This is topic A Need for More Security in forum Ground Level at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Frank Rapisardi (Member # 435) on 02-05-2001, 11:32 AM:
This past weekend an 11 year old boy was at Regal Cinemas in Springfield Ma.He had just seen(as reported by t.v.newscasts) the slasher film Valentine.He called his parents for a ride home after the movie.He was waiting in their arcade and got into a fight with another young man believed to also be 11 years old.The second youth stabbed him to death . This took place within the confines of the theater!What the hell is going on.!) !1) How did he get in,? and 2) Where was the theter staff?------------------
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-05-2001, 04:02 PM:
Frank, I just read about that today. I could not believe it. I almost choked on my coffee.I think we are going to see some political fallout on this incident, in addition to possible lawsuits against Regal.
Posted by Russ Kress (Member # 461) on 02-05-2001, 08:33 PM:
Charleston Police officers are allowed by the city to "moonlight" in uniform for private businesses.I use their services on occasion if I feel the content of a film will draw in the rowdys. It's a little expensive (when compared to floor staff wages), but I have never been questioned for hiring them. My boss calls it "an ounce of prevention".
The question "Where was the theatre staff?" was a bit unfair. 90% of the staff were probably teenaged part-timers who were never expected, or trained, to act as security agents for the theatre.
Our use of armed officers is rare and was never even considered for our run of "Valentine".
I would hope that any lawsuit against Regal would charge that Regal had the ability to see the future and then failed to act.
It was a tragedy that could have happened anywhere, in any type of business or on any playground.
It's a shame, but that's just the way it is today. I can't see any fault on Regal's behalf.
Russ
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-05-2001, 09:12 PM:
Russ, it is my understanding that Regal uses managers who are much older than teen-agers. If a scuffle was starting, any floor employee should have noted that and called the manager immediately. Regal does not seem to believe in projectionists. They want the manager/operator concept. Chances are, the manager was in the booth or someplace else that made him "inaccessable" when he or she was needed the most, that being an emergency. In my last observation of a Cineplex theater in this area (in a mall) a security staff was available to stop something before it ever got started. They were specifically hired for that. And, the security personnel and managers were not young people, they were in their 20's and 30's.
Security at this theater is very tight, and nobody ever complained about it.
Posted by Manuel Francisco Valencia (Member # 710) on 02-05-2001, 09:18 PM:
The theatre that I am currently working at always has at least two police officers on duty on the weekend. This past weekend me and my GM made sure that one of the officers, an usher, or one of us was standing at the auditorium doors of valentine for this exact reason. As far as crowd control goes ushers should be trained on how to at least say "what are you doing, show me your ticket, get to your movie." I believe all theatres should have some sort of security on the really busy days. I know that every theatre doesn't have cops like we do but my theatre is located on the "bad" side of town. When you work with us you learn haw to handle these type of situations.
Posted by Scott Oakley (Member # 651) on 02-05-2001, 10:43 PM:
While I agree that this incident was a tragedy that shouldn't have happened I think a better question than "where was the theatre staff?" would be "where were the parents?"
Posted by Russ Kress (Member # 461) on 02-05-2001, 10:58 PM:
SCOTT!!Be careful!! The voice of reason is not as appreciated as it used to be! (LOL)
Regal should have had Hawk missiles on the roof to thwart a possible attack by a deranged Cessna pilot!
*Geez, they'll let anyone have a pilot's license!*
Posted by Rachel Carter (Member # 693) on 02-05-2001, 11:17 PM:
I don't think this is the time to be blaming this tragedy on the parents or on the theater...How old is the age to start blaming the child??? He's not 4, he's 11...he knew he was killing someone.------------------
"Blood is thicker then blondes" - From the movie, Save the last Dance.
FUNNY!!!!!
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-05-2001, 11:23 PM:
I agree rachel to a point but we all knew was going to happen sooner or later people use theatres as inexpensive babysitters and dont care about thier kids for 2 hours. In mass it is illegal to leave a child under 13 by themselves. ITS THE LAW FOLKS NO KIDS UNDER 13 WITHOUT PARENTS OR GUARDIANS. I believe the parents should be charged for abondining thier child which faccilitated the murder.------------------
I love to smoke I smoke seventhousand packs a day and I'm never F*&ing quittin!-- Denis Leary
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-06-2001, 01:08 AM:
Sean, I didn't know that was a law in MA. So we have a commodity of errors. The parents dumped the kids off, and the theater did not question their age when they sold them their tickets. And, when the scuffle started, nobody stepped in. Then it was too late.Things sure fell through the cracks, didn't they?
Posted by Frank Rapisardi (Member # 435) on 02-06-2001, 06:43 AM:
Security. My biggest concern is how did an 11 year old boy; and probabley many get into this film? To those who blame the parents;your 100% correct. However the theater company should be checking I.D's This doesn't sit well.Is the dollar more important than a childs life. Maybe Washington is right with their concerns about our industry! I don't know. All I know is that this sickened me! Thi should never have happened.Everyone that responded so far is correct. The parents should have known what the kids were going to see.However Regal Cinemas should not have let them in ,in the first place.------------------
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-06-2001, 11:42 AM:
Folks, the fact is that the theatre has no responsibility to card people. it is not the law. If its a policy that they did not follow through with then they could probably get sued but i dont know if it will hold up. I think its the parents 100%. The parents should be charged with negligent manslaughter or some such thing.------------------
I love to smoke I smoke seventhousand packs a day and I'm never F*&ing quittin!-- Denis Leary
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-06-2001, 12:17 PM:
Sean, perhaps the theaters should take the responsibility of carding questionable ages. Many theaters do, in fact, card these individuals. We do in our small theater chain, and we have had positive feedback from some parents. Of course, we have received some flack, also. If the kids don't bring a note from their parents, we call the parents. Some of them had a cow when we asked them, and thanked us for being concerned. Obvoiusly, we have a good reputation in this area. As I have said before, if we don't take steps to police ourselves, the government eventually will do it for us.
Personally, I am sick and tired of hearing the old phrase, "It is not my responsibility". That is a cheap cop-out.
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-06-2001, 12:31 PM:
Frank, I certainly agree with you. This is another reason why I walked out on Regal. My standards are a little higher than theirs when it comes to dealing with patrons and how I treat the employees.
Also, if I was to do it over again with Regal, I would do it exactly the same way, except I would walk out sooner.
Posted by Ky Boyd (Member # 23) on 02-06-2001, 05:45 PM:
My question about this whole unfortunate and tragic incident is where was the arcade located in the theatre complex? Was it a separate room off of the lobby? What staff had a view of the arcade? Is anyone assigned to frequently monitor the arcade?In my limited experience with megaplexes, it always seems that the arcade is a room off of the lobby, frequently very dark, oppressively noisy, and not visibly monitored by any staff.
While a killing is the most extreme thing that could go wrong is such a setting, it also seems to be a perfect setting for vandalism, harrasment and an assortment of other infractions.
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-07-2001, 12:47 AM:
Paul,
I was not saying that the theatre should not card people, I was saying it has no LEGAL responsibility to card people. I believe in following the MPAA guidelines. and I think every theatre should. When I have kids I will not let them see R rated movies without an adult WITH THEM. none of this just buying the ticket crap.------------------
I love to smoke I smoke seventhousand packs a day and I'm never F*&ing quittin!-- Denis Leary
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-07-2001, 10:55 AM:
Sean, thank you. Sorry I seemed so harsh towards your previous comment. True, we may not have a legal responsibility, but we can certainly institute a moral responsibility. I certainly support your idea of not letting them in. 
Posted by Rachel Carter (Member # 693) on 02-07-2001, 11:39 AM:
IMO and in a PERFECT world
Parents should know their kids...They should know what they can handle and what they can't. What really pisses me off is when parents bring thier kids to an scary "R" rated movie just because they can't find a babysitter (This seems to happen very often). At my theater, when a adult tries to buy a ticket for a child I always make sure to inform them that the movie is rated "R", you'd be surprised how many parents didn't even look to see what the movie rating is.
------------------
"Blood is thicker then blondes" - From the movie, Save the last Dance.
FUNNY!!!!!
Posted by Frank Rapisardi (Member # 435) on 02-07-2001, 12:09 PM:
Sean when you have kids... I do have kids,and it's very difficult to control all or some of their actions.But as parents we have gotto try.You say you would not bring your kids to R rated films;great! But what about PG-13.I've seen some in the past few years that were raunchier than R rated films.Years ago at a Drive-In that I was working at,I brought one of my kids to see something or other that he had been nagging me to bring him to.It was rted PG or maybe back then GP (anyone remember that rating?)Anyway there was an awful lot of violence,swears,and some nudity.My manager who was a good friend of mine brought my kid home upon a request from me! We all need to clean up our acts.That's parents,our industry,our kids and SOCIETY IN GENERAL.(BOY WAS I LONG WINDED!)------------------
Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 02-08-2001, 08:30 AM:
Here is what my theatre does for Security. We use the local police force to help patrol the parking lot, interior and to help with security during registers swap outs, cash drains, etc. We generally have at least one during the day (After 2-3 pm) and then 2 at night during Fri, Sat and Sun.They are in full uniform too!
BTW, does anyone have a link to the article. I would like to show this to my other managers.
Also, we will be carding for Hannibal this weekend and watching the doors. Kids are going to buy Saving Silverman tickets to try and get into Hannibal.
We have had to implement a method to control the "kids" because we have started to become a hangout because people think that we can "babysit".
Paul.
Fri, Sat, Sun Night (6-cl)
Posted by Bill Enos (Member # 440) on 02-10-2001, 12:17 AM:
Any civilian (or a cop for that matter) who who attempts to break up a fight without some protection, or a baseball bat or a gun is just plain stupid, let the little bastards fight, it is better than being harmed yourself for nothing.
Posted by Jeff Newman (Member # 752) on 02-12-2001, 08:43 AM:
At my theatre we generally have at least 2 uniformed + gun off-duty police officers. I can tell you that their presence alone helps prevent a lot of incidents. Additionally, the projectionist does nto have to wear any sort of uniform so when he has breaks, he hangs out in the lobby, and if we see something going on far away, he will go in and kick them out, because sometimes miscreants "scatter" into the crowd and you can't find them. Since he has no uniform, they think he is just a normal person, and then when he gets close, he pulls out the walkie talkie and busts them. I like it since they don't get away with much :-) Also patrons have been good about alerting staff to potential problems, and we get the management to go over to a potential problem area which usually stops whatever is about to happen.
In addition, we have started "sweeping" the lobby (i.e if your not here to see a movie, get the F out) to prevent the kids from just "hanging out" We just started really cracking down hard on this about 3 weeks ago, and it has made a HUGE difference in the amount of incidents.
Also, on this thread of the kid killing the other. 2 weeks ago, we witnessed a 11 year old boy being walked to a police car in handcuffs. Why? He had a knife.. Scary parallel to the story that was told here.
Oh yeah, and theatres being used as babysitters? Happens all the time at our theatre. Pisses me off! I see parents taking their 7-14 year old kids to R rated movies all the time. It's like, where are your priorities! And they take them to these type of movies at 10/11:00 at night! I mean, come on! Wherenberg does have a nice policy though, no kids under 5 allowed in PG-13 or R rated movies after 6:00 PM. I always thought that was a nice policy.
Oh well, I could go on forever, I'll shut up now :-)
-Jeff Newman
Posted by Jason Black (Member # 684) on 02-13-2001, 07:20 PM:
Amen Scott Oakley...Where the hell were the parents? Granted, this is a tragedy regardless of how you look at it. The parents of either of the two 11 year olds should have been there where they belonged, with the kid. They're probably card carrying liberals and friends of thos efine fellas in Washington who are trying to put the blame on our business...
Brad, how do you make a smilie for 
issed off beyond belief:
------------------
The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese!
Posted by Jason Black (Member # 684) on 02-13-2001, 07:28 PM:
Sean/Paul/ et al..If your state has an obscenity law, you are REQUIRED BY LAW to verify age before selling tickets to certain features. Rated R, NC-17, X, etc...
While this might not apply to every state in the US, it applies to all those I have had experience with. The theatre does carry a responsibilty to control admittance to R rated films, but there are only so many ways to do so with limited staff/manpower. You hope that your doorperson(s) are doing their best to *see* where the kids are going and stop them before they disappear.
------------------
The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese!
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-13-2001, 08:16 PM:
Jason, I don't know if Washington State has an obsenity law or not. I never heard anyone tell us that we shall card people. We do it anyway if we possibly can out of moral obligations to our community.Listening to the cars going around town with the windows rolled down with their 5 Watt Kraco Car Stereos blasting Rap Music and every other word is a "F" word, I doubt it. Sometimes I think the people in Washington State are so laid back, they are like a bunch of transplanted HillBillys. 