Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Roma (2018)

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Posted by Mark Ogden (Member # 43) on 12-10-2018, 05:59 PM:

Mexico City, 1970: After the dissolution of her employer’s marriage, housekeeper Cleo must continue to help raise their five children while dealing with her own unplanned pregnancy. In Spanish with English subtitles at the iPic Hudson Lights Cinema, Fort Lee, New Jersey.

*****

That’s pretty much the whole plot, a fact that caused another film-goer near me to have a conniption as the lights came up (“That’s IT? Where was the story?”, she wanted to know). There may not seem to be much here to hang a two-hour plus picture on, but what there is is very good and very moving, and not for nothing was it named Best Picture of the Year by the New York, Los Angeles and Chicago Film Critic groups. Cleo is a small person in a big tumultuous world of political upheaval, just trying to keep her wits about her as both her home life and her personal life go through devastating changes, with some of those changes becoming almost unbearable to watch (be prepared for one of the most harrowing child-delivery scenes ever shot). It’s a beautifully made and performed movie about a woman few people in real life would take notice of, and I’m happy I saw it in a theater as the film is visually sweeping enough that it would be diminished on anything but a big screen.

Technically, the film is presented in 2.39:1 and was shot on the very popular Arri Alexa 65. The picture is largely a series of wide shots, and I saw a degree of lens distortion in some of them, but mostly the cinematography is stunning. Terrific audio too. This isn't an Atmos title but it probably should have been, there's a lot of surround happening as well as some interesting audio perspective changes in the dialogue.

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 12-10-2018, 09:22 PM:

I want to see this movie, but chances are I'll only get to watch it on Blu-ray or Netflix. It's not playing on any big screens near my location.

quote: Mark Ogden
Technically, the film is presented in 2.39:1 and was shot on the very popular Arri Alexa 65. The picture is largely a series of wide shots, and I saw a degree of lens distortion in some of them, but mostly the cinematography is stunning.

Barrel distorsion perhaps? I know not to trust IMDb too much, but it says spherical prime lenses were used on the Arri Alexa 65. Some movie productions have used 1.25x anamorphic lenses with the Arri Alexa 65 to gain a bit of the CinemaScope look. And then they have the audacity to use the "filmed in Ultra Panavision 70" logo in the end credits. It takes both 5/65mm film and UP70 lenses to warrant the use of that logo (not to mention some 70mm prints).

quote: Mark Ogden
This isn't an Atmos title but it probably should have been, there's a lot of surround happening as well as some interesting audio perspective changes in the dialogue.

Actually, a Dolby Atmos mix was created for Roma. The movie is listed on Dolby's web page of movie releases in Dolby Atmos and/or Dolby Vision:
https://www.dolby.com/us/en/cinema/theatrical-releases.html

The problem with Roma and Atmos is there are very few theaters in the United States equipped with Atmos that also play art-house product. Alamo Drafthouse has a couple of Atmos-equipped screens, but refused to book Roma due to the very short release window Netflix gave it. I loved what Alfonso Cuarón and his crew did with the Atmos sound mix on Gravity. With the stress Cuarón put on booking the movie in theaters equipped with 70mm and Atmos, I imagine Roma probably has a very good Atmos mix. It's a shame very few people will hear the movie that way.

I don't know if Cuarón or the folks at Netflix know that there is currently no easy, practical way to pair a Dolby Atmos mix with a 70mm film print. 70mm and DTS is the only option now. I don't know if 70mm and DTS-X is even possible. Gotta have some way to synchronize DTS time code (or some other time code) to playback on a Dolby CP-850. The issue of pairing 70mm and Atmos on this release might be irrelevant anyway. Unless they created the final digital intermediate of Roma at the full 6.5K resolution of the Alexa 65 there's little point of using 70mm film prints. If it's a regular 4K DI a 4K DCP with Atmos should be enough.

Posted by Sam Graham (Member # 2889) on 12-25-2018, 09:22 PM:

This is available for steaming on Netflix now and I watched it tonight.

It's slow moving and not for everyone, but has some really powerful scenes and at a minimum deserves award consideration for cinematography and direction. The audio, as Mark noted, is also terrific and will still shine if you have a decent home system.

Posted by Carl Martin (Member # 1146) on 01-03-2019, 03:38 PM:

i saw this last night in 70mm and liked it, with reservations.

i'm in the minority i know, but i feel that with surround sound, less is more. the ocean scene and a couple other set pieces used it well. but i don't constantly need to have dogs barking and birds chirping over my shoulder. that's distracting.

the visual quality of the picture has been overstated. harsh highlights in places, even moire in one instance. it didn't feel like a black and white movie, rather a color movie with the color removed. (it didn't help that the color stock gave the image a greenish cast at times.)

how many home-viewers will make it past the long opening shot of a floor? it takes time to get immersed in the characters' lives, and once we do, some powerful scenes follow.

Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 01-03-2019, 08:19 PM:

We watched the 70mm film 'Roma' playing today on the semi large Castro Theatre screen.
Someone has been working on the Castro's sound system and It showed very well with this new 70mm film.
The B&W movie was very emotional in many places.
I do like surround sound so I was happy the sound director had many interesting split sounds coming around you and the Castro had for once played the wall speakers with good volume.
Also they used the stage speakers in 'Roma' to showcase voice from the far left and right speakers and many other effects that you don't hear much these days.
I can see this movie doing well come Oscar time. Some people don't get a story out of It but I did. The long 65mm pan shots looked so great on the Castro screen on a new clean clear 70mm film print.
I was told by the projection guy they used a Dolby Atmos® mix? I don't know If this can be done If they used a DTS disk? Maybe he meant a Dolby Atmos amp? Anyway It sounded and looked good and they had a great audience for the 2:30 PM showing today in San Francisco Jan 3 2019.
Try to see it before Academy Award time and at a nice cinema with good stereo surround sound in DCP 35MM OR 70MM.
Try not too watch It at home on TV with Netflix, see the movie theatre visual & sound experience on 'Roma'.

.

Posted by Carl Martin (Member # 1146) on 01-03-2019, 08:38 PM:

as far as i know there aren't any 35mm prints... does anyone know different? i think a 35mm scope print on bw stock might have been preferable!

Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 01-04-2019, 11:15 AM:

Did any of you 70mm projection guys see the different cue reel changeover marks on the 70mm 'Roma' print.
The film stated ok with a circle punch in the upper right then after reel #3 It looked like just a scratch scribble marker X the two times It was on the end of each reel.
Must have been hard for a new projection person to see It If you had two 70mm projectors going?
At least they must have had the times for the changeover listed in the booth.
The Castro Theatre projection guy in SF does a good job with the changeovers like always with 35mm or 70mm film prints.

Posted by Jim Cassedy (Member # 4115) on 01-04-2019, 01:29 PM:

quote: Terry Monohan
Must have been hard for a new projection
person to see It If you had two 70mm projectors

> A "new" projection person shouldn't be running 70mm.

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 01-04-2019, 03:30 PM:

The Castro sound system is set the same as it has been since the last time we did a major tuneup, probably two years ago. Roma just has a spectacular sound mix with lots of use of surrounds, too much in my opinion for this kind of film. I loved this film, I know the Roma area from my days working a lot in Mexico City.

I'm always surprised to hear people rave about the picture quality there. It's a fairly old silver screen and impossible to get right in a balcony house with the projectors at a downward angle. Goes to show you what a good movie can do if it absorbs you.

Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 01-06-2019, 11:53 AM:

I was told in person by the manager of the Castro a few days ago that the sound has been just recently worked on. I think there are other tech people coming into the Castro Theatre besides the Dolby team crew these days.
The Castro has had some special sneak film previews playing the last few months and maybe some Hollywood type sound people have gone in and made some adjustments for the better at least
for the volume and amps of the old tired small surround speakers.
I know the new 70mm film 'Roma' has a full kick ass surround element in the theatres or even at home on Net Flicks.
The volume and fullness of the surrounds and placement of sounds at the Castro even to the side back corners at times has never been so well heard in many years.
The projectionist even commented to me how the new 4K 'Yellow Submarine' DCP sounded a few months ago as far as the volume of the split surround channels were heard .
Stop by the Castro Theatre if you are in the San Francisco area when they are showing a stereo DCP 5.1/7.1 or 35mm/70mm film and hear the difference of the surround speaker volume at this great theatre palace in need some day of a new screen.

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 01-06-2019, 09:16 PM:

The sound gets tweaked by Dolby folk or others on a regular basis, due to a call from the studio, mainly to make sure nothing has blown up. However, the components remain the same, amps, processors, projectors, lenses. There's only so much can change with a tweak or two. As I mentioned before the Roma soundtrack uses surrounds a lot and heavy and is of benefit to a cavernous palace like the Castro. The screen is what it is, until management decides it's time to change it. I did mention I've been servicing the Castro since the late '70's for RCA, then Dolby, and now for BACP.

Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 01-06-2019, 10:43 PM:

Thanks Sam for letting us know about the

Posted by Terry Monohan (Member # 8285) on 01-06-2019, 11:01 PM:

Thanks Sam for letting us know about the Castro Theatre sound.
Now that 'Roma' won some Golden Globes maybe they will bring back the 70mm film print soon with It's great surround sound mix and show It again for the many people still wanting to see It.
The 70mm film print of 'Roma' opens up this coming Friday 1/11/2019 at the Drafthouse Cinema in Brooklyn NY for a week. If you are in the NY area go check this movie out in 70mm and It's fantastic surround sound mix.
Strange at one time Drafthouse Cinemas did not want to play the 70mm 'Roma' print now they are. Glad they have changed their mind.

Posted by Carl Martin (Member # 1146) on 01-07-2019, 02:54 AM:

well, the castro has added shows for today, and the local drafthouse (new mission) has it coming in 70mm as well.

funny sam should bring up the top-of-the balcony booth at the castro. that was typical for movie "palaces" of yesteryear and worked well enough for silent and academy ratio films. as screens were often moved forward and shorter lenses brought in for widescreen the distortion from the steep projection angle worsened.

(getting back on topic) in the theater in roma, the projection beam comes from under the balcony. the theater decor suggests pre-1953. is this a vfx error?

Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 01-07-2019, 09:44 AM:

If you compare an exterior view of the theater from the film to Google Street View, the marquee has had some vfx work done, but the building next door has all the same windows open/broken.

Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 01-07-2019, 10:59 AM:

Moving the booth to an under balcony location was fairly common when wide screen came along.

Balcony booth silver screens yield terrible light readings downstairs as the light tends to be set for the balcony while most people sit on the main floor and the balcony is often closed to the public during non peak times.

Posted by Justin Hamaker (Member # 2165) on 01-10-2019, 02:40 AM:

My wife and I just watched Roma on Netflix.

I felt the story was very underwhelming. Generally speaking I'm not a fan of movies where you're more like a voyeur watching people's lives for a period of time rather than having a narrative.

As others have mentioned, the cinematography really was the star of the show. There were a number of interesting tracking shots. And I really appreciated how they built suspense for what was just off screen.

Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 01-10-2019, 09:54 AM:

As I mentioned in another thread I have developed a concept for combining 70mm and Atmos that does not involve running a DCP alongside the film print. So if anyone wants to be the first to do 70mm Atmos just give us a call!