This is topic Star Wars Episode 2 booking terms. in forum Ground Level at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Darryl Spicer (Member # 711) on 04-29-2002, 06:18 PM:
I have heard that the booking terms for Episode 2 will worse than the ones for Episode 1. One thing that our GM said he had heard was that ole Georgie may go as far as making his own showtimes for the theaters. Come on, I can see it now ten minute intermissions. 10am showtimes. Anyone else out there heard anything along these lines or have anything to add.
Posted by Tom Fermanian (Member # 1094) on 04-29-2002, 07:12 PM:
As I mentioned in another topic,We are hearing that :An appreciable number of indy theatre owners in Quebec independantly are awaiting the final booking terms in order to either book or refuse the picture if terms are anything like the last one, that means that in this Province of 7 million people, S W 2 will be shown in the 4 or 5 major markets (controled by major chains that play anything at any price up here) and most of the rest will wait a few weeks for terms to come down, if not,they'll undoubtebly skip the picture alltogether.Theatre owners are claiming that the last SW was the worst deal they ever had and lost money on their engagements.If they refuse, it will be about 20 or more separate markets that will pass this new one ??? Unlike the last Star wars, there are loads of pictures surrounding this release! An interesting comment heard "If my theatre has to depend one One picture to survive,I might as well close it down right away" ------------------
Posted by Jim Ziegler (Member # 86) on 04-30-2002, 05:16 AM:
Dictating showtimes is something I hope no booker agrees to... Lucas only has power over exhibition as long as exhibition refues to say No.
Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 05-01-2002, 12:20 PM:
As someone commented on one of the other recent Star Wars threads, theaters will do OK without Star Wars, but what about Star Wars without theaters? I good point....------------------
This one time, at Projection Camp, I stuck a xenon bulb....
Posted by Greg Mueller (Member # 17) on 05-01-2002, 12:33 PM:
I will never see it at a theater. Maybe not at all------------------
Greg Mueller
Amateur Astronomer, Machinist, Filmnut
http://www.muellersatomics.com/
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 05-01-2002, 01:56 PM:
If Lucas is so picky about presentation, why does he allow Star Wars to be released on video? Then he has NO control over presentation. Many video setups are mono, 13" screens, poor viewing angles/lighting, bad color adjustments, etc....there are probably even a few black&white sets running the films! Horrors!If he REALLY was uncompromising, he would show the movies ONLY in theatres and ONLY those theatres with (at least) digital sound. But we all know he really REALLY cares most about the bottom line.
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 05-01-2002, 04:40 PM:
>>Sarcasm switch 'on'<<Mike, I cannot BELIEVE how sarcastic you are!
>>Sarcasm switch 'off'<<
------------------
"It's not the years honey, it's the mileage". - Indiana Jones.
Posted by Tom Fermanian (Member # 1094) on 05-06-2002, 08:40 PM:
Hi all, Terms came out today for new Star Wars, Seems almost mirror terms from the last one we are told, In Quebec, a circuit comprised of Indepedent theatres representing 1/3 of the business(205 Screens) in this Province representing about 40 Medium & small markets have REFUSED each independantly to play the picture on opening on account of bloodbath suffered on the last SW instalment.?? This story actualy made the Montreal french papers. What will happen?? No one knows if these theatre owners will relent and play the film. Rumor has it that Georgie couldn't care less about the indy's. he'll open his epic on fewer screens!!the ones that play by his rules, okay, the others be damned! 
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Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 05-06-2002, 08:53 PM:
First Print, Minimum 12 weeks,4 weeks @ 70% vs. 90/10
4 weeks @ 60% vs. 90/10
4 weeks @ 50% vs. 90/10
Second Print, Minimum 8 weeks,
Penalty clause if you pull the prints early, you will be billed for the remainder of the weeks owed at whatever the last numbers were.
I figure this film has 4 great weeks in it and then nothing.
One assumes that if you are in a small local market with no competition you can wait 8 weeks, play the film for as long or short as you like at 50% vs. 90/10. If you are in a market with competition you have to ask yourself; "Can I afford to show this film?"
Posted by Adam Fraser (Member # 1074) on 05-06-2002, 11:24 PM:
Twelve weeks, wow. I dont know if that will even be played on break anywhere near us then. I dont think even Titanic would have held up for 12 weeks in most markets. ------------------
Adam Fraser
www.pinestheatre.com
Posted by Aaron Sisemore (Member # 145) on 05-06-2002, 11:57 PM:
'Titanic' fared well into its 14th week in the big house in Sebastopol... Running in SDDS no less! It moved to a far smaller house on week 15.Episode I was no Titanic. I don;t think Episode II will be either.
-Aaron
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 05-07-2002, 12:08 AM:
12 weeks? That movie will not survive that long. Just by watching the previews, I give it 4 weeks, if that.At least it is better than 90/10.
Posted by Jason Black (Member # 684) on 05-07-2002, 10:29 AM:
I am not at liberty to say right now but the terms they have hit us with are abosufreakinglutely unheard of.....the percentage... Unimagineable....
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The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese!
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 05-07-2002, 11:26 AM:
12-week minimum for the first print? 8-week minimum for the second print? Sounds the same as the terms for Episode 1. No wonder all those theater chains started going bankrupt in 2000!This type of officially sanctioned extortion justifies Loews' policy not to play 20th Century Fox titles in Manhattan.
If Lucasfilm insists on these terms, why doesn't Lucasfilm four-wall screens to show Episode 2? That's how the Bollywood distributors get their movies shown at the Regal megaplexes here in New Jersey.
Posted by Dave Bird (Member # 490) on 05-07-2002, 01:07 PM:
I don't want to debate this myself, however I got this in my e-mail, thought Tom and others would enjoy...>>>Please give it a couple of days and then check out the new web site:
www.georgelucasbites.com
Try and forward to as many drive-ins you know.<<<
Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 05-07-2002, 01:19 PM:
Quoting Ian:
"First Print, Minimum 12 weeks,4 weeks @ 70% vs. 90/10
4 weeks @ 60% vs. 90/10
4 weeks @ 50% vs. 90/10
Second Print, Minimum 8 weeks,"
Question? Are those 90/10 over a house nut figure?
Say 90/10 / $8000.00 etc.
What kind of settlement will there be if the picture fails to meet a certain figure.
It's been over 20 years since I was involved in booking but I sure as hell would not recommend that the above terms be signed without some give on the part of the distributor.
Why not comeback and offer 95/5/$10,000. Watch how fast they will want to re-negotiate if it fails to perform in the 5th or 6th Week. 
Posted by Jonathan M. Crist (Member # 413) on 05-07-2002, 03:27 PM:
Bob 90/10 is always over a house expense figure designated in the either in the indivual contract or the master lease for that particular venue. For new multiplex builds an individual house expense is usually based on so much per seat and sometimes actually approaches actual operating costs.
However, the film distributors however really stick it to older venues where house expense for a 90/10 deal is usually just some arbitrary (often historic) assigned figure which is often much lower than and bears no relation to actual operating costs. When an operator with an old house expense attempts to request that his or her floor be raised, the distributors (at least those in my neck of the woods) often completely ignore those requests, or limit the amount of raise at given time to no more than 10%(will only cosider an increase request no more than once every couple of years or so).
Posted by Steve Anderson (Member # 364) on 05-09-2002, 05:28 PM:
Is this "12 week minimum" pretty much locked in for all who books this movie? Reason I asked is the owners of our theater said that the booker told them that it would be a 4 to 5 week minimum.
Posted by Tom Fermanian (Member # 1094) on 05-09-2002, 06:40 PM:
There are 12 or 10 & 8 week deals, in Canada , They must all be played in the multi-screen cinemas for the slated amount of weeks in the big screen being able to move it to smaller screens solely on Lucasfilms permission,wether it deseves to remain there or not, all this accompanied with what most theatre owners feel are abusive terms.It was said on the last SW EP 1 that theatres where charged pro-rata for the weeks not played if the theatres in question did not play their full engagements.Also, the distributor took permission to yank the print out of the theatre if all their conditions where not met to a tee! Charging the additional weeks originaly contracted for. 
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Posted by Michael Gonzalez (Member # 593) on 05-09-2002, 07:04 PM:
"It's been over 20 years since I was involved in booking but I sure as hell would not recommend that the above terms be signed without some give on the part of the distributor."Was that Distributor or Dictator? 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 05-10-2002, 02:07 AM:
I do sincerely hope that ALL of the exhibitors get together when Episode III is about to be released and say "no way, PASS" to these sort of ridiculous terms. Without the theaters, Lucas has no way to make money on his film and he will be forced to rethink his demands. These kind of booking contracts are just not needed. Hopefully with all of the majors combining together this sort of power can be thrown back at these kind of terms.Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but if the film is GOOD, the theaters WILL keep it in their biggest houses WITHOUT BEING TOLD TO and continue to play it week after week for however long it continues to bring in the customers. Right? No contracts or threats are needed for that to happen...just a good movie!
Posted by Pete Naples (Member # 761) on 05-10-2002, 02:22 AM:
I'm with Greg on this pile of poop. I won't be seeing at all. I caught glimpses of EP1 out of various ports, and decided not to bother, and everything I've read and seen of EP2 does nothing for me either. It opens here on Thursday, with cinemas flapping and scheduling ridiculously early first screenings. Who they think will attend at these times is beyond me. The schools are not on holiday, and AFAIK Thursday is not any kind of public holiday.
Posted by Tom Fermanian (Member # 1094) on 05-10-2002, 08:32 AM:
I agree totaly with Brad, In a Multiplex today How many pictures at One Time are sooooo successful that we are refusing people at the door?? Max 3 or 4 at one given time, Most popular picture gets the seats deserved and thats it, we are not there to turn away business, if we have to, we'll cancel shows of an unpopular picture and play a picture in tandem (yo-yo) on more screens, Let it be remided that we are in the CINEMA business,our main sphere is SHOWING MOVIES, restaurant is an added revenu and should not become our main money maker!------------------
Posted by Lance C. McFetridge (Member # 95) on 05-12-2002, 09:13 AM:
I guess my 4 week deal isn't too bad then. They reserve the right to additional weeks depending on grosses.
Posted by Dennis Benjamin (Member # 1137) on 05-12-2002, 02:55 PM:
You know, this is going to get me started on a subject that hits me where it hurts.STAR WARS was the reason I got into the business.
STAR WARS will be the reason I leave someday (I'm sure).
You see it took me a while to learn the industry and how it works. Of course the majority of my career there were no STAR WARS movies out there until the re-relases back in '97. At that time I was still a big fan. It wasn't until Episode I opened that I realized how much of a greedy b*stard Mister George actually is. As a General Manager I was forced to sign paperwork stating that I would follow certain rules concerning the release of the film (a few of my friends were let go due to a breach of that contract). But you see - I had seen the film a month before it came out and knew that the bottom line was the almighty dollar. Maybe your saying right now - jeeze you're slow - it took you that long to realize that it was all about the money??? All I have to say is - yeah - I was such a big fan for so long - yeah -it took me that long to realize. The day I threw my THX personalized Tenneessee license plate in the garbage was the day that I stopped being a STAR WARS fan.
It is sad to see an artist with such an awesome imagination trade it in for dollar signs.
------------------
"Running through life at 24 frames per second"
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 05-12-2002, 06:12 PM:
From their published showtimes, it looks like Cinemark 17 here has booked the space movie onto "only" 3 screens. (Spidey is on 4 screens). BUT they've scheduled a 9AM round of shows. First time I've seen them do that. They must figure they can make more money with 3 prints doing more shows each day, rather than more prints and normal scheduling. ?? After the first couple weeks they will probably dump the 9AM round and return to a normal 11AM or noon open and still be running all 3 prints. Seems like an interesting strategy.
Posted by Tom Fermanian (Member # 1094) on 05-12-2002, 06:44 PM:
Well in our area, 1/3 of all the available screens in this province (208 Screens) have refused the picture alltogether, the few others that have made deals are taking 1 or 2 prints in theatres that had up to 5 for Spiderman. Like I said before only the 4 or 5 major markets have signed on plus a very little few smaller ones. This made the Newspapers (national) and French Network T.V.,(dimming (excuse the pun) : Georgie's Star) Exhibs actualy came out and blasted Georgie in print and voice!One reviewer (where he saw the picture I don't know) says: When this 'flavor of the week' humdrum saga passes, there will be plenty of other films a few weeks down to push SWep2 out of the way!May the force not be with Georgie anymore!------------------
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 05-13-2002, 05:31 PM:
From what I can gather, National Amusements wants to send a message to Lucasfilm over the extortion-like terms. Here's what the NA-owned Multiplex Cinemas in New Jersey are doing:All-Jersey (Newark) -- 3 Star Wars vs. 4 Spider-Man
Amboy (Sayreville) -- 3 Star Wars vs. 4 Spider-Man
Edgewater -- 4 Star Wars (3 in 35mm, 1 in DLP) vs. 4 Spider-Man
Hazlet -- 3 Star Wars vs. 3 Spider-Man
Locally for me Reading Cinemas (Manville NJ) has 3 Star Wars vs. 3 Spider-Man.
Posted by Jacob Huber (Member # 1138) on 05-14-2002, 12:08 AM:
At our head theatre (18 screens), we have 4 prints of Ep II v. 3 of Spidey (Star Wars showing in significantly smaller houses). All our other first-run theatres have 2 prints of each and in theatres of similar size.
Posted by Steve Anderson (Member # 364) on 05-14-2002, 10:42 AM:
Our little two screen independent theater, got it for 4 weeks. And we got a great deal on the ??/?? I talked with others in this area and 4 weeks seems to be the going terms. So who is being held to the 12 week terms?
Posted by Jonathan M. Crist (Member # 413) on 05-14-2002, 10:54 AM:
In Central Pennsylvania it is an 8 week minimum. 70/70/70/60/60/60/50/40. All weeks are(of course) vs. 90/10 over your house expense (whichever is higher) with the highest percentages applied to the highest weeks in the run regardless of when those weeks occur in the run. No mention of a total miniumum aggegrate on the engagement (although I admit that I forgot to ask about that one).
Posted by Tom Fermanian (Member # 1094) on 05-14-2002, 10:55 AM:
Some theatres here have been offered 4 week deals, BUT the % ag for the 4 weeks are unreasonable, i.e. these theatres are usualy 2 week towns with business being drained out in the first 4 days!!, anyway most towns here should get the 4 week deals, but NO DICE from Lucas!Sticking to 12-10-8- 6 week deals with insistance that picture plays in the largest screen exclusively, A) Theatre owners here have told fox/lucas: If they want to dictate, rent out our theatres or buy them,B: Do they honestly think that a theatre owner would kick out a picture from a given screen if a film is performing, C: Do they think that so many flicks are performing strong that we are refusing people at the doors? Georgie! Wake up and smell the roses!------------------
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 05-15-2002, 12:09 PM:
According to Variety, Lucasfilm gave in somewhat and is allowing theaters in some highly competitive zones a 2-week minimum for multiple prints. The AMC Empire and the UA Union Square in NYC are among those theaters.In most other zones Lucasfilm is going with a 4-week minimum (standard for event films) or a 12-week minimum (like Episode 1).
Given the bad vibes and the ENDLESS ENDLESS HYPE! I give Episode 2 only 2 weeks before it falls off fast.
Posted by Bernie Anderson Jr (Member # 410) on 05-15-2002, 04:39 PM:
All I got to say is, "Go Loew's theatres in Manhattan!" None of the Loews theatres in Manhattan NY will be showing EP2. They won't give in to the demands. If all of us, AMC included, like I said ALL OF US stood up to the studios the exhibition end of the industry would be in much better shape. There's always someone that bends!
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 05-16-2002, 02:05 AM:
I applaud Loews for having some Balls
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 05-16-2002, 10:27 AM:
The Quebec indie theaters' boycott of Episode 2 made Variety.Tom F: You correctly anticipated the product jam. I didn't even know Asterix & Obelix 2 was going to open in Quebec! (Miramax has US rights but is sitting on it for now.)
Posted by Jacob Huber (Member # 1138) on 05-16-2002, 09:18 PM:
Charles: Most likely it won't get released in the US or limited if it does. I'd say 97% of people have never heard of Asterix or Obelix, and the only way I've heard of them is via French class.
Posted by Tom Fermanian (Member # 1094) on 05-16-2002, 09:31 PM:
Hey, this is the second one in a series, the first one cost 100 MILLION U.S. DOLLARS to make in France a few years back making it then the most expensive picture ever shot there, in Quebec alone when it played it had grossed more than 3 million dollars , the new adventureopened past Xmas in France & Europe outgrossing the first one 2 to 1 !!!!,Everyone in Quebec knows Asterix, Vive La Diférence!We are hoping to put the whole disgusting SW EP2 booking saga behind us by May 31st when Asterix & Obelix opens on aprx 180+ screens compared to the paltry 86 for Lucas's gem!------------------
Posted by Larry Baxter (Member # 714) on 05-22-2002, 07:26 AM:
What would you do if Fox, distributor of SWE11, as much as threatened you by letter that if you dare to even question or discuss terms or deals others may be getting....they will cut off supplying you?------------------
Posted by Brad Haven (Member # 954) on 05-22-2002, 11:06 AM:
Asterix and Obelix 2 ?.
What happened to the first one , i'm not sure if it ever got a release here?.
I loved reading the books growing up in england, i hope to see these someday on the big screen, even though i heard it (the first one) stunk ?.
Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 05-29-2002, 04:14 PM:
Just checked the weekend bookings and I can see that Episode 2 won't last 12 weeks . . .Loews New Brunswick -- 5 prints to 3
AMC Hamilton -- 5 prints to 4
Reading Cinemas (Manville NJ) -- 3 prints to 2
UA East Hampton (Long Island) -- 2 prints to 1
UA Hampton Bays (Long Island) -- 2 prints to 1
OTOH the UA Union Square in NYC stays with 5 prints for a 3rd week.