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This is topic Flashback Cinema Series - "Oklahoma" 30FPS release? in forum Digital Cinema Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 12-28-2018, 01:52 PM:

Our venue is doing these series and it's interesting how these series are processed for digital.

Makes you wonder on where the source is coming from - from crisp to tired negatives or prints.

Most of these, one can really tell the tiredness of the source stock due to excessive graininess and the similar.

In the next series, out comes "Oklahoma" stated for the first week of February.

I received the content for the up and coming releases since being loaded on one 1T HD, and one of the content is "Oklahoma"

Reading the CPL on the drive, the content list "FTR-2-30"

Wonder if the content is the Todd-AO 30fps version.

Plus, content is in a 4K flat container.

thx - Monte

Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 12-28-2018, 03:04 PM:

Yes, Oklahoma! is 4K and 30FPS. It's in a SCOPE container.

Oklahoma_FTR-2-30_S_EN-XX_US_51_4K_TCF_20140317_FKI_OV

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 12-28-2018, 08:17 PM:

Okey. Someone printed the label wrong on the paperwork where it mentions a Flat container...

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 12-28-2018, 08:54 PM:

All the 5/65 movies I've seen transferred to DCP have been S-220.

I had a call for help from one place that was trying to play the Oklahoma DCP, and couldn't ingest it. Turns out that they were using a DSS100/DSP100 combo, which won't support any frame rate other than 24. They ended up having to play a DVD.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-29-2018, 01:00 PM:

Leo, the DSP100/DSS100 support 24 and 48fps (NOT 30fps...same is true of other servers of that era...I recently ran into a late model GDC SX2001 that sort of handled 30fps...it ingested and played but it was asymetrically cropped.

As for 5/70 features converted to DCP...i'd say most actually are in FLAT containers because it results in a higher pixel count. What is stupid is that they should be putting them in "C" containers for the best pixel count. The worst that would happen is that the 2.2 frame will get cropped to 2.39, which isn't as bad as it would seem since it is a 1.8963 imager, it is already a bit letterboxed.

Those theatres that create the 2.2 "C" formats could enjoy a better resolution version than either F or S versions.

Oklahoma! is definitely 4K/30 and will run on a DSS200/CAT745 system without issue.

Sound wise, go for the 5.1 version if you don't have Atmos. They butchered the sound track...if you run it 7.1, there will be no rear surrounds. They don't offer the Todd-AO mix at all BUT if you have Atmos, then you get the 5-screen channels.

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 12-29-2018, 03:19 PM:

Cropping the top and bottom of a 2.20 frame to 2.39 doesn't seem like much, but it would very likely shave a bit off the text of the opening titles of a 1960s or '70s era movie, which is probably why the studios ruled this route out. Agreed that F-220 and C-220 would boost the pixel count, but S-220 is the only "plug and play" option for a venue that cannot or will not create a bespoke macro, lens and screen files for F-220 or C-220.

The DSS100/DSP100 can't do 25fps either, which can make some European content problematic.

It really annoys me that they couldn't put the stage extra channels on 9 and 10 (I remember that they were also missing from the Hello Dolly DCP I played at the Egyptian a few times). If the theater isn't wired for the stage extras, they won't cause any trouble, as those channels won't be going anywhere. But if it is, I see no reason why such theaters shouldn't be given the ability to play the authentic audio.

I did once play a DCP of U.571 (originally made with SDDS 8-channel) that had the stage extra channels on 9 and 10, so at least one of the studios knows how to do this.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-29-2018, 04:07 PM:

The whole idea of "Version Files" is that you can easily release a movie with variants. In my opinion, job-1 on any reissue of a title is to release the ORIGINAL version as an option. Sure, always have a 5.1 compatible version (as the OV since 5.1 is the default DCI soundtrack configuration) but if a 6-channel or SDDS type 8-channel version exists, always have that version available for those that can handle it.

Again, on 70mm titles released in F-220 far exceeds those released in S-220, from what I've seen. C-220 is what they should be released in and I think You'll find that the titles and stuff will be safe within the safe-title area.

Posted by William Kucharski (Member # 7246) on 01-02-2019, 05:55 PM:

quote: Leo Enticknap
I had a call for help from one place that was trying to play the Oklahoma DCP, and couldn't ingest it. Turns out that they were using a DSS100/DSP100 combo, which won't support any frame rate other than 24. They ended up having to play a DVD.

From a potential of 30 FPS 4K to a DVD; it makes me want to cry. [Frown]

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-02-2019, 06:23 PM:

And "Oklahoma!" has a minute and half intermission..

In two weeks, we are doing "Gone with the Wind" and running time is posted as 232 min, which means I'll have a 10 min Intermissions with this one.

Be the third time I ran GWTW being my last time was in 1998 with those IB printed, anamorphic released prints to get 1.37/1 image on the screen. This release could be on the screen in 1.37/1, and just wonder what source is used for this release.

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 01-02-2019, 06:34 PM:

I played a DCP of GWTW at the Egyptian in 2016. It was a 4K F-137 DCP. Here is my report from that show:

As you can see, the two parts were two separate CPLs, with all the roadshow music present.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-02-2019, 07:52 PM:

Thx for this info Leo .. Interesting that Park Circus had issued this one.

When we did King and I, Patton and 2001ASO, both had individual content per half due to the intermissions being Roadshow releases.
On building the SPL's, I labelled each with Pt1 and Pt2 at the end of the title.

-Monte

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 01-03-2019, 06:59 PM:

quote: Monte L. Fullmer
Interesting that Park Circus had issued this one.

Because Selznick was an independent producer with his own studio, the rights and distribution situation with his films can be messy. They were originally distributed through United Artists, but when he liquidated his studio in 1942 (to avoid the IRS liquidating it for him), he sold the rights to GWTW to one of the company's partners for $500k, who then immediately "flipped" the movie to MGM for several million (an unprecedented sum for an already released film, given that in the pre-TV era, the only way of making any more money out of it was theatrical rereleases)! MGM have owned GWTW ever since, and as Park Circus now distribute their back catalog, they now have it.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 01-04-2019, 04:17 PM:

Thx for this great info.

Where I ran the film 3 times, I wondered why Leo the Lion trademark wasn't on front of the film even though it and Wizard of Oz came from the same distributor when I began running the film.