Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: mp4 question for Mac geeks

This is topic mp4 question for Mac geeks in forum Film-Yak at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 03-21-2007, 01:37 AM:

I have some video content ripped from a DVD with Nero Recode (included in Nero 7 Ultra). The file format is Nero Digital which is an .mp4 variation which also stores subtitles and chapter marks. The file ending is .mp4, too.

It plays without any problems on my PC with WMP, Winamp, and (of course) Nero Showtime. The subtitles and chapters are only available when I play it with Nero Showtime, but the other media players play the audio and video without any problems.

When I play the file in Quicktime, however, the image is broken up and in funky colors. A friend of mine tried to play the video on his Mac and got the same result, plus WMP didn't work properly either.

It looks like Quicktime only supports AAC-type .mp4, no matter
on what platform, but I would have thought if WMP can play the video on the PC, it should also play it on a Mac.

Apart from checking if there are any updates for WMP for Mac (although I hear WMP for Mac is not supported by Microsoft anymore, and therefore, there may be no updates for recent file formats), are there any other options to solve the problem? Are there media players for Macs which can play all sorts of .mp4 files properly, or are there converters which convert it to .mov?

There are a lot of applications which convert .mp4 to .mov, but the keyword here is of course "free".

How about VLC player or Real Player for Mac?

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-21-2007, 02:21 AM:

How about not using a proprietary Nero MP4 codec? There are many variations of MP4, and the best, by far, is H.264.

Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 03-21-2007, 08:25 PM:

Nero Digital mp4 makes the file smaller while still retaining good image and sound quality. It's not a Nero problem anyway, since you can play the files easily with several media players on a PC. So it's obvioulsy more a Mac problem, the fact that Apple apparently decided QuickTime users are only allowed to see some file formats, ad that there are so few media players and programs for the Mac in general. For instance, there is no Nero for Macs - catastrophy, that's the best burning and editing suite I have played with.
I played the file on VLC and it worked great, so, since VLC is also available for Mac, maybe that works. But I wonder if it is possible to burn the file on DVD on a Mac - probably not.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-21-2007, 10:32 PM:

Yeah, Macs can't burn DVDs. That requires technology from the future. Anyway you can't talk unless you try H.264 first. I can make files with higher frame rates, bigger resolution and smaller file sizes than most "regular" MP4 formats.

Posted by Jacob Szewczyk (Member # 2513) on 03-22-2007, 02:19 PM:

What you can always do is import the .mp4 file to iTunes and watch it through that.

Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 03-22-2007, 09:02 PM:

That didn't work at all on my PC. When I open the file in itunes and play it, it plays the sound, but the image is totally scrambled. Yes, I have the latest version of itunes. If it doesn't work on the PC, I doubt it works on a Mac - have you tried it?

Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 03-22-2007, 09:05 PM:

iTunes relies heavilly on QuickTime for both platforms. If QuickTime can't open it, niether can iTunes.

Posted by Jacob Szewczyk (Member # 2513) on 03-23-2007, 01:43 AM:

I have tried it, I have a bunch on my iTunes right now.

Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 03-23-2007, 02:20 AM:

iTunes/QT certainly can play *some* .mp4 format variations, but not all of them. Not this one, obviously.

Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 03-23-2007, 02:23 AM:

MP4 is a container format. The audio and video streams can be compressed using any number of codecs (though the standard h264 and aac combination is commonly recognized as the standard for this format). Nero is using a codec quicktime doesn't understand.

Again, if QuickTime can't open it, iTunes can't either. Or iDVD. or iMovie...

Fortunately, QuickTime has downloadable "components" that allow it to learn other codecs. To play WMV on the mac, you can get the free flip4mac components at Microsoft's website. Apple offers links to a variety of other components here .

I have Divx, 3ivx, XViD, and flip4mac components installed myself. Between them there isn't much I can't play.

The Dolby AC3 component is also useful for ensuring that your DVD backups are saved in full 5.1 [Smile]

Posted by Paul Trimboli (Member # 1509) on 03-23-2007, 03:48 AM:

No need to install individual codecs, just user Perian the swiss army knife for Quicktime. Perian

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-23-2007, 08:12 AM:

Flip4Mac ain't free. It has a free demo version, but I found that it only plays like 1/4th of the WMV file or some shit. My boss bought the whole version, but I haven't installed that on my home computer yet. WMV sucks ass. Mike, I tried to tell Michael what you did. Doesn't work. He loves the Nero proprietary codec.

Nero is less easy to use than Toast (though Toast makes some shitty VCDs).

Paul, sweet link! Quicktime kicks ass.

Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 03-23-2007, 03:03 PM:

Flip4Mac player is free if you download it from Microsoft's website. Click the link. I dare you. [Smile]

Perian supports flv?!? Kick ass!

Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 03-23-2007, 04:09 PM:

Here is a small sample from that file. Can you play it with any of the above solutions?

Has anyone tried VLC player for Mac? VLC can play the file on my PC, and I wouldn't be surprised if it also works on the Mac. VLC is a very flexible player.

Here is the sample:
http://www.yousendit.com/download/M3BsSlJ3UzhRYTgwTVE9PQ

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-23-2007, 06:18 PM:

Yeah I've had VLC for a long time. Your sample file played perfectly fine. It also played in Quicktime, but was a bit stuttery, but all of the colors looked good.

Mike, the free flip4mac player... err I mean QT plug-in (because that's all it really is) does not seem to play the ENTIRE wmv file (like I was saying).
EDIT: Nevermind, I had an older version.

Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 03-23-2007, 06:29 PM:

Odd. The copy I know I didn't pay for works fine. Go fig. [Confused]

Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 03-24-2007, 04:58 AM:

quote: Joe Redifer
Yeah I've had VLC for a long time. Your sample file played perfectly fine. It also played in Quicktime, but was a bit stuttery, but all of the colors looked good.

Interesting. It was totally mosaicked when I played it in Quicktime on the PC. In the complete video, longer stretches sometimes work OK at first, but it seems that whenever a shot lasts for a while, the picture gets progressively greenish and then more and moe psychedelic, and then it starts breaking up. When you pause it for a moment or the shot changes, the picture seems to "recover", but then it gets funky again. I guess it must have something to do with progressive frame encoding.

I think the brief sample already demonstrates why Nero Digital is a pretty good format for this use. The image quality is slightly mre pixellated than on the original DVD, and the sound quality is fairly good (the original recording isn't all that brilliant either, it's from 1972). I chose the moment with the triangel and glockenspiel because plingy, belly sounds like that often don't work at all with compressed audio codecs - you hear massive artifacting -, but here, you can hear them quite clearly. Yet the overall file (1h15m) is just 680MB, not too bad at all, and much less than the VOB.

Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-24-2007, 05:19 AM:

The resolution is only a wimpy 608 x 464. That's weak. Nero must suck.