Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Single screens that have added a screen.

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Posted by Adam Fraser (Member # 1074) on 07-29-2010, 04:01 PM:

Our situation is getting near a point where we have to consider adding a screen or two to our theatre to keep profitable. We are profitable right now, but I see things trending to a point in 5 or so years where we may not be. Films are only holding for 2 weeks where they used to hold for 3-4 and opening grosses are not what they used to be.

We typically see 30,000-50,000 patrons per year, with the last few years leaning much more towards 28,000-35,000.

What % increase in business have you seen from adding a screen? Two? I have heard the 50% figure thrown around a lot.

If you did a new construction addition how much did it cost? How many seats did you add? Our architecture and historical nature would cause major problems if we cut up the original building, but we have the space to add on to the existing structure.

I will be consulting an architect fairly soon, but just wanted to know of other owner experiences.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 07-29-2010, 04:25 PM:

Good luck finding a qualified cinema architect! This is not just Michigan, but everywhere! Louis

Posted by Adam Fraser (Member # 1074) on 07-29-2010, 04:50 PM:

I know. I have talked to 2 or 3 architects in the past few years and most who say they do theatres have only done one or two, and nothing as complicated as our theatre.

I kind of wish we could split the auditorium, but it would kill the look of the theatre we have worked so hard to maintain. Could never do it.

Posted by Matt Fields (Member # 3211) on 07-29-2010, 05:24 PM:

Before I spent a lot of money on an addition, I would figure out why the attendance is declining. It looks like a nice theatre. Is there new competition or less population in the area?

Posted by David Zylstra (Member # 4230) on 07-29-2010, 06:40 PM:

Adam - there is a firm in Grand Rapids (FTC&H) that did a lot of theatres in the past (including some THX auditoriums), they did all the Star Theatres (now owned by AMC) and a lot of the '90s and early '00s Loews. I'm not sure if any of the original staff who worked on the projects are there, but I know they did at least 20-30 theatre projects.

Posted by Adam Fraser (Member # 1074) on 07-29-2010, 06:56 PM:

I believe attendance is declining partly because of MI's bad economy and our location in a tourist town. Along with that, films seem not to have the legs they once had in our area. 50-65% 2nd week drops seem to be the norm now where they used to be 30-40%. This is the reason we are considering adding 1 or 2 small auditoriums to keep our main screen clean for new releases. We have no competition within 30 miles.

The theatre is immaculately maintained with owner operators on staff nightly and good presentation.

David, thank you for the information.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 08-01-2010, 10:55 AM:

A SMALL second auditorium should be easy, cheap and unobtrusive. I should think 125 seats or less. Think of it as an add-on, not a second theatre. The goal is to have a move-over house so you can have 2-3 week runs. Louis

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 08-01-2010, 11:30 AM:

That's exactly what we'd like to do here...have a second screen for holdovers. But we have no room for it! I've laid awake nights trying to come up with a way to do it, but outside of adding a second story, there's just no way.

Posted by Adam Fraser (Member # 1074) on 08-02-2010, 09:39 AM:

Louis and Mike, that is exactly what I am talking about. I do know that the new building codes would make us add quite a few more bathroom stalls and we would have to build a new office too, but those shouldn't add a ton to the project cost.

Most Architects want to get $3000-4000 into the project before cost estimating happens and builders won't give a quote without prints. Guess we will just have to bite the bullet and get some prints drawn up whether or not we do the expansion.

Posted by David Zylstra (Member # 4230) on 08-02-2010, 10:55 AM:

When we look at a project our ownership uses $120-$130/sq ft for the build out costs for the physical plant, but that is an average based on over 10 screens - a single screen might be a little higher due to being a small project.

One route to go is to have an architect give you a general set of plans that show the floor plan and equipment layout, then a GC and their subs bid the job as "desing/build" where the subs are responsible for coming up with their own detail for the blueprints . . . . . . although I would suspect the architect would hit you with a few thousand in design fees before you get to the point of having the subs bid their portion so it may not be beneficial from a cost standpoint. One of our cancelled projects was going this route and overall costs were similar to getting a full set of plans up front.

Posted by Matt Fields (Member # 3211) on 08-02-2010, 05:15 PM:

David - Does that 120/130 number include equipment/furnishings?

Posted by David Zylstra (Member # 4230) on 08-02-2010, 08:45 PM:

Usually just the building itself, none of the specialized items like projectors, speakers, poppers, seats, etc . . . . . basically the $120/sq ft number is an overall estimate of what any business can expect to pay for a commercial building (at least in the eyes of our ownership).

Posted by Mike Frese (Member # 4361) on 08-08-2010, 06:00 PM:

Adam,

We are fortunate in this industry to have at our disposal Rentrak's wonderful website. What I did to estimate a previous expansion was to look at what movies we had to pass on and estimate grosses. Easy to get an idea of a pattern using the "bookmarks" tab on their website using other theaters in your district.

50% would be a good number to start with. IMHO, I can't think of a reason not to add another screen.

Posted by Mark Hajducki (Member # 1732) on 08-09-2010, 08:47 AM:

Where is the extra land located, is there an existing building there that you could convert into the second screen?

If the new screen can be connected onto the existing foyer then it should reduce the extra staff required (assuming sensible show times). This would especially be the case if the two entry doors are close together.

Posted by Adam Fraser (Member # 1074) on 08-09-2010, 06:39 PM:

We have a 5+ acre lot that the theatre, a house, a furniture store, and a mattress store sit on. We own all the businesses and the house.

The new screen would likely sit right next to the current screen, I will try to get a few exterior shots when I get a chance. It would utilize two separate booths, with one main boxoffice entrance and concession.