Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Carding for 'R' rated movies

This is topic Carding for 'R' rated movies in forum Ground Level at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://ft-forum.com/ft/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=000153

Posted by Jeff Newman (Member # 752) on 02-04-2001, 12:20 PM:

Hi All..

I don't know, maybe its just me, but do any of you have customers that get VERY irate when you card them for a rater R movie?

I had one guy threaten to KILL me last night (Quote: "Im taking you out dawg. Im not even joking, im taking you out" Then he stared at me very evil as he walked by) The employee next to me had someone start pounding on the glass screaming for a manager because he didnt think he should show his ID. Literally screaming obscenities and banging his fists on the glass.

Is it just me? What is the big deal? Please someone enlighten me as to this aspect of humanity. Why we threaten to beat, kill, cuss people out over showing a piece of plastic with our age on it.

Sorry, rough night last night :-)

-Jeff "Box office god" Newman

P.S Funny side story:

Told people all last night "Walk around the chains, not over them! They are there for a reason!" I even had some lady scream back at me "Ill walk over them if a damn well want to!" (I told her when she came to my window to buy a ticket, "No, you will not! Do you understand? If I see you do it again you will be escorted off the property!") Anyways, not 1 hour later, somebody was walking over the chains, tripped, fell on their face splitting their chin open.. People never listen and just think your being a jerk for saying something. Until they trip and realize that you were not ust being a jerk.. I told one of the managers I am going to weld spikes onto the top of the chains to prevent people walking over them. :-)

Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 02-04-2001, 01:38 PM:

What does it say on the back of your ticket?

Posted by Daryl Lund (Member # 356) on 02-04-2001, 02:27 PM:

you could put up a sign. that says you must show your ID or the ss john mc Cain and Joe liberalman. will put you in jail and fine the poor box office person 10,000.00 .

Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 02-04-2001, 03:06 PM:

You aren't going to like my answer, but about the only thing that will eventually solve the problem is a manager who will take the person aside, and let them know that unless they not only provide the ID, but apologize directly to the employee that was cursed at or threatened, they won't be allowed in the theatre ever again. The manager then has to follow through, and make sure all the assistants do as well. This isn't a policy that corporations like.

Word gets around quickly, and a--holes hate being taken to task and made to apologize.
They usually end up threatening to get the manager fired or some such.

There is no reason you should ever accept being cursed at or threatened. If the management expects that of you, and repeatedly refuses to take action despite your requests, wait until it happens again in the middle of a Saturday night rush, and tell the manager you are leaving immediately and he can deal with the customer. Eventually some crackpot will take a jab at a face, and better that jab get directed at the person who allowed things to deteriorate.

Thirty or forty years ago, there wouldn't have been a question. The doorman, manager, or even a nearby customer would have taken the guy out back and... err.. given instructions in manners.

The other side of that coin was that employees always had to treat customers with utmost courtesy and respect, and present a professional appearance at all times, with no friends hanging around, no leaning on counters or walls, etc. In other words, standards were equally high for both customer and employee behavior. Civilization can be like that.

Posted by Russ Kress (Member # 461) on 02-05-2001, 08:46 PM:

Cashiers can be abused. That's why they get glass between them and the customers!

I find that placing an assistant manager or a really big usher in the ticket line to direct traffic tends to eliminate most of the abuse.

"Hi! How are you this evening? Welcome to the theatre! The shortest line is right over there!" This also keeps the youngins from harassing other customers to buy their tickets for them.

The second usher checks stubs at the auditorium door.

When I was little, I was a wiz at sneakin' into the R rated films!

I guess it takes one to catch one *grin*.

Russ

Posted by Ky Boyd (Member # 23) on 02-06-2001, 05:35 PM:

I have to chime in here and say that I disagree about the glass thing. I strongly believe that putting a glass wall between the box office cashier and the customer is an invitiation for rudeness on both parties. At our theatre, prior to our ownership of it, people purchased their tickets from out on the porch through a glass window right next to the front door. When we took over, we turned the box office 90 degrees and put in a nice counter. People now come inside to purchase tickets and employees and customers agree it is a much friendlier, welcoming environment. We do frequent drops and never let the cash accumulate.

Obviously, with the gargantuplexes, cash security is an issue, hence the glass - but if the box office is inside the lobby is it absolutely necessary? It's not in banks.

As to the topic of this thread, if the person doesn't appear to be at least 17, then yes, by all means check their ID. However, a policy of checking all id's for R rated films is ludicrious. No one 30 or over will find it anything but absolutely ridiculous, not to mention a waste of time. The longer people wait at the box office, the less likely they are to get in line to buy concessions.

Posted by Daryl Lund (Member # 356) on 02-06-2001, 08:59 PM:

I like the glass. I think the old box office gave the old theatres some class insted of a blank front wall. NATO is asking all theatre owner to have the staff ID any one that looks under age, so we can keep the liberial Democrats and far left republicans from getting into our bussiness

Posted by Richard C. Wolfe (Member # 431) on 02-06-2001, 09:21 PM:

I know a lot of liberal Democrats...but where do you find a far left Republican?

Posted by Dwayne Caldwell (Member # 417) on 02-09-2001, 06:19 PM:

Would Colin Powell fit that category?

------------------
The man with the magic hands.

Posted by Richard C. Wolfe (Member # 431) on 02-09-2001, 11:11 PM:

absolutely not... maybe a moderate republican, but truly a conservative.

There is no such thing as a far left Republican. That would be a true oxymoron.

Posted by Tom Ferreira (Member # 70) on 02-10-2001, 01:45 PM:

Here we go again with one of my favorite topics. This always seems to pop up on this forum whenever a new R-rated film that teens may want to see is released(now it's Valentine and Hannibal). Experience has shown that you can repeat the policy several times on the theatre recording, post sign at the front door, box office, concession stand, wherever, and you're still going to get some little jerk who feels that he's the one who's the exception to the policy. I've had box office cashiers sworn at by 16 and 17 year olds. One ass threw a tensabarrier across my lobby one night. My policy on such matters? Zero tolerance and no backing down from your stand. Even the slightest utterance of profanity(and I mean ANY profanity), means ejection from the premises. What has gotten into kids? I blame it on the XFL and that M & M guy(even though we sell a lot of his candy)

Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-10-2001, 08:28 PM:

Tom, it is going to happen. Fortunately, only 10% of the little brats are going to pull this crap on you. Once they finally accept you have zero tolarence towards that, they will usually back off.

Posted by Jeff Newman (Member # 752) on 02-12-2001, 08:19 AM:

To me, you see a sign at the gas station, or gorcery stores that say "If you look under 30, we will ID you" Thats the same judgement I use. I have seen 25 year olds that look 15 and 15 year olds that look 25. Im a bad judge I guess. I just always take the safe route. 18 to buy cigarettes, 17 to see an R rated movie. I don't think they would get as pissed if they were buying smokes, so they shouldnt get that mad to see an R rated movie...

Now about the cussing thing. If I do have someone in front of me cursing, etc.. I have the right (and the managers back me) to stop the sale immediatly, give them their money back and tell them to leave. The problem is most of the people take their change/tickets and walk away and say "Thanks asshole" or something to that effect. Now, the line is to the back of the door, as soon as they step away, someone walks right up to my window. My options are very limited. I can run around the corner and eject the person, leaving the window/customer. Or I can yell to the guest services desk for a manager and hope they are not busy etc.. My point is that the options are very limited, unless the sale has not yet been completed and they are standing in front of my window. I can say that management is usually VERY supportive, and do not expect us to be cussed at or anything. They have a very limited tolerance or patience for cussing :-)

Posted by Jason Black (Member # 684) on 02-13-2001, 07:07 PM:

I'll yield my two cents from a manager's standpoint... Please bear in mind that I work for one of the major chains, so you have to keep that 'corporate policy' thing in your mind..
Two kids, ages 16 and 17 come to the window on a busy Friday night for the 7pm Hannibal. My cashier denies them a ticket due to inability to produce a valid ID. They display hostility to the cashier but do not use profane language (I know, it's far fetche dthat someone would NOT cuss you out) and they ask for a manager. I step up from the Customer Service desk (or wherever I may be) ad kindly ask what assistance might I be... The kids tell me that the lady at the window wouldn't sell them a ticket and was rude to them. I ask them what film they were planning to see with the reply being "hannibal". I ask for ID myself and, of course, they can't produce. I tell them that I'm sorry but we will not sell a ticket to anyone underage (-17). This was NOT the answer they were looking for so they display more mouth to me and blab on about how they NEVER get carded any other time, even at my theatre... yada yada yada... I break in and tell them that they have been given my final answer and there is nothing further to discuss, you can buy a ticket for another movie but not for an R rated film. And don't get caught trying to cross over or you'll be asked to leave with no refund given.

When they elevate the verbal assualt, I offer to call the police and let them settle the matter. This works 99% of the time. Kids are assholes these days because they KNOW that they will most likely be allowed to get away with it. I blame it on the liberals in society who have allowed anyone and evryone BUT themselves to raise their kids, but that's a story all it's own.

Corporate policy or not, I simply REFUSE to be treated like a dog from a customer anymore. It's bad enough that corporate folks treat you the way they do....

Bottom line, stand your ground and keep the riff raff out. The money they bring in is not sufficient enough to replace the money you will eventually lose when the regular customers you have stop coming to your facility due to the troubles kids create.

Your milage may vary. Rant mode off. The above did not happen to me this wknd, instead I had a run in with a drunk middle age man who had $27 worth of gift cert's that expired 12/31/00. If anyone cares to hear the story I'll tell it if asked.

------------------
The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese!

Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 02-14-2001, 03:45 AM:

Tell us, tell us!!!

Posted by Robert Golding (Member # 746) on 03-04-2001, 02:42 AM:

I guess I'm lucky. I haven't had any problems and this is because I have a drive in theatre. I believe 99% of the people who drive there car to the theatre are at least 17 yrs old. So I don't bother checking ID's.

Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 04-15-2001, 01:12 AM:

I just read about this on AOL Family News (www.aol.com) this evening. Sorry I could not provide you with a link. AOL is funky that way.

Here is the article:
............................................

Movie Exhibitors Feeling Political Heat

By Pamela McClintock and Carl Diorio

WASHINGTON (Variety) - Got ID? Theater owners across the country are increasingly asking this question as pressure mounts to make sure America's kids aren't watching R-rated pictures, absent an accompanying adult.

Already this year, four states have considered legislation making it a crime to allow anyone under the age of 17 into theaters showing such films without a legit chaperone.

Arkansas defeated a measure to criminalize the movie ratings system -- for this year, at least. Same goes for Utah. Legislation is still pending in Massachusetts.

On March 20, the Virginia legislature passed a measure making it a Class 1 misdemeanor for a person or theater to sell a ticket for certain movies to kids under 17.

For Hollywood, Virginia's sting was softened by the fact that the final version of the law doesn't talk about R-rated movies, but rather movies "harmful" to juveniles, an extremely difficult legal standard to meet.

Even if most proposals don't become the hard-and-fast rule,

they are a troubling sign for National Assn. of Theater Owners (NATO) president John Fithian, who said that exhibitors have lost millions of dollars in revenues with the latest Hollywood freeze-out.

'SCARY PROPOSITION'

"I think it's serious when you have four different state legislatures saying, 'We're going to take your voluntary ratings system and attach criminal penalties.' It's a scary proposition. I don't remember a year in recent history when four pieces of legislation were introduced that essentially do the same thing." Fithian told Daily Variety. "The issue hasn't gone away, it's just shifted from the feds to the states."

Legally, there is no official sanction against theaters allowing kids into R-rated movies without an adult present.

These days, Fithian is repeatedly instructing member exhibitors to card, period. Never mind that a trip to the movies might feel more like going through U.S. Customs.

No one wants the situation to get so out of hand that they face a fine or jail time for letting a 15-year-old into the latest hit flick, or for that matter, an adult guardian who really isn't 21 years of age.

AMC Entertainment -- which recently pulled out of NATO -- has taken the additional step of carding any guardian who appears to be in their early 20s, said Rick King, spokesman for the Kansas City, Mo.-based circuit.

REPORT RESULT

Most everyone said the latest flurry is a direct result of last fall's fierce debate in Washington over the marketing of violent R-rated movies to teens and kids. A Federal Trade Commission report criticized the MPAA and NATO for doing an end-run around the ratings system, which they jointly administer.

MPAA president-CEO Jack Valenti, who developed the ratings in the 1960s, immediately drew up a 12-point initiative changing the way the seven major studios pitch their pictures to young audiences. At the same time, NATO got dead serious about enforcing age restrictions.

"In tightening up our enforcement procedures and being as vigilant as we can be, we absolutely lose business. But it's the right thing to do," Fithian said.

But lawmakers like Arkansas legislator Mark Smith aren't mollified. Smith introduced a bill this year that would make it a misdemeanor for theater owners to either sell a ticket for an R-rated movie to an unaccompanied youngster, or allow such kids to jump theaters. Legislation was defeated in committee, but Smith continues to call on Arkansas theater owners to do a better job among themselves.

VOLUNTARY SYSTEM

"I think a lot of parents are shocked to find out that the rating system is absolutely and totally voluntary. Theaters are not required by any law to restrict ticket sales. I think most places do a fair job at the door, but once kids get into a multiplex, that's it," Smith said.

MPAA senior vice president for legislative affairs Vans Stevenson said bills attacking the movie ratings system are introduced year in and year out at the state level. He said the proposal to make the sale of tickets to certain customers a crime has come up before, but not in recent years.

Stevenson said the Constitution is ultimately on Hollywood's side.

"At this point, no ratings enforcement legislation has any traction," Stevenson said.

MPAA and NATO have lobbied hard at the state level in recent weeks, extending an olive branch to lawmakers in Arkansas, Massachusetts, Utah and Virginia. Efforts paid off, particularly in Utah and Arkansas.

General Cinemas spokesman Brian Callahan said it's inappropriate to target exhibitors with criminal penalties, considering the extra steps they are taking. General Cinemas posts lobby signs in all theaters stressing that a "guardian" who escorts minors into R-rated movies must be 21 years old, and has sent out reminders to make sure theater managers are keeping staff informed.

Massachusetts state Rep. Brad Hill said he recently introduced a measure to clamp down on video stores and movie theaters after constituents claimed that their children routinely gain improper access to R-rated material. Legislation has yet to be acted on.

"Believe me when I tell you that I'm not trying to blow up the movie industry. Most theaters do a very good job, but clearly there are some video stores and theaters that don't," Hill told Daily Variety.

04:37 04-12-01

Posted by Jim Ziegler (Member # 86) on 04-15-2001, 03:12 AM:

I think my prefered solution to this is to make it a civil offense for anyone under the age of 17 to be in a R rated theatre without an adult... Try as we may, we can't catch all these kids from sneaking in... But, if the ones we do catch go home wiht a $100 ticket and a court date, they might think twice about waiting for the video..

Posted by Brad Allen (Member # 470) on 04-16-2001, 06:58 PM:

In our theater, we catch much grief from the parents for trying to keep their kids outta R rated films. We require the parent to come in and buy the ticket, and to write out and sign a note stating it's ok for so and so to see such and such film.

Posted by Mike Judge (Member # 558) on 04-16-2001, 09:17 PM:

Ahh the parent grief...you mean I have to sit there with them? This is what I get the one time I work on the floor through the week. We used to require that just the parents buy the tickets, now they must accompany them through the movie. I'm still up in the air over this whole thing. I remember what it was like to be 16, all 4 years ago, yet I know what it's like to be a responsible manager. I know that a manager in town was assualted because the father found out his daughter had made it into "Summer of Sam." This is what I use to reinforce my reasonings for carding. And the kids in the box accept it too....I always tell them that they'll get to help out in dealing with the person if there's a problem. A little responsibility really brings people up to the plate. I'm glad that my staff has so far preformed admirably. No complaints, other than not being admitted, as to date.

Posted by James R. Hammonds, Jr (Member # 673) on 04-17-2001, 12:09 AM:

oh, my god, mike judge is on this forum!!!
those beavis and butt-head shows are great, man!

Posted by Chris Duvall (Member # 787) on 04-17-2001, 01:59 AM:

I had my staff today do their job to the letter of the Regal policy and guidlelines set by the MPAA. And what do I get in return, some jacka$$ sneaking into Blow anyway that we had to remove because he thought it was BS. He called me just about everything under the sun (in front of children in my lobby BTW) ranging with insults from necrophelia, beastiality, incest and this is not including what he planning to do to me as well.

My staff tells me that this jerk went ahead and blatenly walked into Blow and glared at them as he did. This is why the got me to ask for his ticket. They knew he would be trouble. As soon as I askfor stubs he starts dropping F-bombs in the auditorium in front of the customers. I, of course, just ask him to leave and he can pick up his refund at the box office on his way out. This is when he starts his little tantrum of insults and threats as he walks out. Luckily Las Vegas metro police made it to my site in time to have the guy trespassed off the property.

The guy turns out to be 22 years old but he did not want to show his ID. Last time I checked, it is unlawful in NV to go around without proper ID if you are older than 18. Mr. Officer was kind enough to re-iterate this to Mr. Jerky. The last time I had problems with carding I had one guy spit on my window and another on my lobby floor. ??!!??!!

I just don't get it, I feel more like a babysitter than a manager.

Maybe there should be maturity ID's as well as age ones. One with the lack of maturity, will be barred from public...aahhh. Just a pipe dream, oh well.

------------------
Chris Duvall
General Manager
Regal Cinemas
Colonnade 14
Las Vegas, Nevada

Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 04-17-2001, 08:50 AM:

"Last time I checked, it is unlawful in NV to go around without proper ID if you are older than 18. "

What?!?!? It is illegal to drive in every state without an I.D., but I've never been aware of a law that required carrying an I.D. at all times outside of times of marshall law, at military installations, and at border crossings. I suspect the cop was over-reaching. Spitting in public places may be illegal, however. IIRC, the laws against it date back to the times when TB was running rampant and 'baccy chewers didn't want to carry spit cups.

Posted by Brad Allen (Member # 470) on 04-17-2001, 02:20 PM:

No Actually I meant getting chewed out because I wouldn't let their little brat into such and such.

Course then you've got the idiot parents that walk in the door with their two 5 & 8 yr old daughters, and buy 4 tickets to the film that deserved it's R rating the most.

"You have to have a license to have a dog, but any d*ckweed can be a father". Great quote uttered by Mr Reeves in Parenthood.

Posted by Gordon Hedges III (Member # 863) on 05-01-2001, 10:03 PM:

I try not to get started on this subject, due to many incidents of people not old enough or producing ID's. From people telling me that they can leave and bring me a bottle of liquor to prove they are over 21 (which I tell them to pick up their ID on the way back

) to the parent who walks in with their children and sneak out as soon as the trailers come on. I have a saying that I repeat everytime I am done with these type of people. "I really hate stupid people".

I just thought of a cool idea. We should start branding the patrons with a white-hot iron poker when they produce an ID. That way, if they come back to your theatre they can just show you the nice scar. The brand can be your company logo or a GM's initials. You won't have to worry about "I left my ID in my car 200 miles away" or "You didn't card me last time" crap.

Do you know what is even more annoying than an individual that doesn't meet the age requirement buying a rated R ticket? The ones who just turned 17 a couple days ago and give you a hard time? No. The ones who just have a few days to become a legit rated R patron? YES!!! The ones who say, "Hey, Man!! Come on!! I will be seventeen in a couple of days!" I just tell them that I was denied a ticket to see a PG-13 film two days before my 13th b-day. I waited patiently and so should they. NEXT.

Posted by Jim Ziegler (Member # 86) on 05-03-2001, 03:24 AM:

Jerry,

A lot of states require people over a certain age (usualyl 18) to carry identification..

Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 10-02-2001, 05:04 PM:

Related to this thread and just as pertinent:

At the AMC Hamilton in New Jersey an usher checks ID on all patrons going into L.I.E. That's because the movie is rated NC-17.

Posted by Dave Williams (Member # 299) on 10-03-2001, 09:33 PM:

I had a customer just three weeks ago threaten to beat my head off of my scrawny little body because we ID'd him. I came out from behind the counter got in his face and said "please oh please do that, then when you are in prison I can have sex with your wife".

He backed off and left. I am not sure if it was the prison or the sex remark, but both made him realize that this scrawny little fella had more balls than he did.

Dave

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 10-05-2001, 12:22 PM:

OK, I'm confused. If there is no law *requiring* us to card those who appear to be underage, then why is it I've been told we can get fines for selling tickets to minors?

I think it should be enforced by law.

Also, is there an exact rule as to who can buy tickets to R movies? I've heard different things at different times. I've been told that Only people 17 and over can purchase the tickets. Also been told that if you're over 17, you can purchas one ticket for one of your friends that's not. Also been told that only a parent or guardian over 21 can purchase tickets for minor under 17, and that guardian MUST acompany them. Also been told that the guardian mush purchase the ticket but doesn't have to acompany them. Is it pretty much up to the manager's discretion?

Posted by Christopher Duvall (Member # 284) on 10-05-2001, 02:21 PM:

Some states are forcing the issue. From what I understand, states do have the power to do so, the feds do not. I have heard that the Virginian senate is trying to make some sort if a fine to theatres and/or the minors parents depending on the situation. The again, that could be rumor 'cause I live in NV and not there anymore. Can anybody confirm this?

Posted by Kristin Wahlund (Member # 922) on 10-06-2001, 12:20 AM:

Our GM tells us that since it is R meaning Restricted, that yes is it a movie law. But I've never seen the movie police...

------------------
Kristin Wahlund
Regal Cinemas
Eagan 16, MN

Posted by Aldo Baez (Member # 790) on 10-06-2001, 04:48 AM:

Ken, the way we do it is if you are going to bring a minor in, you MUST be 25 or older with id. This gets some people pretty pissed off, but we do not want a 21 year old buying for all his 17 year old friends. We hope that being 25 or older people have grown out of that stage, usually they have.

Posted by Kevin Baglow (Member # 721) on 10-06-2001, 08:21 AM:

Yep, I had two threats in one day last week. One was going to belt me up and burn the place down. At a morning session his lady friend & Kids that arrived earlier got a discount from a special we were running because she asked for it but He didn't. And later A cranky grand farther Threatened to 'get me' because he had to cue for a busy session, and i asume later complained to the fire bregade that 'we Locked people in the theatres'. Fire safty officers then visited and said they new it wasn't true. In retrospect, its better to be busy and put up with minor problems than be quiet & broke.

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 10-06-2001, 01:02 PM:

Last night was my night on the floor. I was standing in the box office for a while and one of the employees pointed out a guy who had come up to the window 3 times to buy tickets for Joy Ride. So I proceeded to go to the ticket stand and ask for the ID of everyone with him as they entered. I told my GM waht I was about to do just to make sure it was ok. He said that it is company policy that a "guardian" is anyone 17 or over, and as long as one person in the group is at least 17, there's nothing we can do. I later read an email that confirmed this.

Posted by Michael Gonzalez (Member # 593) on 10-06-2001, 07:48 PM:

I always took guardian to mean "Legal Guardian" meaning someone who is either a parent or have legal custody of the minor (Such as a foster parent). A 21 year old should not be able to purchase tickets for their 16 year old sibling. Nor should a parent be allowed to buy tickets for their child's friends.

Posted by Christopher Finn (Member # 938) on 10-09-2001, 02:02 AM:

Here is how we do things at the theatre where I work.

You must be accompanied by a PARENT. No sister, no older boyfriend, nada. The only type of exception is if you are brought in by an adult. I have seen an "adult" bring a group of underage people in, when we have asked the adult if they are watching the show and they reply yes. At that point, we have done our job. If little Johnny's mommy wants to get in my face because he saw boobies and decapatations and heard naughty words, she needs to take it up with the grown-up who took them, not me. I do not get paid to baby-sit your brats, and if I didn't let them in unless they were obviously accompanied by an adult, I have done what I am paid to do.

I will go above and beyond to try to enforce the rated R policy, but dammit, parents need to stop passing the buck and take responsibility. Hell, the kids need to take responsibility! I am tired of these parents who tear me a new bum because I threw their "precious angel," who snuck into JoyRide after being denied a ticket, out on his ass! "Take your money back and leave, little Johnny. Tonight you are more trouble then you are worth!"