Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Dual Processor Would it help?

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Posted by Sam Hunter (Member # 1119) on 01-09-2003, 04:26 PM:

So what could a person gain by using a dual processor Motherboard?
Say like adding two 1.2G processors to it with Max memory?

Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 01-09-2003, 05:15 PM:

Would it help what?

It all depends on the software and OS.
For most people a single 2Ghz processor would work just as well, if not better than dual 1.2's.

Posted by Steven Pickles (Member # 785) on 01-09-2003, 05:54 PM:

Sam,

Due to processing, locgical, and bus overhead, you will not see anywhere near double the processing capability. Two processors do more work than one, but never twice as much work. Dual motherboards contain more complex logic to operate both processors and thus cost more to build. Then you have to factor in the cost of two processors. There are even some operating systems that do not understand dual-processing capability--so there's another associated cost. From my experience using NT 4 with dual processors I acheieved only about a 40-60% increase in performance in numerically intensive floating point operations using MATLAB. Like Daryl said, it really does depend on the software and OS. Hope this helps.

Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 01-09-2003, 05:59 PM:

I benchmarked single vs. dual CPU systems under NT 4 in a 3D Studio Max rendering farm. The dual CPU system was only marginally faster. But keep in mind that Windows 2000/XP is supposed to be much better optimized for multiple CPUs than NT (though I haven't benchmarked anything on Win2K or XP myself). Anyway, there are a lot of variables that affect how well a multiple-CPU system is going to perform in the real world.

Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 01-09-2003, 06:03 PM:

It should also be noted that stuffing as much RAM as possible into a system doesn't necessarily yield the best system performance.

Also, during the height of NT4 I believe that 3D Lightwave had (and may still have) a better multiprocessor, multimachine rendering architecture.

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 01-09-2003, 06:04 PM:

Not very many PC applications are written in multi-threaded form, which is necessary to take advantage of symmetric multiprocessors. Most computer users will only gain minor benefits at best from dual processor machines. WindowsNT, Win2000 and WinXP Pro can divide tasks from certain applications between the two processors. But in the end, a single CPU is going to handle just about anything a casual user can throw at it.

If you happen to be into digital video editing, 3D animation or dealing with very large Adobe Photoshop images, it is advantageous to use a multiprocessor box.

IMHO, if someone is going to invest in a multiprocessor system, he ought have a RAID disk system as well. Hard disc input/output is the worst performance bottleneck in computing --and the I/O latency of a single hard disc (particularly an IDE drive) can sap away many of the potential speed gains you would get from having a dual processor setup.

There's more on the OS aspect concerning SMP. Some want to upgrade an existing machine to a dual processor box. The last time I checked, WindowsNT/2000/XP must be cleanly installed for SMP use. You can't take an existing single CPU Windows installation and just plop in a second CPU. Win XP makes it even more confusing. The crappy XP Home version is not multiprocessor enabled. And I'm not too sure the standard XP Pro installation CDs have the SMP extensions either. You have to buy special server versions of XP Pro to utilize four-way or eight-way SMP.

On the Mac side, its a pretty simple situation with OS X; its SMP enabled standard. But then any G4 tower you buy now is going to have dual processors. Apple also has its new XServe server systems. My understanding is those systems can run 4-way, 8-way or higher numbers of CPUs. But are those things running a different flavor of OS X Server?

[ 01-09-2003, 10:18 PM: Message edited by: Bobby Henderson ]

Posted by Matthew Bailey (Member # 601) on 01-09-2003, 06:12 PM:

Any drawbacks,etc. with sticking a pair of Pentium 4's in a laptop or desktop?

Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 01-09-2003, 06:23 PM:

XP Professional includes dual-CPU support.

Some sample benchmarks for XP-Pro on single & dual Intel & AMD processors: Benchmarks

There's also "HyperThreading" on some Intel processors. I'm not completely up to speed on HyperThreading, but I think it's a single CPU chip that can mimic much of the behavior & performance advantages of a true dual-CPU architecture. This link has a lot of good info on HyperThreading and other related stuff: HyperThreading

Single vs. Dual vs. HyperThreading benchmarks: HyperThreading Benchmarks

Oh yeah, don't forget that 2000 and XP Pro support "processor affinity" in SMP systems. Instead of letting the OS split the load up as it sees fit between multiple processors [threads], you can designate a specific task to a specific processor or processors, reserving or freeing up the other processor(s) for other tasks. For example, if you're doing a lot of heavy-duty 3D graphics rendering, you could devote 1 CPU exclusively to rendering, leaving the 2nd CPU available for other tasks. This could be a significant performance enhancement in certain situations.

Posted by Sam Hunter (Member # 1119) on 01-09-2003, 09:57 PM:

Hmmmmm...
Sounds like I just need to invest in a 2.0Ghz system and go from there.I am fairly happy with my 850Mhz AMD Athlon but since I have about 37 processes running in the background I think I could use a little more Horsepower. I have a choice, buy film/projectors or upgrade my PC. Hmmmmm, tough choice.
Thanks for the info guys. [beer]

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 01-09-2003, 10:17 PM:

I'm not aware of any portable laptop computers being multiprocessor capable. There's no dual-CPU mobile motherboards on the market as far as I know. Also, a dual-CPU laptop would need one hell of a battery!

I'm not aware of there being any drawbacks to putting together a dual-PentiumIV machine. Maybe your electric bill might be a few cents higher every month. You'll have another CPU fan to replace when it dies. And I don't think you can get a dual-CPU configuration on one of those new trendy mini-sized main boards.

The newest Pentium IV chip (running at 3.06GHz) is the first to use the "Hyper Threading" architecture.

Hyperthreading only works on applications that are multithreaded, like Adobe Photoshop or After Effects. If you enable hyperthreading for an app that isn't multithreaded, you may potentially take a peformance hit over it.

Overall, I see Intel's "hyperthreading" concept as a good thing. It will pressure much of the software industry to retool apps to be multithreaded. IMHO, multiprocessing general use computers are way overdue. But the Internet largely sidetracked all that for the past 5 years thanks to the computer companies trying to use web surfing as a means of selling new hardware. You don't need latest-greatest computer technology for much of anything web related. So it is no wonder why much of the computer industry is in the crapper. No need to upgrade!

Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 01-09-2003, 10:26 PM:

Sam, easy... film and some Brenkerts!

Posted by Sam Hunter (Member # 1119) on 01-09-2003, 10:37 PM:

I like how you think Daryl! [thumbsup]

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-09-2003, 11:39 PM:

Sam,
Depends on what use you have in mind for the computer.....If its just e-mail that does not take much power.....Go to the Salvation Army Re-sale store nearest you and get a used 386 for 10 bucks and run Win 3.2. But if it is primarily for use for Film-Tech then you will need tons of extra computing power, and probably quad processors to sift through all the [bs]

here

.
Seriously though, I have been running a dual 1 ghz P3 processor now for a long time. Started out as a single CPU machine with dual MB, but I added the duals to it, and Win 2000 at the same time. Later I switched to XP Pro and wouldn't use anything else...Its great, best OS yet!

The main thing I notice is not so much a speed increase but the fact that it has yet to lock up on me....even once! It does have almost 1 gig RAM in it too, but I do attribute the dual cpu feature to it being a less problematic computer. Since I use mine for varying tasks it sees alot of different things.....sometimes several at once too. Overall, its been a fun, VERY reliable computer.
Mark