This is topic US Campaign for Logo-Free TV! in forum Film-Yak at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 07-23-2002, 01:47 PM:
http://www.logofreetv-usa.com
Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 07-23-2002, 04:17 PM:
OK, who the phugg decided to put dark blue text against an only slightly lighter shade of blue background? I do not feel like straining to read any of the links, so I only read the front page.
Posted by Gerard S. Cohen (Member # 994) on 07-23-2002, 04:30 PM:
The TV stations may be doing this for the same rason Thomas Edison had the scenery in his early films painted with an "AB" logo for
American Biograph. There were no copyrights on early films, until
Edison printed an entire reel on a continuous strip of paper and sent it to the U.S. Patent Office with a check for $0.50 to protect his copyright. Itwas common practice to pirate film reels in nickolodeon days, but the logo fully visible on the canvas backdrop in each scene would indicate the real production company.My TV has the option of displaying the time and channel should I wish to see it, but I agree having the broadcaster keeping a logo there against my wishes is certainly annoying.
Posted by Thomas Procyk (Member # 1170) on 07-23-2002, 08:41 PM:
I agree that the logos are irritating as hell. Especially when a show returns from commercial, and for 15-30 seconds some huge obnoxious animated graphic is dancing on the screen telling me that some show I could care less about will be on that network next week. I look around for a mouse to close that "popup"... 
Other stations tell you what's coming up next or what you're watching on the channel at random intervals. Oh yes, by all means distract my viewing to remind me what I am watching!!
The worst, by far, is "The New TNN." This network has some good programming sometimes, but their little logo thingy takes up an ENTIRE BAR at the bottom of the screen, with their logo, and "text-slides" of info on their dumb station, what program you are watching, what's up next, what's on tomorrow, etc. etc. Not to mention, the image is sqished vertically to accomodate for this thing, and it changes colors with every new message. WHY?!?!
Think I'll just go to the movies... Or maybe they'll stick a studio logo in the corner eventually, so you'll know that Brand-X studio's films are the best. 
It's time to put a stop to this nonsense.
=TMP=
Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 07-24-2002, 01:26 AM:
I dunno, fellas. It doesn't bother me all that much.To be honest, with so many gosh-darn channels, it's kind-of nice to be reminded of what channel I'm on.
I'll tell you what I really, REALLY like...
...and you'll probably just HATE me for this one...
...when they flash up the name of the show that you're watching and, sometimes, a reminder of what's coming on later in the evening, or later in the week. I like those a lot. I think TNT makes a habit out of doing those. They're really handy because then I don't have to go to the TV Guide channel (or the internet) to figure out what the heck I'm watching at 2am.
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 07-24-2002, 05:46 AM:
I hate those station logos, too. They are definitely one of the worst ideas of the '90s. It is ironic, though, that they web page that complains about the ugly logos is, itself, quite ugly.On the same topic, I'll put in a complaint about a similar practice in the radio world: stations that play short advertisements for themselves ("you're listening to WXXX-FM!") every few seconds (it seems). What a waste of time (except to the ratings people, of course!).
Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 07-24-2002, 05:55 AM:
In Canada the CRTC requires that all TV and radio stations 'identify themselves' a set number of times per hour. That way when your're in your airplane and can't hear anything on the airports frequency but the local radio station (that is broadcasting all over the place because their transmitter got hit by lighting) you know who to call and bitch at. 
Actually had this happen before. 
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 07-24-2002, 07:14 AM:
>>Avoid-commercial media. You can rent movies instead of watching TV programs, go to the cinema, theatre, or attend live music performances. You can read books, or listen to local/satellite radio.<<Yeah...THAT'LL show 'em!
Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 07-24-2002, 10:33 AM:
But, Gerard, in most cases, the station doesn't make any of the TV shows that it airs and, as you know, the copyright problem has been solved.I think you mean that they want to make sure that nobody gets a "clean" copy, eh?
Posted by Adam Fraser (Member # 1074) on 07-24-2002, 12:37 PM:
Scott,
The other 1/2 owner of our theatre used to be a radio announcer and said that it was regulated that radio stations had to identify themselves every so many minutes. This was in the U.S.------------------
Adam Fraser
www.pinestheatre.com
Posted by James R. Hammonds, Jr (Member # 673) on 07-24-2002, 12:48 PM:
Radio stations are only required to identify themselves once an hour, and then all they need is call letters followed by city.
No dial setting, no nickname, no nothing else.
Should be done at the begining of the hour or first natural break.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 07-24-2002, 12:49 PM:
I wish they had a deal where, when you switch to a channel, the name of the show would display on screen for a couple of seconds, but it would not appear otherwise. Don't some of the satellite companies do this? I don't know squat about satelite TV.
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 07-24-2002, 01:22 PM:
Yes, I understand the concept of the "legal ID" that radio and TV stations need to broadcast periodically, but that's not my complaint. At least in the Boston market, it's common to give the call letters (and usually some "cute" plug for the station) every few minutes. This applies to all kinds of formats and it seems to be done for the purposes of the Arbitron ratings (since people need to know what station they are listening to in order to write it in their diaries). I often listen to the WBZ morning news, which is one of the worst offenders here--they play an ad for themselves at nearly every commercial break.
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 07-24-2002, 01:54 PM:
I had a short stint at a radio station and they were only legally required to give their call letters once every hour- the rest of the ID's played in between songs just said "104.3: The Breeze" (a boring smooth-jazz format, it's a Spanish station now) Using the TV mentality, they'd just play the ID's continously over the music! I often can't find the right AM talk station I'm looking for, and since it's just people talking why not play IDs continuously in the background? 
(Yes, I'm JOKING!)
The place I moved into last year had the cable left on so I was getting free cable for a few months, and I'd check it periodically just to be disgusted at what was on. They eventually turned it off and I never bothered to unpack my rabbit ears, so for the past few months I've been getting NO TV at all, and I don't miss it one bit!
Posted by Thomas Procyk (Member # 1170) on 07-24-2002, 08:31 PM:
Hey! I've got an idea... why don't theaters play their policy trailer between each reel? That way, you will always know what theater you are at, so if you get a quality presentation, you will know where to come back!! =TMP=
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 07-25-2002, 01:38 PM:
That's actually the main reasoning behind network logos- they think if you see their logo on the screen during your favorite show, you'll remember what network brings you that show and feel really good about them. For me though all it does is cause me to hate that company for ruining the show!
Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 07-25-2002, 02:05 PM:
quote:
why don't theaters play their policy trailer between each reel
Why stop there? Just get a gobo to project the theater's logo in the corner of the screen and use the in-between-reels-time to show rolling stock! 
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 07-26-2002, 11:00 AM:
Adam Martin suggested: "Just get a gobo to project the theater's logo in the corner of the screen and use the in-between-reels-time to show rolling stock!"Nah. The cheapest way would be to print the ads and logos right on the screen surface. Wouldn't even need a gobo projector or to splice the ads in.
------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 07-26-2002, 01:43 PM:
But you'd want the logo to go off the screen when showing ads
Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 07-26-2002, 02:14 PM:
We are starting to get these wretched things here in the uk as well now. They have never been used on any of the four main channels, channel 5 has had a permanent logo since it started a few years ago, but since there is just about nothing on that worth watching, maybe one or two programmes per year, it didn't matter too much.Just about all of the additional channels available via digital/cable/satellite have these things, many of them far more prominent than the Channel 5 one. Cbeebies is one of the worst, but since that is for pre-school aged people, and shows mainly Teletubbies etc., I'm not too worried by it. What I am worried about is having the damned things on BBC4, a new channel showing 'serious' programming, and the main reason why I finally bought a digital terrestrial box three weeks ago.
I absolutely hate these things, yet people will quite happily watch them who complain about change-over cues on just about one second of film every hour or so, and that in four-frame blocks.
What on Earth is the intended purpose of these logos? Are they intended to be some kind of anti-piracy device? Surely not a very effective one; much better ider to go after the people who advertise pirate DVDs for sale on the internet, some of whom have been doing so for months, if not years.
If these logos are really intended for identification purposes, there is no need whatsoever for them to be burned in to the picture, they could be added as a digital overlay at the press of a button when required.
Polite request to broadcasters:
I do not want these things; nobody that I have asked about them, maybe 40 people, wants them. Please remove them as soon as possible.
Thank you.
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 07-26-2002, 09:31 PM:
I already sent that "polite request" to Fox about 9 years ago, their response was to have it stay onscreen all the time instead of just a minute before and after commercial breaks. I did get a letter from The Simpsons staff thanking me though- it's a shame Matt Groening didn't pull the show over this (I don't even watch The Simpsons anymore because of the logo.)
I sent another polite request to Fox when they started taking feedback e-mails, and in response to my well-worded argument they responded with "Unfortunately you will be complaining for years to come. The logo remains."
Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 08-03-2002, 03:01 AM:
Good news for those of us here in the uk. we have a similar thing:
http://www.logofreetv.org.uk/ If you object to these things, please let the BBC know aboout it; if they can be persuaded to stop doing it maybe others will follow.
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-03-2002, 11:37 AM:
I remember an episode of "The Simpsons" where in the opening credit (when the characters all run to the couch) Homer stomps on the logo down in the lower right hand corner of the screen.I hate those logos too. One theory why the networks put that spam on the TV throughout the show so if anyone tapes it they'll have a more difficult time selling a clean copy of it. Only the network will have the "logo free" version in their vaults.
Posted by James B. Openshaw (Member # 1310) on 08-03-2002, 11:44 AM:
On TNN, in addition to the logo on the bottom-right corner, they also have a bar at the bottom of screen showing you what you're watching during the entire show. Anyone else notice that?
Posted by Thomas Procyk (Member # 1170) on 08-04-2002, 12:55 PM:
quote:
One theory why the networks put that spam on the TV throughout the show so if anyone tapes it they'll have a more difficult time selling a clean copy of it.
See, but that's dumb on the network's part. Because what if you aren't selling, or even taping it? You should still be allowed a clean presentation. It's just like if the MPAA threw a bunch of logos and crap into movies, ("You're Watching ROAD TO PERDITION!"---cool transition---"Next Week: SIGNS!") so that those pirates in there with camcorders don't get a "clean" copy to sell. That's not fair to the legitimate audience.
It's all part of marketing and capitalism. Companies strive to instill an emotional sense in the consumer towards their brand. Then they get brand loyalty and you see all these goofball kids with Nike and Adidas logos shaved into their heads.
James--- Someone mentioned the TNN thing earlier in this topic 
=TMP=
Posted by James B. Openshaw (Member # 1310) on 08-04-2002, 01:17 PM:
Thanks Thomas, I guess I need to read these posts instead of run by them. It's good to know that I'm not the only one who hates "The New TNN".
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-04-2002, 02:46 PM:
It's one thing for free tv networks to put their stupid logo on the screen. They of course never put it on during a PAID commercial break, so the way I see it, if the signal is not being broadcasted through the free air waves, all "pay" stations via cable and satellite should not be able to display their logo during the PAID programming.By the way, I noticed Comedy Central is running movies with the logo "Comedy Central MEGA PLEX" in the corner. How stupid is this? It's only one channel! At least with HBO and MTV there are multiple channels of it. Then again thinking back on it, I guess they were referring to the fact that many "mega plexes" have screens the size of televisions.
Posted by Jesse Skeen (Member # 586) on 08-04-2002, 08:12 PM:
Last night I was at a friend's house using his new DVD recorder to transfer some of my old commercials from 1978-1980 from tape collections I've acquired from thrift stores and flea markets. One of these was the original airing of "Shogun" from 1980, and not only was the screen free of any onscreen crap during the show, they let several sements of the show run a long time (close to 30 minutes) without any commercial breaks, and my friend remarked how short the commercial breaks were compared to today (not that I'd know, since I don't watch TV anymore.) The NBC peacock didn't look so bad when they didn't make everyone look at it all the time!!