Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: NEC NC900C with GDC Media Server - A good setup for a 75 seat single screen?

This is topic NEC NC900C with GDC Media Server - A good setup for a 75 seat single screen? in forum Digital Cinema Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Chris Wehrman (Member # 5691) on 02-14-2019, 09:58 AM:

Hello everyone. I'm seeking opinions on purchasing this equipment used form a 8 screen that closed down. There is a NEC NC900C-A projector with what i believe to be a GDC SX-3000 server with portable storage. They also have a Ultra Stereo USD-60 processor.

I have a friend who owns and operate a small sub-run theater that i have had the pleasure of maintaining for the past 20 years. My great grandfather and great grand mother also ran this same theater in the 1940s and 1950s. Grandpa ran the Super Simplex and 4 star sound head that is still there today. I ran and maintained that projector up until the digital conversion. It's still there ready to run film if we ever get the opportunity. Needless to say, this Theater is very near and dear to my heart.

Sadly the current owner have little to no money and could not afford the conversion to digital, so the screen went dark and they rely on live events to stay afloat.

We have a chance to get the equipment listed above from the property management company in hopes to be able to show movies once again.

I can post specs of our screen and throw later but would this projector be a good choice with the GDC media server included? I realize we would more than likely have to purchase a different lens for it to fit our screen. However i'm a bit worried I may be in over my head with setting up the server, lens formats, etc. there won't be any automation, all manual control. Can anyone out there think of any "gotchas" or sticking points for a projectionist like myself getting this up and running? I have basic networking skills and have experience in setting up IP based equipment in general. I can preform the B chain alignment as well.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank You All!

Chris Wehrman

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 02-14-2019, 10:14 AM:

You need to check screen size vs. lens and throw, but there is nothing wrong with this combination of projector, server and USL processor. They are not the highest class of devices, but, they are known to operate without issues. Can you tell us roughly what they charge for it?

Once you have them, you may need to get a qualified tech and do a basic check for software status and cleaning, maybe a set of new bulbs.

- Carsten

Posted by Chris Wehrman (Member # 5691) on 02-14-2019, 10:29 AM:

From what we are being told, there is another guy offering the property management company 20 thousand dollars for each projector. I'm not sure if that is sound equipment included or not but even so, that sounds way too steep of a price. The owner knows nothing about the equipment or what it's worth. problem is, neither do I!

I realize the lens situation and will figure that out later.

As for the software, that was my main concern. Can I upgrade and set it up myself? I assume it may be password protected and i would i have to default it or re-load it? Things of that nature are making me a little nervous about getting a used system.

Chris

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 02-14-2019, 10:47 AM:

Sounds a bit too much for me for used equipment of this type. But of course, there are still quite a few screens left to be converted and full entry level setups like this are in high demand.
The key aspect here is that while the NC900 itself is no longer in production, it is still current technology (as well as the server and audio processor). Older gear can be bought for a lot less, but most people on this forum would disadvise to e.g. buy an old series 1 projector.

Maybe you will find these threads interesting, even if you're not from Nigeria...

http://www.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/f16/t003411/p1.html

http://www.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=16;t=003433#000003

You COULD do the software updates yourself, but you need to source special software to do it, you can not download it freely as you may be used from other type of consumer gear. I would spend the money for a proper tech to get everything going. Even if the equipment had been running in another location, it needs to be set up for your specific location and that is a steep learning curve. Pay a tech, and make him teach you the necessary things, I'd say.

- Carsten

Posted by Marcel Birgelen (Member # 6801) on 02-14-2019, 02:56 PM:

I would never pay $20K for a used NC900C, even if it includes an IMS. The machine was available for roughly $25K new when it last sold.

Depending on how old the equipment is and how many hours it has run, I'd say, anything between $10K and $15K would be reasonable, including the server.

You should definitely also check if the installed lens fits your screen and if not, what the extra costs for a new lens will be, as it will be hard to find a fitting lens on e.g. Ebay.

As Carsten mentioned, getting in a well-trained tech that can at least give you a proper introduction is paramount to get stuff rolling fast and to avoid some expensive mistakes.

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 02-15-2019, 07:54 AM:

I'm worried about the GDC, and for two reasons.

1 - Its UI is not one of the more intuitive or easy to learn of the server options out there.

2 - If it is no longer in warranty, then if it fails for any reason, GDC will not help you beyond diagnosing the fault, unless you renew the warranty. They do not offer a one-time repair service. Per this forum's conventions, I'm not going going to cite actual figures (for a product or service currently in production and on the market) beyond opining that planning sensibly to maintain the reliability of this IMS would add significantly to your overall project cost.

As has been covered above and depending on its hours and maintenance history, if you can haggle the price on the NEC down to something more realistic, and the lens and illumination math checks out, it's a sensible option. Like any complex piece of machinery it does have its known issues, but they don't involve the big ticket components. But I can't help thinking that an IMS2000 (even if bought new), a used but good Doremi ShowVault/IMB, or a used but good DSS220/cat745 (yes, I know that Dolby no longer formally support them, but if the price is right and the IMB has had a recent battery replacement, there should be a few years of life left in it) would be a much better server option than a used, warranty expired GDC.

There are situations in which a used SX-3000 might make sense, e.g. to replace one in a multi-screen venue that already uses them, if the owner is comfortable replacing the cert batteries every year, if it will be used mainly through a TMS, if the operators are familiar and comfortable with the GDC UI already, etc. etc. - but from the information given above, my gut feeling is that yours isn't one of them.

Shameless plug alert: if you decide that you'd like to buy the NEC but the lens that comes with it doesn't work for you, we (as in, the company I work for) may have a used (but checked out and good) model that would - feel free to PM me if we could help. We can also supply lamps and air filters.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 02-15-2019, 08:50 AM:

quote: Leo Enticknap
1 - Its UI is not one of the more intuitive or easy to learn of the server options out there.

2 - If it is no longer in warranty, then if it fails for any reason, GDC will not help you beyond diagnosing the fault, unless you renew the warranty. They do not offer a one-time repair service. Per this forum's conventions, I'm not going going to cite actual figures (for a product or service currently in production and on the market) beyond opining that planning sensibly to maintain the reliability of this IMS would add significantly to your overall project cost.

Leo, You make me laugh hard on #1... I can't begin to tell you how many booth monkeys have walked up to a GDC with touch screen and operate it successfully the first time. The only other option to replace the SX-3000 is the SR-4000 and I am still on the fence about that one. And the Dolbly IMS GUI is actually way less intuitive and far worse to learn. I put in a few and they actually frustrated some people.

2. GDC will indeed sell an extended warranty on the SX-3000 and the per year fee is reasonable. Two of my customers just renewed their warranty on theirs... three at one site. They will also replace an SX-3000 that has lost the certs, but at a bit higher price point. If you want to extend the warranty, just contact Jessica Neal at GDC. The warranty is the only thing GDC will sell direct to the customer. They will do one year, or two years at a slight per year discount.
And yes, 20K is way too much for the system. 12K tops for the system.

Mark

Posted by Chris Wehrman (Member # 5691) on 02-16-2019, 08:51 AM:

Thanks Everyone for the information. I think i'm going to offer 10K for the projector with IMS, the stand, the USL processor, and amps (crown SLX1500s). See what they say.

Chris

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 02-16-2019, 02:34 PM:

You can try, but, including the IMS and USL, and some addons, I would consider 12k-15k still a reasonable price.

- Carsten

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 02-16-2019, 03:29 PM:

Yes, 12 to 15K is a fair price IF everything is working. If you buy it do not forget to change out those batteries!

Mark

Posted by Chris Wehrman (Member # 5691) on 02-18-2019, 06:27 PM:

Looks like the building owner has offered to sell everything but the screen itself for 15K. I told my fried she should take it if she can get the funds together.

Question about the HDMI port on the SX-3000, am I able to connect a Laptop or DVD player to this port to test the projector?

Thanks,

Chris

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 02-18-2019, 06:40 PM:

Not so easy, these inputs do not work as on presentation beamers or monitors.
You need to get access to the sx3000 GUI to enable the input. But once you're there, you could just as well play test content.

The NC900 also has it's own minimal webserver for some basic things, but you need to know it's IP address to get there. Do you excpect to test it in it's current location, still installed, or after delivery? Is it stored away?

- Carsten

Posted by Chris Wehrman (Member # 5691) on 02-18-2019, 08:05 PM:

Yes I want to test it before we load it up. All the screens in this 8 plex are still powered up, all the sound equipment is still on. It's like the theater closed it's door after the last showing for the night and never returned! I'll have a friend with me who knows the GDC GIU.

I hope to be able to use that HDMI port for renting out the auditorium to private groups, show slide presentations on a laptop or play videos, etc.

Chris

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 02-18-2019, 08:28 PM:

You should read these documents here to make yourself familiar with the system:

http://www.gdc-tech.com/english/products_sx3000_enterprise_storage.php

If they are still installed, you should try to dig up someone who is able to operate them. It's not rocket science, but they are not as straight to use as you may expect. Storage power up, projector power up, lamp start, connect to SMS GUI. If you're lucky, there is a monitor, keyboard and mouse connected to the server and you can start right way. You will need login passwords as well.

The best thing would be to bring someone knowlegeable on site.

You can use the HDMI port as you intend to. It's just that you need to learn how to activate it. There is no remote control or 'HDMI input' button on the projector so to speak.

- Carsten