Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Film Booker

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Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-09-2007, 02:22 AM:

Does a theatre have to use a booker from their are or could they use some one anywhere in the country? Our local booker has alot of our area theatres along with are and it seems like anytime we want to book a certain film our booker comes back with sorry you can't have it. Some of the many excuses are
1) There are no prints available. To which i wounder how can a print not be available when the number of screens drops the next week. Upon wich the other theatre down the road gets a print for that same week.
2) When we ask for a print that the other theatre has instead of getting something new they hold the print and play it once a day for the next few weeks. She say because they have it we can't get it.
It seems to me that she really is not helping our house at all and that maybe a booker not in the area may suit us better.
Any Ideas?

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 11-09-2007, 02:30 AM:

Do your own booking. Find the phone numbers for each of the studio and arrange with them on doing your own booking.

A lot of "indies" do their own so they don't have to hassle with booking agents.

The plus side with a booker is that they are more apt to get the films you want with the right terms since they've got that "edge" with the film companies. But some just dive in head first with doing their own booking, and trust me, it can be a bumpy road at times.

Good luck-Monte

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-09-2007, 04:22 AM:

At this point it seems as if we are paying this booker to use their edge for the other theatres. Anyone every have that feeling that they are getting screwed and not even know it.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 11-09-2007, 05:39 AM:

only thing that I can come across is that booking fees aren't being paid and bookers can be a little nasty in remembering this..

Posted by Barry Floyd (Member # 385) on 11-09-2007, 09:56 AM:

We run into some of the same things sometimes.... but not very often.

We use a film booker in Ohio for our Drive-In in Tennessee. The best reason I have found so far for using a booker is the established relationship that booker already has with the studio reps, and the vast number of screens that booker represents. Sure, you could do your own booking, but you just don't have the leverage that a booker with 100's if not 1000's of screens represents.
I could call Paramount and say, "I've got 2 screens here at my drive-in to put Transformers on - what's the best deal you can make me?" However, my booker can call them and say, "I've got 136 drive-in screens plus another 788 indoor screens I can put Transformers on... what's the best deal you can make me?" In that scenerio.. who gets the best deal?

This time of year the print counts are lower and the studios tend to give the limited prints to the theatres who can give them back the most amount of money.

If we can't get a print the week it opens nationwide, it may be week 3 before we're able to score a print. If there's not alot of new stuff coming out, then the other theatres that did get it may hold on to it (for the lack of nothing better to show), and we'll have to wait again. Most of the time if a biger theatre has multiple prints, they'll usually drop the multiple copies by week 3.

Find yourself a different booker.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-09-2007, 10:17 AM:

It sounds to me like your booker is doing a bad job of explaining the "why" when something happens. To just tell you "you can't have it" is bad. You should always be able to understand the reasons why you don't get a print.

First of all, there is almost always a two-to-four week minimum on all new prints. Not one week. It doesn't matter how many shows a day a print is playing....as long as it's making money where it is, the film company will allow it to stay there.

There's also the possibility that the neighboring theatre might not have anything better to play...therefore they'll keep their print another week. As long as the neighbor theatre is making money on the print, they have the right to keep it.

If your theatre will potentially gross relatively well on a given film, and the movie is a wide release (over 2500 screens), then you should be able to get it on the break if you're willing to pay the higher film rent and hold it for at least the minimum play time. If your booker can't secure you prints under those conditions, you might need a new booker.

If you choose not to play a film on the break, then you just have to wait until a print is available. In that case the distributor will look to which theatre has the higher gross potential when deciding where prints will go.

To address the first question in the first post -- I don't think you really need a booker in your area, but you should have one in your region at least. We used to have a booker in Salt Lake City (700 miles from here) who was familiar with all the mountain states. He retired; our current booker is in Montana.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 11-09-2007, 12:17 PM:

If you use a booker you need to use one that is VERY familiar with your area and the other competition. Using a booker thousands of miles away from you is a joke (So was that booker in SLC for that matter! I'm glad he retired)!

I have three customers that book their own stuff and all three of those are sub run/move over locations. If you're doing first run and unless you have alot of screens to book then a booker is the only way to make any headway with the distributers.

I completely disagree with Monte that being your own booker has advantages. I have in fact seen many people try to book their own shows put at great disadvantage as far as split and play dates. A booker that is booking 300 to 500 screens weekly has alot more power than you booking just 6 or 8 screes on your own... he can also move the dogs out sooner for you. In fact many bookers at distribution frown on having to deal with such irrelevant first run bookings. In the long haul a good booker will make you added money and get you the films you want to play. There is no perfect booker out there and sometimes a theater has to play the crap to get the good stuff... but you WILL be getting that good stuff unlike the guy trying to wade through it himself. In the short haul booking stuff yourself your profits will be minimized and you'll probably go out of buisness.

quote: Monte L Fullmer
A lot of "indies" do their own so they don't have to hassle with booking agents.

I like that line the best! If your booker is a hassle its time to find another booker.

Mark

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-09-2007, 01:54 PM:

Any one have any info on a booker in the upstate NY area? Or one that is not in the area that you would recomend? We are thinking about changing to a different booker.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 11-10-2007, 08:49 AM:

The main reason there are "not enough prints" is that the exchange did not order enough. If you are a high grossing theatre, this is inexcusable, but helps the distrib make more money. If you are a low grosser, it is somewhat understandable.

It is your booker's JOB to move you into the "have a print" catagory as soon as he can. Louis

Posted by Mark Ogden (Member # 43) on 11-10-2007, 09:46 AM:

Elmira is my hometown, and years ago I worked in theatres in Upstate New York. In fact, I first stepped into a projection booth at the old Colonial on Main Street in Elmira, with the late Paul Shay as head. At the time the big name in first-run booking was Frontier Amusements out of Tonawanda. They handled most if not all of the Dipson screens, which meant all of Elmira except the old GC Arnot Mall twin. 'Course, this was back in the days of the old "exchange" system, not only would they book your screen, they would also handle print delivery, someone from Frontier used to come around in a panel truck and drop the print off to you (does anyone still do that?) According to this website, they are still going (or are they who you are using now):

http://www.manta.com/coms2/dnbcompany_dd7xq0

Might be worth a call.

Posted by Ky Boyd (Member # 23) on 11-10-2007, 02:09 PM:

As an indie operator in both first run and move over situations, I have to agree with Mark that having a professional film booker more than pays for itself, if you have the right booker.

Of course having the right booker is only half the equation. The other half is that you, the theatre owner/operator, as the client have to be willing to play an active role in the process. That means keeping your booker informed about changes in the marketplace on a real time basis. Watching what happens at theatres similar to yours in other markets and asking appropriate questions. Listening to the advice you are given and doing your part on the promotions and operations front to make sure that your theatre is a "desired" location. And finally, and this is a big one, do you send your box office reports to the studios in one time? Do you pay your film rental on time and at the proper amount? Do you pay your booker on time? If you don't pay on time to either the studios or the booker you are a problem client.

I should also note that I am only in favor of booking service fees that are flat. I don't believe in paying a % of revenue to the film booker. But I do bonus my film buyers at the end of the year based on the theatre's box office performance because they play an essential role in our success.

Finally, as I believe was noted here and elsewhere, not doing your own booking frees you up to focus on operations and promotions that will help keep your theatre at the front of the pack.

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-11-2007, 05:17 PM:

Mark that could be who we use. I grew up in the Colnial, Capitol and the 123 as well. You might have known my Grandfather John if you worked with Paul. My dad said he quit running projectors before he started working in those theatres, his name is tom and i also have an uncle john that worked in those theatres.

[ 11-28-2007, 12:41 PM: Message edited by: Scott McGuire ]

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 11-11-2007, 05:42 PM:

quote: Louis Bornwasser
The main reason there are "not enough prints" is that the exchange did not order enough.

Another problem that digital will solve easily and cheaply.

Mark

Posted by Bill Enos (Member # 440) on 11-11-2007, 06:07 PM:

The reason that there are not enough prints is that the local multiplex operators have requested that it be withheld from you until they have played it a couple weeks and gotten the max attendance.

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-11-2007, 06:49 PM:

Is that because they use the same booker and have asked them to do that or because they have asked the studio to do so. Is it true that studios will not let other theatres that are within a certain distance from each other have the same movie.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-12-2007, 09:16 AM:

That can be true. But there are some locations where two complexes are literally across the street from each other, and both play the same movies. If it's in the studios' interest to do that, they'll do it. ($$$$$)

How far away are you from your neighbor theatres? If it's 10 minutes or less, and you're a much lower grosser, that could be your problem all right.

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-12-2007, 06:32 PM:

The other theatre is about 15 minutes away and they do have a much higher seating compacity. However we have never been given the chance to run a movie at the same time they have it so i don't think you could say that they are higher grossing.

[ 11-28-2007, 12:43 PM: Message edited by: Scott McGuire ]

Posted by Matt Fields (Member # 3211) on 11-14-2007, 09:23 AM:

I am a big believer in user a booker.

1. They save you time and can most likely get a better deal on film rental.
2. They also have tracking information that lets you know what people want to see.
3. They get to watch the movies before they come out (mine does at least). Obviously this helps when choosing.
4. Bookers have a complete understanding of how distribution works.
5. They can network you with other operators.

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-16-2007, 01:05 AM:

May be changing at 1st of year. Looks like we are going to stay with this booker. No longer need suggestions on a booker or any info on where to find a booker?

[ 11-28-2007, 12:45 PM: Message edited by: Scott McGuire ]

Posted by Ky Boyd (Member # 23) on 11-16-2007, 11:50 AM:

Exhibitor Support Partnership (ESP)
Doug Endicott and Mark Schulte
call 323-654-2799
or visit www.espfilmbuyers.com

Posted by Brad Allen (Member # 470) on 11-16-2007, 01:53 PM:

Preferred Booking Service
407-358-8746

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 11-17-2007, 09:59 AM:

Brad's guy (Fred Schweitzer) is the only one I trust. Louis

Posted by Peter David Bruce (Member # 4447) on 11-21-2007, 03:40 PM:

generally in the uk there is a booker per site, and near endless print copies. i guess with the sheer number of cinemas in the US this can become a logistical nightmare...

do complexes have to share their prinys with eachother? site A has it for week 1, site B has it for week 2?

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-21-2007, 03:42 PM:

Not sure what the other people run into. Our theatre isn't that lucky. Site A keeps it for as long as it wants to keep it and then us being site B get it when they are done with it and it is about to come out on dvd.

Posted by Peter David Bruce (Member # 4447) on 11-21-2007, 03:46 PM:

wow that must be frustrating. although for those customers who miss the films the first time around will come to you guys...

its never nice being on the tail end of it all. we are in constant competition from local sites, but prints-wise, we have a good guy here that does payroll, HR, and booking the films. He really cares about the films more than our takings.. so we get the good films, hopefully as fast as possible.

still tough negotiating with the suppliers WHY we deserve the print before someone else though.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-21-2007, 03:51 PM:

Scott M. - you should change bookers right NOW, not wait until the first of the year. There's no reason in the world why you shouldn't be able to get a print in week 3 or 4 of almost any movie you don't open on the break. Waiting until a neighboring theatre is finished with it is unacceptable. There are enough prints of most wide releases nowadays that this shouldn't have to happen.

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-21-2007, 05:55 PM:

We are 99 percent sure that our current booker books for our neighbor and doesn't want to piss them off as they have a ton more screens that we do. We have a contract that is good until March and the only way to get out of it is 30 days written notice or not paying our bill. The 30 days puts us right at the new year and we don't want to get the reputation for not paying. Can we just keep paying her until the 30 days is up and use another booker to do our booking right now?
Wrong they are not booking for them.

[ 11-30-2007, 04:12 AM: Message edited by: Scott McGuire ]

Posted by Mike Spaeth (Member # 524) on 11-21-2007, 08:04 PM:

Agreed with Mike

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 11-21-2007, 08:37 PM:

Time to MOVE is NOW! Before your holiday bookings. Pay him what is due and move on....all bookers know when the end is near and understand.

BTW: If he is booking your competitor and not treating you equally, I would expect a refund for his services for the last 12 months. Louis

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-21-2007, 09:10 PM:

quote: Scott McGuire
We are 99 percent sure that our current booker books for our neighbor

Did you ever ask?

Are you on Rentrak? If so, you can find out exactly who your booker books for by looking up the booker's circuit name on Rentrak.

Either way it should make no difference. Our booker books for almost all of the non-Carmike screens in our area, including our three closest neighbors...and we often get movies as soon as, or sooner than, they do even though we're the smallest town of the group. (I'm just more willing to shell-out for first week film rent than they sometimes are.)

I would pay the 30-days of the contract out and get a new booker immediately.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 11-21-2007, 09:36 PM:

quote: Mike Blakesley
including our three closest neighbors...

I musta been driving by them [Eek!]

.... Where? Oh you must mean the flower shop, the hardware store and the train station.....

Posted by Mike Spaeth (Member # 524) on 11-21-2007, 11:00 PM:

Scott:

Irrelevant.

If I'm wrong, disregard the previous.

[ 11-22-2007, 01:11 AM: Message edited by: Mike Spaeth ]

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-22-2007, 01:09 AM:

We are not the heights mike. sent you an e-mail with some more info. We would like to run some stuff on the break, but even get some second run stuff less that 6 or 8 or even more weeks after the break.

Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 11-26-2007, 08:51 PM:

quote: Scott McGuire
She told he he couldn't get American Gangster at the break because there were no prints available.

Hey, just tell Universal you don't need a print -- you've got a video projector and you can just burn a DVD off the internet and play if from the DVD. [evil]

Posted by Cindy Crossley (Member # 4577) on 11-28-2007, 09:48 AM:

First off, maybe you should be telling the whole story here Scott. You are in opposition to a first run theatre (which is why you can't have a print at the same time as them), you are only open 5 days a week, you charge less than your opposition, and you have nothing to do with the booking at your theatre, you are only the projectionist. You can't play a film until your opposition is done with it. Your booker doesn't make the rules, the film companies do. Maybe if you had given all the facts in the first place, the people replying to you would be able to have the whole picture. And if you want to know if your booker also books for your opposition, you can ask them or look on Rentrak.

Posted by Jonathan M. Crist (Member # 413) on 11-28-2007, 10:00 AM:

The real question that should have been asked here is whether, given all the facts about the situation, this exhibitor even NEEDS a booker at all.

The purpose of having a booker is to use the booker's contacts, knowledge and group buying power to get the exhibitor something they could not otherwise have gotten by themselves. If the situation is truly one where a booker ... any booker ... tells you there is nothing more they can do in your situation the way it is (e.g. "you can't play a film until your opposition is done with it"), then you might as well make the calls to the distributors yourself and save the booker fees.

[ 11-28-2007, 08:10 PM: Message edited by: Jonathan M. Crist ]

Posted by Cindy Crossley (Member # 4577) on 11-28-2007, 10:04 AM:

But if the booker is getting them better deals than they would get themselves and have all the contacts, it is worth it. A good booker fights with the film companies for what they want and it isn't as easy for an individual with 2 screens that is only open 5 days a week, to get what they want from a film company. But a booker who books many screens and has many years experience booking, can usually get a better deal.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-28-2007, 11:14 AM:

Any small-town theatre that isn't open 7 days should be flexible enough to go to a 7-day schedule when the business requires it. Here, we're usually open 6 days a week (closed Thursdays), but with anything on the break (or any big hit) we'll be open every day.

quote: Cindy Crossley
you have nothing to do with the booking at your theatre, you are only the projectionist.

Maybe this is the problem. Maybe the owner has decided he doesn't WANT to pay the extra film rent to get product on the break but blames the booker and uses the "we can't get a print" excuse to save face with his employees.

Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-28-2007, 11:56 AM:

I guess the "we can't get a print" maybe his way of smoothing things over with me. Cindy is right i have nothing to do with the booking. I am just a projectionist. I was merly trying to get an understanding about this end of the buissness and i guess i was in the wrong to do it on here. I in no way intended to give our booker a bad name. I was working with the information that i had and i appologize if i offended any one in any way. In the future i will get all the facts. Again i am truly sorry.