quote:

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Ground Rules: Please be serious and avoid "hit and run" or gag posts.

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Steven, while this isn't a specific forum rule, Manny did request this when he originated his topic. That's a bit rude of you.
 

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Posted by Jason Black (Member # 684) on 01-06-2004, 05:21 PM:
 
Brad,

Perhaps Steven is one of the bitter cynics Manny referred to???


 

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Posted by Dave Williams (Member # 299) on 01-06-2004, 06:15 PM:
 
I like what the indian guy in Matrix Revolutions said to neo that "love is a word". Probably the most interesting moment of the entire film.

However, I digress, whatever the hell that means.

Here is what love is to me...

When I met my second wife, and I do mean when I met her, it was love at first site, or sight, depending on your point of view. To this day, ten years later, that has not changed. My feelings for her never dwindeled and they do not require reciprocation. The do not require her to feel any specific way, as the love I feel for her is totally unconditional.

There was a time that she was not happy and wanted a different road than the one that I was on. because of the love I have for her I let her go, because that is what love is, allowing that which you love to be happy, regardless of where it takes them.

She is remarried, and struggles from time to time. Often she will confide in me and ask for my advice, and on more than one occasion I helped her through some tough times and helped keep her marraige together instead of taking the obvious route and tried to pry them apart.

She is happy today, and so am I. While the feelings for her that I have never have changed in one bit, I do not pine for her or obsess for her either. Instead, I just revel in knowing that she is where she wants to be, and is happy. That is all I ever wanted for her.

Someday perhaps, a new spark may take my attention away from the drudgery of regular life, and perhaps I may even welcome it. However it will never replace what I feel for her and it should'nt either. I had a true love before this one, and I imagine I will have another one some day as well.

All things good and bad make up what we are, and i wouldn't replace any of it for anything. I am who I am because of who I love and how I love, not for who I am with.

This is probably the MOST open I have ever been about this subject. How dare you make me be open!!!

Caio

Dave
 

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Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 01-06-2004, 10:20 PM:
 
Loving, over and over again now.
It aint nothing girl, till youve felt the pain.
up against the wall, why does love always have to hurt?
your scratches run across my back and then a tear.
Dear lover, I cant take the pain no more
Dear lover, I pick my heart up from the floor.
Dear lover, I cant believe it came to this.
Dear lover, give me one last painful kiss.
thier aint nothin in this world for free now.
So how high of a price will you pay?
Hear the screams so loud wake up to the broken glass.
It's a scene from bad to worse and then more tears

--Social Distortion
 

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Posted by Paul Linfesty (Member # 214) on 01-06-2004, 10:55 PM:
 
"Love is a trick that nature plays on us to get us to reproduce."
- Callisto (from Xena, Warrior Princess)

And yes, I'm being serious.
 

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Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 01-07-2004, 03:36 AM:
 
I think it is too simple to reduce the phenomenon of love to reproduction. A lot of animals - it is obvious that a lot of animals have a complex psyche, but definitely not all species - reproduce without probably having a concept of love. And a lot of human infants are conceived and raised without much or any love, just out of horniness and stupidity.
This may be one key: raising children. Human infants are born relatively early (if they were born later, the head would be too large), in fact at an earlier development stage than any other mammal. This means that of all animals, humans are also the ones who are dependent on their parents for the longest period. This necessitates a tight social structure and bonding with the partner who has to (or should) be around long enough to protect mother and child and make his contribution to raising it. And of course a very tight bond between child and parents.
Another factor may be that we are social animals with a very complex psyche which both needs and produces communication to develop itself. Obviously, our sexuality and our identity are central topics. Sharing (naturally for a social animal) and thereby enhancing them can be done on many levels, but obviously the person we are closest to physically would be also the person with which we would seek to share other more mental experiences the most. Because body and mind are a unity.
This is not at all to deny the important role reproduction plays in the concept of love. On the contrary, the urge to mate and the success or failure at finding partners reach very deep into our soul and is one of the most important factors which shape our self-perception. That is also why many organized religions seek to control the love life of people: because it is the most powerful way of controlling them.

Of course, these are only a few concepts of approaching this phenomenon. The mystery of love is inexplicable, as is the fact that we are emotionally experiencing the world around us.

I haven`t read Erich Fromm, but I believe he also stresses the interaction of psyche and society, as do many psychologists and anthropologists.
 

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Posted by Gracia L. Babbidge (Member # 582) on 01-07-2004, 09:41 AM:
 
Love is a difficult thing to fully describe - when you feel it, you know it - no one else can tell you whether or not it is there.

To love someone, you care about them, their well being, their happiness, just because you do - not because you're motivated by how it will work to your own benefit.

Love tends to involve attraction on multiple levels. The most obvious is the most animal - the physical / sexual attraction, less visible are the intellectual, and spiritual attractions. The latter not everyone will detect, as many people have yet to awaken their own spiritual sensitivities. The most enduring love will combine those three forms of attraction.

I'm now saying this from the point of view of a happy person that has indeed fallen in love. We were friends first, introduced by a mutual acqaintance, and began to get to know each other in a geeky context- playing Magic: the Gathering. So of course, while playing that game, we discovered in conversation the multitude of interests we have in common. It was the realization of the physical attraction that developed gradually - we had both been *distracted* by others for a while. Then there was the night we spoke openly of the feelings we mutually had developed for one another, and shared our first kiss - which was truly a thing of beauty. You really can tell much about a person's feelings for you by the way they kiss you - I was instantly hooked. No other kiss had touched me on such a deep emotional level, with so much tenderness and passion at once. Something else we quickly noticed (both being pagan & spiritually inclined) - when we embraced the energies from both of our heart chakras fired up and while still retaining their individualities, mingled with each other in a most pleasing manner.
...While we didn't give in to temptation immediately (which I think is for the better), we have since discovered that we certainly are sexually compatible.

Time will tell more than I know right now about the future of this relationship - I am however, highly optimistic.

Ok, so I was just a bit more sappy than is normal for my fiesty self - but like I said, I've been very happy.
 

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Posted by R. Andrew Diercks (Member # 1725) on 01-08-2004, 06:26 PM:
 
I believe that Robin Williams said it best in "Good Will Hunting". I cannot remember the exact quote, but it refers to the idiosyncrasies becoming adoring traits rather than imperfections. When you can laugh and enjoy something that drives you absolutely nuts. As an example, my wife has a bad habit of leaving butter out and not replacing the lid on the milk, these things bug the hell out of me, but we laugh about it all the time. She also looks more beautiful with each passing year and I am always happy to go home to her and our children. We've been married for 5 years, been together for almost 9. I met her at age 12 in junior bowling and we became high school sweethearts later. Consequently we were married at the bowling alley, and well before "Ed" was on TV.

I do have to break a small rule and mention the love of family i.e. brotherly love. My family immediate and extended share a love I have seldom seen elsewhere, those that have it, I am deeply happy for you. All of us would die for eachother. This was born from a lot of illness in our family through the years, but we share something very special. My father needs a kidney and everyone has lined up to test themselves for the opportunity. This is more special because the family offering is my mothers side, not my father's immediate relatives. Love to me is very real, and life would be unbearable without it.
 

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