This is topic How do we preserve the comfort of the "Ideal" 10-plex? in forum Ground Level at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://ft-forum.com/ft/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=000220

Posted by Joe Schmidt (Member # 822) on 04-19-2001, 11:36 AM:
 
Making a separate thread here. Should we allow peanuts, popcorn, soft drinks and all of that mess in the Deluxe houses, mainly Screen #1 and #2? If you want a true Deluxe house to stay that way, I don't think you can let all that stuff in there. OK for screen #3 thru #10.

The Super-Deluxe Screen #1, which also has the full stage and the 5/100 theatre pipe organ... I envisage this as being completely separate with its own public entrance, although otherwise it would be a part of the same building.

 


Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-19-2001, 03:51 PM:
 
Moving to Ground Level.
 
Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 04-19-2001, 03:56 PM:
 
If you want to make money, you should let food into every auditorium.

You shouldn't make the larger aditoriums super deluxe and then make the smaller auditoriums "cheaper." That will just piss off the customers that find out that the film they wanted to see was in an inferior house. If you make the smaller aditoriums very nice as well then people will really like the whole plex. The trick isn't designing a great large auditorium, the trick is to make a small auditoium great.


 


Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-19-2001, 04:15 PM:
 
Thank you Ian! Finally someone else who agrees with me. I've always thought that theaters like this were built by idiots. Here is a couple of very common scenarios:

Late 1980s theater (8 plex)
2 screens THX with Dolby
6 screens mono!

Late 1990s theater (12 plex)
4 screens THX with SRD/DTS/SDDS (because films sound best when played simultaneously in all digital formats, right?)
4 screens with DTS (based purely on cost)
4 screens with Ultra Stereo analog (not even with SR emulator cards)

Who dreams up these kind of layouts??? The money has already been spent! This 12 plex could've been built with SRD in every auditorium and more THX certified auditoriums to boot for the same amount of money.


 


Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 04-19-2001, 04:34 PM:
 
Gee Brad, sounds like you used to work for United Artists Theatre Circuit.

I used to argue with Bobby Pinkston about that all the time. But his hands were tied as well. The Greenwood was a mistake. Somebody goofed and they put Dolby CP65s in every auditorium with subwoofers in every auditorium, but with center/surround in the small houses. The extra speakers were still on the truck! The new theatre manager took over and pulled half the SR cards to send back for a credit! When he left, they were still under his desk. So Joe and I grabbed them and put them all back in. We moved the subwoofers all to the big houses when we got digital. After the digital blew half the surrounds, we got full stereo in the small and JBL 8340s in the big houses. It was just goofy.

Later, Bobby Pinkston went to work for Dolby and one of his first triumphs was to get Edwards to sign a contract that stated that 100% of their auditoriums would feature Dolby Digital.


 


Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 04-19-2001, 05:47 PM:
 
Brad -- I agree with you completely. That's really stupid. I do like the idea of having something "special" for the biggest one or two auditoria (maybe EX or LE/RE screen channels or 70mm or something) in a multiplex, but the idea of going all-out on a couple of screens and putting junk in the rest is just stupid and gives the theatre a bad reputation among people who don't always see films in their first week of release.

Until last summer, the GCC Burlington 10 had CP-65s and some form of digital sound (DTS, SR-D, or SDDS) in nine of the ten houses. The two big screens were THX certified and had Dolby EX. Screen 2 was Kintek mono/surround...

Thankfully, they finally replaced the Kintek stuff with a CP55 (no SR, though) and DTS unit... I can't believe that there was any logic behind the previous configuration.
 
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 04-19-2001, 05:53 PM:
 
Ian Price said....
"You shouldn't make the larger aditoriums super deluxe and then make the smaller auditoriums "cheaper."
Man this is true! I did an 8 plex in Elgin Illinois a number of years back. It had one 550 seat room with a 55 foot screen and one of the best THX systems installed at that time. I was given carte blanche when building it. Customers buying tickets loved the large theater and would always ask if the film they were comming to see was playing on the large screen??? If it was not many of them turned around and left. This created a bit of a problem so when the theater added on another 6 screens we built another large house again, with a large screen and super THX system. FYI, the other houses ranged from 160 seats to 375 seats. and the larger theaters were received better and always did better buisness than the smaller ones.
MArk @ GTS
 
Posted by Ky Boyd (Member # 23) on 04-19-2001, 07:57 PM:
 
So true Mark. If there is a vast difference in quality between auditoriums people will either start calling up and asking what films are on the "good screens" and/or just avoiding the theatre all together because of having been relegated to the "cheap" screens once too often. Quality shows and so does cheapness.
 
Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 04-19-2001, 08:22 PM:
 
Sorry guys but I have to disagree with you.

When you put your budgets together and you start lining up the cost for booth and stage set which includes screen, screen frames, masking, masking motors, curtains, Valance, speakers, speakers platforms, THX Wall and/or Baffles, speaker isolation pads, Location of HVAC units, Location of pipes in walls,THX Monitors, Certification cost per auditorium, and re-certification each and every year be ready to up your budget from a non THX auditorium.

You can still do most of what THX asks you to do but you do not need a THX Monitor at the price they charge. You can still purchase THX approved speakers, and THX approved amplifiers and I don't think anyone is going to go in the auditoriums without test equipment and tell the difference.

If Joe Schmidt is going to go to the trouble of putting in a separate entrance with a higher class concession area or restaurant with real food, then I think he can not only charge more but I believe the patrons will expect more. This does not mean that you don't build the smaller theatres to perfection, when you are charging the for first run they deserve the very best for the money they are spending.

Sorry fellows but the budgets for THX auditoriums and a non THX auditorium will not be close to each other.

OK, I'm holding my ears,start the screaming.
 


Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 04-19-2001, 08:29 PM:
 
I'm not a fan of THX. I think they did wonderful things for the industry, but their time has passed. You can do better than THX for less cost. One should know and follow the THX ideal.

The point is don't shortchange the smaller auditoriums when building a multiplex. They should still have stereo, digital, movable masking the proper ratios, nice seats, look good and not feel dinky. If people are calling you up asking you what room a film is in, your doing something wrong.
 


Posted by Joe Schmidt (Member # 822) on 04-19-2001, 08:51 PM:
 
Just a bit more information to assist with the thread. Screen #1 is envisaged with:

-- 2-projector 70/35 plus a platter
-- 70/35 mag playback capability custom-built by me
-- 3-projector Cinerama with separate mag playback system for this, also custom-built. 3-proj. should be easy to do with platters. This adds 2 more 35mm proj. + 2 platters to the booth. I have this peculiar revival idea of playing "How the west was won" in the summer to try and catch people on the way to Yellowstone Park; tie-in; probably just a matinee daily.
-- Dolby Digital & surrounds
-- Custom audio switching system to set up whatever sound format needed
-- Custom-built, by me, Interlocked mag film recorder for scoring silent movies using the 5/100 theatre pipe organ
-- Full stage for occasional dramatic arts use, special business convention presentations, etc.

So, this Screen #1 is not designed to be a full-time movie house exclusively anyway and I'd want it to stay nice; that's why no popcorns & etc. As an Archival house run by a non-profit corporation it does not necessarily have to make money -- however, there rarely is such a thing as a "no-profit" corporation.

Furthermore, if all the sound is designed by me, I can absolutely guarantee to everyone here there will no such thing as a bad house soundwise in the 10-plex. Then, in Billings MT if all the competition I have is carmike, I won't even have to work very hard to surpass this by 1000%!


 


Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 04-19-2001, 09:10 PM:
 
Is that "Pie in the Sky" I'm smelling? It don't smell good, does it?
 
Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 04-19-2001, 09:22 PM:
 
How's the Alberta Beir Fox Theatre doing?

Center for the Performing Arts


 


Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 04-19-2001, 09:23 PM:
 
Joe, What do you know that your not telling us. I don't think you have enough people in the whole state to support the type of theatre your going to be building.

I think maybe I will join Ian for a bite of pie. Make mine Chocolate Cream, Please.

Oh, yes a latte also.
 


Posted by Darryl Spicer (Member # 711) on 04-20-2001, 12:18 AM:
 
I have had the pleasure of working with THX systems. Our theater was equiped with two of them until our company pulled them out in favor of dts sound systems. I agree with Bob in that you can achieve the same results just by setting things up as if it were THX and just not using THX monitors. The houses that were THX I think sound bettr now than they did with the monitor. The best thing THX did was raise awareness that you need the highest quality equipment for the best sound.
 
Posted by Joe Schmidt (Member # 822) on 04-20-2001, 01:22 AM:
 
No, pie in the sky it is not; this project is being researched and worked on.

Ian, the Alberta Bair is alive and well; and it presents performing arts all the time almost exclusively. It does NOT do movies well, steep projection angle from the old booth, but these are only occasionally. But it's one of these things run by "committee" of society ladies, an environment from which any sensible person will run like hell. An unfilled need is for something that can handle "intermediate" events for which the Bair is just too big and expensive. As you know about the Bair, you may also know about the Babcock, dead in the middle of what we call Dreadful Downtown Billings. Also bad movie house with steep angle too. Insurmountable problem here is ownership by landlord who wants huge rents and thus nothing can work in the Babcock, hasn't for years. Sits empty. The whole downtown area is well known as a Graveyard For Capital and no knowledgeable business person would do anything down there.

It is entirely probable that Billings, MT is the wrong place completely for such a project, however it just happens that here is where I live. This used to be a good movie town before carmike came along, wrecked everything and drove people away. For the moment, conceptually the 10-plex is quite conventional for screens #3 thru 10.

One thing's a slam-dunk certainty, a multiplex properly run with good projection will take away most of whatever business carmike has left. The challenge will be to make people aware and get them to come back to the movies again.

Now is not the time to build anything. There are VERY worrisome danger signs on the economic horizon. At what I see now, no decision can be made on the financial practicality for another 2-3 years.



 


Posted by Jonathan Haglund (Member # 807) on 04-22-2001, 07:47 PM:
 
Ian:
My Edwards signed a contract to have all Dolby Digital??
I wonder if it was just at least every location have DD, but not every projector. My theatre has 5 DD, and 5 DTS, and the whole circuit is phasing out dual or tri digital systems, with only a few exceptions. But then there's the art houses. They do have DD now, but that conversion was recent.

Anyway, I like my 10 plex layout. All theatres have the same basic equipment with digital sound, Christie projectors, same amps, same moveable masking, same 2:1 screens (!!). Though if there's any intelligence upstairs, they take the Simplex XL's from the closed locations and give them all to me
We have 2 large(er) auditoriums with 4000 watt bulbs instead of 3k like the others and much bigger screens. Its more equal this way and cuts down on people getting angry when a movie goes from a big theatre to a small one. I have Along Came A Spider in our smallest theatre and there are no complaints because the experience in the same, just closer.

At the gigaplexes, its the same way, except the big halls get bigger. Much bigger. And are promoted as much more of a shi-shi o-la-la experience.

Someone actually said "Yes, its 1985, and while Dolby is nice and all, I think we'll go the mono route. The people won't notice, they'll be too distracted by the pretty lobby." ???

------------------
Jonathan Haglund
Edwards Theatre Circuit, Inc
Park Place 10
 






Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.3.1.2