usually you can fix the damage to your reputation by explaining the situation and handing out free-passes or other goodies. But letting your customers sit in the dark is another thing, especially if you went for the show that markets itself as the thing that cares the most about quality.

While a technical glitch might be entirely excusable, the latter, letting your customers sit in the proverbial dark, until one of them actually realizes the problem isn't going to fix itself, is something else. It's showing lack of respect to your customers and that's the entire point.

Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 04-17-2017, 03:11 PM:

In NYC, AMC charges $23.29 for a seat at the Dolby Vision screen. They charge $21.49 in San Francisco. If you order online, there's an extra $2 charge. As far as I'm concerned, this is serious money. I expect perfection. No excuses. Period.

In the case mentioned, this level of incompetence and uncaring, especially on the primary screen (as in "AMC PRIME") is absurd. A staff member can't stick their head in to make sure the show starts okay if there's no projectionist? And why is there no projectionist? And if there is a projectionist, why didn't they catch the problems?

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 04-17-2017, 03:46 PM:

quote: Martin Brooks
In NYC, AMC charges $23.29 for a seat at the Dolby Vision screen. They charge $21.49 in San Francisco. If you order online, there's an extra $2 charge. As far as I'm concerned, this is serious money. I expect perfection. No excuses. Period.

The concessions prices at those theaters are likely in proportion to those high ticket prices. However, Manhattan and San Francisco both have some of the highest living costs in the nation. San Francisco has a $15 per hour minimum wage law going into effect in 2018. I could survive okay here in Lawton on $15 per hour. Living on $15 per hour seems impossible in San Francisco. I don't know how coffee shops, restaurants, movie theaters and other service businesses could staff any positions at that rate with such extreme living costs. Anyone trying to commute from a somewhat more affordable place like Tracy or Stockton would see any of the extra pay eaten by commuting costs, along with many hours of valuable time.

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-17-2017, 06:26 PM:

My problem with this Dolby Cinema @ AMC Prime thing it is yet another sellout for Dolby.

Dolby Cinema was going to be custom built auditoriums where all details would be exactly specified by Dolby. F-117 style wall and ceiling cladding, specific theater geometry, speakers hidden from sight, specific type of seats and even an entry into the room via a specially "themed corridor". From that custom built-concept only the "themed corridor" part seems to have survived.

It looks like only the first few installs got this treatment, the AMC implementation is just "Prime" with Atmos and Dolby Vision. I'm not implying it's bad by definition, but it's like McDonald's selling you a Whopper in a Big Mac box. (Which would undoubtedly be a bit of a squeezed-up situation.)

Posted by Geoff Jones (Member # 3668) on 04-17-2017, 07:24 PM:

quote: Martin Brooks
As far as I'm concerned, this is serious money. I expect perfection. No excuses. Period.

Well that's your first mistake! [Smile]

I saw Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children at the Dolby Cinema AMC Flatirons in Broomfield, CO and paid a premium for it.

Before the film, there was a Dolby Vision trailer that demonstrated "This is what black looks like with other kinds of projection" on one side of the screen, and "This is what black looks like with Dolby Vision" on the other. And it was definitely a darker black... except for where it was BRIGHT RED from the aisle lights.

Oh, and the bottom third was out of focus for the entire film.

[puke]

Haven't been back, and don't intend to.

Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 04-17-2017, 07:34 PM:

quote: Bobby Henderson
However, Manhattan and San Francisco both have some of the highest living costs in the nation. San Francisco has a $15 per hour minimum wage law going into effect in 2018. I could survive okay here in Lawton on $15 per hour. Living on $15 per hour seems impossible in San Francisco. I don't know how coffee shops, restaurants, movie theaters and other service businesses could staff any positions at that rate with such extreme living costs.

That's true, but I can practically guarantee you that none of the staff at the AMC Empire live in Manhattan and if they do, they either live in a city housing project or way uptown (unless they're kids living with parents). Not that the outer boroughs are inexpensive to live, but they are less expensive than Manhattan. NYC just increased minimum wage, but it varies depending upon the type of business. It's $10.50 for businesses of fewer than 10 workers, $11 for 10 workers or more and $12 for chain fast food, but IIRC, movie theaters used to be exempt from minimum wage laws. Don't know if they still are. Next year, it goes to $12/$13/$13.50 and up each year until everyone reaches $15 an hour by January 2020. Based on the July, 1970 Federal min wage of $1.85, if you believe the official inflation rate (I don't), the min wage should be $11.53 now, but if you take the rent of the apartment I lived in in 1973 and the rent of that same apartment now, the min wage should be closer to $30. But you're right - if one is not already in a low-cost place, you cannot live in NYC on $15 an hour. Even two people earning that full time could not survive - the entire salary would go to withholding taxes and rent.

And San Francisco to Palo Alto and Cupertino is worse. I once had an online argument with a woman who I thought was trolling when she claimed that she was getting thrown out of her tiny house because the owners wanted something like $12,000 per month. I told her that "it was obvious" that the owners didn't like her and just wanted her out. But then she sent me an image from a real-estate site showing the rental fees of the houses around her and they were all in that range. You can make $200K in that area and still be "poor".

Tipped workers in Manhattan can do okay. Although they can be paid as little as $2.13 per hour (Federal), but $8.65 in NYC for businesses of 10 or more, tips can be large if there's enough traffic.

The biggest problem in NYC is the cost of real estate, which is one (but certainly not the only) reason why we've lost so many theaters: 29.5% of theaters and 16% of the net screen count since 2001. We've also lost about 33% of the seats since 2012, but that's also due to lounge seating installations. I expect a lot more to close in the coming years as leases are up and developers want to build apartment buildings for the rich just about everywhere. If day-and-date happens, it won't be pretty. Having said that, we will be gaining 2 theaters and about 22 screens over the next few years, but they're both inside large high-end apartment towers where the apartments will sell for $ millions.

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-17-2017, 07:44 PM:

quote: Geoff Jones
Before the film, there was a Dolby Vision trailer that demonstrated "This is what black looks like with other kinds of projection" on one side of the screen, and "This is what black looks like with Dolby Vision" on the other. And it was definitely a darker black... except for where it was BRIGHT RED from the aisle lights.

Well... another sellout really.

This intro video actually is a pretty spectacular presentation of what Dolby Vision can achieve contrast wise. And if you watch it in one of their custom-built theaters, where ALL THE LIGHTS go out after the show starts, this moment is actually pretty impressive.

They obviously trick you, by showing a very bright white circle, but you won't be able to spot the edges of the screen if done properly.

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 04-17-2017, 09:14 PM:

quote: Marcel Birgelen
Dolby Cinema was going to be custom built auditoriums where all details would be exactly specified by Dolby. F-117 style wall and ceiling cladding, specific theater geometry, speakers hidden from sight, specific type of seats and even an entry into the room via a specially "themed corridor". From that custom built-concept only the "themed corridor" part seems to have survived.

I have mixed feelings about AMC's implementation of Dolby Cinema. It would have been cool to have the futuristic F-117 Stealth Fighter wall panels. On the flip side, AMC's flavor sports bigger, better recliner seats. I don't know how far AMC has gone with the Atmos configuration in these theaters. I assume the original Dolby designed concept was closer to a maximum quality configuration. At least each one of these AMC/Dolby installations has the dual 4K 6P Christie laser projectors. That's the most expensive element in the system.

Even though AMC has appeared to water down some of the visual style in their flavor of Dolby Cinema they have close to 70 of these screens now operating, which is way more than what IMAX has with its laser-based system. They would probably have far fewer of these systems installed if they fully duplicated the original Dolby concept.

For all the red and black glitz of the "Prime" decor, I would still prefer it if the screen had masking and curtains. If you're going to install big recliner seats, curtains would seem to be a natural addition.

quote: Geoff Jones
Before the film, there was a Dolby Vision trailer that demonstrated "This is what black looks like with other kinds of projection" on one side of the screen, and "This is what black looks like with Dolby Vision" on the other. And it was definitely a darker black... except for where it was BRIGHT RED from the aisle lights.

That's a fail on that theater's part. I had a better experience in a "Dolby Cinema @ AMC" house in the North Dallas area (watching Doctor Strange). They at least completely turned off the red lights in the speakers before the Dolby Cinema trailer began. The Quail Springs Mall theater in Oklahoma City just opened a "Dolby Cinema @ AMC" screen. I might give that one a try for one of the big movie releases in May.

Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 04-17-2017, 10:07 PM:

Seems like when they did a test of Dolby Cinema® or Dolby Vision® some time ago at the old Vine Theatre in Hollywood CA they only had blue lights. Now seems everything is red. To bad they did not put in a multi LED color light pattern so you could have a different color for certain films. The red lights on the aisles near the bottom corners of the huge curved Dolby Cinema® screen at the AMC Metreon Theatre in SF I had a problem with a few weeks ago bleed onto the screen when the image is not bright. Blue would look so much better above the ceiling around the speakers and side walls not bright red that they have now. Does anyone at Dolby® do a test before they go and put in red lights that shine onto the screen? Last year I did go to a new theatre in Sparks Nevada the 'Galaxy' and they did have blue lights not red. I was hoping they would keep the blue lights on during the movie or at least the trailers but they turned them all off around the ceiling speakers. The manager told me that so many people complained of the blue lights being on during the film. I still like to see some color lights on low during a movie. The Grand Lake Theatre in Oakland just put in some nice new LED lights in the large theatre downstairs, to bad the owner does not like blue so he put in red. The Grand Lake does not have Dolby Cinema® but they know how to light the place up during a film plus they have great stereo surround sound, 70mm film and two sets of curtains,something you won't get at a big increase for Dolby Cinema®. I will be going back to the SF AMC Metreon later this week and use my pass to see another movie at our only Dolby Cinema® in San Francisco, hope all goes well, I don't want to go looking for the so called manager again.

Posted by Marco Giustini (Member # 4544) on 04-18-2017, 04:22 AM:

quote: Terry Monohan
I was hoping they would keep the blue lights on during the movie or at least the trailers but they turned them all off around the ceiling speakers. The manager told me that so many people complained of the blue lights being on during the film. I still like to see some color lights on low during a movie.

O_O

A cinema must be pitch black - particularly a Dolby Cinema. If you want lights and colours during the movie you can buy a Philips TV! [Smile]

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 04-18-2017, 09:25 AM:

I agree, a proper cinema auditorium should be as dark as possible. In some cases, local regulations prevent this from happening. They require aisle and/or emergency exit lights not to be extinguished. In many cases, exceptions are possible, but they require special measures taken by the exhibitor to get a permit to extinguish those lights.

One of the points behind Dolby Cinema's auditorium setup was to be able to avoid the need for always-on aisle and exit lightning. Wide, open aisles at both sides of the auditorium and rigorously tested emergency lightning and evacuation procedures should be sufficient to grant those exceptions, where possible.

Posted by Jonathan Goeldner (Member # 4854) on 04-23-2017, 10:45 PM:

quote:
Well that's your first mistake! [Smile]

I saw Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children at the Dolby Cinema AMC Flatirons in Broomfield, CO and paid a premium for it.

Before the film, there was a Dolby Vision trailer that demonstrated "This is what black looks like with other kinds of projection" on one side of the screen, and "This is what black looks like with Dolby Vision" on the other. And it was definitely a darker black... except for where it was BRIGHT RED from the aisle lights.

Oh, and the bottom third was out of focus for the entire film.

[puke] [dlp]

Haven't been back, and don't intend to.

I have a major beef with AMC/Dolby with this same problem at Tyson's Corner - the darkness of 'Batman vs. Superman' was completely hindered by the aisle lights bouncing back onto the screen ... and the Atmos sound level, and playback in general never sounds completely calibrated right (Arclight Bethesda's Dolby Atmos system put's Tysons to shame). I now avoid Tyson's Dolby Cinema screen like the plague

word is that Dolby messed up a number of screens nationwide with the aisle/step lights flaw.

On AMC's Georgetown's Dolby Cinema screen the lower left hand corner of the screen was also out of focus, which the manager said they could fix - thankfully there is no red light problem, but the screen is no where as tall or wide as Tysons

Posted by William Kucharski (Member # 7246) on 05-03-2017, 10:48 PM:

I'm glad I am not the only one horrified by the bright red lower corners and the poor registration issues at the AMC Flatiron Crossing Dolby Cinema.

Alas, continued complaints to management both locally and AMC corporate have accomplished precisely nothing, as of course the theater continues to sell out every weekend.

In particular, the red corners date back to when it was just an AMC ETX screen, a problem they could have fixed in the Dolby remodel had they cared to.

They have now added a "Liemax" screen as well.

Truly pathetic.