Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Re-Programming a Car key

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Posted by Richard Hamilton (Member # 321) on 05-11-2007, 10:44 AM:

o.k., so my car just decided not to start. Before I tow it into the dealer, their service shop wants to make sure it isn't the security system. (The car cranks over, but doesn't fire), the security system shuts off the fuel pump.

I must leave the key in the ignition and in the ON position for 30 minutes, then call the dealer service center for the rest of the process to program it...He thinks it's electrical,security, or fuel....................... [Eek!]

Sorry, my smartass coming out.

Rick

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 05-11-2007, 10:56 AM:

These electronic car keys suck. Just this morning, I found out that getting a spare key made for my Honda Accord (sorry Daryl...I sold the station wagon) would cost upwards of $120 and require a service appointment. I had expected to pay maybe $25 and walk out with the new key. I told the guy "no, thanks." I can live without a third key at that price.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 05-11-2007, 11:52 AM:

Between us, my wife and I have had 3 vehicles with electronic keys in the last 7 years...we always insist on an extra key as part of the deal when we buy the car. (I think those keys are a pretty profitable item.)

Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 05-11-2007, 12:33 PM:

Induction powered RFID chips don't come cheap. Well, OK, they do, but it's more fun to charge a lot for them.

If you already have two keys you can program additional ones (usually up to around 5 total) yourself with most Ford and GMs. Keys for Fords and GMs are usually $75-$140 and you only need a service appointment if you only currently have one key (they'll need to plug into your computer to program the key).

I'm not sure what Honda and Toyota publishes/allows. It almost certainly works the same way, it's just a matter of if they want to be ass-hats about it.

quote: Scott Norwood
sorry Daryl...I sold the station wagon

Get tired of being single Scott? [Big Grin]

Posted by Richard Hamilton (Member # 321) on 05-11-2007, 12:43 PM:

no luck, I just met the tow truck driver to get the car. Now my fate is in the dealerships hands. [eyes]

Before this car, the last 3 I bought were all new Fords, never any problems. I hope this isn't a sign of things to come!!!! [Confused]

Rick

Posted by Monte L Fullmer (Member # 2797) on 05-11-2007, 03:18 PM:

Fords...*cough*...you can do better than that..Get a Tundra.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 05-11-2007, 04:25 PM:

Ford,Tundra, GM, ***COUGH*** you could all do better than that...get a Land Rover and have some fun... it NEVER gets stuck, and is otherwise known as the "Jeep Rescue Vehicle"! When its not out wading through the mud or a river it drives like a BMW [thumbsup]

Cleaning it after the mud is a bitch [Eek!]

.

The Land Rover has an interesting mode thats called "Super Lock". It goes into this mode when you press the remote lock button twice. In this mode you can't do a dammed thing with the vehicle, the engine won't even turn over and the lock/unlock button on the dash won't work. The entire vehicle is controlled by a central CPU that handles just about all ancillary things in the vehicle... even the windows. There is also a mode that if you are not careful you can get locked into the vehicle and can't get out... Any attempt to break a window out, open the rear tail gate or hood and the alarm goes off. If someone is going to steal this thing they'll have to pick it up and gently carry it off because the accelerometer will tell the CPU someone is jossling it around.

I got the shop manual for it a while back on CD but its 987 pages long and I haven't had time to mull through much of it except to know that all it's sub-systems are linked on whats called a CAN network... Engine, cruise, brake, CPU, gauges, the tush heaters, and front and rear window heaters.

Keys and remotes... are expensive, I think it was 90.00 or so. But they are easy to get. All it involves is to take the present remote and key into them and they can read the programming on them and make you duplicates. If you loose it its like all other makes... take the vehicle into them.

Mark

Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 05-11-2007, 09:10 PM:

The problem with Land Rovers (I own a Discovery II) is everything, including the key, is very expensive. If you can afford the higher price for 'winch-rated' bumpers, lockers, etc. for off road use, you almost don't want to go off road because you are afraid to damage something. BMW's also have a Super Lock mode.

I do understand the security features, but I just don't think a simple thing like a replacement key should cost $90.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 05-12-2007, 07:07 AM:

John... that was for the key and remote combined.... Not all that bad... There are LR's everywhere you loko around in this area... If you ever need serious service on your Land Rover SLC is the best place to come.... there are 5 shops that specialize in just Land Rovers amd 2 others just for parts and accessories.

Edited in later... Rovers ARE for off roading and getting scratched and all, they are expensive but are some of the very best off roading vehicles made. Excepting the House Wife that wants to think she's being cool driving around town in her's I would say the majority of them around here see much off road use. Some of the old Classics and Defenders look like they've been around the world and back.

Mark

[ 05-12-2007, 10:56 AM: Message edited by: Mark Gulbrandsen ]

Posted by Bill Enos (Member # 440) on 05-12-2007, 07:38 PM:

Electronic keys for my wife's '98 Buick are $75 at the dealer, but any lockshop with a key reader will make one for around $25. This does not count in the vehicles key count since it is a duplicat of an existing key.
Is it possible to deactivate these stupid systems? I've heard that a lock/switch with the correct electronic key inserted and taped in place can be spliced into the wiring to the original switch and the system will then see that key and then any standard key that will operate the lock can be used. The spliced in lock is attached under the dash somewhere. Anybody know if this is true?

Posted by Richard Hamilton (Member # 321) on 05-28-2007, 11:37 AM:

It was the fuel pump. $800 bucks later, i'm driving again.

later, Rick

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 05-28-2007, 03:04 PM:

You will soon learn that Ford's fuel pumps are shit. My wife's Mercury Mistake is on pump #3. Last failed on the way to Show West in the middle of the desert just outside of Pioche, NV., Pump relay also failed as well. We finally figured out that if the car sat for a short while it would go about 20 miles before the pump quit again... since there are ALOT of long down hill runs on Rt 93 I turned the engine off on every down hill run... went all the way to Vegas ths way and the engine didn't die out on the uphill runs thankfully. Longest coast that day was just a tad bit over 14 miles down past the power station and onto the I-15 entrance ramp [Big Grin]

I say learn to change them yourself and carry a spare... also don't let your fuel get below 1/3 of a tank... the gas is used to cool the pump motor [Frown]

.

Mark

Posted by Bill Enos (Member # 440) on 05-28-2007, 08:55 PM:

If you take 'em out and look at them all these in tank pumps seem to be nearly alike and usually last a very long time. Actually they look like it would be miraculous if they ran a month, pretty skimpy in appearance. Even with a low tank plenty of gas sloshes over them, fuel level isn't supposed to have any effect though.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 05-28-2007, 09:44 PM:

Just for the record, between us my wife and I have had 12 Fords in our lives including several high-mileage ones, and have never lost a fuel pump. (She used to have a Tempo that was a real lemon, but still no fuel pump trouble.)

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 05-28-2007, 11:06 PM:

Mike,

Ford has had recalls on many fuel tanks since about the year 2000. The latest recall is for the Focus... The Cougar also had recalls. Below are photos of another person's Mercury Mistake pump that died and the cannister that it lives in. Note the revised version of the pump on the left [Big Grin]

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 05-29-2007, 01:15 AM:

Well just be sure to tell your dealer to replace your crappy original equipment pump with a Carquest(R) replacement for many miles of happy motoring! [Big Grin]

Posted by Tristan Lane (Member # 1169) on 05-29-2007, 04:01 AM:

I'm not sure what kind of system Ford calls theirs, but the GM passkey system, and many others can be bypassed with a module. Car stereo places sell them for when they install remote start systems.

Posted by Richard Hamilton (Member # 321) on 05-29-2007, 07:50 AM:

Autozone had it in stock for under 200 bucks, but the car was already at the dealership. They charged 320 for the pump and 320 for labor. It's not a Ford, I was just saying my previous new cars were Fords and I didn't have any problems, probably the same case with any new car.

Rick

Posted by Bruce McGee (Member # 131) on 05-30-2007, 11:08 AM:

$120 and up for a key?

I thought $15 was insane for the new switch key I bought for my 1984 Mercedes 190E!!!

$800 for a gas pump?

I had to pull the tank on my old 1986 Pontiac Grand AM to replace the in-tank pump. Took all of 2 hours from start to finish. New pump and sock cost around $65 at AutoZone.

Dealer prices suck.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 05-30-2007, 11:13 AM:

Pump prices (installed) on my Dodge mini-van. Louisville area dealer $900, local gas station 385.00, my friendly Chrysler dealer in-the-country $300.00 The gas station did the work, since a 130 mile tow or even drive for that matter costs something. Louis

Posted by Richard Hamilton (Member # 321) on 05-30-2007, 12:34 PM:

I had the dealer do it because they had worked on it a couple months ago. My gas guage didn't work and they replaced the sending unit(?) which is mounted on the pump. I was hoping they would absorb some of the cost. They charged me for fluid disposal, $11.00, but they disposed of about $30.00 worth of gas [puke]

Rick

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 05-30-2007, 09:58 PM:

quote: Louis Bornwasser
Pump prices (installed) on my Dodge mini-van.

I had an '87 Dodge Minivan... worst vehicle I've ever owned. Three transmission rebuilds and two transaxles later I disposed of it. Tranny shop did the second and third rebuilds for free. I don't remember what the deal was with the transaxles. Turns out the tranny clutches were made from the wrong material by Chrysler... that has since been rectified by Chrysler but it took them several years to get it right after I had gotten rid of the van.

Best vehicle was my 1990 Ford Aerostar van. I beat the crap out of that van and couldn't kill it no matter what I did to it. Last of the rear wheel drive Minivans. The only thing I ever had to do to it was a steering rack at 120K. Down side was the rev limiter that shut the engine down if you went over 95mph [Eek!]

. I traded it in at 170,000 miles for a 95 Dodge RAM Pickup on the advice of my local Ford dealer when I was out looking at new Ford pickups one day!

Mark