I know some folks like to post after hours, with a brew in hand, but would it be too much to ask everyone to read their post, either before sending it or immediately after the buzz wears off, and correcting the most glaring errors?
A tip if your spelling is bad and you know it - write your post using a word processor, run it through the spellcheck, then cut and paste it into the forum text box.
This isn't English class, and I hope folks don't think I'm going off the deep end, but I do want to be able to read what people are trying to say. Thanks. Note to Evans - The Bible is a self-referencing document with the theme "All your gods are belong to us." U talkin' tooo meeee?
Last night, I made a post that was one huge paragraph (in the "Caring About Composition" thread) listing many attributes of a theatre that was built in a former grocery store location, and after writing it, went in and quickly "broke it up" into shorter paragraphs, which made it much easier to read. Sometimes, even days after making a post, I'll spot a spelling or grammatical error that I never saw before. Thank goodness we can edit our posts on these forums. This thread is just begging for the following to be posted: The Spelling Checker Song I have a spelling checker. Eye ran this poem threw it. A checker is a blessing. Each frays comes posed up on my screen Bee fore a veiling checkers Butt now bee cause my spelling Now spelling does not phase me, To rite with care is quite a feet Sow ewe can sea why aye dew prays
That paragraph was exactly as I typed it at speed, without trying to be funny. I always have to do at least a couple read-throughs of my posts. Normally, I don't type fast enough to get sentences looking like that, but I always have errors that I have to correct. When I don't use spell-checking, I read through my posts immediately after they are posted, and snag out the worst problems. I'm convinced that my net connection somehow knows how to screw up my words between my computer to Brad's servers.
I just edited my post it was a mess with one continuous paragraph. Sometimes when I start ranting all proper procedures go out the window when it comes to paragraphs. I to have to go back and edit these problems out if I think about it. Sometimes I just get in a hurry. Just for the record I do not drink so I was in a consiuos state when making the post.
I love Evans response.
If you would like to read the following, please send your credit card number to SolemnRaz@aol.com where between $1 - $1000 will be deducted. (I'm being like the big guys where you never know the exact amount withdrawn). -Thankyou- Click your mouse button at the beginning of what you want to copy, hold the button down and drag it to the end of the area you want to copy so it is highlighted Go to the area or window you want to paste it, hold down the alt button and hit the letter V... TA-DA!!! Ok, thats about my extent of computer classes! hehe
Don't hit the Alt-C and Alt-V.... you need to use Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V. Don't worry Rachel, I'll only charge you 25% of whatever credit card fees you get!
I saw Mike's post up above and hope you don't have to pay him too much. My Credit card information is as follows: Please keep it confidential and don't let anyone one else have it. American Express Gold: 3921 453816 73072 Remember the above information is a secret.
There are UBB forums like this one that have built in Javascript spellcheckers.
http://home.earthlink.net/~jgar1/ubbw.html But first, you'll need to get a Mac to run it on. I'm sure there are other apps for lesser machines. I was trying to be funny and I can't even get that right!!!!! Now I gotta share all my money!!!!! GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
Evans
There is no need to use elaborate vocabulary, as we want everyone to understand our messages. However, the lack of good grammar and spelling, or typing, is uncalled for and as mentioned previously, can easily be corrected by simple review before sending each post. It would also help to lessen some of the misunderstandings that occur from time to time.
EVERYONE download this now. It works great!
Ummmm... guaranteed?
guar·an·tee (grn-t) We Windows users put the "u" before the "a." Oops! another case of keyboard dyslexia.
Try not to ever split infinitives. Not capitalizing proper adjectives is like not saluting the american flag. Don't use contractions. Do not abbr. Ixnay on colloquial stuff. Proofread to be sure you didn't any words out. And so on..... I highly recommend the books by Richard Lederer in which he takes very fun looks at the English language and provides many funny mistakes that people have made. Language is a fascinating subject. Evans A Criswell This sentence no verb. This sentence totally fails in its attempt to convey the point that it does not try to make. This sentence has contains two verbs. No hay huesos en helado. Or eight years in a Catholic grammar school, taught by "old fashioned" nuns in habits that rapped your knuckles with a ruler when you made a mistake. ------------------
If you question yourself I think it's okay to use "(sp?)" if you aren't quite sure how to spell something. (This assumes that you have TRIED to figure out how to spell it.) If you're quoting somebody or using an intentional misspelling or bad grammar then use "[Sic.]" (Latin abbreviation meaning that you copied word-for-word) Essentially, TRY to get things right! It's usually appearent to me when people do or don't put forth the effort. Those who try get some slack from me. Those who don't get pitied.
Back to the subject of spelling errors: I was thumbing through some maintenance logs at one of our theaters. The logs were written by the projectionists, who are 18 and 19 year old high school graduates. I did notice the spelling of some of their words. It is amazing. Get a load of this: Here is one about counting money. Check this out: Some time ago, I went to a store and purchased two computer sound cards. The total bill was $75.44. I presented a one-hundred dollar bill and two quarters. I was expecting $25.06 in change, and the lady at the cash register was not able to figure it out. To help her figure it out, I asked her to give me the two quarters back, which she did. Then, I gave her one quarter and told her I wanted 1 dime, 2 nickels and 5 pennies. I would guess her age is about 24 to 26 years old. How in the hell did she qualify for the job as cashier? Jeech!!!!!
Just like the commercial says, people DO judge you by the words you use (and, I submit, also by the words you write and how you write them). It's more important than you might imagine. My wife gets aggravated with me sometimes because of how long it takes me to write. I mull over every word, sentence, and paragraph, to make sure the ideas flow smoothly. As many books on the subject relate, editing IS writing. Some of my favorites are: "Write Tight", by William Brohaugh; "On Writing Well", by William Zinsser; and John's already mentioned Strunk and White's classic guide. One of my favorite columns is "The Writer's Art" by James J. Kilpatrick. He really keeps you on your toes! You can keep up with him at: ------------------ You can just TELL when they are putting forth an honest effort to answer the problem. Maybe they'll get it right, maybe they won't. If they don't, they'll try again. Perhaps they just can't get the right answer. I don't know why. Maybe they were out of school one day when the teacher explained something. It doesn't really matter why. The kid won't be happy that he couldn't get the answer but he'll know that if he doesn't go on to the next problem he won't get ANY of his homework done. (Maybe you would remind him of that?) Now, take another kid. He just sits there and wastes time hoping you go away. You get fed up and start trying to "prompt" him. It takes a few minutes to get the ball rolling and the answer ends up being right. Truth is YOU did the homework and HE didn't really learn anything... BUT he got the right answer (!) Which hypothetical kid is the "better" one? The one who got the right answer but didn't learn? Or the one who didn't get the right answer, even though he tried? Okay, this might be a thin example but what I'm trying to show is that a good, honest effort IS worth something. However, I make it clear that making a furtive effort and then just throwing up your hands and saying, "Oh, I tried..." is NOT acceptable. In the context of this forum, I would expect that TRY means to reread your post before hitting the submit button. Maybe if you didn't catch a mistake, you'll go back and edit it. Maybe there are ones you just don't find. Maybe you couldn't figure out how to spell a word and then typed your best educated guess and then added "(Sp?)". It's often pretty easy to tell the people who do these things, isn't it? You can tell who the "wankers" are, almost from the start, can't you? Let's face it. This isn't writing for the Pulitzer prize here. If we spent time to reread every single letter of every single word we wouldn't get a whole lot accomplished. I think there sould be a certain amount of slack built in for errors. On the other hand.... WANKERS DESERVE TO DIE, DIE, DIE!!!!!
Learning how to learn is a priority, and public schools have lost the ability to show how that is done. Huge schools and overloaded teachers do not make for educated students. As a manager in Vermont, I had theoretical physics students, second year film students, a television producer, and others of that educational level on the staff. The professionalism was outstanding, and things ran like clockwork. When I first moved to the south I was dismayed at the level of education of those applying for work. Birmingham students just weren't any where near as well educated, but they did have a terrific work ethic and a willingness to learn. When I moved again to Miami, it was another world entirely. The average employee in the theatres was lazy, uneducated, and unmotivated. I had employees threaten me that if I made them work they would get physical revenge, I had employees that couldn't count, I had one group of employees that walked off the job en-masse during a sellout show just to show their power. (Which was a totally fruit-loop childish idea, since they didn't have any jobs after that, and got bad references to boot.) Eventually I was able to get a better quality employee base in that particular theatre, but it was never great. When I became D.M. for Wometco, one of the first things I did was review all employee applications and set up some minimum standards for hiring. You would not believe some of the applications that were submitted. Major circuits simply don't know the difference in employee quality in different areas. I'll end my rant now before I get going too strong.
On the subject of spelling... I have been known to write some never-ending sentences here on Film-Tech, and so have most of you. I am here to read what all you have to say so that I can learn from you. I have to say that I have noticed some errors in some of the posts, but I would never bring it to the attention of the forum. My mama raised me to respect others and treat people the way I would want to be treated by them. We exchange alot of ideas here on this forum, which by the way, is the greatest! I'd hate for newcomers to read this thread and decide NOT to post simply because he/she is embarassed by his/her spelling skills. I have never enjoyed speaking before a group of people. I just freeze up and get tongue-tied. But, I do post here. If someone started getting on to me about errors and mistakes in grammar, I'd probably stop coming here. I love talking to all Film-Tech'ers. But this thread could make me think before I post... Not everyone paid attention in grade school, unfortunately. Southerners are no more slow than anyone else. I've met some real live-ones from "up north!" Before this becomes another civil war, I'll step away from the podium.
I am just so sure that Jerry hemmed and hawwed before he made his original posting on this thread and that he had concerns that his post might possibly have a negative effect on someone -- just like the one it had on you. But he was real careful to essentially say "please read your posts before you hit send," or barring that, edit it after you re-read it later on. I currently have a job that requires me to edit the often-technical writings of others. And let me tell you: I sure wish I had paid more attention in English class. I've only recently become more aware of my own split infinitives and with the proper use of "which" versus "that". And I don't get it right every time. But the point I'm attempting to make here and the one that I think Jerry was saying is that many of the posts have errors that just about ANYONE would recognize. It's just that rush to hit "send" that leads to many errors. I'm just about as forgiving as the next guy when I see errors in writing, but I can't tell you how many times I've read and re-read a sentence and realised that ONE WORD was making all the difference in the world to the meaning of that sentence, and often the word is "not" or "no" or some negative term. So, for instance, when the instructions tell you NOT to plug the equipment in until after you have re-assembled it, and the "NOT" is missing, it can lead to problems. And it's not just on web sites that these errors crop up. The WASHINGTON POST is FULL of grammar, punctuation, and spelling errors. SPELLING ERRORS!! -- Don't they at least have a spell checker? It's nuts! The POST is allegedly written for a less than high school-level reader, so when I have to stop and re-read a sentence in mid-paragraph, I know that they made some error somewhere, which I then spend time to ferret out. It shouldn't be like that. Let's see ... where was I going with this? AHHH ... Jerry, myself, and others are just saying that we love to read the words of wisdom of others, but if the message is garbled, it leaves us very frustrated and means that the efforts of the writer were wasted. With the collective knowledge of the members of this forum, THAT'S a darn shame -- David I have had almost the exact same experience when I moved here. I just couldn't believe how bad some people are. There are a lot of well educated people here but sometimes it's easy to let one bad apple spoil the whole bunch, if you know what I mean. Same thing happened in one of the places I work at! The Usher-B (who was on his "last legs" to begin with) clocked in at 6pm and walked out the door about 1/2 hour later and didn't tell anybody. Nobody knew he'd left until movies started comming up late. It just so happened I came to that theatre for a PM call. I had just walked in the door when the GM told me what happened. So the two of us went upstairs and took care of the booth for the rest of the night. Later on that night I went outside to have a smoke between sets and there's the kid who quit, driving through the lot with a couple of his friends from work. They were drunk. Cimenark has a very strict no drinking policy. (As it should be) Since they were intoxicated on company property they were all fired. It turned out that a couple of other kids knew about this whole thing. I think some of them were supposed to walk out too but chickened out. All of them got called into the office and were disciplined. I think one of them got canned. In the mean time, the manager made it known to all that their little plan backfired on them. Honestly I think this whole thing is rather funny! PS: I have since learned that it is a good idea to "run" a booth yourself once in a while. There are a whole lot of little things you'll find that need to be fixed that way. You might not find them otherwise.
I maintain that it is not enough to try; you must DO. If other people can write in one blurb and then leave, with their message fully comprehendable, that's wonderful! I greatly admire someone who can do that. I go over my words, sentences, and paragraphs with a magnifying glass because I HAVE to. That is how I DO. ------------------
I worked for Wometco after the K.K.R. breakup, and never had a chance to meet the Colonel. The theatres had been run by an ex-GCC employee during and after that time. The horror stories I could tell are not nice. Placing blame on any one individual wouldn't be fair though. The breakup was huge, and the things that the old Wometco was involved in were incredibly diverse. Wometco had cable tv, television stations, production studios, theatres in Puerto Rico, Florida, and Alaska, wax museums, the Key West Conch Train, the Miami Seaquarium, a major vending and office cafeteria company, etc., etc. That any of them got proper management supervision from a man spread so thin is amazing. I redesigned much of the WOMETCO theatre paperwork (with lots of input from the managers and office staff) from the ground up, starting from the day I arrived as a manager. The GCC bullshit forms were swamping the managers while the floor was being left unattended. Paperwork was only a minor part of the problem, but correcting it lifted some of the burden and helped get the ball rolling on other improvements. It took a couple of years before things started to come around, thanks to tremendous teamwork by everyone involved. By the time the remaining theatres were sold to Cobb, the managers were hiring better people, and not afraid to dump the losers. I'm proud of the improvements in Wometco theatres during those years. Enough about Wometco. My comment on education wasn't meant to start a civil war. I still live in South Florida, but I've been around and my observations are from a comparable cross section of employees in the same industry. I stand by those observations, and don't fault the poor kids that get stuck with sub-standard education. The problem is recognized here in Florida by everyone including the state legislature, so much that schools (not the kids - the schools) now get grades, and kids from underperforming schools are being given the chance to transfer out to other schools, and teachers at the worst schools are called on the carpet. Florida, by constitution, has no income tax, and must balance the budget each year. There isn't enough money for education. Many schools are merely collections of portable housing (trailers). Those schools that _are_ permanent stink from mold and mildew. I've taken adult ed courses in one and walked through others. I don't know how kids stand being in those buildings. Teachers have to somehow teach kids that speak only Spanish or Creole right along with those that speak only English, and the flow of drugs through the area makes it a requirement that there are police officers at every school to slow the traffic. This is not conducive to education, through no fault of the kids. Compare that to a school where class sizes were 30 students max, usually less than 20, in an isolated area where there was no incentive to skip school, no drugs available at any price, and the teachers expected most of the seniors to go on to college or at least junior college, and demanded each kid give his or her best. The difference in schooling is there. Southern parents with money pay to provide kids what we got for free, and those Florida parents without money entrust their kids to a terrible system. Reality sucks, and saying it ain't so won't make it any better. RE: Causing people to not post for fear of being critisized - I respectfully disagree with the concept. I posted because I couldn't read a particular post that had a single paragraph fully eight or more paragraphs long. Darryl broke that post up into readable chunks and was very gracious in how he handled what I had meant as constructive critisism. I was then able to read the post and became a happy camper. If you re-read the first post, you'll note that I specifically said: "This isn't English class, and I hope folks don't think I'm going off the deep end, but I do want to be able to read what people are trying to say. Thanks." I guess I wasn't clear enough, or I confused the issue with some nit-picking I did in jest after that post, but please note the smilies that accompany those jests. I hope you continue to post, and I hope that others aren't turned off from posting (unless their posts turn out to be totally unreadable Anyone with a burning desire to become better at their profession has to be willing to suffer a little in obtaining that goal. Edison didn't get the light bulb right the first time, Churchill and Einstein weren't great students, and Dan Quayle... well, nevermind Dan Quayle. I think you get my point. Many spelling errors are simply "typos", and we all have that problem from time to time. Just like the word, "hemorrhoid" - who cares if it is not spelled correctly? You would be surprised how many people can't spell some words. As long as the thought is conveyed, that's what counts. The post I made earlier about 18 and 19 year-olds clearly indicates some can't spell worth a hoot. But I can say the worst speller of the two was a very careful projectionist, (and a very good one at that) and actually took pride in what he did. I can't ask any more than that from a person.
That post about the salesperson unable to make change was great. I think the advent of the "amount tendered" button on cash registers made change-counting a lost art. My brother in law owns a grocery store. One of his employees sold $2.57 worth of stuff, and received a five dollar bill from the customer....but by mistake, she punched in $50.00 as the amount tendered. The machine showed that $47.43 was due in change, so that's what the cashier gave him! (Needless to say, she's no longer employed there.) I know there are a ton of stupid people in the business world but I've never seen one THAT stupid before! As for this thread about grammar, etc. I'd just like to suggest that paragraphs be kept short. A big long paragraph is harder to read. Three or four sentences is a good length; just look at a newspaper. Of course this is just my opinion; your mileage may vary! I abosultely agree that coddling kids who fail by saying, "That's okay because you tried." does not promote learning. They weren't made to "attack" the problem and gain experience (in the subject area). When a student can't get the right answer the "proper" way to handle it would be to say, "No, that's not right... try again." If they can't get it after a few tries then you, as the teacher, should take a different approach. Maybe you should "rephrase" the problem. Maybe you should move on to another problem and come back to the original problem later. Maybe you should abandon the problem all together. If you don't do something you'll only succeed in frustrating the student and impede learning. Now, to bring this back to the subject at hand, when somebody is writing a post to the internet or an e-mail it might be said that he is in the position of being his own teacher. When faced with a problem, (in this case, it is writing in English) he must realize when mistakes are being made and look for a solution. As pointed out above that solution could possibly include having to leave a word misspelled or making an error in grammar. When this happens, the person should somehow point it out. Maybe by marking the word as being misspelled. After all the real task is to get a message across. Belaboring a small mistake just gets in the way. All this having been said; I think it's easy to tell who is putting forth the effort and who isn't. Again, I say that those who I perceive to be making an honest effort get slack from me. Those who I do not perceive as making an honest effort get no slack. I don't think anybody would disagree that posting to the 'net has a lot more room for error in spelling and grammar. Few people can type with the skill of a stenographer / secretary or write with the eloquence of a professional writer. When I say that making an "attempt" is good enough I am going under the assumption that one is making his BEST attempt and not just throwing his hands up and saying, "Well, I tried..."
Your replies have enlightened my thinking. YOU are absolutely right. I did jump the gun and go off half-cocked....Something that I am famous for.... What a site! I've learned something new today!!! As far as driving people away, I've never known anyone to not post for fear of looking stupid in regards to grammatical errors, but I do know of a some people that could offer the gang here a lot, but do not post because they are afraid that something they write will be incorrect or live in fear of what their boss might say about participating on a public forum. This to me is sad, as EVERYONE makes mistakes. This can be proved on any thread that deals with a troubleshooting problem. Absolutely every member who has attempted to assist with someone else's problem (almost always without quite enough information to offer an absolute solution) has posted a recommendation at one point or another that turned out to be wrong. One would think that people are above this, but apparently not. Also bothersome is any company that will frown upon an employee participate for whatever bizarre reason about being misrepresented. But what can be done? Nothing that I know of. Still, I would rather have a lot of posts with grammatical errors on them that would add to the overall information passed through these forums than not hear from those people at all. There are lots of extremely smart people who know an awful lot in the field of projection that cannot type or spell worth a damn. While I agree that spelling and grammatical errors are important to professionalism, I also don't want to see those people leave based on something like this. So my question is...if I figured out how to incorporate a spell checker into the forum's program, would it be used enough to warrant the time and hassle of coding it in? I am not exactly a master wizard of Perl, Java and the whole "raw code" thing to begin with, but I will put forth the effort to add it if the members want and will use it.
When I am on one of my other computers that does not use two monitors, I would definately use your spell check if it was in your program. Paul
------------------ Is the computer that does not use dual monitors capable of running more than one program simultaneously? If so, then you can still pull up Word and check your crappy spelling Aren't dual monitors cool? I love being able to move the mouse pointer back and forth between the two screens, and drag files and windows back and forth as well. Aaahhh, the freedom!
Being as feeble minded as I am, I like to see the page in Film-Tech at the same time I am ANALyzing a word. Yes, I have Word 2000 on my taskbars in the other machines, except I have so much crap in the taskbars now that I need quad focals to see them - even on 19 inch monitors. Yes, Dual monitors really kick butt. Presently, I have 4 computers on my network here at home that are configured for dual monitors, and the others are not. I didn't know my spelling was crappy. I guess I'll have to fix my corrupted spelling check file..
To sum it up in one sentence:
Is it just me, or do any of you find that spelling errors and grammatical errors are much harder to see when using the post entry mechanism than when viewing the post in the forums? I do proofread my posts after writing them, but I usually overlook spelling errors and other mistakes that become very obvious when looking at the actual post on the forum pages. I believe the font has something to do with it. I just made a post in the thread about the Newsweek digital projection article and I had to edit my post 7 or 8 times to remove spelling errors that I could not see in the post entry mechanism, but that were totally obvious in the forum view. Typically, my posts require one or two edits to get them corrected because mistakes are so much harder to see while entering. Am I the only one who has noticed this? I think the forum font for posts is much easier to read than the Courier type of font used in the entry mechanism. Evans
Evans
By the way, the font in the text entry box is not changeable. [This message has been edited by Brad Miller] Actually on other UBB forums, you can edit your post a million times and have only one [This message has been edited by Joe Redifer (edited on 3-30-2001) ] You just have to delete the previous My favorite UBB tag is as follows if the Film-Tech boards were unhacked: [NOTE: This message may have been edited by Film-Tech staff without the author's knowledge, permission, or approval.] That just seems rude! I think another reason for errors is that the text box is so small. It is not wide enough. It needs to be at least twice as wide.
Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 03-21-2001, 11:04 AM:
Jerwee,
Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 03-21-2001, 11:17 AM:
I usually always make spelling errors the first time I write, and usually have to edit most posts at least twice to get all spelling errors out.
It came with my PC.
It plane lee marks four my revue
Miss steaks aye can knot see.
Your sure real glad two no.
Its very polished in its weigh,
My checker tolled me sew.
It freeze yew lodes of thyme.
It helps me right awl stiles two reed,
And aides me when aye rime.
Eye trussed too bee a joule.
The checker pours o'er every word
To cheque sum spelling rule.
Hour spelling mite decline,
And if we're laks oar have a laps,
We wood bee maid too wine.
Is checked with such grate flare,
There are know faults with in my cite,
Of nun eye am a wear.
It does knot bring a tier.
My pay purrs awl due glad den
With wrapped words fare as hear.
Of witch won should be proud,
And wee mussed dew the best wee can,
Sew flaws are knot aloud.
Such soft wear four pea seas,
And why eye brake in two averse
Buy righting want too please.
Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 03-21-2001, 11:20 AM:
Hi Bob.
Posted by Darryl Spicer (Member # 711) on 03-21-2001, 11:33 AM:
Jerry
Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 03-21-2001, 01:03 PM:
Jerry, I do the same as you. I review what I send and hit the edit button. I am not computor literate enough to be able to cut and paste. As a matter of fact I forgot to give Robert DiNiro credit for my line which I stole from "Waxie Wiver".
Posted by Rachel Carter (Member # 693) on 03-21-2001, 01:43 PM:
*Rachel's Training Class for Copying and Pasting* Then hold down the alt button and hit the letter C
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-21-2001, 02:07 PM:
Mike's Update on Rachel's Computer Class
Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 03-21-2001, 03:05 PM:
Rachel, Thanks for the information, I appreciate the help. Some time soon I will figure out where all these keys are located.
Expiration Date 08/05
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-21-2001, 04:15 PM:
On the Mac its even eaiser to copy and paste. The control key is waaay over on the corners of the keyboard, so you have to use two hands or stretch your fingers to press Control-C and control-V. On the Apple its Command (The key with the Apple symbol)-C and Command-V. Command is right next to the space bar, so you can do it quickly and effortlessly with one hand.
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-21-2001, 08:37 PM:
There are text editors especially for off-line editing before posting to a BBS. One that comes to mind is UBB Writer.
Posted by Rachel Carter (Member # 693) on 03-22-2001, 02:17 AM:
DAMN!
Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 03-22-2001, 09:51 AM:
I've found that correct spelling and grammer is very esential to good writing. People that can't seem to form porper sentences just doesn't give a good impression. By fourth grade, nearly everyone should of been taught how to properly get they're ideas in to english. In complete sentences, too. If you doesn't know english pretty good, you should pick up a grammer guide, which be of significant help occasionally, or even hire you some secreterial staff. There's few things worst than trying to read some poorly written paragraph, its givin an impression thats badder than a kindergarden kid. Always strive for excellance in you're writing and if yor mispell words a lot, be sure their some good spellers enroled in your departmant. Mispellings are an embarressment. I ain't meaning to be hipocritical but this subject is being relevent to a lot of stuff going on here and I feel that Jerry done good by bringing it up. I haven't saw much good grammer in public forums in quite a while and good speling went away about 30 years ago. All those folks borned about a generation or two ago just didn't absorb the stuff that they was teached as well and they just never knowed their english. A few years ago I seen a poster that had a big ol' cartoon and at the top it said "How many mispelled words can you find" and I thought it was pretty wierd. There was always one mispelled word on that poster noone never found. Oh, and about cutting and pasting, if you don't know them shortcut keys, you can always go up to the Edit menu and use the cut copy and paste options embeded in it. Well, I gess I'll get down off my sope box about grammer and speling.
Posted by Richard C. Wolfe (Member # 431) on 03-22-2001, 10:55 AM:
It had been on my mind for sometime now to bring up this topic, but I must admit that I was afraid that doing so would create a great deal of criticism. Many people today just don't care what impression they make when speaking or writing. I prefer to read well written dialogue as, obviously, it makes it much easier both to read and to understand.
Posted by William T. Parr (Member # 677) on 03-22-2001, 11:46 AM:
I must admit, I am one of the worst in this forum when it comes to this. 
I will make the conscious effort to correct and spell check my work before I post it in a Forum. And it is OK Jerry I appreciate you pointing it out as sometimes we may not notice that we are doing it until somebody says something.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-22-2001, 05:21 PM:
Yes, everyone should download UBB Writer. You just type in your text, and you can even add bold, italics, etc just as you would in any text editor. There are also graphical smilies so that you are guaranteed to get the smily you want without having to go look it up in the smilies legend. Then you just copy and paste the text into the real UBB and post!
Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 03-22-2001, 05:23 PM:
"Yes, everyone should download UBB Writer. You just type in your text, and you can even add bold, italics, etc just as you would in any text editor. There are also graphical smilies so that you are gauranteed "
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-22-2001, 05:30 PM:
Hey! I don't use it! I'm too lazy!
Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 03-22-2001, 05:38 PM:
I always suspected Mac users spoke a different language.
n. Something that assures a particular outcome or condition: Lack of interest is a guarantee of failure.
Leave it to the Steve Jobs to create a new and improved version of the word.
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 03-22-2001, 06:08 PM:
.thgir kool ti evah tsael ta ot semit noillim a tide ot evah I ,semitemoS .boB dna lyrraD sa emas eht od yllausu I .kechc lleps a esu elpoep emos emit tuoba si ti kniht I
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-22-2001, 06:37 PM:
Paul, how long did it take you to type that? I assume you have a program to flip everything around?
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 03-22-2001, 07:24 PM:
Joe, just a jug of wine to make me silly and LOTS of concentration does the trick...
Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 03-22-2001, 08:40 PM:
Paul. that is oot, not ot.
The o slipped to the od.
Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 03-22-2001, 09:43 PM:
The previous post I made with all of the intentional spelling and grammatical errors was meant to be humorous. (A paragraph sharply criticizing such mistakes while each sentence contains at least one such error). It was inspired by a WWW site I saw years ago that tallied occurrences of misspelled words on the WWW or USENET (I forget which) and had them sorted by frequency. It was also inspired by lists of "English rules" where the rule is broken in the statement of the rule, such as:
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 03-22-2001, 09:59 PM:
"Elements of Style" by Strunk and White is highly recommended for writers:
"Elements of Style" at Amazon.com
"Growing Up Catholic" at Amazon.com
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0767905970.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-22-2001, 10:53 PM:
As far as I'm concerned, a COUPLE of errors here and there are acceptible. BUT not when the grammar and spelling mistakes obscure the message.
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 03-23-2001, 12:46 AM:
Jerry, I corrected my error.
Allin Wrinchs
Desktop Suplies
Windos
Cleening
Sockit Tools
Leeks Oil
Statick
Manul
Flikered
Exzust
Bottum
Colecting
Cought
Plater
Problum
Plyers
Tikit
Wees Gonna....
Neat, Huh? Our future leaders? This is going to be interesting...........
When she gave me that change, I said, "Now I gave you a hundred dollar bill, right"? She replied, "Yes". I then said, "OK - here is a quarter, a dime, a nickel, and 4 pennies. How much money are you going to give me back in change? She blushed, and gave me $25.00 back.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-23-2001, 01:05 AM:
There are no kwalifikayshuns to be a cashier. Just wander downstairs every now and then and look at the people working behind the stand or in the box orifice.
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 03-23-2001, 01:17 AM:
Joe, "Bulls Eye"!!!
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 03-23-2001, 01:57 AM:
This is one of my pet peeves, boys and girls! Spelling and grammar are most important, regardless (note I didn't say "irregardless", which isn't a word) of the current belief that anything goes as long as you are trying, and as long as a person understands what you mean.
http://www.uexpress.com/coveringthecourts/viewjk.cfm?Archive=yes
Better Projection Pays!
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-23-2001, 02:40 AM:
Have you ever sat with a kid in grade school, trying to help him or her grasp some concept from their homework? (Math for example.) It could be your own kid, a neice/nephew or a neighbor kid.
Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 03-23-2001, 08:37 AM:
Paul, that booth log is typical of what passes for spelling in many areas. Of all of the gifts that a parent can give a child, perhaps the best is a good early education that teaches how to ask questions and instills a sense of curiosity. My parents moved to a different town, and my mother took a job as a teacher at the local school so that her sons would get the best education. That school was regularly rated one of the top schools in the state, and education within the state was a priority.
All three of us became well educated because of her effort.
Posted by Bruce McGee (Member # 131) on 03-23-2001, 10:02 AM:
Jerry!
I worked for a short time for Wometco at one of their TV stations. The station was sold shortly thereafter and I kept the old Wometco logo artwork when the new owners started tossing everything. It's here in storage somewhere.
Posted by David Koegel (Member # 25) on 03-23-2001, 01:11 PM:
Bruce -- You tell me that you NEVER see me post here anymore on Film-Tech, so here's a fresh one for you. 
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-23-2001, 01:13 PM:
Jerry: quote:
When I moved again to Miami, it was another world entirely. The average employee in the theatres was lazy, uneducated, and unmotivated.
quote:
I had one group of employees that walked off the job en-masse during a sellout show just to show their power.
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 03-23-2001, 06:33 PM:
quote:
Which hypothetical kid is the "better" one? The one who got the right answer but didn't learn? Or the one who didn't get the right answer, even though he tried?
Neither, because no one learned; which is, after all, the objective. Randy, this is the whole point. Our current educational system holds that simply trying alone is all that matters. They don't care whether you learn anything or not, which should be a crime. That's what I was referring to.
Better Projection Pays!
Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 03-23-2001, 07:05 PM:
Bruce! ).
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 03-23-2001, 07:59 PM:
Quite honestly, when I read a post, I look beyond the spelling errors. I agree, these forums are not an english class. I also agree that some spelling errors basically should not even happen, and a spell check should be initiated if one is not sure of a certain word spelling.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-23-2001, 09:00 PM:
Paul (and everyone),
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-23-2001, 10:21 PM:
I'd have to say that "learning" is not always equal to "getting the right answer". Learning is more about gaining experience in one way or another. Since making an (honest, forthright) attempt and then failing is experience then if follows that one CAN learn something when he fails. You learn not to do something (dangerous) again or you learn that 2+2 <> 5, etc.)
Posted by Bruce McGee (Member # 131) on 03-23-2001, 10:30 PM:
Jerry, Paul, David K....
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-24-2001, 02:21 AM:
...and this is precisely why the very first "hack" I did to this board when I first purchased it was to figure out a way to get rid of the [This message edited by XXX XXXX] notations every time a message was edited. Personally, I just type it all in, click submit and then when the program takes me right back to the thread THEN I re-read my post. Most of the time it reads well and I am a pretty decent typist, but if I do catch something, I click that edit button and fix it. I do it this way because I find it easier to read a post on the entire finished screen as opposed to this little box I am typing in right now. Regardless, I'm sure there are members that don't realize they can edit a post. This is covered in the "faq" link at the top of every forum page for anyone who wants to know how it works.
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 03-24-2001, 01:50 PM:
Hi, Brad. I would probably use the spell checker if it was in the program. However, I have a dual-monitor setup on this computer, so if I run into a word where the spelling is questionable, I'll just simply pull up MS Word on the other screen and run a spell check.
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 03-24-2001, 03:09 PM:
Randy, we fundamentally agree.
Better Projection Pays!
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-24-2001, 05:56 PM:
Paul- Just put an alias to Word on the Windows taskbar at the bottom of the screen... just one clicky-poo away!
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 03-24-2001, 06:46 PM:
Hi, Joe. Sometimes, I have Film-Tech loaded through AOL on one monitor and MSIE on the other monitor , so if I answer a post, I can taylor it to the post I am answering. Works cool.
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-24-2001, 07:40 PM:
Yes, Tim I think we DO agree!
I realize that people make mistakes but I have very little tolerance for people who put forth the minimum amount of effort to "get by".
Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 03-30-2001, 10:42 AM:
I've been meaning to say something about this for a few months, so here goes:
Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 03-30-2001, 10:49 AM:
Evans, I agree. When I am writing a post I do not pick up my spelling errors. I usually hit the edit button the minute my post appears in the forum section. I edit at least two times per post.
Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 03-30-2001, 01:38 PM:
Good! I'm glad I'm not the only one. Brad, is it possible to get the text entry part of the posting page to use the same font that is used to display the text of the postings on the forum viewer pages, or is that hard-coded in the software? It may cut down on the number of uncaught errors made in post entries.
Posted by Jerry Chase (Member # 660) on 03-30-2001, 01:52 PM:
Evans, I agree. I find it strange that I can't see the errors while typing but they are glaring in the post. I dislike text entry boxes.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 03-30-2001, 02:08 PM:
This is the reason why I have hacked out the "[This message has been edited by...]" notation that normally appears on this forum program whenever someone makes a change. Let's say I had to edit this thread 4 times to get all of my spelling errors out of it. It would otherwise look like the end of this one.
[This message has been edited by Brad Miller]
[This message has been edited by Brad Miller]
[This message has been edited by Brad Miller]
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-30-2001, 05:51 PM:
I agree with Evans. Perhaps we should send some covert operators to the UBB headquarters and force them to change it. They make tons of changes all the time. You will see below the text box when you are typing a post "NO BOOKMARKING ALLOWED" and it will be in a scroll window. This was a change in the UBB to let you see the post you are replying to. I think they make at least one change per month.
[This message has been edited by Joe Redifer (edited on 3-30-2001) ]
each time you edit. Fun!
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-30-2001, 08:32 PM:
This is why I suggested the UBB Writer program. It makes double checking your spelling / grammar much easker.
AND you get all those cool UBB features at the click of a button!