Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Tiny little bugs

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Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 02-29-2012, 11:59 AM:

We are having an issue with these little tiny bugs in our concession area. They don't seem to be infesting anything, they're just THERE, buzzing around.

They look kind of like a miniature house fly, except they have a red body. They're just a little over 1/16" long They're very fast...they buzz around slowly, but if you try to grab one or slap one it's almost impossible. They don't sting or anything.

We've had a bug guy come in and he first said they were "fruit flies" and then he changed his mind and said they were "drain flies," and then he did some research and decided they were "vinegar flies." I looked up all three of those on the internet and none of them look exactly like the little bugs we are having here. They seem to hang around the soda machine the most -- there might be five or six floating around at a given time. They seem to disappear when there is a lot of activity -- you don't really see them too much when we're open. But if I go in during the day to get a soda, there'll be a half dozen of them floating around the machine. I do see them occasionally just about anytime -- not clouds of them or anything, just one floats past once in a while.

I'm at my wits end on how to get rid of these things. The bug people sprayed some stuff around, plus they've cleaned out our drains, and the stupid things are still here. I've tried things like "Raid" (after removing all the food items) but they don't respond to that either.

We aren't doing anything different than we have always done; the soda machine gets a deep clean every Tuesday and the whole counter area gets at least one wipe-down every night so it shouldn't be the problem. I've looked in every nook and cranny and can't find any kind of "nest" or gathering of these things anywhere. The only thing different than usual is we had a very wet year last year and we've had a very mild winter this year.

Has anyone had any experience with anything like this? I'm about ready to order a whole fumigation or something if nothing else can be done.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 02-29-2012, 12:58 PM:

Little buggers are Fruit flies.

They feast on anything mouldy or loaded with bacteria.

Have any garbage cans that needs to be cleaned out, bleached out or similar?

Any old vegetables or organic food floating around that needs to be tossed?

Might have to tear apart the soda towers and give them a good bleach water cleaning to sanitize the units.

Posted by Frank Cox (Member # 6258) on 02-29-2012, 02:02 PM:

I put an electric bug zapper machine in an out-of-the-way corner of my lobby in the summer. In addition to killing them, the light attracts the bugs over and keeps them away from the rest of the lobby.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 02-29-2012, 02:54 PM:

What's another strange thing about these little dudes is, they don't seem to be attracted to light, so I don't think a zapper would do much. Our Pepsi machine has a lit tower that stays on all the time, and there are bright lights in the ceiling, but they don't go buzzing around those. They just seem to fly around at random, but concentrating on the area around the Pepsi machine. I'm thinking Monte might be right about bleach-cleaning the nozzles. I'll give that a try next.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-29-2012, 03:07 PM:

Have you checked the restroom for dead people?

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 02-29-2012, 06:00 PM:

Do you soak your Pepsi nozzles daily (like McDonalds). If not, you can't imagine what is "living" inside there. Louis

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 02-29-2012, 06:44 PM:

Joe - HOLY CRAP, that could be it!

Louis, we use the ProStar nozzle soak formula and I think it's only supposed to be used once a week, which is what we do. But, I'll review that for sure. Be that as it may, we've had the exact same procedures for a dozen years or more and have never had this problem till now.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 02-29-2012, 07:02 PM:

Every theater I have ever worked for soaked the nozzles daily.

Posted by Edward Havens (Member # 4715) on 02-29-2012, 09:38 PM:

I have my crew soak the nozzles in warm water, pour hot water down each drain and wipe down the bottoms of the soda towers (where the fizz from the drinks hits when the cups are filled to the top) with a hot clean wash cloth every single night. Twice a week (on Sundays and Thursdays), we add a soda tower drain cleaning solution we get from our concession supply company to the mix. We have never had an issue with any kind of flying nuisances in or near our snack bars.

Posted by Dave Macaulay (Member # 813) on 02-29-2012, 09:38 PM:

Maybe it's just the weird weather this winter? Fly hatches are weather triggered, and if a species has hatched early because of the non-winter we've had, their natural food may be missing and they're out looking for any nourishment they can find.
I've been places where the air is black with some species of small - or giant for that matter - fly for a few days every few years. There may be some cycle involved, but Hawaii has a fruitfly infestation every few years and around Lake Erie there's an occasional mayfly hatch that they bring the snowplows out for (seriously).

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 02-29-2012, 10:45 PM:

Once you get everything cleaner overnight, one thing to do with fruit flies is:
1) Put sweet vinegar (like apple cider or balsamic) inside cups
2) Cover them in plastic wrap.
3) Poke tiny hole
They get in to drink the stuff but can't find their way back out.

And you can also cut soap into it and that breaks the surface tension so that if they get in the fluid, they get stuck (and they get stuck easily at night when they can't see where the fluid begins).

Posted by Bill Enos (Member # 440) on 02-29-2012, 11:52 PM:

The over night false teeth soak products cleans the residue from nozzles very well.

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 03-01-2012, 12:07 AM:

Oh, agree with the weird weather-early hatching for sure.

In December, I saw some theatre's roller dumpsters that are store in a receiving room outside crammed full with fruit flies due to garbage that wasn't completely removed that had become mouldy.

Heard the staff members had to take the roller dumpsters outside on a good day and totally give them a degreaser wash and scrub down

I would like to add and maybe drift off topic here a bit, but it does pertain to conc cleanliness that one really has to be aware of:

Okey, wer're focusing on the excess syrup/mould/bacteria issue on why the attraction of these fruit flies, but we also need to pay attention to the syrup/water drains of the soda tower.

The tray drains and ice bin drains: if not flushed with hot water, or a light mixture of bleach and water, a build up of algae growth can begin like something fierce, esp if no conditioned water is used.

Algae growth will harden up in the lines to be like a black, rubbery substance that will plug up both ice bin drain lines and soda drain lines. I've had to clean out both using compressed air since the goo can easily be discharged under pressure.

Some theatre companies forbid the use of bleach on the premises due to safety issues, thus a degreaser is a close second choice. Thus, the daily washing out bins and drain lines with hot water is the most helful.

Some tips to look at. - thx Monte

Posted by Steven Stroud (Member # 6775) on 03-01-2012, 02:13 AM:

My question... what kind of bug guy do you have that can't ID fruitflies?

That's like... bug guy 101.

Posted by Edward Havens (Member # 4715) on 03-01-2012, 09:44 AM:

Some theatres still allow bleach in the building? I've worked for four different companies over the past twenty years, and all of them have had a strict policy about bleach. Can't order it from vendors, can't bring it in on our own, tell the janitors not to use it.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-01-2012, 10:57 AM:

quote: Steven Stroud
My question... what kind of bug guy do you have that can't ID fruitflies?

Well that's what's strange...after he got a look at them he told me they are NOT fruit flies. But I don't know what else they could be.

I'll see if I can catch one in a cup or something and get a photo of it.

Posted by Martin McCaffery (Member # 37) on 03-01-2012, 11:04 AM:

Have you checked any floor drains, especially one connected to the drink machine?

If the flies are residing there and living off of the sugar fueled lifeforms that can grow in the pipes, a treatment or two of cesspool cleaner (the kind with bacteria that eats the organic matter) may be the cure.

Posted by Dominic Espinosa (Member # 2122) on 03-05-2012, 01:27 AM:

quote: Joe Redifer
Have you checked the restroom for dead people?

Go, Joe with the topical humor...

Agree with the aforementioned.
We take it one step further, once a week we take a tiny bottle brush with hot water to the fountain heads.
The nozzles get a daily hot water bath and sanitizer and the hardware is all washed in the sink same as dishes or wiped down if it doesn't come off.

Additionally, you should take your BIB connectors (if equipped as such) and soak them in hot water once a week or so for a bit to get the crud off of them. The fruit flies LOVE those things.

Definitely also agree with douching out the trashcans regularly and cleaning the drains.
I'm partial to simple green for the former and plain old hot water and soda tower cleaner for the latter.

Good luck!

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-05-2012, 01:37 AM:

I'm working on a combination of various suggestions from above, so I'll report back what happens. I've already implemented daily soaking of the soda spigots and I noticed that the crew has been lax in catching the under-side of the valves, so that's being addressed too.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 03-05-2012, 07:59 AM:

What they need is a "solid nozzle" that you could fill with solution and install in place of the nozzle. This would let the "underside" soak. Louis

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-05-2012, 09:16 AM:

quote: Monte L Fullmer
Algae growth will harden up in the lines to be like a black, rubbery substance that will plug up both ice bin drain lines and soda drain lines. I've had to clean out both using compressed air since the goo can easily be discharged under pressure.

You should see the sludge that grows inside the drains from the beer tap in a bar! Yeast and bacteria from the beer grows on the inside of the pipes until it evenly coats them but, once the growth gets heavy enough, gravity pulls it away from the surface of the plastic pipe and it sloughs downward to make room for more growth. After a while, a whitish, snakelike skein of yeasty bacteria grows inside the pipe. It's friggin' scary!

The only thing that kills it is boiling water and pure lye. Bleach won't touch it. (The biofilm resists bleach.)

Pour a good, healthy cupfull of lye crystals down the drains, followed by a pitcher full of hot water from the coffee pot. Let it sit overnight and follow with another pot of hot water in the morning. Rinse with hot tap water until the drain runs clear. Follow with a drain snake if necessary. (Be sure to wash out all the lye lest you get chemical burns!)

Point I'm making, here, is that you might have some kind of biofilm coating on the insides of your drain lines that resists bleach and cleaners. Pure lye and/or mechanical cleaning might be the only way to remove them.

While you're at it, do the floor drains, the sink drains and any condensate drains from coolers or refrigerators, too.

Also, do you have any floor drains in areas that don't get used very often?

At Mercyhurst, we occasionally have problems with the drains in the downstairs dressing rooms drying up. During the summer, the dressing rooms don't get used very much and the water evaporates from the traps in the shower stalls and floor drains. When that happens, sewer gas and, sometimes, flies come up the drain.

Housekeeping and maintenance don't clean the dressing rooms during the summer because nobody uses them. The dressing room doors are all locked and nobody even goes in there. Why bother cleaning them? Right?

Well, the correct answer is that, even if they aren't used, somebody needs to go in there every couple-few weeks to check on things and run hot water down the sinks and showers, flush the toilets and pour a bucket of water down the floor drains.

So... Do you have a sink, a drain or a soda tower in a corner or a back area somewhere that doesn't get used very often? Since nobody ever uses it, you might think it doesn't need any attention from the cleaners but I think it pays to give them a look-see every so often just to make sure.

Posted by Eric Robinson (Member # 2966) on 03-05-2012, 12:12 PM:

quote: Joe Redifer
Have you checked the restroom for dead people?

Joe - you are the master of comedy [thumbsup]

Posted by Robert Crabtree (Member # 4795) on 03-16-2012, 03:44 AM:

Since I'm paranoid about the use of hazardous chemicals, I've come to use essential oils for a few tasks, including insect repellant.

Most essential oils are good at deterring a few specific insects. Some, like peppermint, lavender, and eucalyptus make a good broad-spectrum deterrent. You could try them out individually to see if they help drive them from your building.

I mix those three in equal parts in large batches, and as needed, place 3-6 drops in a mug of hot water. Pleasant, slightly medicinal smell to it. You can pick the oils up at GNC and most health food/whole food stores. Even if they don't work on the flies, these oils (particularly lavender) can be used with cleaning products or as a lobby fragrance.

More effective, but less adaptable as a "lobby fragrance", would be a mixture of 2 parts lemongrass with 1 part each peppermint, thyme, and lavender. Reasonably innocuous/pleasant odor, but thyme oil is comparatively scarce relative to the other oils.

Or do what my colleague from the Buckeye state does: she weekly wipes down every surface in her home with pure ammonia. Hasn't seen a roach or most other insects at home in over 18 months, and that's quite an accomplishment in Florida.

Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 03-16-2012, 03:23 PM:

We called them "mynocks".

Posted by Robert Crabtree (Member # 4795) on 03-17-2012, 01:32 AM:

While your bug guy ruled out fruit flies, this article about the effective use of citrus oils against fruit flies might be of use; and yet again, even if it doesn't work, you have a pleasant lobby/home fragrance on hand.

Fruit Flies Hate Citrus Oils