This is topic Burger King Conveyor Grill? in forum Film-Yak at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 01-02-2005, 12:53 PM:
 
Hello Everyone:

My friend just got a job at Burger King and was telling me about what she does in the kitchen. She says that the grill looks like a conveyor belt leading in and out of a metal box. She says she places the raw patties on the conveyor belt that then slide into the unit, and almost a minute later, they come out the other end where the conveyor belt is horizontal, and are completely cooked with grill marks on one side.

Do you know who manufacturers these grills and how they flame broil in an enclosed grill in under a minute?

[I know McDonald's can cook their small patties in 36 seconds in a contact grill, but the quarter pound patties take almost 2 and a half minutes in the contact grill.]
 

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Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 01-02-2005, 01:47 PM:
 
I don't know anything about who makes them, but I wish McDonalds used them. Carl's Jr. uses them too. It's basically a metal oven with gas burners under the conveyor belt to flame-broil the meat. The burgers taste better when cooked this way (my opinion).
 

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Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-02-2005, 02:03 PM:
 
I betcha' it's some kind of custom device, built especially for BK restaurants. There may be other kinds of machines LIKE it but not one EXACTLY like it.

That's part of what you get when you buy a franchise restaurant... A license to buy and use equipment designed and built especially for franchisees. It's a lot like the original pressure fryers they used to use at Kentucky Fried Chicken restaurants.

When Col. Sanders was still alive and active in the company, if he didn't like they way you ran your affairs, he would take your frying equipment away. On one occasion, the legend goes, he took the fryers out into the parking lot and ran over them with his car as he drove off! (Back in those days, a pressure fryer was nothing more than a big pot with a tight lid.) Doing that would effectively put the franchisee out of business.

If you didn't know, the REAL secret to Kentucky Fried Chicken is the cooking method (pressurized deep frying) and NOT the "7 secret herbs and spices". The actual recipe is pretty well known these days. (There are NOT seven ingredients... NONE of them are classified as an herb... Only ONE of them is classified as a spice.)

Therefore, I'm sure Burker King does some similar kind of thing with their equipment and business practices.

I'm not 100% sure but that's the way I understand things.

Nowadays, you can probably by a pressure cooker a lot like the ones K.F.C. uses but probably not exactly like them.
 

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Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 01-02-2005, 02:29 PM:
 
The BK grillers have four burners under the conveyor belt for the heat. Over these burners are plates that protect the burners from the fat droppings. These fat droppings hit the cover plates are flare up providing the grill taste and marks. Not sure who the mfr is. Been a while.

BTW, there is a second conveyor on the bottom of the unit that toasts the buns. You put just as many buns in as you do patties. Once they are done cooking, then they are married and placed in a lovely steam table awaiting your specific order.

(Sounds nice doesn't it)
 

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Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-02-2005, 03:54 PM:
 
okay i'll bite what are the secret herbs and spices
I heard once a story that the formula was changed once due to one of the ingredients was on a carciongenic list
never did get any confirmation of that
 

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Posted by Barry Floyd (Member # 385) on 01-02-2005, 04:42 PM:
 
Not sure about Burger King, but I used to work on a corporate training team for Dairy Queen International, and we installed the NIECO brand of flame broilers in the DQ "Brazier" stores.
Neico Automatic Broilers

Big mothers, and VERY expensive, and a pain in the ass to clean.
We'd put the burger patties on conveyor on the rear of the machine, and then place the buns in a slot in the back of the machine too. The buns usually dropped out of the front first, then the patties would come out later. The burgers and grilled chicken tasted unbelievable. For volume flame-broiling.. it's the only way to go. Once the machine is setup correctly and the speed of the conveyors is adjusted properly, there's really not alot to go wrong. Because of the conveyor, every single burger comes out cooked exactly the same.

Pizza's are done the same way... minus the flame broiling marks. We are considering purchasing a Lincoln Impinger Conveyor Pizza oven at our theatre, just because of the shear volume of pizza we sell.
 

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Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 01-02-2005, 05:12 PM:
 
There's a pretzel shop at one of the malls here that uses an electric conveyor belt oven to bake the pretzels (dough they hand-twist into a pretzel shape). Like you said, once they get the timing right (by adjusting the speed of the conveyor belt), the cooking results are very consistent. Barry reminded me that one of the most popular pizza stores in Eugene, Track Town Pizza, uses a conveyor belt pizza oven. Even when they're really slammed, they can load that conveyor belt up to the max and every pizza comes out perfect. Nobody has to time anything. You just want to make sure someone is paying attention to the "finished" end.
 

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Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-02-2005, 05:19 PM:
 
Four ingredients:

• Flour.
• Pepper. (The lone "spice" in this recipe.)
• Salt.
• Monosodium Glutamate. (MSG)

Could MSG be the "potentially carcinogenic ingredient" you heard about?
There's a big grocery store chain in Erie (Wegman's) that recently put in a ready-to-eat pizza shop. They installed a Lincoln Impinger pizza oven.

I had been there a couple-few times and bought some decent food but, one day, I was disappointed to find the pizza shop closed down. They had to shut down for several days because of a "major problem" with the oven but nobody would say what the "problem" was. Finally I was able to weasel it out of one of the girls.

It turns out that some butt-head set his plastic clip board down on the conveyor belt, not thinking that it would be pulled into the oven and subsequently heated to several hundred degrees Fahrenheit in a matter of a couple minutes!

It took them about a week to get all the melted plastic out of that thing!
 

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Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 01-02-2005, 06:10 PM:
 
Famous quote from "Fast Times at Ridgemont High"

Brad: What's the secret sauce?
Dennis: Ketchup and mayonnaise....what's the secret sauce at Bronco Burger?
Brad: Thousand Island dressing.
 

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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 01-02-2005, 08:25 PM:
 
Thanks for all this great information! I find it very interesting (and that Nieco link is great!)

(Just by the way- I'm lucky to not be in the hospital tonight. One of our boarder's horses came to attack our other horse while I was trying to bring him into the corral. The gate got caught on his blankeyt and pinned him inbetween the gate end and the post. He started panicing because he was caught and because of this other horse, and he then reared, whcih got his front right hoof caught in the gate (its 2x6s in a rectangle with a 2x6 going diagonally from top to bottom- he got his hoof caught at the top end). He then twisted his leg back and reared while moving forward (he was right over me and if I didn't move 2 inches, he would have come down right on me). He snapped the post that the gate connected too but he appears to be fine. I have a huge blister on my right index finger that makes it hard to type/move, so its good that I'm left handed! Anyways, just wanted to let you know what was up without starting a new post!
 

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Posted by John Hegel (Member # 628) on 01-02-2005, 09:01 PM:
 
The grill itself is only a small part of the total cost for these kitchens. From what iv seen the exhaust, make-up air, and fire control system will cost you far more then the grill.

If you are going to build a new hood/fire area for these I would suggest to put a drain in the floor so at the end of the night you can take the burners out and pressure wash the rest of the machine.
 

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Posted by William Bunch (Member # 1040) on 01-03-2005, 08:46 AM:
 
I've spent many a late hour working on the various Burger King kitchen equipments. Barry is correct. BK uses the NIECO automatic broiler. The ones overseas here are fired by LPG. There are three burner boxes on the top and three on the bottom. It may be difficult to clean for the kitchen staff but from a maintenance standpoint these things are extremely well built. I actually love working on them though it is not often. At Misawa we have the broiler turned in such a way so the customers can see the flames. The burners are infrared. The flames are from the grease dripping off the meat and onto the lower burner shields. NIECO is pretty good about going out of their way to give hands-on training too. Make sure you have plenty of hands and strong backs before trying to move one of these puppies.

There are smaller versions of the same type broiler and one that has the meat product make a U-turn and arrive at the same end as it entered. There are also some electric models which use ceramic burners but I've not had an opportunity to work on them. Both versions use tons of gas or electricity. They would not be wise for low volume stores unless you knew exactly when the volume would pick up. Pre-heating a cold broiler in the morning takes the better part of an hour.

For any of these broilers you need special heat extraction ductwork. The common stove hood just won't pass muster here. This is very important lest you burn the place down.

Burger King has picked up a good habit of investing their money in good, well engineered equipment. Anyone wishing to open such a business would do well to study their list. Good, hard working and durable equipment is expensive but it pays for itself over and over.

Our pizza restaurants all use the Lincoln Impinger ovens. Another very well made machine. The most recent models (Advantage) are easy to stock parts for and all the goodies are easy to reach. Not so some of the earlier ones of ten years ago. A 16 inch pizza only takes four and a half minutes in one of these. They are easy to clean too. The smaller ovens are sometimes used for the pretzles. Many large restaurants use these to cook/reheat entrees. Don't EVER stick your hand into the cavity of one of these babies while it is running. There is massive heat jet blasted from both directions. Like the NIECO, once you get the menu set and the chain speed determined you can make lots of money in a short time. Unlike the broiler most of the heat will stay inside an impinger while it is idle thus saving some energy or they can be throttled back for a while during expected lulls. They will heat back up pretty quick when needed in under five minutes. Whether you need a hood or not depends on the menu. Anything with meat will have the fire department checking.

Bill BuncH
Misawa, Japan
 

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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 01-03-2005, 09:54 AM:
 
Thanks! All this information is great!

So, can the Neico conveyor broiler have electric burners that heat the plate, causing the flame, or are they only gas?

How about the Quizno's toasting conveyor? Anyone know who makes that equipment? Subway is currently using something similar to the TurboChef C3, correct? I like the Quizno's toaster better, however because it provides a sort of 'production line'
 

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Posted by William Bunch (Member # 1040) on 01-03-2005, 03:58 PM:
 
I think that only the smaller N824 and N850 models are offered in the electric version. Please check the Nieco website.

At one time a very large electric model was offered to BK but that may have been a special unit just for BK. We couldn't use it here because the electrical service to the building was not large enough.

You will notice on most models that the bun platen (toaster) has been eliminated. This is because newer menus require the same buns for other sandwiches as well. The broiler can't keep up in speed. So the stores go with an optional stand alone vertical toaster instead. In these, the heel and crown are toasted in about 10 seconds.
 

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Posted by Jon Miller (Member # 163) on 01-03-2005, 09:06 PM:
 
Andrew, I think the Quizno's broiler is nothing more than a specialized electric conveyor broiler. The TurboChef ovens, like the ones Subway now use, rely on a combination of convection and microwave cooking to achieve both speed and that "toasted" quality.
 

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Posted by Pravin Ratnam (Member # 1417) on 01-04-2005, 03:30 AM:
 
I prefer DQ burgers to Burger King. A lot of times, Burger King employees will flat out just microwave an excess whopper and give that to you. The idiots will microwave the entire sandwich including the lettuce. I think BK had better standards in the 80s. I even had employees lie to me at the drive thru about the freshness of the whopper they were selling me.
 

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Posted by William Bunch (Member # 1040) on 01-04-2005, 06:09 AM:
 
Pravin, The microwave thing is out. Now when the meat comes out of the broiler it goes directly to a holding tray which sits in an electrically heated chute. No longer are the patties kept in the buns in the steamer. The heat chutes are made by Hatco and run on a computer program. After so many minutes any meat left in the holding unit gets pitched in the trash. Even before, the microwave was only for melting the cheese.

Bill Bunch
Misawa, Japan
 

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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 01-04-2005, 11:05 AM:
 
The only reason I was wandering about electric was because on the 850 brochure it said the unit would be gas fired or electric and would be set at the factory to run on natural gas, so I didn't know if it meant if it had to be both.
 

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Posted by William Bunch (Member # 1040) on 01-05-2005, 07:29 AM:
 
The spec sheet for the N850 on their website only lists the gas model. You would need to contact NIECO directly for the electric model.

All the gas models require electric to operate for the controls and chain motor. The gas model with the bun platen will use a good bit more electricity for the toaster.

Bill Bunch
 

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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 01-05-2005, 10:24 AM:
 
Thanks for the updates!
 

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Posted by Oscar Neundorfer (Member # 458) on 01-06-2005, 06:58 AM:
 
I never cease to be amazed at the kinds of things one can learn on Film-Tech
 

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Posted by John Hegel (Member # 628) on 07-05-2005, 02:42 AM:
 
Is it possible to cook a pizza in a Nieco broiler?

The broiler I just bought has the digital drive upgrade so I'm curious as to weather or not this will allow me any more flexibility in a drive-in kitchen.

I haven't been able to find a model number on it yet, but it has 4 top and 4 bottom burners. (if that helps anyone)
 

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Posted by Barry Floyd (Member # 385) on 07-06-2005, 09:15 AM:
 
Pizza in a Nieco Broiler?? Don't think I would try it.

Most of the major pizza operations around this area use a Lincoln Impinger conveyor oven for pizza. Most are gas fired with electrically driven chain conveyors. The small countertop models of the Lincoln ovens go for around $4k new.

I once had a high school kid who worked in the kitchen at my drive-in who tried to see if Chocolate Chip Cookie Dough Bites from the concessions stand IF cooked in the pizza oven would make Chocolate Chip Cookies. What it made was a black bubbling goo on the bottom of my oven!
 

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Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 07-07-2005, 01:55 PM:
 
Conveyor ovens are the bomb!
 

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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 11-01-2005, 03:33 PM:
 
What exactly is the estimated cost for just the broiler.

I spoke to a representative about the electric broilers that still use a flame from grease drippings flaring up, and that is available in some models, some even big models.

Also, for those with experience with this type of equipment, do you think that the electric model would take longer to cook the same patties that a gas model would, or would it be comparitive?

Burger King definitely does have the best and unbelievable tasting patties!
 

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Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 11-02-2005, 01:21 AM:
 
this is the best "oven" I have worked on



it is definetly good at gresse flaring
 

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Posted by John Hegel (Member # 628) on 11-02-2005, 02:10 AM:
 
If you dig around you should be able to find a used Neico for $250 - $1000.

In the long run gas will be cheaper to install, operate, and maintain. The cooking time is dependent on the Btu output so a gas and electric with the same Btu output should have the same cooking capacities.
 

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Posted by Barry Floyd (Member # 385) on 11-03-2005, 09:17 AM:
 
In regards to cleaning one of Nieco broilers. At most of the DQ's I helped to the installations on, we had a big rectangular stainless steel tank that was full of some really toxic stuff, I don't remember what it was, but it burned like hell if you got it on your skin. At the end of the night, we'd break the machine down, and drop the really BIG parts down into this tank. The next morning, the set-up crew would remove the parts from the tank and wash the remaining "stuff" off the parts.

Andrew, as far as the gas vs. electric thing..... I'd go with the gas. Currently in our kitchen at the drive-in, everything we have is electric. As soon as I can afford to, I plan on replacing the electric kitchen equipment with gas fired units. Gas deep fryers recover faster than electric moels do, gas char-broilers make for a better tasting burger than a flat grill, and presently, gas is cheaper to operate than electricity.

I don't know about you guys, but my electrical panel is almost maxxed out. I have a 600 amp 3 phase service entrance coming into the building, and most of the amperage is dedicated to the grill and fryers. When we added our second screen a month or so ago, we had to do some serious juggling of electrical breakers to squeeze in the rectifier circuit.
 

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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 11-03-2005, 09:34 AM:
 
Barry,

I just love to gain knowledge on different food service quipment.

But, if I were to put a broiler in at the last drive-in in Winnipeg, then I'd have to go for electric, as gas service isn't available at the drive-in.

When they built it (in a suburb outside of Winnipeg), they didn't have running water out there or sewage facilities either, so it has a huge fresh water sistern for the drinks and dishes, well water for the bathrooms and a sewage lagoon. Its so far off the highway, running a new gas line there for be insane.

How much was the finished cost of your 2-screen drive-in?
 

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Posted by Floyd Justin Newton (Member # 1316) on 11-03-2005, 09:41 AM:
 
Gord--

Which model retort is that which you are warming your buns on?


 

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Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 11-03-2005, 02:27 PM:
 
It is a Forster made in Toronto The B&L is a copy of it as Brookes &Looker used to be Alf Fosters bricklayers till they left for Florida with teh shop drawings The main chamber has 2 incinomite 1.2MBTU burners and the postcombustion is a Unipower Fast80 1.7MBTU burner useing fireye flame detectors
There is a venturi in the stack to maintain a positive suction on the unit
 

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Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 11-03-2005, 04:24 PM:
 

quote: Andrew McCrea

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But, if I were to put a broiler in at the last drive-in in Winnipeg, then I'd have to go for electric, as gas service isn't available at the drive-in.

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There's no truck out there to deliver a propane tank on? Amazing. I knew Manitoba sucked, but wow.
 

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Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 11-03-2005, 04:56 PM:
 
That pic of Gordon reminds me of why whenever I see or talk with him, I ***NEVER*** ask "What's Cookin'?"
 

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Posted by Andrew McCrea (Member # 674) on 11-03-2005, 06:15 PM:
 
You can get propane out there, I'm sure, but wouldn't it be outrageously expensive to install a big tank on the property for it?
 

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Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 11-03-2005, 07:24 PM:
 
Lots of businesses, including drive-ins, do it. That's why they make the big tanks.

Electric is probably cheaper though, especially if you can get one of those peak demand meters since most of your operating hours will be off peek demand times.

Then again, it's a matter of cost or taste.
 

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Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 11-03-2005, 11:25 PM:
 
phil said "That pic of Gordon reminds me of why whenever I see or talk with him, I ***NEVER*** ask "What's Cookin'?""
sometimes it should read "who not what"
 

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Posted by Barry Floyd (Member # 385) on 11-04-2005, 09:14 AM:
 

quote: Andrew McCrea

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How much was the finished cost of your 2-screen drive-in?

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