Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Clear oil in the kettle after popping....

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Posted by Ben Calloway (Member # 5742) on 06-08-2010, 07:50 PM:

I've got a cretors kettle that's doing something I've never seen before...My concessionist emptied the kettle after popping and turned away for "30 seconds" to help a customer. When he came back to make more popcorn he saw clear oil in the kettle about 1/2 inch deep. This isn't every time....Today was the second time it's happened. The first was several days ago. I was only told about it the first time and I was told it was water. I just assumed it was condensation...but I got a look at the stuff today and it is like a clear oil with a strange odor....any thoughts?

*edited to make more sense

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 06-08-2010, 08:02 PM:

You got a very hot kettle there. (Is that a Cretor's President, Diplomat or Merchant? I've seen President's do that before when the T-stat is set up too high)

I bet it's over 600 degrees when hot like that. Course, that makes for good popcorn cooking.

Vegetable oils, which is basically clear with food coloring added to it where that hot kettle cooked away the food coloring.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 06-08-2010, 08:04 PM:

Do you have an electric oil pump? Maybe somebody pushed the pump-button for another batch. I'd keep an eye on procedures and see if you can catch it happening.

If you are using coconut oil and it gets hot, it'll turn clear. But it would be smoking by then.

If this stuff turns out to be your regular popping oil, a half inch is WAY too much.

Posted by Ben Calloway (Member # 5742) on 06-08-2010, 09:27 PM:

It's a closed cabinet president I believe...I'll check the temp...
It is electric pump...though my guy swears he didn't hit the pump...It is coconut oil...And half inch is probably an exaggeration.

Infrared thermometer puts it at 540 degrees...

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 06-08-2010, 09:50 PM:

Since your oil comes up from under the kettle via the pump, there's almost no way this could be happening without somebody triggering the pump. Maybe somebody thinks you have to push that button for some other reason.

We have a Diplomat here and I estimate our oil depth in the kettle, with no popcorn in it is probably slightly less than 1/4" so you might need to check your pump settings. I know when our machine was new the pump was factory set to put WAY too much oil in for our kettle size.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 06-08-2010, 11:17 PM:

Seed to oil is 3:1 for any popper. e.g.: 32 oz kettle takes 11oz of oil.

Posted by Ben Calloway (Member # 5742) on 06-09-2010, 01:26 PM:

Well...I suppose I should give some background.
I worked at this location off and on since 1999. It's a sub-run theatre that was started by o'neil theatres. Then run by the dirt mall that it's in...then GTC ran it for several years and now it's a true Ma & Pa. I'm now working for the new owners as their GM in a way....Which I'm happy to do, as this was the first theatre I worked at. But honestly I haven't been a GM before just an assistant...So I'm having to really train myself. That includes learning about things that I never had to worry about before. There's no corporate to pay for repair bills.

So with that said, where can I find manuals for this popper to adjust the heat and oil outputs? I've looked on cretors website with no luck.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 06-09-2010, 02:30 PM:

I would just contact Cretors directly for a manual. Or if you have a regular dealer, contact them (you'll need the serial number of your machine)

On our kettle, the temp adjustment is a screw located inside the bottom of the kettle. On the pump, there is a line of DIP switches that corresponds to the amount of time the pump runs. (Sorry I don't have mine in front of me but maybe that'll put you on the right track.)

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 06-09-2010, 02:58 PM:

Contact Cretors

C. Cretors & Company
3243 N. California Ave.
Chicago, IL 60618
(773) 588-1690
(800) 228-1885

..ask for Jerry in the Service Department. Ask for manuals or any parts manuals and he can probably email them to you, which they'll be in .pdf form.

Good luck- Monte

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 06-10-2010, 11:55 AM:

Too hot is just as bad as too cool. Also ask them for the thermostat instructions. (not in every manual). Louis

Posted by Chad Souder (Member # 343) on 06-10-2010, 02:11 PM:

Too hot is very bad in large kettles. The stuff that comes out first gets the oil and comes out and what's left in the kettle gets dry and doesn't taste good. My old 48 oz Cretors kettle made the best corn when I turned the stat down below the recommended temp. It took longer to make a batch, of course, but the product was better.

That being said, I'm guessing you have a smaller kettle, given the size of the theatre you described. 540 degrees is way, way too hot. That's a fire hazard. Monte is correct on the ratio of oil being 3:1 and if the pump came with the popper, Mike is correct on there being dip switches to adjust the time. If you have a 20 oz kettle, you should only be pumping 7 oz of oil per batch. On the kettle, there should be a hole, probably covered by a metal cap, that gives you access to the thermostat. Typically counter-clockwise raises temp and clockwise lowers it. Do not adjust more than a quarter turn at a time, and always make at least 3 batches after adjusting the temp. A 20 oz kettle, which I'm guessing you have, should reach about 420 degrees before the thermostat cuts off heat. 32 oz or larger should reach 410 degrees. Another measure is the light that indicates when the heat is on should shut off 15 to 30 seconds before the batch needs to be dumped.

Coconut oil is clear. It appears white and cloudy when solid. Only the oil colored with beta caratine has the orange/red color.

All that being said, that still doesn't explain why you would have oil in the kettle between batches. It doesn't just fall from the sky. Even if it's pumping too much per batch, the oil would get absorbed by the popped kernals and the remaining oil would come out when the kettle was dumped. Somehow that oil is getting in there between batches. It's possible something in your pump is failing or shorting out causing it to pump on its own. I've never heard of that, but anything is possible.

Posted by Cassandra Palko (Member # 5362) on 06-11-2010, 12:09 AM:

too much oil? I suppose - but my favorite batch of popcorn was double-pump white coconut oil with white seed = pure yummy goodness!

Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 06-17-2010, 01:48 PM:

No way you can have 1/2 inch of oil in the kettle after you pop. Even if you dumped twice as much oil as you needed in there, the corn would have absorbed it.

If you have a President, it's more likely that someone on your staff (maybe everyone?) is putting the corn cup in front of the oil pushbutton, and it's getting pressed... especially on busy days when you're loading up for the next batch. It used to happen to us on occasion, until we figured it out & stopped the staff from putting the cup there.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 06-17-2010, 02:35 PM:

quote: Cassandra Palko
but my favorite batch of popcorn was double-pump white coconut oil with white seed

Oh agree, why on occasion I would do a dbl pump batch while I'm cooking regular batches to make mix a bit more flavorful...thx to the high saturated fat content.

Posted by Bruce McGee (Member # 131) on 06-18-2010, 10:48 AM:

My Cretors poppers run at around 475 degrees.

Double-shot popcorn is wonderful to eat. Dont do it often, but when I do, I try to mix it in with the other batches. Its a blast of extra flavor

Posted by Ben Calloway (Member # 5742) on 09-21-2010, 04:14 PM:

Just an update to this...
I took apart the instrument panel and found that the coating on the wires to the pump button had melted and the two wires were touching each other...with the exhaust fan, they would touch then not touch...simulating a button push. Problem fixed.