This is topic Ridiculous customer/show scheduling in forum Ground Level at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Mike Spaeth (Member # 524) on 09-27-2000, 04:13 AM:
So I have this old guy come in around 7:30 and ask me when "Way of the Gun" starts. I kindly inform him that the next show isn't until 10:20. When he asks when the previous show was, I tell him 4:25 (it's alternating show's w/ the Replacements). So he proceeds to cuss me out, "No one goes to a 10:20 movie on a work night..." Then asks when my showtimes are tomorrow. I tell him the same thing. He gets pissed off and tells me that I should alternate those every day (i.e. show Replacements at 425/1020 and Way of the Gun at 730). I explain to him the way that show scheduling works, yada yada, only to cringe when I hear his next question "When does it show next week" (knowing that my bookings next week call for last show only - the magical 10:20 show). This really ticked him off, he was basically threatening that hell to consume my theater because my showtimes weren't to his liking. Question: If you wanted to see this movie THAT badly, why didn't you see it during the first 2 weeks, when I had a full round of shows? Kind of like the people that got pissed at me when "I Dreamed Of Africa" went to last show only for the second week of it's engagement (which also happened to be the last).A second question: for all you managers out there: do you write your own show schedule or have corporate office mandate one for you? That's one thing I like about my company - the show scheduling is 100% up to me. If their is a problem with it, my booker advises me otherwise (i.e. you need to fit 5 shows over the weekend, which is VERY rare) I think it would take 75% of the fun out of my job, as the bookings are my favorite management activity (sure beats inventory).
Posted by Chad Souder (Member # 343) on 09-27-2000, 03:50 PM:
I don't know any managers that don't set their own showtimes. Just play as many shows as you can for the length of the movie, and stagger times so your projectionist doesn't have a heart attack imitating Carl Lewis. I would not say this is the most enjoyable part of being a manager, but it does give you a little bit of a God complex.Oh, and if people complain about a show not being on at a certain time, just tell them "Well, we could run both movies at that time, but it would probably be hard on the machinery, and it might even mess the sound up" and see what they say.
Posted by Michael Gonzalez (Member # 593) on 09-27-2000, 07:16 PM:
Tonight I had a older couple show up 20 minutes late for Space Cowboys. Since no one had previously show up for that feature, I had never started it. So of course the lady threw a fit because I wouldn't start the show late for her. You know the usual... Whats my bosses name? The owner's name etc. Of course I tried to explain the concept of show scheduling and movies running over but she wouldn't hear of it. She was nice enough to let me know that it was ok to "fast forward" 
through the previews because she dosn't like to watch them anyways. I of course wussed out and started the movie late for her. 
Posted by Mike Spaeth (Member # 524) on 09-27-2000, 07:34 PM:
That's precisely why we start everything. If there are no customers, we simply kill the Xenon and the exciter circuit breakers, so the auditorium runs "dark" - basically the film is just being motored through. If someone shows up, we simply turn on the xenon and the exciter, and, voila, there picture is right where it should be. (i.e. you don't get a "special start" if you're late).
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 09-27-2000, 10:30 PM:
I don't know what kind of market Mankato is, but 10:20 does seem awfully late. The Replacements isn't THAT long is it? When does it start and get out? But yes, it sounds like the guy overreacted 
.As far as setting your own schedule, this summer every feature came with "mandatory showtimes" . Now we're doing our own again though, they don't care about the movies now.
On the issue of starting on time, Its quite easy for me to pull the previews out, set them up on a platter-ring and all just like it had rewound there, and thread the projector without cutting the films or breaking a splice and remaking it. Did it yesterday afternoon as a matter of fact.
Posted by Mike Spaeth (Member # 524) on 09-28-2000, 12:29 AM:
Basically, I have 2 rules when writing a show schedule. First, no 2 movies start at the same time, always spaced 5 minutes, plus I make sure that there is a 30 minute intermission plus 5 minute spacing between drop times, so that I can more efficiently schedule staff (i.e. spread things out so that I only need 2 people working 8 hours, rather than 3 working 7.) BTW, 10:20 is my last start of the night, and, being a college town, my 9:30-10:20 round is the largest of the evening, beats the 7's.
Posted by Zach Zagar (Member # 379) on 09-28-2000, 10:18 AM:
One problem I've had with shutting off my Xenon bulb after I start the movie, the hour meter still goes (at least on the Christie, Xetron and Strong lamphouses I've worked with). What's the point of shutting it off if your eter runs? (unless you log hours you didn't run it). The way I've found around it, is if someone's in the theater, or we sold for it, I press start. However, if its a no show, I will simply flip on the motor and it goes. Then if someone shows up, we/I press start, it then overrides the motor and we can flip off the manual motor start and then the lamphouse meter is only logging ACTUAL hours, not just hours that the start button was pushed.Only problem is those cashiers who forget to tell you if they sold a ticket. Once I fix that problem, there's no flaw whatsoever, I guess.
------------------
If ya smell, what the Zach is cooking.
Zach Zagar, the most electrifying man in theater entertainment today.
Posted by Scott D. Neff (Member # 185) on 09-28-2000, 01:06 PM:
At Cinema West we would give the manager's the option of writing their schedules. The only catch was that we'd have to call some of them early on Mondays and Tuesdays because of newspaper deadlines. Those who didn't mind, got their schedule the way they wanted it. Those who would rather sleep were sometimes tortured by little intermission, little lead time and sometimes repeating start times.Having the Main Office do your times is okay though. They would keep your shift times low... meaning your first movie would get in LATE and your last movie would start and finish EARLY -- keeping payroll AS LOW AS POSSIBLE. I loved starting at 6:00 on weeknights and getting out at 10:30.
THE WORST however was getting your movies spaced out too far. I ran a 4-plex where the WORST schedule was 12:30 / 1:00 / 1:30 / 2:00. That meant NO DOWN TIME! ARRGh.
Scott Neff
The Guy Formerly Known as Asst. Dist. Mgr.
Cinema West Theatres
Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 09-28-2000, 02:54 PM:
I was raised to respect punctuality. If I wasn't on time there was hell to pay.
Last night was my day off, in theory. One of our employees was sick so I came in to close the theatre.Our schedule is such that all our films save one get out by 10:45 PM. The other film gets out at 11:30 PM. It has the last start time at 9:15 PM. 9:15 came and went without a ticket sold.
You all have had this happen to you.
9:25 two ladies come in and ask for tickets to the show that I am not running. I tell them that it is cancled and please come again tomorrow. They start whining and saying that they drove here from Petaluma which is 25 miles away. I relent and start the show at 9:30. This means that I am here one more hour on my day off.
Why is it that people can be on time for the train, plane and symphony but they are always 5 to 10 minutes late for a film?
I have to go. My staff is due here in one minute.
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 09-28-2000, 03:15 PM:
I must have been raised the same as Ian. If I was late for anything I got an earfull growing up, not that I am complaining. Now I find myself irrated when I have to wait on someone who is late. I go by the moto "If you're on time, you're late!"If it was up to me (and it's not) I would stop selling tickets 2 minutes prior to show start, no exceptions. But then again, I am an a**hole when it comes to things like that.
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 09-30-2000, 08:03 PM:
One of my biggest customer pet peeves is when only 1 or 2 people show up for that one movie that runs 45 minutes or more later than the last shows of everything else, and they don't stay through the end credits!!! That shows they didn't really care about seeing the movie, so why waste my time??? Then I have to stay while those credits run to an empty house anyways, while if no one had been there at the BEGINNING of the movie I could've just stopped it and gotten it ready to start for the next day then gone home early!
Posted by Russ Kress (Member # 461) on 09-30-2000, 10:51 PM:
Jesse, Lighten up!!I personally don't care who your boss is! (LOL)
You advertised that you were showing a movie.
A customer was late.
Believe it or not, that customer is more important than the person who signs your paycheck.
If you really have a problem with this, you might want to apply for that position at the bank. I hear that their hours are much more structured.
"A waste of your time?"
You are definately in the wrong line of work.
Thank you for creating such a pleasant customer experience that will eventually affect us all.
God help me! I just agreed with my boss! Start every show! Even if it's empty.
Russ
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 10-01-2000, 12:56 AM:
Here here Russ! The customer is ALWAYS right, even when they're wrong.
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 10-01-2000, 02:18 AM:
so... if the customer is always right what do I say when they insist that I rewind the movie???
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 10-01-2000, 10:13 AM:
Apologize (even though you didn't do anything wrong) and apologize again. Offer passes if they're really upset. Try to explain to them why you can't do that, offer to show them the booth if they want.
Posted by Tom Kroening (Member # 201) on 10-01-2000, 11:39 AM:
Here's my two cents worth. If a move shows at 9:15, and two people come in at 9:30 wanting to see it you don't have to show it. If someone has a 12:45 flight and it leaves, its not coming back for anyone thats late. Now I personally will start the movie if someone shows up late, but thats me. Our last show starts at 10:20 or 10:30 so im there late anyway, and this way ill have an extra few minutes to do some maintanence. I usually start everything on the weekends, and on weekday mornings i *might* track customers by using the computer, but if i'm doing something else in between starts its much quicker to start everything.
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 10-01-2000, 01:35 PM:
Its just my opinion that it is our job to do whatever it takes to make the customer happy. Many people do not like previews, so they intentionaly come late. I really don't see the problem with starting every show. If no one shows up, just turn off your lamp.Airports? Trains? Buses? We're not a transportation company, we're movie theatres.
Don't get me wrong guys, bitch all you want on the forums, I hate it when customers do stuff like this too. But in front of the customer, you should be apologetic and accomodate every need you possibly can.
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 10-01-2000, 02:04 PM:
Starting everything is a good policy and just extinguishing the lamp is good (thats what I do) but... what about that thursday night you built up all your films and tore down all that you could theres only one teardown left. The 10:20 showing of the nine reel "art" film that no one has come for all week you couldA. Not run it tear it down and leave bye 11:00
b.run it and leave bye 2:00am
?????? I know what I would do...
Posted by Mike Spaeth (Member # 524) on 10-01-2000, 02:45 PM:
"I know what I would do"I would run the film! Especially in the days of declining box office - every customer makes a difference! Why risk losing a customer so that you can tear down a show early. You should've been planning on tearing it down late anyways. I wholeheartedly agree with everything Dustin is saying in this thread. It is one thing if a customer is demanding something beyond your control, but if you can do something about it (especially something as simple as starting a show because they happen to be late), by all means do it. They are paying for a service, so by all means provide that service!
I once heard a saying that applies very well. "Very few people will tell their friends about good service, but everyone will tell all of their acquaintances (not just friends) when they receive bad service."
We tell our employees "You have the power to do whatever it takes to please a customer." (and we mean it) - so management should be doing the same thing - leading by example.
Posted by Russ Kress (Member # 461) on 10-01-2000, 10:12 PM:
Tom,My Ballantyne PRO-35 could hardly be compared to an airliner! (LOL)
It's turn-around time is faster and to date there has not been a single FAA service directive issued on this model!
Okay, you advertise that your showing of "The Attack of the Obnoxious Theatre Employee" is scheduled to start at 9:35.
Well, 9:35 rolls around and no one is there yet. This is your moment of greatness!
You can either A, start the film and insure that you will get to leave when the schedule said you would, or you can B, leave it idle and PRAY that no one shows up late.
If you chose to start it, you just say "That selection has already started. Is that okay?"
If you make the direct decision to NOT start it, you alone are responsible for going home late.
Since the standard projector never actually lifts off of the runway, there is no need to refuse admissions simply because they arrive late.
They could always stay home and press "play" at any time they chose to. They chose instead to come to your theatre.
Next time, they might just stay home.
I would,
Russ
Posted by Tom Kroening (Member # 201) on 10-02-2000, 02:00 AM:
Thats exactly why I always start the movie. At the same time I understand people's reasoning for not starting them. When It all boils down to it read your corporate policy. If it states that you must start all movies then start a movie late when someone comes. If its up to you then its up to you! But like i said, I usually start all the movies. Working at an 18 plex, threading a couple more movies is all the same to me( just more practice on my presentation!)
Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 10-02-2000, 03:41 PM:
When we get turkeys that aren't doing very well (and hence the liklihood of no-show performances) I run commercials and trailers on a 2,000ft spool, then the feature from a platter. That way if no one is there after the trailers have finished, we cancel the show. If someone does appear late, then we work out if we still have time to show the feature before the next screening in that auditorium is supposed to start, and if so, we'll show it. If not, then we've saved a bit of print wear and a couple of lamp hours.
Posted by Steve Scott (Member # 630) on 10-03-2000, 02:39 PM:
My theater is run by a small, local corporate office, but GM makes the schedule every week. He likes to run the shows continuous thru matinee showings, except at night, when he makes a break from 8 til 9. This is a good time for me to send employees on break, clean the lobby, or change mylars. We alternate shows too, but some are just common sense moves.
For example: when we shoed Pokemon 2000, we put Gladiator on that screen for the night shows, casue you don't find a lot of kids or adults going to a 9:30 show of Pokemon!
More recently, we kept Disney's The Kid (oh the horror of printing that entire title on tickets which the ushers can't understand!) and alternated it with Coyote Ugly at night. We had only a few people complain about that one.:rolleyes:
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Posted by Chad Souder (Member # 343) on 10-03-2000, 10:21 PM:
If you guys are wanting to take the gamble of not starting a show, and then just going to buckle and start it late anyway, all you need to do is put something in writing somewhere that says you won't start movies more than 15 minutes late if there are no other ticket purchases. We personally start them late for whoever, but if you don't want to, just put it in writing, and then they can't complain.------------------
"Asleep at the switch? I wasn't asleep, I was drunk!" - Homer Simpson
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 10-04-2000, 02:08 AM:
I know a few ways to stop films after they've started and either re-start them right away or at least have them ready to start for the next day in shorter time than it would take to run the movie to an empty theater. This is why I always start shows on time, but if someone were to come 10 minutes late to a show that ended early anyways I could easily re-start it from the beginning; conversely if I'm running the very last showing of "The Patriot" that ends at 1 AM and has to be broken down as soon as it's over, I can save about 3 hours if it turns out all the trailers are over but nobody's bought tickets. I certainly don't 'hate' people for coming to a movie, but I feel like the show's gone to waste if one person shows up for that last show and ends up leaving during the end credits; that says to me they didn't appreciate the movie. That's just my opinion though, I might be wrong.
Posted by Greg Pauley (Member # 503) on 10-04-2000, 06:35 AM:
As Russell mentioned above we require our managers to start all movies for each show regardless if a ticket is purchased. We do allow the manager to make a decision on Thursday night not to start a film if nobody shows up at showtime, but if a customer shows up they must start the film late. I think you have to remember that we work for the customer in the end. Their is a very small segment of the population that attend movies and that segment returns to our theatres over and over again. You might think that it's just one or two customers, but those customers might reflect 10 to 20 visits a year. We as an industry under fire from other forms of entertainment can't afford to lose any of our customer base. If a customer drives 20 miles to come to your theatre and you refuse them a ticket because of being late, you will lose that customer the next time to your competitor or Blockbuster. If we lose enough, we will be forced to get a real job.
Posted by Michael Gonzalez (Member # 593) on 10-04-2000, 04:44 PM:
I usually take the gamble and not start the movie until I have a paying customer. There are a number of reason for this and the biggest being is that I run a nine plex. We are currently running 13 seperate prints (that is a lot of splits) because of how slow things have been lately, it has typically been myself and one other staff person running the theater on a weekday night. It just makes more since to me to start movies as customers show up rather than starting nine movies when we only have customers for four of them. However I am prepared to suffer the conquences if a customer show up 20 minutes late for "What Lies Beneath" even though we had it for 11 going on 12 weeks.
Posted by Dennis Atkinson (Member # 345) on 10-04-2000, 05:58 PM:
There is a brass plaque near the entrance of the place I work.
It says
"All of our customers bring us happiness.
Some by coming - others by going."
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 10-05-2000, 11:50 AM:
Jesse,How exactly are you pulling the center ring, running the previews and then stopping the movie, only to turn right around and break the film down WITHOUT damaging the film? I'd like to hear this.
Posted by Sean M. Grimes (Member # 445) on 10-05-2000, 05:47 PM:
Brad,Very simple to break down the movie without a center ring all one really has to do is creep the bulid table so slowly that you might as well just speed wind through the movie and break it down as you normally would. hahaha
Posted by Tom Kroening (Member # 201) on 10-05-2000, 06:58 PM:
What you can do is wind the extra film on the ring, collapse the ring and sink the trailers back in. Then expand the ring as far as it will go.. sometimes you get lucky and it clicks, but usually not. Its not a great practice, but sometimes it has to be done (like when someone threads a movie by mistake). You should not be starting a movie last set on thursday night unless you intend to play through it all. Although the above method works (usually), as you are winding the film the ring will slowly shrink and the film will start pulling tight from the center, causing little scratches everywhere.
Posted by Rick Fowler (Member # 605) on 11-08-2000, 02:10 PM:
well let's see you start every show that is scheduled yes if noone shows turn off the lamp (to conserve electricity saw it mentioned that the meter still runs) here's a novel approach if you know you have a dog and it's gonna leave that thursday don't schedule a late show. make it's last show at the 7-8 oclock set it'll be done before 10 and tear it down. also move your prints so your dog ends in the house your new movie starts in on friday I doubt anyone is having sellouts on thursday 10pm shows. so when that dog is done at 10pm you can screen your new movie early and tear down the old and be out by 12-1am. that's assuming everyone screens thier movies before putting them on screen for the public like you should. the dropping the center back in should only be used in an emergency like an extended power outage or starting the wrong movie. that's the way I see it. this way you avoid the customer complaints at least the legitimate ones those that show up late of course apologize but you have a scheduled time and it was started on time. that leaves them very little to argue about and you should never argue with a customer. so in essence do your job your a theater manager, your job is to show movies so show the movie!------------------
Regal Booth Certifier
Posted by Dave Williams (Member # 299) on 11-15-2000, 10:52 AM:
Ok I have heard enough of "The customer is always right" crap. It was never true and never will be. This phrase came about a couple of decades ago by groups fighting for consumer rights. This originally dealt with consumer safety and truth in advertising. It was NEVER intended for customers to assume that just because they graced your business with thier presence, that they are entitled to order you to start licking thier bums!In reality, the customer only assumes they are correct, even though they rarely are. They must be treated as if they are, but really are not. In fact, you must patronize them and pretend you are an idiot to placate them.
There was a time when if you showed up late, you were not admitted into the theater. It was considered to be rude to assume you could just show up whenever the hell you wanted. Now we have by virtue of massive multiple prints and megaplexes and overscheduling told the masses that it is ok to be lazy slobs and just show up without checking the paper for showtimes, and its ok to be a rude son of a bitch and show up in the movie, late, start talking as if it were the previews, make people move for you, and act like a total ass!
It is time to take our industry back to when the number of shows and prints were limited, and if you were late, YOU DONT GET IN!!! ASS!!
Customers are like children, they want structure and will take it if you are willing and daring to give it. Most customers prefer a dose of "FU" every now and then anyway. You know that when they are told to go away because they are late, they will eventually come back, and on time, just to be part of the crowd that showed up on time.
I am now watching a TV ad for Chuck A Rama, an all you can eat slop house. This couple is excited to go there, and get into theier POS ford truck. I think this says it all.
Dave
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 11-15-2000, 04:00 PM:
You know the difference Dave, VIDEO. Back then, if a customer didn't see a movie in the theatre, they didn't see it. Nowadays, its on HBO, Showtime, Network TV, DVD, re-release, VHS.They don't have to come to our theatres anymore. If you turn them away like that, you know where they'll go? The corner blockbuster.
Posted by Aldo Baez (Member # 790) on 04-01-2001, 05:34 PM:
At my theatre, we would always start the movie maybe 6 or 7 minutes earlier, that way when the showtime came around, the movie would be starting since the trailers already played. Saves just a few minutes. Sometimes we never did start them and there really hasn't been any problems, but did anyone get that memo from Disney about some thing that theatres weren't playing all the shows for some reason or another, and that if future theatres are caught not showing a showtime they won't be able to run Atlantis? My manager freaked and ever since then we have started every movie no matter what.
Posted by Michael Barry (Member # 237) on 04-02-2001, 12:52 PM:
At my current job, I start every movie. I usually get told by box office staff if something is a no-show, but just run it anyway. At one of my previous places with no platters, the movie would usually be run on 6000' spools. If there were no sales, I wouldn't thread the second projector. If there still wasn't anyone by the time the changeover was due, I wouldn't make the changeover and rewound that reel, and that was that. I miss changeovers. (Oops! I don't want to start another Guttag vs. Miller!!!). But seriously, if I'm running 5 shows a day of 'Miss Congeniality' or what have you, platters are the way to go.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-02-2001, 04:31 PM:
I always enjoyed the debates. I think Steve had fun with them too. Neither of us were actually angry at each other. 
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 01-22-2002, 05:43 PM:
Bumping this back up thanks to the references in a different thread about "Mandatory Showtimes".
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 01-23-2002, 03:55 PM:
Mike S, Dustin: At my nearest multiplex (Reading Cinemas, Manville NJ) the 7 PM round is spread out. Here's that round for this weekend:6:00 Black Hawk Down (print 1), Kung Pow! Enter the Fist
6:20 A Beautiful Mind
6:30 The Count of Monte Cristo
6:45 Brotherhood of the Wolf, Snow Dogs
7:00 Black Hawk Down (print 2), The Lord of the Rings
7:15 I Am Sam
7:30 The Mothman Prophecies, Orange County
7:50 A Walk to Remember
8:00 Kung Pow! Enter the Fist
Yes, Kung Pow! gets listed twice -- it only runs 81 minutes.
Last show starts 10:30 (The Lord of the Rings).
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 01-23-2002, 06:38 PM:
What is the Matinee schedule?
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 01-23-2002, 07:07 PM:
First round for that day goes:12:00 Black Hawk Down (print 1), Kung Pow! Enter the Fist,
The Lord of the Rings, The Mothman Prophecies, Snow Dogs
12:20 A Beautiful Mind, A Walk to Remember
12:30 The Count of Monte Cristo
12:45 Brotherhood of the Wolf
1:00 Black Hawk Down (print 2)
1:15 I Am Sam
1:30 Orange County
Posted by Michael Brown (Member # 890) on 02-15-2003, 03:41 PM:
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
I guess they expect people to show up late.
![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
![[eyes]](graemlins/eyes.gif)
![[thumbsdown]](graemlins/thumbsdown.gif)
.