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Posted by Jeffry L. Johnson (Member # 453) on 11-13-2007, 08:52 AM:
Are movie theaters doomed?
quote:
Are movie theaters doomed? Do exhibitors see the big picture as theaters lose their competitive advantage?
Jon Silver and John McDonnell,
School of Advertising, Marketing, & Public Relations, Queensland University of Technology, Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
Available online 9 October 2007.
Abstract
After three straight years of decline, movie theaters in the US may have recently ended a period of crisis with an increase in annual admissions (+ 3%) in 2006. This article argues, however, that major problems are not over for the industry. Most movie theaters in the multiplex era have adopted a remarkably similar strategy, one which is also very vulnerable to recent trends such as the explosion of home cinema, pay TV, video-on-demand (VOD), discounting by mass merchandisers of DVDs, computer games, and the collapse of video windows. Just as technological convergence has created a challenge for movie theaters, as it has in the past, so too can new technologies and creative use of assets (combined with multiple target marketing) offer a counter measure for at least some movie theaters; at least, until the next challenge arises. What is unlikely to succeed is the status quo, especially when so many multiplexes offer the same format as their competitors, appear to adopt a narrow definition of what business they are in, and manifest a ‘one-size-should-fit-all’ approach to customers. The industry has employed differentiation and niche marketing much less than other industries. As the extensive variety of necessary strategies cannot comprehensively be explored herein, this article focuses on two new technologies from the IMAX Corporation, DMX and MPX, as an example of how a theater operator might counter audience declines.
Keywords: Cinema; Movie theaters; Strategy; IMAX; Home entertainment
Corresponding author.
Business Horizons
Volume 50, Issue 6, November-December 2007, Pages 491-501
Posted by David Zylstra (Member # 4230) on 11-13-2007, 09:56 AM:
Some interesting data to ponder:
From 1970 to 2005 movie attendance increased 52%
From 1970 to 2005 screen count increased 270%
From 1970 to 2005 the average per screen attendance dropped 59%
From 1995 to 2005 screen count increased 37% while location count decreased 20% (the book only had location count back to 1995)
Data taken from the last NATO book we received.
Overall the industry is growing (slowly), but the attendance growth is not keeping up with new screens being built.
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 11-13-2007, 10:06 AM:
quote:
this article focuses on two new technologies from the IMAX Corporation, DMX and MPX, as an example of how a theater operator might counter audience declines.
Boy the guy that wrote this article is out of touch! I can't think of a single multiplex location thats making any money on its Imax system. Imax still has their hands too deep on other peoples pockets. Everyone with one that I know of wants to get rid of it at the end of the contract. The only thing that might savve Imax's face in the exhibition industry would be for them to go digital to at least keep the operating costs more tame. But of course they will still have their hands in your pocket non the less. So are movie theaters doomed.... certainly not! Only the Imax screens are.
Mark
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-13-2007, 10:11 AM:
Was that article written by a computer? For one, the word "Abstract" gets its very own paragraph for absolutely no reason whatsoever. So does the phrase "Corresponding author". Then there are a bunch of keywords. What the hell? Also, I must know... WTF are "video windows" and why did they collapse?
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-13-2007, 11:18 AM:
I get the feeling this is a Joe Redifer Sarcastic Question®, but I'll answer it anyway since I have a minute.
Video window = the time between the release date of a movie in theatres and its home video release. Collapsing refers to the shortening of that time, or elimination of it.
The windows have shortened because the studios think they can maximize their return on investment by putting the DVD on sale while the movie is still fresh in consumers' minds.
Actually the average video window has increased in the past couple of years, especially with more popular movies. The window is decreasing mostly with flop films.
That article was obviously written by somebody who doesn't understand the cyclical nature of the movie biz, which has been the same since it began.
Posted by Thomas Pitt (Member # 4322) on 11-13-2007, 11:22 AM:
Providing there are movie theaters that run new movies as soon as they are released, I don't see them going out of business any time soon. Movies are not released on DVD until a few months later, at least - and not on TV (or TV-on-demand) until about a year after their theatrical release!
There's always the argument that seeing a movie at a cinema, even if it's a second-run or third-run house, is a better experience. You often get full 5.1 surround and an enormous screen without having to invest in the (rather expensive) surround equipment and HD TV/DVD player.
However, I do foresee that in the not too distant future, second-run and third-run houses will see a decline in the number of visitors. More and more people are getting HD-TV systems and the movies these theaters show are often available on DVD already.
Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 11-13-2007, 01:24 PM:
quote: Thomas Pitt
I do foresee that in the not too distant future, second-run and third-run houses will see a decline in the number of visitors. More and more people are getting HD-TV systems and the movies these theaters show are often available on DVD already
I dunno about this one since I work in a discount house..being that the quality of movies nowdays geared for the 12 to 18 year old minds, they come out of the gate with guns a-blazing, but they run out of shells and legs within two to three weeks.
Then, we discount houses picks up these exhausted movies and keep them forever. Why? These movies aren't worth the 8 to 9 bucks (3.4 to 4 Pound Sterling in the UK )to see in a first run house.
"Transformers" and "Ratatouille" are now out on DVD, yet we're still doing the business on them. Our biggest surprise was a few years ago when "White Chicks" came out. DIED in the first run houses. Yet, we held on to that crazy movie for a record 17 weeks.
Yet, for the 1 to 2 bucks to spend at the gate: "Well, anyone can afford that kind of money to go see a movie - even the worst ones, cuz that buck or two loss ain't gonna kill them"
But, the big thing is that with a cheap movie ticket means more to spend at the snakbar, esp. if the conc. prices follow the cheap gate prices..
"Thar's gold in dem thar hills, folks"
One little 3plex discount in our area has been striking gold ever since a big 21plex opened up down the next block since they've been getting their overfill from constant sellouts at the 21plex. Plus, this 3plex is always blowing out the other 6plex discount a couple of miles down the street. Why the success of this 3plex? SIMPLE! The owner of that 3plex know how to market that theatre very effectively.
No, I don't think that the discount world will ever fade away simply it's a great avenue to go down on to see the movie on the big screen for little cost involved from the patron.
Plus, it allows those who are strapped for cash, or on a tight family budget, to still get out and go to a movie for their entertainment fix.
-Monte
Posted by Christopher Crouch (Member # 3784) on 11-14-2007, 12:47 AM:
quote: Monte L Fullmer
No, I don't think that the discount world will ever fade away simply it's a great avenue to go down on to see the movie on the big screen for little cost involved from the patron.
I work at a discount oriented theatre myself and attendance almost couldn't be any better. We are regularly at full capacity on weekends (i.e. the only attendance limit being our seating capacity). Defying many of the "dying industry" arguments, we are also located in southern california, where home theatres are plentiful and there are more than a few alternative choices for entertainment dollars. Throw in that this theatre is literally surrounded by other theatres (two mega plexes and four multi plexes within roughly a ten mile radius) and still thriving. I can't speak for every discount house, but I definitely know of a few that aren't disapearing anytime soon.
Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 11-14-2007, 01:12 AM:
When you mention discount house what are your ticket prices and what a the large plexes charging in comparison.
Posted by Frank Dubrois (Member # 3042) on 11-14-2007, 01:13 AM:
quote: Mike Blakesley
The window is decreasing mostly with flop films.
Transformers - 4 months
Santa Clause 3 - 1 year and counting
Posted by Christopher Crouch (Member # 3784) on 11-14-2007, 05:08 AM:
quote: Scott McGuire
When you mention discount house what are your ticket prices and what a the large plexes charging in comparison.
We are charging $1.50 at the theatre I was refering to. The nearby megas charge in the $9 to $11 range for their adult tickets. However, this particular area is rather affluent, so I don't believe the lower price is the sole draw.
We have another So Cal discount theatre, in a low income area, that charges $1.50/$2.00 (with nearby megas charging $9 to $11). Interestingly enough, this theatre generally pulls in slightly less people than it's smaller counterpart in the more affluent area; supporting the idea that there is more to drawing patrons than just having a low price.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 11-14-2007, 10:14 AM:
quote: Frank Dubrois
Transformers - 4 months
Santa Clause 3 - 1 year and counting
Transformers - 4 months is about the average window.
Santa Clause 3 - is a Christmas film. It would make no sense to release it in the shorter window because it would have come out in February. They're releasing it on Nov. 20 to promote it as a Christmas movie. By the way, it did about $85 million, not exactly a flop.
Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 11-14-2007, 01:19 PM:
In my area, we have a 14plex that chgs $8.50 night and $6.25 for matinees. And they're right across the way (A KMart is inbeteen them and us. We used to be a Cineplex Odeon location..and long story made real short: I used to work at at 14plex til the change of ownership from EDW to REG that forced me out..).
We're just a plain $2.00 buck 6plex that the entire county on going to since there is no competition for us to be concerned about
If their was ever a condition of "doomed movie theatresw", that would never happened around here.
-Monte
Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 11-14-2007, 01:45 PM:
"We're only doomed if the (financial) insanity continues." Louis
Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 11-15-2007, 03:22 PM:
Sometimes I wonder how doomed we are. I drive into our parking lot, and see more employee cars than customer cars sometimes.
However, I was at a rather unique theater two weekends ago where they were showing Shrek The Third. They sold 170 tickets for one show. Not bad for a movie almost out on video. That's probably close to the same number of tickets we sold for Bee Movie. Then again, this theater provides a much different experience than your standard noisy, advertising infested, flashy neon decorated google plex.
Posted by Jack Theakston (Member # 4484) on 11-15-2007, 03:40 PM:
I think I would be safely in agreement with most that we wouldn't even need to worry about this sort of thing if there were better quality pictures being made and if the movie theater as an icon was shifted away from adolescents to all ages.
The trend for film making is far too predictable, I'm afraid. I'd clear house if I was a bigwig at a studio.
Posted by Marc Hansen (Member # 705) on 11-15-2007, 10:04 PM:
Mark-
What was unique about the theater?
Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 12-02-2007, 11:35 AM:
While theaters are still an amazingly big business, they are becoming more and more simply a marketing exercise for other forms of distribution.
That trend is going to increase greatly after Feb of 2009 when analog TV broadcasting ends in the U.S., which will force holdout consumers to bite the bullet and buy a digital TV (yes I know the Government is offering coupons for converters, but that's not going to work). And that's in addition to the ongoing improvements in digital download speeds, etc.
My prediction is that we'll always have movie theaters, but they'll be fewer of them, just as most cities have just a few legitimate theaters today. This is especially in true in cities, where high-real estate values make movie theater operations impossible. (Do you know that there is not a single movie theater left on Broadway in New York City between 20th street and 66th street?) I think eventually the movie studios are going to have to buy back the theater chains so they can guarantee theatrical distribution for their product and we'll return somewhat to the days before the consent decree.
There will always be people who will want to see movies on a big screen in a nice environment and have a communal experience and there will always be young people who want to get out of the house no matter what, but there will also be more and more people who will be perfectly satisfied to watch movies on their flat-screen or computer while consuming chain crap-food because most of our movies have become as disposable as that food.
Posted by Sam D. Chavez (Member # 1841) on 12-02-2007, 12:15 PM:
I agree with Mr. Brooks. The instrument that will close a large number of screens is D-Cinema. Those not able to convert from film are inevitably doomed.
Further, an all digital release with no film will allow the studios to release day and date everywhere and it will prove to be an irresistible temptation. My opinion only of course.
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 12-02-2007, 01:04 PM:
I only partially agree with what Mr. Brooks has said. So far there is no shortage of customers at any all digital multiplex's. So far in fact they have done even better... at least in this area in terms of ticket sales. I don't think the consumer cares enough what form the show is presented in as long as the performance is done well. And as long as it is done well there will be theaters. Poor quality is whats going to eventually kill them off not lack of 70mm or not being able to buy/lease a D-Cinema system. And we can't blame D-Cinema as an excuse for those theaters not "strong enouugh" to buy/lease one system... we can only blame the owners of those theaters for not having enough forsight to become financially strong enough. Too many theater operators STILL bilk every last penny out of the buisness for themselves! Those are the operators that will fail!
There will always be a small group screaming for 70mm or some sort of larger format thing even 3000 years from now. I don't disagree with them at all but you have to face what is practical today... 70mm just isn't nor will it ever be seen again in the quantity we saw back in the 80's.
Mark
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 12-02-2007, 01:37 PM:
quote: Martin Brooks
I think eventually the movie studios are going to have to buy back the theater chains so they can guarantee theatrical distribution for their product and we'll return somewhat to the days before the consent decree.
Considering AT&T is now quite a bit larger than it was in the old "Ma Bell" days before the government broke up the company, I don't think it is far fetched for studios to gain controlling ownership in movie theaters. It could even come to pass if the country elects another Republican President.
I also agree we're going to eventually see a good number of theaters disappear -starting with most discount houses and, sadly, lots of independent operations. Movie theaters are trying hard to justify their existence to customers, with some adopting a luxury minded attitude. Not everyone is going to be able to afford to do what chains like Warren Theaters in Wichita, KS is doing. I feel they have to move in that direction because "home theater" is just continuing to improve in its sophistication. The movie theater viewing environment will be the draw for customers instead of the sound and picture (which will also have to be very good).
quote: Sam D. Chavez
Further, an all digital release with no film will allow the studios to release day and date everywhere and it will prove to be an irresistible temptation. My opinion only of course.
Such a move will kill off the movie theater business. The only way I can see the movie theater business managing to survive in a day and date situation is if the movie distributors gain ownership of the theaters (and don't move to close them). Movie theater chains separated from movie studio income would not make it for all the lost customers. Too many people would just save money and stay home to watch the show. The studios would have to absorb the financial losses as a fee for making a movie legitimate by having it play in actual movie theaters.
Posted by Jonathan M. Crist (Member # 413) on 12-02-2007, 02:10 PM:
The October 2007 issue of Conde Nast Portfolio echoes many of the ideas in the article posted by Jeffry L. Johnston:
http://www.portfolio.com/culture-lifestyle/culture-inc/arts/2007/09/17/Movie-Theaters
The text of this article appears below:
Precisely what caused the rift between Sumner Redstone and his daughter, Shari, may never be known, despite vague suggestions of disagreements over “corporate governance.” But one major source of friction between the 84-year-old chairman of National Amusements, the company that controls Viacom and CBS, and his 53-year-old daughter is clear: She’s sanguine about the movie-theater business, while he thinks it’s on its last reel.
Amid the glamour of assets like Paramount and MTV, it’s easy to forget that privately held National Amusements, started back in 1936 by Sumner’s father, remains an important player in the theater business, with about 1,500 screens around the world. Shari, who owns 20 percent of the company (her father controls the remaining 80 percent), has run the theater unit since 1999 and is relentlessly upbeat about it, even as insiders speculate that Sumner would rather sell the whole thing off. Does Shari know something about the popcorn economy that her father doesn’t?
By most measures, the long view looks dreary. Except for the occasional bump after a season of blockbusters (receipts are up 7 percent so far this year, for example), annual sales have stalled at around 1.4 billion tickets a year since the late 1990s. The major theater companies have scratched out profits over the years by raising ticket prices and selling onscreen ads. In pursuit of more eyeballs to satisfy those advertisers, they also added several hundred thousand seats, which resulted in about half the major chains filing for Chapter 11 by 2001. (National Amusements was not one of them.)
Meanwhile, the industry has allowed the theater experience to deteriorate. Nowhere is the clash of generations more evident these days than at the multiplex, where teenagers yak on their phones as middle-aged couples fork over $8 for a bag of Twizzlers and a Coke and snarl at the endless advertising. “Theater owners definitely shoot themselves in the foot by putting 40 minutes of commercials in there,” says Bob Shaye, co-chairman of New Line Cinema, the studio behind the Lord of the Rings and Rush Hour franchises. “If it’s no longer a pleasant environment and you add that on, at some point audiences revolt.”
But for the most part, the leading theater chains aren’t worried—at least not enough to change things. Headquartered in places such as Plano, Texas (Cinemark), Kansas City, Missouri (AMC), and Knoxville, Tennessee (Regal, half owned by Philip Anschutz), they push for blockbuster “event” movies and lobby to maintain the traditional window between theatrical and home-video release dates. Studios, which split box-office receipts evenly with the theaters, have advocated collapsing that window, as they’d rather sell higher-margin DVDs or downloads. Some studio heads have even fantasized about charging a premium above theater prices for a movie piped directly to the home on the same day it opens at the multiplex. The theater chains, which earn about 75 percent of their profits from concession sales, see this as Armageddon. When Disney C.E.O. Robert Iger came out in favor of collapsing the window two years ago, the president of the National Association of Theater Owners called it a “death threat to our industry.”
Shari Redstone was among those who protested loudest. Then again, she has also been the most experimental major operator. Since 2001, she has opened dozens of Cinema de Lux megaplexes in places like Los Angeles and Westchester County, New York, that offer amenities such as guest lounges, reserved seating, and a casual restaurant called Chatters. Today, half of National Amusements’ theaters are branded as Cinema de Lux, up from 10 percent only seven years ago, and the company says that 95 percent of its recent expansion has been in the upscale category. Such theaters have thinner margins than pure popcorn venues, but despite the fact that tickets cost a dollar or two more than the local average, they appear to foster loyalty. Cinema de Lux patrons make as many as eight visits a year, the company says, versus the industry average of five, and spend more on concessions when they’re there.
Redstone has also bet heavily on developing markets, especially in Russia, where she and local partners have opened high-end multiplexes in Moscow and St. Petersburg suburbs. In 2000, there were only 105 modern movie screens in the whole country; last year, the number hit 1,100. At Redstone’s upscale Russian venues, martini-sipping patrons don the kind of finery that most American moviegoers haven’t favored since the 1940s.
Back in the U.S., the smaller chains are doing most of the innovating. Muvico, for example, has 259 screens at 14 locations in Florida, Maryland, and Tennessee. Most of its venues are themed (Egyptian, ’50s drive-in, Xanadu), and many are subdivided into areas designed to appeal to different age groups. “Premier” adult levels offer a full restaurant and bar, and babysitting is available at all locations. (Parents are given a vibrating pager at no extra charge.) The company declined to disclose revenue or profitability figures but claims per-customer spending on food concessions at its theaters is 25 percent higher than the national average of about $3.50. At Alamo Drafthouse, an 11-year-old Austin-based chain with seven locations, every other row of seats has been replaced with café tables, and customers can write orders for pizza and microbrews on slips that are silently picked up by black-clad waiters. The company is in negotiations to open theaters in large markets like New York and Los Angeles by late next year, with the goal of having 200 screens by 2012. C.E.O. John Martin says the average concession tab is nearly $14.
But don’t expect your multiplex to get the religion anytime soon. Offering a more layered experience may sound obvious, considering the writing on the screen about competing technologies, but the low-maintenance, popcorn-and-candy ethos will continue to reign, at least for now. With box-office receipts strong (for the moment), studios are under less pressure to collapse the distribution window, which prolongs the status quo for theater owners. “Our members say that what most people want is candy, popcorn, and soda,” says Patrick Corcoran of N.A.T.O. “Banana-nut muffins sound nice, but they don’t move.” A bag of popcorn nets a 95 percent profit, he points out, which would be tough for any other snack to match.
“It’s hard for the big chains to change their mind-set,” says Chuck DeWitt, Muvico’s vice president of operations, who spent 20 years at AMC. “They don’t think about how to create a new generation of moviegoers, how to make the theaters somewhere the whole family can have an evening. They think only about cutting costs. National Amusements is really the only major one who is willing to go for it.”
So even if it means forever losing the loyalty of her own King Lear, Shari Redstone is hanging tough. Maybe, like many of us, she just wants to see how the picture turns out.
Posted by Floyd Justin Newton (Member # 1316) on 12-02-2007, 07:33 PM:
Sorry guys....I have to agree with Louis on page one of this
thread. If the insane greed doesn't slow down, or stop, we may
as well kiss this biz goodbye. There's going to be a lot of
used equipment on the market in the near future!
Posted by Lyle Romer (Member # 1266) on 12-02-2007, 11:34 PM:
quote:
And we can't blame D-Cinema as an excuse for those theaters not "strong enouugh" to buy/lease one system... we can only blame the owners of those theaters for not having enough forsight to become financially strong enough. Too many theater operators STILL bilk every last penny out of the buisness for themselves! Those are the operators that will fail!
This is a bunch of crap. Do you understand how small the profit margin is on a theater (especially an independent)? Besides the 50%+ film cost how about all the rent that is being paid while screens are empty mon-fri afternoon. An owner is supposed to have the foresight that they will be forced to spend over $60,000 per screen for no reason other than to save the distributors money? You make these type of comments often about D-cinema and frankly you don't know what you are talking about.
You have an expertise in installing, maintaining and repairing equipment not in owning a theater. There is no business case that can be made on the exhibitor side that makes the cost worthwhile. Maybe for 3D but even then it'll take a lot of $2 surcharges to pay for the projector and the 3D system.
On a new build it isn't too bad as it should only be $30,000 or so extra per screen. Not chump change but not a huge deal. But on an existing location where the equipment has been paid for already it is a HUGE deal.
D-cinema was rolled out probably 5 years too soon. If they would have waited until a viable 4K system could be sold for under $50,000 it would have been much better. At least then the cost of upgrading would give the exhibitor a significantly better presentation than what is available at home. Don't say 3D here either because I guarantee that in less than 5 years 3d will be readily available at home.
Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-03-2007, 12:12 AM:
Actually, TI is promoting DLP and 3D in the home now! They'll do anything to forstall the death of DLP in the home.
http://www.dlp.com/hdtv/3-d_dlp_hdtv.aspx
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
And we can't blame D-Cinema as an excuse for those theaters not "strong enouugh" to buy/lease one system
It has nothing to do with strength...more like stupidity. It offers little to nothing that the film systems already in place don't or can't already have. It makes no business sense for the exhibitor. And no matter how you cut it, 2K is really a consumer format being trumped up as a commercial format. It is half of the worst 35mm format. It is a format that makes CinemaScope, the format based on more image area, bigger picutre a less resolution/smaller picture.
2K is a nice first step and there have been great strides in it but it is not a worthy successor to 35mm film as it exists in 2007.
Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 12-03-2007, 12:15 AM:
quote: Lyle Romer
Besides the 50%+ film cost how about all the rent that is being paid while screens are empty mon-fri afternoon.
You wouldn't believe how much money I spend on office (and manufacturing) space for my employees that goes unused Mon-Fri evenings/nights and *all day* Sat-Sun (and holidays). If only I had it as good as movie theatres when it comes to maximizing time utilization of rented space!
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 12-03-2007, 04:14 AM:
quote: Lyle Romer
Besides the 50%+ film cost how about all the rent that is being paid while screens are empty mon-fri afternoon
Oh come on guys, everyone knows that DCinema is going to change all that and eliminated all those wasted, non-income generating schedule holes. DCinema, we are told (many times over), will fill those empty seats on weekday afternoons with its unique ability to show ALTERNATIVE programming! You know, during that lonely, one-in-the-afternoon hour when not even the biggest blockbusters can draw patrons, DCinema will fill those seats by showing the same stuff that hardly anyone one watches on PBS during prime time. People evidently are just waiting to flock to see that PBS fare....in a movie theatre....on video....on a Monday afternoon.
Posted by Cameron Glendinning (Member # 3516) on 12-03-2007, 04:48 AM:
quote: Frank Angel
Oh come on guys, everyone knows that DCinema is going to change all that and eliminated all those wasted, non-income generating schedule holes.
I wonder what titles will be avaliable for the potentually lucrative "midnight to dawn" marketplace that perhaps Phil Hill productions could potentially exploit?
I too have to agree with Louis, but somehow I can not ever picture the distributors agreeing to lower the rates, even if it was in their best long term interests!
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 12-03-2007, 09:17 AM:
quote: Lyle Romer
An owner is supposed to have the foresight that they will be forced to spend over $60,000 per screen for no reason other than to save the distributors money?
Actually the CBG plan is shooting for the exhibitor investment to be $10,000 per screen.
Posted by Frank Dubrois (Member # 3042) on 12-03-2007, 09:37 AM:
quote: Monte L Fullmer
"White Chicks" came out. DIED in the first run houses. Yet, we held on to that crazy movie for a record 17 weeks.
This is the MOST amazing fact that I got from this thread so far.
Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 12-03-2007, 11:14 AM:
Monte, are you sure you guys weren't being paid by the studio to run it that long?
Posted by Per Hauberg (Member # 529) on 12-03-2007, 02:17 PM:
You can have an example from the most humble site in business:
My place is one of the smallest in the country: screen 1 seats 88, screen 2 just 39 visitors. 5.000 inhabitants in the village, 2-3 miles to the competition - 3 modern houses with 5-8 screens, max 550 seats.
I run about 80-100 titles a year, and will sell about 27.000 tickets in 2007. -Just 5 years ago, it was a stable 35.000 a year. 10-12 first-runs every year, the rest coming within 2-3 months from opening. Biggest hit: "Titanic" 10.200 tickets !!Ticket price must be 60 DKK - about 10 $, or I will have no films before the video-release. That means, box-office makes about 1,6 million DKK = 162.000 US$, and no: The danes do not buy concessions as an american audience: I'm lucky, when they spend 1,5 buck a head ! A 2K installation will cost about 125.000 $ per screen right now - And no ! I don't think it is a matter of me, not having looked foreward in time, because I haven't got those 250 grants lying there. I had to buy me a Kinton FP30D three years ago for Screen2 for about 23 K$ - thats acceptable (and a fine peace for the money), even for those 39 seats, but 125K...?? My two vintage 1960 DP70 are still running fine, and could do so until my retirement, so why spend that much money for
. I don't think, many in the audience will stand up and shout about pictures being better than before.
When (if...
) the digital picture becomes a must, half the danish cinemas will be closing, and I am afraid, I'll be among the minus part.
The video window is very firm in Denmark: Foreign film comes on DVD 4 months, danish productions 6 months from cinema premiere, video distributors still pressing to get an even shorter window.
Mosts DVDs selling at 30-35 $, Disney a bit more, and to compare, 1 litre of 95 octane unleaded is today 10,21 DKK = 1,70 US$ (3,785 litre = 1 US gallon).
But I'm still here - running World Premiere friday on "Golden Compass" - Advance sale: 2 tickets
And that, Gentlemen - is the situation as today, december, the 3rd, 2007 in Malling, Denmark !
P.s.: Monte: Did You find the key again for Your MakeUp Table, so life can go on ?
Posted by Ron Curran (Member # 3631) on 12-04-2007, 12:48 AM:
We bleed all the cinema’s riches. After, that is, the install of 4 track mag, then Xenon, platter, automation, Dolby SVA, then DTS, then Dolby Digital, then ES, then …
Of course, to show certain features before video release we had to invest in a server and digital projector, followed by a 2K upgrade and an up-spec projector.
Along with this, we lost many weeks of income to alter for disability facilities, followed by the same authorities closing us down again to alter the access again due to a change of policy that resulted in a 20% loss of capacity.
Yes, it’s all cream to us independents.
Posted by Phil Blake (Member # 2012) on 12-05-2007, 08:07 AM:
I see the future of our cinemas is in the hands of the makers.
I todays fast disposable society we don't screen a hit that will hang on for 7 8 or 10 months straight. Those days are gone , we simply entertain or rather entice people to our houses with something that is popular or in the younger ones terms "Cool".
I don't see any type of TV ,DVD ,Cable etc as a direct threat to our patronage. We are offering a night out , if people choose to stay at home we are not in the race to compete. However If they choose to go out , then we are competing against restaurants , hotels, clubs, casinos etc.
As for the technology , 100' screens 10k xenons 8 tier platters and sound systems that are from another world may very well impress all us operators , but frankly most say 14 to 29 year old patron could not give a rats ass about it all.
They are indeed going out to see a "cool" show together with their partners for a night out.Or if the show that that great it is just simply cool to be seen there. Alot just go for that reason. I guess this makes up for the majority, then we do have the respectable citizens that do wander in for entertainment and escapism from the house and the lonely who gather for friendship , they are the best type , not mess and not ripped up seats but sadly not enough of em.
When I look back over the past five years and all the marketing tricks I have tried , our takings have been up and down with only one common factor present. If we have a film that is hot and the town is talking about it , they will pour in the door.
No matter how bad or good it is, if it captures the audience and it is "Cool" it will work, word will spread and it happens automatically.
The problem is that the gap between these types of films is getting larger, we are being sold too much Crap , Movies have lost their dynamic stand alone greatness, They are churned out by the dozens and maybe one out of every 30 is the one that they want. Trouble being we have suffered the 29 failures in between.
I also believe price is also a major factor , 10 years ago we ran movies in the local hall , $5 for kids , we would get over a 150 kids in on a Saturday afternoon for a 6 month old sub run.
Now we are running new releases in a dedicated cinema and charging $11 for kids we get about 15 to 20 kids in on a Saturday afternoon.
As long as we have the right "item" on our shelves at the right price , we will always have bums on seats.
The problem of selecting the "Right Item" is the hard part.
Even looking back trough attendance at the Drive in on the 1960s before the town had TV this trend was still the same , it the movie was not something that was talked about , it would draw only a few cars.
Distributor promotions is one last point that does make a difference.
I have found heavy advertising by distributors makes a huge difference to attendances.
My last days at the Drive in in 1986 we ran a triple feature of a home movie/ documentary films by an Aussie adventure Alby Mangles , mentioning that name will make a few in the industry cringe! , However the marketing those films received from the distributor was an absolute saturation. In 1986 we were battling TV and video and we were just about buggered. The three nights we ran those features we got more cars in than the drive In had ever got in its 20 year history.
It is also amusing to look at the reactions . people seem to appreciate watching a heavily advertised crappy show and walk away happy. But If they walk up and watch an unknown crappy film they will walk out very unhappy.
I guess the moral is you cant polish a turd but if you sell it well people will buy it.
Posted by Brad Allen (Member # 470) on 12-07-2007, 05:21 PM:
Very well said Phil.
Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 12-07-2007, 06:50 PM:
quote: Phil Blake
I guess the moral is you cant polish a turd but if you sell it well people will buy it.
..and NOW you wonder why McDonalds can sell their horsemeat hamburgers left and right over the nearest competition...marketing skills to the hilt!
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 12-07-2007, 07:00 PM:
McDonalds' success has everything to do with three things:
1. Being reliably fast
2. Being attractive to kids
3. Being consistent from location to location
The food has next to nothing to do with it. (Well, maybe the fries a little.)
Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 12-07-2007, 09:02 PM:
quote: Daryl C. W. O'Shea
are you sure you guys weren't being paid by the studio to run it that long?
..Couldn't tell yas Daryl on that one since I don't have anything to do with booking matters - just that the traffic in this movie wouldn't die off though for that booking. Yet, we've had similar insidences where movies don't last as long in our local 1st run house and we can hang on to them longer - for the simple fact that people in our county love to come to our theatre being cheap and our county isn't that all rich due to being an agriculture county, not an industrialized county.
Hey Mike!
I'm sure that you and/or your wife can make better hamburgers that "McD's" any day of the week. Just that, as you mentioned in your three listings that they can win it over with the kids with a clown character and that a big marketing winner in itself.
Now, wouldn't it be fun if you could find a marketing tact to win over "The Clown of the Golden Arches".
-Monte
[ 12-08-2007, 03:48 AM: Message edited by: Monte L Fullmer ]
Posted by Scott McGuire (Member # 4508) on 12-08-2007, 12:24 AM:
How about adding a mickey d's into the concesion stand?
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 12-08-2007, 12:30 AM:
quote: Mike Blakesley
McDonalds' success has everything to do with three things:
1. Being reliably fast
2. Being attractive to kids
3. Being consistent from location to location
Having the most effective business sign in the world helps.
Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 12-08-2007, 08:24 AM:
The BEST showbusiness in the world...McD's.
Perhaps there is something there for our business to learn? Louis
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 12-08-2007, 09:25 AM:
Well, they fail at being reliably fast. Wendy's has them beat by a wide margin there.
Mark
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 12-09-2007, 01:38 AM:
quote: Mike Blakesley
The food has next to nothing to do with it. (Well, maybe the fries a little.)
Mike, here I disagree....the reason that burger is a winner is because it appeals to the broadest range of taste buds -- and to get that appealing taste, they spend millions of dollars in R&D to perfect it. It may be horsemeat (and even that's questionable), but it's been pulverized, flavorized and taste tested to the point were they find the taste that is most appealing to huge numbers of people. If it tasted like what it really is, no one would eat it. But you've got to hand it to them, they have figured out how to make the cheapest junk food taste like actual edible food. I can't imagine that this is an easy feat. But then again, IMAX is making a couple of 2K video projectors look to the general public like a real 15/70 film image....or so they think. We shall see. Maybe they should offer fries with each ticket.
Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 12-09-2007, 03:51 AM:
Thus, it looks like "McD's", "Wallys-World" and IMAX are accomplishing the ultimate - to "re-educate" the public with the results of their marketing skills and products combined.
Then, you have others who are trying the worst thing ever imagined when they see these results and turn into "welfare" cases due to them: "Following success with hope."
-Monte
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 12-09-2007, 01:54 PM:
quote: Frank Angel
Mike, here I disagree....the reason that burger is a winner is because it appeals to the broadest range of taste buds
I agree with you there, but you have to admit that nearly every other fast-food chain offers a better burger than McDonalds does. I'd take a Wendy's single or a Dairy Queen Grillburger, or a Burger King burger anyday over a McD burger. (I don't like Big Macs because of all the extra junk they pile on it.)
Posted by Phil Blake (Member # 2012) on 12-10-2007, 08:36 AM:
quote: Mike Blakesley
The food has next to nothing to do with it. (Well, maybe the fries a little.)
Well I agree Mike ,Macdonald's in Australia has to share the market with a few well entrenched Aussie fast food chains. It is so common to here "I hate Macdonald's , can't stand them" over here , yet they are still probably the number one fast food chain in Australia.
Looking in from the outside as Mike said
1. Being reliably fast
2. Being attractive to kids
3. Being consistent from location to location
this is the basics for their success even if their food sucks!
It seems to be what the majority goes for leads a trend for the success of anything.
I see my wife reading crappy magazines that suck , but because everyone buys them , it is cool , so it is cool to read them, so in turn millions buy them.
Many of the most successful companies of the world , IBM, 3M , Disney world, Macdonald's and Phil Hills Porn shops , have all made it with this type of marketing.
But , when it come to movies the product is still the major factor in our patronage.
People will still shop at a supermarkets that sell rotten apples because they also sell good quality potatoes.
But our cinemas have to put on a good show or they wont come.If the Film does not "cut It" they wont come and they wont tell everyone about it. We have no fall back , all our shows have to be good or we will have empty seats.
We are indeed in the hands of the filmmakers , no matter how passionate we are with our cinemas , screening quality and service and equipment , our product is what keeps us alive.
The ratio of hits to misses needs to improve , filmmakers need to consider their market more so rather than making crap in hope of a few fast bucks!
Posted by Cameron Glendinning (Member # 3516) on 12-10-2007, 03:51 PM:
If the future of cinema continues to look at maccas for inspiration, well we are all in trouble!
Phil, my wife reads the same crappy celebrity mags! As for the cool factor, very rarly are truer words spoken. However I have worked for a showmen who have managed to create that buzz around a cinema.
Word of mouth is probably the most valuable source of advertising. He managed to create a consistent and unique experience for his customers that was unlike any other cinema. It was achieved through time management and giving the audience a choice of activities. ie watch the trailers or listen to a live jazz band whilst drinking at the bar. The fact that the venue was first class, with a 60ft screen, art deco, and perfect focus & sound. The result was an audience that would be just as inclined to talk about going there. Ie I just saw "movie title" at the Parkway cinema on the weekend, rather than I saw "movie title" on the weekend. This did translate to $, huge attendences and some of the largest crowds that I have ever projected to.
quote: Phil Blake
As for the technology , 100' screens 10k xenons 8 tier platters and sound systems that are from another world may very well impress all us operators , but frankly most say 14 to 29 year old patron could not give a rats ass about it all.
100ft screens and other varients like bean bag cinemas (all with good acoustics) are atleast the current way of hypeing the cinema experience and making it fresh for the new generations. Hoyts are clearly aiming for the cool factor in there marketing! Dont be surprised if there is money in it!
added
My fear is the billions that will be spent on marketing and cool factor that 1080p will recieve over the next few years! The other obvious issue is that people today do not go out to a cinema if they have already seen the bootleg DVD at home.
Posted by Phil Blake (Member # 2012) on 12-10-2007, 11:28 PM:
quote: Cameron Glendinning
The other obvious issue is that people today do not go out to a cinema if they have already seen the bootleg DVD at home.
That is one issue we have overlooked Cameron. And a vital one indeed.
I have said this before , I can't understand why the government cant make it illegal to bring pirate DVd's in from overseas .
There are millions of the come in from Bali each wee as we know. They lock up people that bring in illegal substances , pirate DVDs as classified as illegal so why not apply the same laws ?
Posted by Ed Alvarado (Member # 2760) on 01-11-2008, 02:28 AM:
I prefer movie theaters over being at home but then again im A pirate. so its hard to answer this but the real question is ARE PROJECTIONIST GOING OUT OF BUSINESS??? DLP is taking over for new theaters.
Posted by James Westbrook (Member # 3690) on 01-11-2008, 03:03 PM:
Not completely. Some new builds are installing all 35mm, but most of the equipment is used/reconditioned in anticipation of digital's arrival.
Posted by Phil Blake (Member # 2012) on 01-12-2008, 02:27 AM:
even DLP requires a certain amount of work , uploading files , setting up playlists etc , I have one DLP and I welcome it , the show turn arounds are fast and it gives me more time to do other things.
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