This is topic One-Sheet Typos in forum Ground Level at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


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Posted by Ky Boyd (Member # 23) on 11-10-2006, 12:11 AM:
 
One of my staff members just pointed out a funny mistake on the Fast Food Nation one sheet. Look closely at the description box below the rating. The word should be disturbing but they left the b out. Ooops!
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-10-2006, 07:16 PM:
 
What do you expect considering we now live in a culture that has no respect for proofreading and displays little pride in wanting things to be correct. Mediocrity has become the new excellence.

I see typos everywhere. On signs, restaurant menus, instruction manuals, movie credits, certainly all over the Internet, and maybe even in this post if I'm not careful. The worst is when a place of business is displaying a temporary, hand-written sign. In fact, just yesterday I was in a Starbucks that positions near its cash register a hand-written sign featuring daily trivia. Naturally, it included a possessive word misspelled as a plural. Well, in classic uptight, grammar-nazi fashion, I pulled out a pen from my backpack and wrote the correction right there on the sign in front of the staff and any nearby customer. I then paid the clerk and went off to enjoy my coffee.
 
Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 11-10-2006, 07:51 PM:
 
And what about The Pursuit of Happyness? Who is Happyness and why is she being chased?
 
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 11-10-2006, 10:16 PM:
 
One either side of our Grand Lobby there are very nice, backlit signs above the stairs leading to the lower level for the rest rooms. On the left end of the lobby is a sign indicating the stairs for the LADIES restroom, which is OK if they intended mean many women, but then what can be made of the sign on the right hand staircase that boldly proclaims MENS? It's been up there like that since the building was built. It's an integral part of art deco facade so no one has ever made any attempt to correct it, and until I pointed it out, no one seemed to notice or mind. I got up there with white-out and drew in an apostrophe. I have to redo it every year or so.
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-10-2006, 11:28 PM:
 
I think the word "HAPPYNESS" is going to have something to do with a plot point in the movie. I don't think it's a misspelling. Either that or the kid will write a school essay or something saying his dad has given him "happyness." It'll be along those lines.

I agree typos are everywhere and they "definatly" drive me crazy.
 
Posted by Brian Michael Weidemann (Member # 2243) on 11-11-2006, 02:50 AM:
 
Mike just pointed out the top one that really gets to me. First runner-up ... "prolly".
 
Posted by Ron Curran (Member # 3631) on 11-11-2006, 04:25 PM:
 
I'm tempted to buy the stationary cabinet advertised in a brochure.
I hate the cabinets that follow you around.
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-11-2006, 06:16 PM:
 
This isn't a typo, but just a stupidity thing. Once I was watching QVC and some chick was selling a tool set, and on the list of tools was:

COMB. WRENCH

Which of course means "combination wrench." She kept on calling it a "comb wrench" (rhymes with home wrench, that is) and how handy it would be to have a "comb wrench" around the house, and how there were a hundred uses for a "comb wrench" etc.
 
Posted by Wayne Keyser (Member # 2420) on 11-11-2006, 08:48 PM:
 
Frank - re the "LADIES" and "MENS" signs:

Picture the guy in the sign shop ... "You know, I'm not particular; I likes the ladies, but every now and then I likes the mens too."
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 11-11-2006, 11:19 PM:
 
Honestly, I have ZERO SYMPATHY with any of these complaints. Get used to it. Look forward to more bullshit with movie posters. Be happy with orgasmic joy over the mistakes. That is the only option.

The graphic design industry is woefully infected with lots of wannabe talent-less hacks who think they are "artists" since they illegally downloaded hacked versions of Photoshop, Illustrator and Quark Xpress.

The United States no longer requires anyone to have any formal training, any kind of graphic design degree or any qualifications at all whatsoever -or even a decent portfolio of work. Just be willing to work for $6 an hour and have the "honor of being published" (one of the greatest jerk offs of all for any dumb-ass willing to fall for it).

Most professions require at least some proof of competence in order to gain employment in that profession. The United States has not required that of graphic design in many years. And by that measure our level of graphic design has paled stupidly in comparison to that of many European countries for a long time now. That especially goes to northern European countries like Sweden, which I believe (in my EXPERT OPINION) has been factual for at least the past several years if not longer.

The United States is sucking ass in so many areas. We love to pat ourselves on the back about how great we are. But other countries have been passing us by in many different categories while we've been too busy going on about our own stupid pride.

It all gets back to that cheap-ass "good enough to get by" ethic of our current business culture. Fuck ever doing the job right, or even competently. Sluff it off. Charge the customer double for the trouble on top of that!
[Mad]

If the United States goes down the tubes we only have ourselves to blame for it. No one else. Don't try to blame any politician either. Don't try to blame any other country for it either. It's all OUR FAULT. We don't give a shit about doing a job right at all. We are not willing to pay for it. So if our country and culture diminishes in relevance, we deserve for that to happen.

Hollywood pisses me off so much these days I feel like rooting for greater Europe to torpedo their business into the ground. It would be great really! Watch that whole Hollywood industry implode and have the movie making business center move off to London or Paris or even New Delhi! Watch all those assholes who expect to fetch $750,000 on the sale of a shitty two bedroom house in California take a bath financially! Frankly I think it will be pretty damned cool! At this point, California can fall off in the fucking ocean for all I care -those greedy fuck heads!

Those fuckers out there floating this kind of incompetence should only be flipping hamburgers for a living.
[fu] [Razz]
 
Posted by James Westbrook (Member # 3690) on 11-12-2006, 12:39 AM:
 
a comb wrench sounds handy. I want one.
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-12-2006, 01:09 AM:
 
quote:
At this point, California can fall off in the fucking ocean for all I care -those greedy fuck heads!

Bobby...not everyone in California is a greedy fuck head.

I agree with your comments in the first half of your post (the stuff on work ethic, pride, etc.) but your transition to Hollywood seems like unrelated venting. What does California falling into the sea have to do with people not knowing how to spell or communicate effectively??!!
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 11-12-2006, 12:00 PM:
 
Actually I was just having some sarcastic fun. Wasn't it obvious with the very ridiculous tone?
[Smile]

Aside from that, it's a pretty serious mistake to have a spelling error on a widely circulated one-sheet.
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-12-2006, 07:16 PM:
 
quote: Bobby Henderson
Actually I was just having some sarcastic fun. Wasn't it obvious with the very ridiculous tone?

No, because a good percentage of your posts have that same tone.
 
Posted by Dave Macaulay (Member # 813) on 11-13-2006, 02:01 PM:
 
I'm married to a writer/editor and if I don't catch a typo she will. Toronto newspapers appear to have fired their proofreaders and rely on spell-checking programs, with all there (sic) usual problems.
A business on the main street of the Beach (Toronto neighborhood) put up a new sign with quite large letters reading "Honey Bee Restautant". I have a hard time understanding how the sign maker, installer, and client all let that one go.
 
Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 11-14-2006, 07:47 PM:
 
quote: Bobby Henderson
The United States no longer requires anyone to have any formal training, any kind of graphic design degree or any qualifications at all whatsoever -or even a decent portfolio of work.
Huh? Are you implying that at one time the "United States" required graphic designers to be somehow certified and/or licensed? I doubt that very much. Like many artistic professions, no one has to be certified or even talented. The marketplace is supposed to take care of that. And there always was and always will be both good and bad designers, photographers, artists, performers, etc. And although I don't have the facts to back me up, I'm not sure it's any different in most other countries either.

Whether one has a legal or illegal copy of Photoshop or Illustrator is about as relevant (aside from the ethical considerations) as whether one has a pencil and pen they bought legally or whether it was shoplifted.

One is either talented or not (whether that talent is intuitive or as a product of training and education) and there will always be far more untalented people than talented people. That's always been the case and always will be.

While there's a lot of bad design out there, there's also a lot of very good design.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 11-15-2006, 12:18 AM:
 
quote: Martin Brooks
Huh? Are you implying that at one time the "United States" required graphic designers to be somehow certified and/or licensed? I doubt that very much.
After more than 20 years of working in graphic design I think I can say with some qualified authority the average standard of graphic design in the United States has definitely declined a great deal.

Two decades ago it usually took an art degree and a good amount of hands-on graphic design experience in "old school" analog studio skills to even be considered for a decent staff job doing graphics work anywhere. Local newspapers, small magazines and fledgling ad agencies all wanted people with degrees, solid portfolios of work and good knowledge of analog paste up skills. You couldn't publish squat without any of that back then.

Today, it takes nothing more than some guy claiming he knows how to use Photoshop or PageMaker since he pointed and clicked around a few times in a pirated copy he downloaded. Hardly anyone even asks to see a portfolio these days. They figure if the candidate can get the job done in at least some kind of a half-assed way, and be willing to work for shit pay, they have the job.

Business people believe the computers are making the art. Why pay extra to hire a talented person to do the work when the secretary can do it for $6 an hour? The digital tools are often used as a crutch to cover up lack of qualification.

It seems like I'm spending more time these days fixing amateur hour artwork someone wants to use on a sign, or in a brochure or something else.

Currently, I have a nice thorn in my side type of sign design project for a bank chain. We've made signs for this company for many years. But a lady now working there, one with little knowledge of graphic design, has taken it upon herself to redesign the company logo using a downloaded copy of Photoshop. The finished design is very insipid, with lots of gradients and shading -but in a pixel-based only design at a resolution so low it works only as a web page graphic for a computer monitor.

As I have done many times before, I'll have to take this amateur's work and spend hours fixing lots of problems so it can work in high resolution large format printing and a variety of outdoor sign applications.

I rarely ever run into these kinds of problems when I get artwork from graphic designers who actually know what they are doing. But it seems like their files are making up a smaller and smaller percentage. There's more of this DIY design happening.

But it takes a little more than just the purchase of Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro to qualify someone as a graphic artist. It's like someone going out and buying the same kind of golf clubs Tiger Woods uses and then expecting to play just as well.

The problems I describe are not unique to my profession alone.

There's lots of threads in this forum complaining about the lack of professionalism in film projection. The business people get rid of the professionally trained, skilled projectionists. Managers and assistant managers take over their tasks. Routine maintenance is jobbed out to a tech who visits the theater rarely. Then the box people or counter help hired at minimum wage is threading movies. The end result is declining presentation standards. And then there's the push for 2K digital projection to fix the problem.
 
Posted by Brian Michael Weidemann (Member # 2243) on 11-15-2006, 05:18 AM:
 
I could mirror Bobby's sentiment with regards to the music world. The art of sound and recording once required experience and knowledge that now has been reduced to hacked programs and pull-down menus, which require no ingenuity. Going back further, actually composing music no longer requires years of education, practice, and hands-on dealing with what it is to WRITE music, orchestrate it, and conduct it. I'm all for ease of tools, and advanced technology, but there's a school of discipline behind every endeavor which is not only taking a backseat, but which is disappearing entirely.

But we were talking about typos ...
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 11-15-2006, 10:02 AM:
 
Well, the typos are a symptom of a much larger, underlying problem in terms of quality assurance in publishing work-flows.

It used to require a good amount of planning and discipline to generate any high quality mass color printing project, such as a movie poster. Applications like Quark Xpress and Adobe InDesign have made the process much easier. But I contend a certain amount of laziness has set in among many who are qualified to do the work. Those tools have allowed others who didn't want to be bothered with any formal training in graphic design (much less any training in offset printing) to suddenly want to jump into the fray. And that has helped push down wages and drive talented artists off to entirely different careers.
 
Posted by Chad Souder (Member # 343) on 11-15-2006, 09:49 PM:
 
The menus from our local Chinese restaurants are filled with typos, but parking lot is never empty.
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-15-2006, 10:34 PM:
 
And your point is...?

Actually, I find it slightly less annoying when I encounter something like words misspelled on a mom-and-pop Chinese restaurant menu. English is, after all, a very difficult language to master. If tenth-generation, high school and college-educated adult Americans can't compose a simple sentence without making themselves look like incompetent fools (just spend a few minutes on any Internet forum for proof), then why would anyone expect a first- or second-generation immigrant to be able to do so? [Roll Eyes]

You'd think that an immigrant restaurant owner would seek the help of an "educated local" to help prepare and proofread something as important as a menu. But then, if the parking lot is full....
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 11-15-2006, 11:25 PM:
 
I don't know about the Mom & Pop shop Chinese restaurants elsewhere. We have a LOT of those kinds of restaurants here (Chinese, Korean and a couple Japanese places). They have their menus published by local print jobs mainly staffed by American born people who should be capable of proof reading.
 
Posted by Scott Jentsch (Member # 1681) on 11-16-2006, 08:09 AM:
 
quote: Bobby Henderson
But it takes a little more than just the purchase of Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro to qualify someone as a graphic artist. It's like someone going out and buying the same kind of golf clubs Tiger Woods uses and then expecting to play just as well.

The problems I describe are not unique to my profession alone.

I see this all the time in web design. Everyone thinks that, just because they can get around in FrontPage or they can find the "Save as HTML" option in Microsoft Word, that they are now a web designer.

Quite a few theaters I contact about designing their web site tell me that they just have their assistant manager do it in their free time. Most of the time, their web site looks like they did just that. [Frown]

I had a major movie chain steal some graphics from The BigScreen Cinema Guide, probably because some intern (or assistant manager) that maintains their site decided to "borrow" my graphics instead of making their own.

I have found that those who care about quality are willing to pay for quality results. Those that don't care, cut corners wherever they can, especially if it saves them a buck or two. Ability to pay usually has little to do with it, curiously enough.
 
Posted by Steve Scott (Member # 630) on 11-16-2006, 12:09 PM:
 
As for Pursuit of Happyness, the IMDB board goons say that the reason behind the misspelling is revealed only after seeing the film.

Sorry, but I don't find this a compelling enough reason to see a Will Smith film yet.
 
Posted by Jeremy Jorgenson (Member # 2989) on 11-16-2006, 07:12 PM:
 
They have released a new version of "The Pursuit of Happyness" one sheets - "happy" is a different color than "ness". I suppose it is to show that it is an intentional misspelling?
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-17-2006, 01:09 AM:
 
In the new Premeire magazine it tells the reason for the misspelling.

SPOILER AHEAD, skip the next paragraph if you don't want to know.

.
.
.
.

The day-care where Will Smith takes his kid has that word, misspelled, on the wall. And Will looks at it as the ultimate failure of parenting, that a day-care which is supposedly caring for and educating kids, has a mis-spelled word on the wall.

So there you go. Not what I expected. Personally I think that movie has the potential to be huge. It seems to be really gathering steam.
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 11-17-2006, 04:57 AM:
 
quote: Michael Coate
...we now live in a culture that has no respect for proofreading and displays little pride in wanting things to be correct.
Oooh, don't get me started! This is one of my pet peeves.
quote: Bobby Henderson
But a lady... has taken it upon herself to redesign the company logo... with lots of gradients and shading... at a resolution so low it works only as a web page graphic for a computer monitor.

I made a merchant ad trailer for a bank out in Kansas a few years ago, and they kept telling me to get the logo off their web page... for a FILM RESOLUTION production! Their "graphics" person had no clue as to what vector artwork is. I ended up having to trace something like a 72 pixel-wide logo just so it could be seen on the screen.
 
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 11-17-2006, 09:51 AM:
 
Public displays of misspelled words and bad English drive me insane, but I seem to be the only one in my circle who cares. One of my personal favorites is located at the express lane at a super market near you: "12 Items Or Less".

And I really don't understand the morons in Congress when they say, "I yield to the gentle lady from the great state of California."

Which she then follows with, "I thank the gentleman for yielding."

What kind of a sexist institution has Congress become where the ladies are referred to as being "gentle" but the gentlemen aren't? I thought the majority of these people were lawyers. Didn't they take English classes?

Anyway, I'm straying off topic here. Yes, I see typos all the time, all over the place, and it annoys the hell out of me.
 
Posted by Chad Souder (Member # 343) on 11-17-2006, 12:30 PM:
 
quote: Mark J. Marshall
What kind of a sexist institution has Congress become
Are you serious? How about the kind where out of 535, fewer than 80 are women and that is way up from where it was, say, 50 years ago. Regarding the term you referred to congress using, I always thought that gentlelady was an appropriate, although seldom used, form of address for a woman. Is it not?
 
Posted by Andy Muirhead (Member # 712) on 11-17-2006, 06:38 PM:
 
I don't want to stray off topic too much, But I liked what Brian had to say

quote: Brian Michael Weidemann
I could mirror Bobby's sentiment with regards to the music world. The art of sound and recording once required experience and knowledge that now has been reduced to hacked programs and pull-down menus, which require no ingenuity.
Many years ago, I used to enjoy writing and producing music. Just tracks I would write and share with friends. It was a buzz to see their reaction! These days that buzz has gone, It's just too easy to do what I did then. Tracks I spent days crafting using an old Amiga with outboard gear, I could now do in about 10 minutes.
 
Posted by Wayne Keyser (Member # 2420) on 11-17-2006, 09:04 PM:
 
"The United States has not required that of graphic design in many years."

We haven't required it of filmmakers, why should we require it of graphic designers?
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 11-17-2006, 10:15 PM:
 
Why?

Because there is a lot of technical stuff involved in the graphic arts profession that is not at all subjective in nature.

Many amateurs out there passing themselves off as graphic artists just because they have some software often do not know any of that technical stuff. Lots of them don't even understand something as basic as the difference between vector and bitmap art. But they'll still try to make money selling graphic design services.

Most other professions and trades require some sort of proof of formal training to work in that field. Doctors and lawyers to hairdressers and bartenders need some kind of certification. Lots of people will have an auto dealership with ASE certified mechanics work on their vehicle before turning the "shade tree mechanic" loose on their car.

IMHO, any serious visual artist who wants to make a living in either the commercial arts or fine arts fields needs formal education, in part to grow as an artist, but mainly to learn many of the nuts and bolts stuff for getting actual work done.

Talent alone is not enough. And many of the amateurs out there taking money from others don't even have talent. It's like all those bad singers you see auditioning on American Idol. Being able to work as a graphic artist is not any God/government guaranteed right. It is not for everybody. Most of us have something we are really good at doing. Only a few have any business getting paid to create art, illustrations or graphics.

As to filmmakers and certifications, I will agree the movie industry has its share of bad filmmakers. However, you're not going to be able to walk on the set of most any movie production expecting to get a job without having a number of different things to prove you know what you're doing. Your chances improve with a reel of good work, improve further with a film school degree and improve further still with a track record of professional jobs on your resume. That's the "certification" for filmmakers.
 
Posted by Chad Souder (Member # 343) on 11-18-2006, 10:20 AM:
 
quote: Bobby Henderson
Doctors and lawyers to hairdressers and bartenders need some kind of certification.
I think the differences are pretty obvious.

Doctors - Could kill you or permanently injure you if they are wrong
Lawyers - Operate in government courtrooms and are pretty important in the whole "due process" thing and other facets of our constitution
Hairdressers - Barbers can shave, cosmetologists can do manicures and pedicures, all of which can have serious health concerns
Bartenders - Deal with federally regulated substances. Rules vary state by state. Many states have no certification required other than age limits.
Graphic arts - One of thousands of free enterprises through which people in this country can attempt to earn a living. Being bad at it won't hurt anyone. It might cost a few people time and money, but then your business should fail if your work stinks.

I think with many of the fine arts, people in the field get kind of a high and mighty attitude about their training, like trying to compare it to that of a doctor or lawyer. You very well may be better at it than most, but everything in this country is supposed to be based on supply and demand. If there is a demand for your high quality graphic designs, you will be called upon to supply it for a fair price. If not (in other words, if having a typographical error on a one-sheet does not affect attendance for the film), people will hack something together themselves and it is up to you to find something you can make a living at. At one point early in my managerial career, I had 6 employees enrolled in graphic design at our local college. Currently, one actually has a job in that field. They all graduated. They were all willing to move. It seems to me as if the demand falls far short of the supply.
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-18-2006, 01:11 PM:
 
quote:
I think with many of the fine arts, people in the field get kind of a high and mighty attitude about their training,
Yes, because they feel they can do a better job than an amateur and in most cases they are right. But science has given the amateur the tools and often the same opportunities, causing frustration to those who put the time/money into education and equipment.

It's the same feeling I get when I hear people talking about seeing movies on video, when I know darn well that the movie would have been better if experienced in the theatre.
 
Posted by Kara Tillotson (Member # 3899) on 11-18-2006, 01:19 PM:
 
Typos/bad grammer are a major pet peeve for me too, dispite the fact I am sometimes typimg to fast to notice an error untill I hit post.
Prolly aggrivates me so much....it still throughs me off sometimes on forums, someone will post prolly and I stupidly ask what a prolly is.
Then again theres me who has randomn letters jump into words. Just a second ago a randomn W appeared.
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-18-2006, 07:44 PM:
 
quote: Kara Tillotson
Typos/bad grammer are a major pet peeve for me too, dispite the fact I am sometimes typimg to fast to notice an error untill I hit post.
Ever notice the EDIT button??? [Roll Eyes] Those NINE(!!) misspelled words in your recent post could be taken care of in a matter of seconds.

In the future, before hitting the post button, you could also consider the long-forgotten concept known as proofreading... And if you still don't get it, there's the SPELL CHECK option.
 
Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 11-18-2006, 09:32 PM:
 
quote: Mark J. Marshall
bad English
I assume you mean "poor grammar" and not shifty Brits. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 11-20-2006, 12:17 AM:
 
Haha, yes that's correct. The Brits are often much better with their grammar than the average American.

quote: Chad Souder
How about the kind where out of 535, fewer than 80 are women and that is way up from where it was, say, 50 years ago.
Yeah, I guess you're right. That's only what... 14% or so? Even Iraq's new Parliament is 25% female, so even they have a higher percentage than we do.

quote: Chad Souder
I always thought that gentlelady was an appropriate, although seldom used, form of address for a woman. Is it not?
No, it's not. "Gentlewoman" is a word, but "gentlelady" is not. However there's a problem with using "gentlewoman." If you'd like a lengthy explanation, read on, otherwise feel free to skip the rest of this post.

"Gentlewoman" implies that a woman has some form of nobility or "gentle birth" or breeding. "Gentleman" also has that definition, but applied to a man. "Nobility" is hardly a word that should be used to describe members of the U.S. Congress, regardless what some of them would like to think.

"Gentleman" also has another definition, which is: "a respectable form of address for a man." "Gentlewoman" does not share that second definition. The feminine compliment to that definition of "gentleman" is applied to the word "lady." Some will say that "lady" is the feminine compliment to "lord" which is also true.

So, the bottom line is, "gentlelady" doesn't exist (which is why Firefox 2.0 keeps underlining it whenever I type it). "Gentlewoman" implies nobility - which makes it the wrong word to use when addressing members of Congress. Using "gentlewoman" as the feminine compliment to "gentleman" means that you are also using the nobility definition of "gentleman" when addressing the men of Congress, which is also incorrect.

The words they're searching for, which have been in common use for probably 150 years, are "lady" and "gentleman." The ironic thing is, I guess they're trying to be politically correct and overly proper, but instead, they're speaking incorrectly. [Roll Eyes]

Sorry if I put some of you to sleep. Carry on...
 
Posted by Paul Van Dusen (Member # 3640) on 11-23-2006, 07:58 AM:
 
quote: Mike Blakesley
This isn't a typo, but just a stupidity thing. Once I was watching QVC and some chick was selling a tool set, and on the list of tools was:

COMB. WRENCH

Which of course means "combination wrench." She kept on calling it a "comb wrench" (rhymes with home wrench, that is) and how handy it would be to have a "comb wrench" around the house, and how there were a hundred uses for a "comb wrench" etc.

This just reminded me, I need to buy a fin rake for our ice machine. THANKS!!!

quote:
Honestly, I have ZERO SYMPATHY with any of these complaints. Get used to it. Look forward to more bullshit with movie posters. Be happy with orgasmic joy over the mistakes. That is the only option.

The graphic design industry is woefully infected with lots of wannabe talent-less hacks who think they are "artists" since they illegally downloaded hacked versions of Photoshop, Illustrator and Quark Xpress.

The United States no longer requires anyone to have any formal training, any kind of graphic design degree or any qualifications at all whatsoever -or even a decent portfolio of work. Just be willing to work for $6 an hour and have the "honor of being published" (one of the greatest jerk offs of all for any dumb-ass willing to fall for it).

Most professions require at least some proof of competence in order to gain employment in that profession. The United States has not required that of graphic design in many years. And by that measure our level of graphic design has paled stupidly in comparison to that of many European countries for a long time now. That especially goes to northern European countries like Sweden, which I believe (in my EXPERT OPINION) has been factual for at least the past several years if not longer.

The United States is sucking ass in so many areas. We love to pat ourselves on the back about how great we are. But other countries have been passing us by in many different categories while we've been too busy going on about our own stupid pride.

It all gets back to that cheap-ass "good enough to get by" ethic of our current business culture. Fuck ever doing the job right, or even competently. Sluff it off. Charge the customer double for the trouble on top of that!
[Mad]

You my friend sound like your auditioning for a part in the movie Gung Ho, props. lol
 
Posted by Luci Reeve (Member # 3651) on 11-29-2006, 02:50 PM:
 
There is a good book about bad grammar called "Eats, Shoots and Leaves" which will make you smile.

I have had a concessions poster in the lobby for two years now and just last week one of my staff noticed that the second O was missing from "popcorn". Was my face red!

I always carry a sharpie to correct posters and signs!
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 11-29-2006, 07:42 PM:
 
I had tuned out of this thread for a while due, just to control a bit of anger.

quote: Chad Souder
I think with many of the fine arts, people in the field get kind of a high and mighty attitude about their training, like trying to compare it to that of a doctor or lawyer. You very well may be better at it than most, but everything in this country is supposed to be based on supply and demand.
Chad, I invite you to employ any of these "by demand" amateurs to do ALL of your advertising work for you should you ever launch your own business. Hire only hacks. Go on the cheap. Be my guest. After all, the computers are making the art, not the people actually pecking away at keyboards, mouse-clicking and imagining the design concepts.

I find the sort of thing where some ass will download Photoshop or Illustrator and call himself an artist to be even more lame than the guy who owns a nice electric guitar but can't play a damned lick on the thing.

This lack of qualified people doing the work is at the very basis of why we have shit design and typos happening all over the place in mass media. Typos are only part of the problem. Just look at how the "King's English" is butchered on a regular basis everyday. Prince Charles was right to rag on Americans for their misuse of the language.

The United States is in a state of decline and the declining quality of our visual communications is an undeniable symptom of proof in that.

As I've stated in earlier posts, if you feel it is great to have unqualified people doing the job then you have absolutely no right at all to complain over shit quality work. You only get what you are willing to pay for. If you're only going to pay for shit, then you should only expect shit in return.

Frankly, I think anyone who is willing to defend mediocrity in any profession is taking a fucking stupid side. It's that simple and I will not apologize over that stance.

Anyone who wants to back up that stinking bit of idiocy is campaigning to have their own legs cut own from under them at the ankles at some point. "Who gives a fuck if you have a degree, qualifications and know what you're doing!? This other guy is willing to work for $1.24 an hour! Get the fuck out!"

[ 11-30-2006, 08:01 AM: Message edited by: Bobby Henderson ]
 
Posted by Mike Heenan (Member # 392) on 11-29-2006, 07:49 PM:
 
[sleep]
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 11-29-2006, 09:18 PM:
 


[ 12-01-2006, 07:53 PM: Message edited by: Michael Coate ]
 
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 11-30-2006, 11:41 AM:
 
You could always hire Lindsay Lohan to do your proofreading for you. Here's her condolences letter to Robert Altman's family.

Link

quote:
Lindsay Lohan released a statement Tuesday extending her condolences to Robert Altman's family:

"I would like to send my condolences out to Catherine Altman, Robert Altmans wife, as well as all of his immediate family, close friends, co-workers, and all of his inner circle.

"I feel as if I've just had the wind knocked out of me and my heart aches.

"If not only my heart but the heart of Mr. Altman's wife and family and many fellow actors/artists that admire him for his work and love him for making people laugh whenever and however he could..

"Robert altman made dreams possible for many independent aspiring filmmakers, as well as creating roles for countless actors.

"I am lucky enough to of been able to work with Robert Altman amongst the other greats on a film that I can genuinely say created a turning point in my career.

"I learned so much from Altman and he was the closest thing to my father and grandfather that I really do believe I've had in several years.

"The point is, he made a difference.

"He left us with a legend that all of us have the ability to do.

"So every day when you wake up.

"Look in the mirror and thank god for every second you have and cherish all moments.

"The fighting, the anger, the drama is tedious.

"Please just take each moment day by day and consider yourself lucky to breathe and feel at all and smile. Be thankful.

"Life comes once, doesn't 'keep coming back' and we all take such advantage of what we have.

"When we shouldn't..... '

"Make a searching and fearless moral inventory of yourselves' (12st book) -everytime there's a triumph in the world a million souls hafta be trampled on.-altman Its true. But treasure each triumph as they come.

"If I can do anything for those who are in a very hard time right now, as I'm one of them with hearing this news, please take advantage of the fact that I'm just a phone call away.

God Bless, peace and love always.

Thank You,

"BE ADEQUITE"

Lindsay Lohan


 
Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 11-30-2006, 09:11 PM:
 
There's a big difference between complaining about the poor quality of much design and being angry that people without training are performing the services that you trained for.

The fact is that in all artistic professions, even those that require some technical skills, there are qualified and unqualified people who have been trained and there are qualified (or at least talented) and untalented people who haven't been trained. The Beatles never had any formal music training. Should they have been banned from performing music? Should Bob Dylan been forced to get a license to be a poet just because there are lots of bad published poets?

There has always been good and bad art, design, photography, acting and singing. In the past, there were technical and/or financial barriers as well as limited distribution channels that limited the number of people who could be "heard". Many of those technical, financial or distribution barriers no longer exist and so more people are creating. This, by definition, makes for a decline in general quality.

You sound very angry. I suspect this is because you feel that those you deem "unqualified" are taking work away from you. If you feel threatened by those who have far less talent than you, than the problem is yours. That's a like a clothing designer of top-end clothing feeling threatened because Wal-Mart exists to sell crap.

It sounds like you'd be much happier if the government would step in and license designers. You want the government to be the design police? Do you really think that's enforceable? Office workers would be banned from using Photoshop if they weren't licensed? Should we not let people use Word unless they prove they can write? These are just tools.

Licensing means almost nothing. Architects are licensed because if they don't design properly, the building might fall down, but there is plenty of really horrible architecture everywhere. Certification means nothing when it comes to aesthetics.

You want to argue that much design is really bad? Fine, I agree. You want to argue that the availability of Illustrator and Photoshop has made it easier to create bad design? Fine, I pretty much agree with that as well although there were plenty of bad mechanicals and certainly plenty of bad photography made in pre-computer days. You want to argue that as a society, we create crap? I agree with that as well. So what? There is still more high quality design, art, music, performance, etc. available than any one person can absorb in a lifetime.

All one can do is try to create the best work they can and hope the market responds to that. There are still plenty of people who get paid quite well to create great design. A look at any of the design annuals that are published proves that fact.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 12-01-2006, 10:44 AM:
 
quote: Martin Brooks
You sound very angry. I suspect this is because you feel that those you deem "unqualified" are taking work away from you.
Martin, you're missing the point. My disgust over this issue doesn't come from any personal situation. I'm doing just fine.

The problem is the graphic design field used to be a respectable profession. That's no longer the case. These days the general public just pisses all over it, thinking that graphic design is an easy job and that anyone can do it since computers are involved.

The Beatles and Bob Dylan don't work at all as a comparison. Guys like Bob Dylan and John Lennon had lots of talent. There's a lot of people trying to do graphic design that have no talent at all. But they're doing it anyway since the computers are making the art.

Most people can recognize good music when they hear it and even identify some of the elements that make the music work well. They know bad music and especially bad singing when they hear it, and often are not afraid to confront it with laughter and ridicule. The same doesn't hold true on knowing good graphic design from bad, much less spotting any of the elements that makes a design go bad. The creators of bad graphic design are rarely, if ever, confronted about the poor quality of their work either. Most laypersons don't have the guts to tell them the work looks terrible.

quote: Martin Brooks
There are still plenty of people who get paid quite well to create great design. A look at any of the design annuals that are published proves that fact.
The design annuals of Print and How is not what the general public sees in their everyday lives.

Pick up your average local newspaper. Outside of major publications, most look like shit these days. Even some of the big ones look bad as well.

Drive through commercial districts in any American city and you'll see lots of really crappy looking signs and billboards. Even a lot of major retailers have unremarkable signs. Decades ago American businesses both large and small took more pride in how their stores looked from the road. That sort of thing is more rare today.

These visual problems would not exist in so many areas if:
1. all the people doing the work had any talent or aptitude for the job.
2. all the people doing the work understood basics of handling type, color, visual communications & problem solving skills one would gain from taking classes or at least reading books on the subject.

None of that is going to happen while the current level of disrespect for the graphic design profession continues -and has people stooping to defend the mediocrity resulting from all the amateur hour design.

Here's a pretty good website lampooning this subject:
http://www.baddesignkills.com

The site has a lot of visual "propaganda" designed to ridicule bad design. I like this mock up of an Adobe software box:

 -
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 12-01-2006, 01:21 PM:
 
quote: Bobby Henderson
Pick up your average local newspaper. Outside of major publications, most look like shit these days. Even some of the big ones look bad as well.
Maybe what you consider "bad design" is just the new modern way of designing. Magazines these days are in love with making their pages look "artsy." PREMIERE is one of the worst offenders, and ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY is another, and ROLLING STONE is yet another. I would think those publications could hire the cream of the designing crop, yet they put stuff sideways or backwards or upside down (or any combination thereof), use dark type on dark pictures, split words up all over the page, use odd looking fonts, etc etc etc. I guess they think it looks cool but it just makes things harder to read.

Maybe we're all just getting old(er)? I guess it beats the alternative.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 12-01-2006, 03:29 PM:
 
My complaint isn't with efforts some magazines do to be "artsy." I'm familiar with the stuff going on in those magazines you mention. Even if a graphics person comes up with a theme I find ugly, at least I can give the fellow some points for coming up with an actual design scheme in the first place.

My complaints are directed more toward the folks who repeatedly make obvious rookie mistakes in design. These people are not usually found on the staff of a major magazine. More often they're found in print shops, small ad agencies, sign companies and small businesses with an "in house graphics person." Lots of times the hack will be someone moonlighting as a graphics person trying to design web sites, letterheads and other stuff for businesses.

The only way that stuff affects me negatively in a direct manner is when I have to deal with poor quality customer provided art files. I've raised prices on the time it takes to fix technical issues. But the crap keeps pouring in. And everybody gets to see it on a billboard for a few months or up on a sign for years. Ugh! I try to do as good a job as possible in my own design work -in part as an attempt to try to cancel out some of the tide of terrible crap all over the landscape. Sadly, I have only so much time I can spend coming up with my own creations. It seems like more and more of my time is spent fixing other people's shit work.

At least our business cash flow is good.
 
Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 12-01-2006, 04:03 PM:
 
I can understand some of what Bobby complains about, because I have known a lot of people who weren't cut out for computer programming, and were not capable of making it in college, and several years ago a shockingly large percentage of them were calling themselves "graphics designers". They were basically unemployed college drop-outs not capable of holding a steady job and went around looking for "Photoshop" work and took anything they could get. During the "dot com" boom, it was very common. Designing graphics and web pages were the thing to do for all these guys who couldn't seem to do anything else. This gave the field of computer graphics design a bad rap because in many people's minds, the term "computer graphics designer", instead of being associated with professionals with experience, invoked the thoughts of inexperienced college drop-outs trying to take advantage of a trend.

For a professional in that field, I could see it as being infuriating.
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 12-04-2006, 05:28 PM:
 
Hey, check out the end credits of "Happy Feet"! By chance, I just happened to look out the porthole, and caught a typo in the music listing for "My Way". It reads:

"Performed b Robin Williams".

That's the first time I believe I've ever seen such a mistake in movie credits. [Wink]
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 12-04-2006, 08:42 PM:
 
One mistake in end credits that made me laugh was the end titles to the IMAX version of Fantasia 2000. The titles were rendered in so low of resolution all the pixels on the edges of letters were clearly visible like bricks in a wall.

The sad thing is I see a good number of photographs in major magazines badly pixellated in that same manner. Very basic details like using the appropriate resolution for the type of output (print, video, film, outdoor, etc.) doesn't seem to matter as much these days.

Ah, don't worry about it, it's all digital!
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 12-05-2006, 01:54 AM:
 
My name was misspelled in the credits of this movie.

Last name was spelled Coates, which I'm used to hearing people mistakenly say, but even after I spelled it correctly in the contract it ended up wrong in the final version. Name is spelled correctly on the IMDb page...but only after I sent in a correction! (Since I was just a lowly crew member and not a department head, my misspelled name didn't make it onto the one-sheet.)
 
Posted by Cameron Glendinning (Member # 3516) on 12-05-2006, 03:42 AM:
 
quote: Michael Coate
My name was misspelled in the credits of this movie.
Dont you mean

My name was misspelled in the debits of this movie.

most of my on screen credits have been debits unfortunatly
 
Posted by Martin McCaffery (Member # 37) on 12-05-2006, 09:52 AM:
 
My favorite typo is carved in stone at Hank Williams grave (actually, on his ex-wife's tombstone). There is a message from Hank, Jr to his mom informing her that "she left to soon."
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 12-08-2006, 05:01 PM:
 
quote:
Hey, check out the end credits of "Happy Feet"... It reads:

"Performed b Robin Williams".

So, has anyone else seen this, or was I just imagining it? [Smile]
 
Posted by Daniel Fuentz (Member # 1684) on 12-09-2006, 03:49 AM:
 
I just happened to see this directory sign at my local Wal*Mart the other day...

 -
 
Posted by Cory Isemann (Member # 2517) on 12-09-2006, 11:16 AM:
 
Tim, I looked, but couldn't remember the song title. So i tried reading them all as the credits were rolling. A futile attempt to catch such a small error. You must have bionic eyes or something!
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 12-09-2006, 01:10 PM:
 
When we played the movie FRESH HORSES some years ago, our marquee kid put up:

FRESH HORES
 




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